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[Aggelos]

2 Trains collide near Larissa, Greece, at least 36 killed, dozens injured.

Edit:
"With at least 57 fatalities, more than 85 injured and 2 still missing, it is the worst disaster in the history of railways in Greece."

Tempi train crash - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Greece train crash kills at least 38 people, many of them likely students

At least 38 people were killed when a Greek passenger train collided head-on with a freight train late on Tuesday, derailing carriages which then burst into flames in the country's deadliest rail crash in living memory.

www.reuters.com

Trains collide near Larissa, at least 36 killed, dozens injured | eKathimerini.com

A passenger train and a cargo train collided head-on in Greece on Tuesday night, killing at least 36 people and injuring dozens as the country’s deadliest rail crash in living memory threw entire carriages off the tracks.

www.ekathimerini.com

 

[DeepEnigma]

Damn, RIP.

And WTF is up with all the train issues around the world recently?

 

[SlimySnake]

How does this even happen? Dont they have the separate tracks for inbound and outbound trains?

 

[Aggelos]

How does this even happen? Dont they have the separate tracks for inbound and outbound trains?

There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.

 

[SlimySnake]

There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.

Thats awful. Are there no safeguards? Sounds like that Breaking Bad plot.

I dont feel safe traveling by trains now.

 

[GymWolf]

How the fuck can this happen with all the radio communication and stuff?

Rip.

 

[mortal]

Fucking hell that is horrific.
RIP to those who lost their lives. I hope the death toll doesn't rise much higher.

 

[RiccochetJ]

Damn, RIP.

And WTF is up with all the train issues around the world recently?

Well if you're talking about how everyone is reporting on derailments recently, it's because people have a magnifying glass on trains due to what happened in Ohio, people are freaking out, it's good clickbait, and it gives politicians the ability to grandstand.
According to federal data, more than 1000 derailments happen each year on average in the US:

We’ve seen reports of three train derailments this month. Is this normal? - Poynter

Federal data shows more than 1,000 train derailments happen each year on average. Most do not cause extensive damage or result in injuries or death.

www.poynter.org

What's uncommon is how much damage they do. The Ohio one was significant due to the toxic chemicals and now unfortunately this one which appears to be due to human error and caused significant loss of life.

 

[Tams]

This is ultimately going to boil down to vast underinvestment and negligence, of which the former breeds the latter.

RIP to all those who died because of that.

 

[BlackTron]

How the fuck can this happen with all the radio communication and stuff?

Rip.

It seems all the electronic systems and safeguards in their rail system have been busted for years, and everything is done manually. So, it was very prone to human error.

Not saying the station master didn't drop the ball (he did fail, and hard) but they were also asking for this to happen by neglecting to maintain the system.

 

[GymWolf]

It seems all the electronic systems and safeguards in their rail system have been busted for years, and everything is done manually. So, it was very prone to human error.

Not saying the station master didn't drop the ball (he did fail, and hard) but they were also asking for this to happen by neglecting to maintain the system.

Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...

 

[Aggelos]

 

[DeepEnigma]

Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...

It usually starts at the political funding level, and we know how that immunity works.

 

[newtypepilot]

RIP to all the victims.

wtf, there should be multiple safeguards in place as systems like track signals and train control would prevent this from happening, even if the station master had sent the train to the wrong track. Like, there had to be multiple points of failure, or they were running things manually which is even more bonkers.

 

[GymWolf]

It usually starts at the political funding level, and we know how that immunity works.

Not so sure with so many deaths involved...

Someone's head is gonna roll...

 

[DeepEnigma]

Not so sure with some many deaths involved...

Someone's head is gonna roll...

Oh it will happen, it will trickle down though. I have zero faith in the system that screws things up to begin with at the top.

 

[N0S]

Tragic

 

[BlackTron]

Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...

Don't count on it. I'm sure it was a funding issue. I can't read Greek but I hear the rail people even protested about it. As if the government people that make funding decisions would face any consequences.

Aside from the fact that they already ruined Greece's economy and are skating by on bailouts.

 

[Aggelos]

The chief coroner of the Larissa Medical Examiner's Office reports that they have completed the autopsy and medical examination of 43 decedents and they're, in fact, in really bad shape. (mostly ages between 20-30 years old, from what the chief coroner can gather)
In order to be identified, DNA samples have to be taken from the decedents and all their relatives. Pictures are also taken in case there's anything from their belongings that can be used to identify them.
In addition, the chief coroner reports that they have mutilated limbs and body parts that need to be identified.

 

[HoodWinked]

its weird to see such rapid accountability people being arrested and resigning after a big fuck up like this. feels like this sort of shit happens here and people just fail upwards.

 

[BlackTron]

RIP to all the victims.

wtf, there should be multiple safeguards in place as systems like track signals and train control would prevent this from happening, even if the station master had sent the train to the wrong track. Like, there had to be multiple points of failure, or they were running things manually which is even more bonkers.

They have those systems. They just didn't work for years and funding never got approved to fix it. So, oh well.

 

[AlteredForms]

RIP. Greece was hurting due to a recession right or was that years ago? Hope the country can jump back from this. Also, I want to try those moustokoloura grape cookies one day.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Damn, RIP.

And WTF is up with all the train issues around the world recently?

In Mexico we had a season of months when there was sabotage in our subway train almost daily.

 

[chromhound]

That's a big fuck up...

 

[ForAcademicPurposes]

Final Destination, anyone?

 

[Giallo Corsa]

Final Destination, anyone?

40+ people have died and yet, you make a drive by shit-post ? Man, fuck you, you should be ashamed , everything is a meme for people like you, fucking internet kids, nothing sacred anymore...

 

[Tams]

Final Destination, anyone?

Incredibly crass.

 

[FeralEcho]

Disgusting, every dude who was in charge of these decision should be thrown in jail.

How can you neglect stuff like that?


This fucking planet...

It's all about greed,upping the profit,lowering cost without the thought of endangering people until a disaster happens then everyone in charge is like

It happens time and time again,it happened recently in Turkey as well with the earthquake and the way all those buildings werent earthquake proof because of corruption.

This world is a shitshow of narcissistic greedy cunts.

 

[bitbydeath]

Seems wrong to blame everything on the brand new station master.

RIP

 

[anthony2690]

Final Destination, anyone?

Come on man, now isn't the time to make jokes, 40+ families have now been devastated and lost a loved one.

& Sadly I imagine it will be even higher by the end of the day

 

[xrnzaaas]

Damn if they actually were running everything manually then a big crash like this was bound to happen sooner and later. You can't just ignore repairing all of the electronical safeguards and assume that there will be no human errors.

 

[Aggelos]

Seems wrong to blame everything on the brand new station master.

True. It seems like other factors have contributed also, aside from human error.

Vassilis Zavogiannis, the person representing the workers of Hellenic Train SA on the board of the company that operates the country’s passenger and freight trains, spoke of a system that had been “disarmed.”
“The fundamental problem on this particular line, between Athens and Thessaloniki, is that the remote-controlled operation and signaling systems – that is the basic safety measures that protect trains from accidents – do not work,” Zavogiannis said. “Essentially, on a line that is critical for the country, the part of safety and protection relies, in the year 2023, entirely on the human factor. Our trains operate like they did 30 years ago. To put it metaphorically, it’s like having a pothole in front of our house: We know where it is and we avoid it, but at some point we will fall into it. That’s what happened here,” he added. “Just imagine that it took 45 whole minutes to locate which part of the route the train was at. It’s shocking,” he said.

 

[El Pistolero]

Words are failing me right now...You embark on a train with all the thoughts of the world, except for that one where you envisage your life tragically ending because of underfunding and inadequate training around an incredibly sensitive position.
R.I.P to the victims, and may the injured ones fully recover, physically and psychologically.

 

[The Lunch Legend]

It's baffling how long the fail safes were ignored, but hopefully this issue gets resolved definitely.
Unfortunately, it has come at the cost of so many lives.

 

[Aggelos]

The chief coroner of the Larissa Medical Examiner's Office reported that the death toll had risen to 57 fatalities.
Allegedly, the human error may have only been the tip of the iceberg, in a barrage of omissions and failures involving: budget cuts within Hellenic Trains SA, understaffing, safety systems that haven't been working, a railway system that is not properly maintained/serviced, etc that played their role in this disaster.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I dont know anything about trains, but skimming the posts it seems like a combo of a new driver and archaic safety controls and infrastructure.

Even though Greece seems like a broke country (bail outs needed and some reason hiring too many government workers), you got to put money into infrastructure and safety policies. You can always tell which countries do and dont. As per Agellos' post above, if a country cant fix train lines in 30 years, there's issues where money is being spent.

The ones that dont always have collapsing buildings, broken bridges, fires that can sweep across entire neighbourhoods, ferries overloading and sinking etc..

 

[EverydayBeast]

Trains are worth a lot they began using them in the 1900s one of the greatest methods of transportation we’ve ever seen, yet we get these rare deadly crashes.

 

[Kenpachii]

I dont know anything about trains, but skimming the posts it seems like a combo of a new driver and archaic safety controls and infrastructure.

Even though Greece seems like a broke country (bail outs needed and some reason hiring too many government workers), you got to put money into infrastructure and safety policies. You can always tell which countries do and dont. As per Agellos' post above, if a country cant fix train lines in 30 years, there's issues where money is being spent.

The ones that dont always have collapsing buildings, broken bridges, fires that can sweep across entire neighbourhoods, ferries overloading and sinking etc..

Knew a greek guy, he told me most people just ride those trains for free and can't be bothered to even pay. If its true that could be the issue right there.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Knew a greek guy, he told me most people just ride those trains for free and can't be bothered to even pay. If its true that could be the issue right there.

Probably a reason.

Greece also has shit loads of tax evasion too.

 

[TGO]

I have no words, this should have NEVER happened.
The amount of safe guards, location tracking etc that is and has been available for decades and this still happened.
R.I.P

 

[Tams]

Knew a greek guy, he told me most people just ride those trains for free and can't be bothered to even pay. If its true that could be the issue right there.

Very much this. Greece has some serious and deep social issues that make other countries' look like nothing.

There's a deeply ingrained stinginess and entitlement. They want public services but aren't prepared to pay for them. I don't know how or why it came to be, but it has.

Of course, that's not all Greeks. But it is a very significant number of them.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Damn, are airplanes the only relatively safe form of transportation?

 

[Fuz]

Not so sure with so many deaths involved...

Someone's head is gonna roll...

Spoiler

 

[Aggelos]

Actually now they have 56 people unaccounted-for and the confirmed fatalities are 57. This implies that there is a possibility that some people on the train were in fact "fare dodgers".
But this is still under investigation, nothing official as of yet, about (the) potential ticket dodgers on board.

 

[Vestal]

How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.

 

[Hugare]

There are two 2 different tracks in the Greek railway system, but it seems that a human error has in fact contributed to this tragedy.
The 60-year-old station master was put in this job a month ago after having one-month training. First, he stated that it was a system failure, but the latest reports mention that he confessed to his error (i.e. sending the passenger train to the track where the cargo train was traveling in the opposite direction).
The result? Head-on collision of two trains and an unspeakable tragedy.

Poor guy

Imagine his guilt for being responsible for so many deaths, ruining families, the resignation of the transport minister, the worst train accident on the history of the country and etc.

 

[Tams]

How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.

1. Underfund the railway.
2. Have a massive tragedy.

 

[Aggelos]

How in the year 2023 don't we have a complete digital map of the railway along with GPS location & direction for each train on it. Computer simulations would alert to and/or prevent collisions.
Its not rocket science.

Nope.
The trains and the railway system were safer back in 2010-ish than it is nowadays. Budget cuts, underfunding, understaffing and lay-offs over the years (there should have been at least two station masters at each station), a centralized train monitor system that was dismantled in 2020 (acting as a safeguard, in case of human error), delays over delays in implementing the European Train Control System, thefts-pillaging of copper wire that has degraded part of the railway system (meaning that station masters have to reroute trains to a different track in various parts), the alleged error of the train master and the deceased train conductor of the passenger train, and the list goes on and on.


Here the Greek reporter explains.

 

[Mohonky]

How the fuck can this happen with all the radio communication and stuff?

Rip.

Human error.

Just watch Air Crash Investigations / Mayday, it is scary how the most basic things don't get picked up on and the consequences of them.

The one where they covered the pito tubes with tape while cleaning the plane and forgot to remove the tape causing the plane to go down is literally amazing to me that such a vital piece of equipment is so easily rendered useless and can slhave such a dramatic effect.