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[Astray]

I think there is at least one positive side to it:

• If I really love a game, I'd feel very happy if others are also playing and experiencing the same thing.

There is also one practical/business side to it:

• If someone really loves a game, they'd be hoping they get more sequels or at least new games from that studio. And commercial success of a game is important to ensure that happens.

For example, most of us didn't like Concord, but obviously someone in this world must have. And they'd have like continuous support or maybe even a sequel and, therefore, would have wished that more people played Concord to keep the devs going.

I honestly think that what Piscatella said was right.. We have basically no business stats on releases so we overinflate the importance of what we get.

I also think this game is selling okay (maybe even more than okay), I just don't understand why people are scrambling to declare it a success and a GOTY like that.

 

[adamsapple]

You giving someone a sermon on "objectivity" is both hilarious, and hypocritical. Just stick to your knob polishing of all Microsoft's bought releases. It suits you much better.

Nah, I can be both right and polish the knob at the same time. Something demonstrable in this very topic. Don't hate cause you know I'm correct.

 

[Ristifer]

It need to sale yes ,

Amazon Best Sellers: Best Xbox Games

View the best video games in Amazon Best Sellers. Browse the 100 top video games to identify the most popular games. Get useful information on what other people are buying.

www.amazon.com

So, it's behind two heavily discounted games with gigantic fanbases and is currently sold out on Amazon? I don't think you're making the point you're itching to make here.

 

[onQ123]

We now got Sony guys absolutely concerned with the sales and future of this Xbox owned studio.....


....I'm over here living my best life playing this goty.

I mean a few days ago we were told that this game helped push Xbox ahead of PlayStation and Nintendo for the Holiday Season now we shouldn't care about how it does?

Variety: How ‘Indiana Jones’ and ‘Call of Duty’ Are Pushing Xbox Ahead of PlayStation, Nintendo in a Next Gen Console-Less Holiday Season

https://variety.com/2024/gaming/news/indiana-jones-and-the-great-circle-preview-video-game-plot-details-1236233902/ For lots of avid gamers this holiday season, there will be Indiana Jones — and then everybody else. Microsoft’s gaming division, after spending billions on developers and...

www.neogaf.com

 

[onQ123]

So, it's behind two heavily discounted games with gigantic fanbases and is currently sold out on Amazon? I don't think you're making the point you're itching to make here.

The game has digital codes just like the other games on the list

 

[Klayzer]

It needs to sale yes.

Amazon Best Sellers: Best Xbox Games

View the best video games in Amazon Best Sellers. Browse the 100 top video games to identify the most popular games. Get useful information on what other people are buying.

www.amazon.com

Number 3, isn't that bad of a debut, to be honest. Am I missing some context?

 

[Ristifer]

The game has digital codes just like the other games on the list

Doesn't really change the discounted/gigantic fanbases part. The digital code is still $70, but okay.

 

[Three]

Not the "gotcha" you think it is. Concord was objectively worse. Both games sucked. Also Concord had no Gamepass option, making the numbers even more depressing.

Except that's exactly what the guy you were arguing with was saying and you were defending redfall with that nonsense :

My initial comment was simply that for as much hate as Redfall got for being a flop, Concord has proven to be worse. Based on Steam numbers, that's objectively true for PC player count where we can measure such success.

Your response was to blur the lines. A defensive act. I'm more just laughing at the need for you to defend Concord.

Now you don't give a shit about these numbers again?

Old releases like Ragnarok and HFW doubled Indiana Jones day one release but I bet you'll argue against that too much like you were arguing with Helldivers and Halo Infinite. You people care when it suites you.

 

[grvg]

I'm pretty excited for it, will probably play it whenever I have a raytracing capable pc

 

[onQ123]

Number 3, isn't that bad of a debut, to be honest. Am I missing some context?

It released a day ago

 

[Mortisfacio]

Except that's exactly what the guy you were arguing with was saying and you were defending redfall with that nonsense :

Now you don't give a shit about these numbers again?

Old releases like Ragnarok and HFW doubled Indiana Jones day one release but I bet you'll argue against that too much like you were arguing with Helldivers and Halo Infinite. You people care when it suites you.

You're conflating games that released on Steam vs game that released on Steam + GamePass. If you can't understand the difference here, maybe you're not smart enough to be having this discussion.

 

[MMaRsu]

I mean a few days ago we were told that this game helped push Xbox ahead of PlayStation and Nintendo for the Holiday Season now we shouldn't care about how it does?

Variety: How ‘Indiana Jones’ and ‘Call of Duty’ Are Pushing Xbox Ahead of PlayStation, Nintendo in a Next Gen Console-Less Holiday Season

https://variety.com/2024/gaming/news/indiana-jones-and-the-great-circle-preview-video-game-plot-details-1236233902/ For lots of avid gamers this holiday season, there will be Indiana Jones — and then everybody else. Microsoft’s gaming division, after spending billions on developers and...

www.neogaf.com

Who cares what Variety writes lol...

 

[demigod]

Another fake neutral ousted.

 

[SmurfMustard]

If they made a game where all you do is nothing except sit in the car and having kitt talk to you with the themesong playing? Instant buy.

We already know that anything more complex than pressing the emoji button is a challenge for you, so a game where you'd have to do absolutely nothing does seem right up your alley.

 

[Klayzer]

Nah, I can be both right and polish the knob at the same time. Something demonstrable in this very topic. Don't hate cause you know I'm correct.

 

[Three]

You're conflating games that released on Steam vs game that released on Steam + GamePass. If you can't understand the difference here, maybe you're not smart enough to be having this discussion.

Just as I thought then. Stalker, Palworld and countless other games were and they too did much better on steam. HFW was even on PS+.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I honestly think that what Piscatella said was right.. We have basically no business stats on releases so we overinflate the importance of what we get.

I also think this game is selling okay (maybe even more than okay), I just don't understand why people are scrambling to declare it a success and a GOTY like that.

This. Pretty much what I was trying to say.

 

[Mortisfacio]

Just as I thought then. Stalker, Palworld and countless other games were and they too did much better on steam. HFW was even on PS+.

And yet Concord had no GamePass and couldn't push 1k. Redfall was a bad game, with numbers being taken by GamePass and still did 10x on Steam.

As I said, if you can't see the difference here, you're not smart enough to have this conversation.

 

[demigod]

We already know that anything more complex than pressing the emoji button is a challenge for you, so a game where you'd have to do absolutely nothing does seem right up your alley.

Don’t let my emojis hurt you now, we wouldn’t want that.

 

[RoboFu]

I am surprised it's doing anything on steam being a game pass game.

 

[Buggy Loop]

It already surpassed the first Wolfenstein, and will likely surpass the second game this weekend.

Amazing job Machine Games! Another modern classic.

This game is on gamepass and still is doing similar numbers to Wolfenstein. This is clearly a successful story.

Adding games that had NO gamepass competition

Returnal - 6,691
Ratchet and clank rift apart - 8,757
Uncharted Legacy of thieves - 10,851

Before you jump on me for saying I'm throwing sony games under the bus, no, see my previous posts on the exact subject matter about how relevant concurrent player count is for single player games. It just happens everytime Sony launches a game on PC we often have these threads about CCU.

ratchet, Returnal

Also bought Uncharted but haven't played it yet.

There's only so much you can extrapolate from concurrent users. Fanboys are hard on these stats but it's the only place where you even have this kind of data. There can be a shitload of peoples waiting to have time to play it,

Another case



Horizon zero dawn - 56,557
Days Gone - 27,450
God of War - 73,529

Spider-man had reports of selling 1.5M+ units, ccu peak 66,436

They're bigger numbers for sure but there's no extrapolation to be made here between the sales numbers and the CCU. Imagine if it doesn't say anything for sales, how difficult it becomes to extrapolate the success when you factor in gamepass. Nobody on this board even has a chance of estimating anything out of it.

There's no "twitch" phenomenon with these kind of games, the goblin king has not put his legions to play the next GAAS big thing. It's a single player game, by the time peoples typically put a lot of time gaming on a friday night or saturnay afternoon, there's already peoples who finished the game.

If other platforms had this statistic, we could talk and start extrapolating something. But we don't.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

if it doesn't crack 30k by Sunday it will be a bad look. Either way, this game is going to be a financial flop. PS could make things better tho. I don't think Xbox is retared enough to sign a deal with Lucas/Disney based on copies sold.

 

[Klayzer]

Gamers wishing for failure on this release, are being very short-sided. We need more single player games to succeed. First person perspective, is not my personal cup of tea, but I want it to do well.

 

[yazenov]

I am surprised it's doing anything on steam being a game pass game.

As many people pointed out in this thread, we have apples to apples examples of day one Gamepass games having huge numbers on steam. The recent example is Stalker 2 which did 10x of what Indiana Jones did.

https://steamdb.info/app/1643320/charts/

This game under preformed compared to other Gamepass games.

 

[Spitfire098]

We now got Sony guys absolutely concerned with the sales and future of this Xbox owned studio.....


....I'm over here living my best life playing this goty.

You literally made a thread asking where people are playing Indy and specifically mention low steam ccu...is this consider living your best life?

Where are you playing Indiana Jones: The Great Circle?

Like the title says. Indy has launched and the steam numbers are not looking too great at launch. If you are playing the game, where are you playing it? Would be good, if people answer honestly to see from GAF's sample size where people have chosen to play.

www.neogaf.com

 

[Plague Doctor]

Everyone shut the fuck up.

12k is great CCU for an Indie game.

Wait.... wrong Indy.

 

[Astray]

People need to understand something important about Publishers and PC sales: They don't only mean Direct Steam/Epic/GOG, they also mean their advance sales to the PC key sites (legit and grey).

Yesterday I looked up Indiana Jones on GMG to see if they have an XP offer, but the game was "Out of Stock".. That would imply that they keep a stock of keys for every game, which is sold in advance and topped up when stock runs low or runs out entirely.

It's basically the old-school publisher/retail agreement, but played out in digital form.

This means that Microsoft could have sold 10,000 keys to say, GMG or Gamesplanet alone, and pocketed a portion (or all) of the money, meanwhile the game "only has 12k CCUs". Now apply this same logic to all games that are being sold on PC.

Steam CCUs only tell the full picture when the game is F2P on Steam, because then you won't be "buying" the game from a non-Steam store, and even then it only tells the Steam portion of the story.

 

[mayham2199]

if it doesn't crack 30k by Sunday it will be a bad look. Either way, this game is going to be a financial flop. PS could make things better tho. I don't think Xbox is retared enough to sign a deal with Lucas/Disney based on copies sold.

The deal was signed before MS took over the company so I can guarantee it was signed based on copies sold. On top of that Phil Spencer even came out and said that IPs like Indiana Jones just don't make sense for them because of Gamepass.

People need to understand something important about Publishers and PC sales: They don't only mean Direct Steam/Epic/GOG, they also mean their advance sales to the PC key sites (legit and grey).

Yesterday I looked up Indiana Jones on GMG to see if they have an XP offer, but the game was "Out of Stock".. That would imply that they keep a stock of keys for every game, which is sold in advance and topped up when stock runs low or runs out entirely.

It's basically the old-school publisher/retail agreement, but played out in digital form.

This means that Microsoft could have sold 10,000 keys to say, GMG or Gamesplanet alone, and pocketed a portion (or all) of the money, meanwhile the game "only has 12k CCUs". Now apply this same logic to all games that are being sold on PC.

Steam CCUs only tell the full picture when the game is F2P on Steam, because then you won't be "buying" the game from a non-Steam store, and even then it only tells the Steam portion of the story.

True but we've also seen the kind of crazy contracts Disney has for their IPs to the point even EA wants to move away from these sort of deals. Phil already said these deals don't make sense for them because of gamepass. It doesn't just have to do ok it has to sell very well for MS and in the end I think they are going to lose money no matter what.

 

[Starbuck2907]

https://steamdb.info/app/1643320/charts/

vs

https://steamdb.info/app/2677660/charts/

Apples to apples.

Good point, but Stalker 2 is a much more pc gamer centric title than Indy. I bet it’s catering to a slightly different audience than Indy. The pc community has a lot of love for the Stalker ip and know it will be good for modding, so they bought it and are still playing it. It will be good for modding for years. Whereas Indy is more of a one and done story driven game they can get on Gamepass and won’t need to buy.

 

[jm89]

We now got Sony guys absolutely concerned with the sales and future of this Xbox owned studio.....

You mean like you in playstation sales and ccu threads?

 

[Mortisfacio]

if it doesn't crack 30k by Sunday it will be a bad look. Either way, this game is going to be a financial flop. PS could make things better tho. I don't think Xbox is retared enough to sign a deal with Lucas/Disney based on copies sold.

Do we know the estimated budget of the game? Other than GAF, I didn't see much talk about it. No ad campaigns (not saying they didn't exist, I just didn't see them). An IP with the last good movie being in 1989. Was just a weird choice overall and no hype behind it, even from the Xbox team. Maybe the ad campaign on my end just got drowned out in the sea of COD BOPS 6 ads?

 

[Astray]

You mean like you in playstation sales and ccu threads?

He has 25 PS5s he can't be a console warrior ok.

 

[Three]

Another fake neutral ousted.

Guy was outed already, a while back he was trying to argue that hellblade 2 had more gameplay than TLOU and Death Stranding 2.

Went on and on about poor AI, combat, cutscenes, walk and talk.

Yet I bet he would defend the bad AI, combat, walk and talk and cutscenes in Indie religiously.

 

[Astray]

True but we've also seen the kind of crazy contracts Disney has for their IPs to the point even EA wants to move away from these sort of deals. Phil already said these deals don't make sense for them because of gamepass. It doesn't just have to do ok it has to sell very well for MS and in the end I think they are going to lose money no matter what.

That's why I think this game won't make its money back by 2025 (even PS5 won't help much imo, competition is just too steep in 2025). It's selling ok and word of mouth is good, but it's also trying to make back an astounding amount of money while still releasing on a stagnant subscription service.. That's a tall ask no matter who you are.

It's not just the licensing money, but also how expensive the game looks (it's honestly very gorgeous and painstakingly made.. Very AAA). It's clearly a big budget problem

 

[Iced Arcade]

Not surprised.

- you are going to get a bulk of people on game pass.
- no offense but indie is an old IP that withered away in popularity years ago.
- Xbox doesn't know how marketing works anymore. More interested in catchy "this is an Xbox" and game pass sizzle reels than marketing actual games.

I'll probably start it tonight.

 

[poppabk]

if it doesn't crack 30k by Sunday it will be a bad look. Either way, this game is going to be a financial flop. PS could make things better tho. I don't think Xbox is retared enough to sign a deal with Lucas/Disney based on copies sold.

It's on gamepass. There is no way to know if it is financially succesful because the metrics are totally different. Even if MS came out and said that it was financially succesful most of us would have doubts.
Is gamepass profitable? We don't know, and even if MS said it was we would doubt that they are taking all expenses in to account.

 

[Thief1987]

Do we know the estimated budget of the game? Other than GAF, I didn't see much talk about it. No ad campaigns (not saying they didn't exist, I just didn't see them). An IP with the last good movie being in 1989. Was just a weird choice overall and no hype behind it, even from the Xbox team. Maybe the ad campaign on my end just got drowned out in the sea of COD BOPS 6 ads?

It's a 2 hundred devs studio with the first full game release since 2017, no matter how you spin it this game has pretty hefty budget.

 

[Mortisfacio]

Guy was outed already, a while back he was trying to argue that hellblade 2 had more gameplay than TLOU and Death Stranding 2.

Went on and on about poor AI, combat, cutscenes, walk and talk.

Yet I bet he would defend the bad AI, combat, walk and talk and cutscenes in Indie religiously.

When did I say Hellblade 2 had more gameplay than TLoU? I'm on record saying the opposite. Saying "TLOU is a poor example of complex gameplay" some people that couldn't read then took that to assume it was a comparison. I then repeated multiple times I wasn't comparing the two. TLOU also wasn't brought up by myself. As for DS2, the game isn't out. The first is a boring walking sim I quit after 10 hours of boredom, but as for the second, I think my only comments on it is in the realm of "I'll pass" as the first one is boring. Bo Burnham's comments on it "I think it's boring, but that's the point" is spot on there.

2nd line is true. The first TLOU is overrated. The AI was terrible and I'm not going to pretend it wasn't.

I would not defend bad AI in this game, other than joke that maybe the existence of bad AI is to mock the terrible Germans from the original movie trilogy. The AI in the game vs how dumb they were in the movies is pretty comparable, but that would just be a joke comparison. The AI still is bad.

Once again, please learn to read.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Do we know the estimated budget of the game? Other than GAF, I didn't see much talk about it. No ad campaigns (not saying they didn't exist, I just didn't see them). An IP with the last good movie being in 1989. Was just a weird choice overall and no hype behind it, even from the Xbox team. Maybe the ad campaign on my end just got drowned out in the sea of COD BOPS 6 ads?

i mean, videogames are having movie like budgets nowadays. it seems this game had a smooth and focused development (they didn't try to do anything outside their wheelhouse and they weren't overambitious with it) i would guess between 100-150 Million without marketing. but you are right, it seems marketing wise, MS is not pushing this game that hard.

 

[King Dazzar]

I think day and date on PS would have created more interest and excitement around it. And short sighted money grab with the early access timings.

 

[Gamezone]

Using Steam CCU for a game that launches on Game Pass just doesn't work the way you all want it to.

The industry has moved on.

Yet Sea of Thieves reached almost 70,000 players on Steam after being avaliable on Xbox and their own PC store for more than a year.

 

[Three]

When did I say Hellblade 2 had more gameplay than TLoU? I'm on record saying the opposite. Saying "TLOU is a poor example of complex gameplay" some people that couldn't read then took that to assume it was a comparison. I then repeated multiple times I wasn't comparing the two. TLOU also wasn't brought up by myself. As for DS2, the game isn't out. The first is a boring walking sim I quit after 10 hours of boredom, but as for the second, I think my only comments on it is in the realm of "I'll pass" as the first one is boring. Bo Burnham's comments on it "I think it's boring, but that's the point" is spot on there.

2nd line is true. The first TLOU is overrated. The AI was terrible and I'm not going to pretend it wasn't.

I would not defend bad AI in this game, other than joke that maybe the existence of bad AI is to mock the terrible Germans from the original movie trilogy. The AI in the game vs how dumb they were in the movies is pretty comparable, but that would just be a joke comparison. The AI still is bad.

Once again, please learn to read.

Maybe visit the ridiculous thread you were in where everybody was laughing at your takes

Hellblade had as much gameplay as a Naughty Dog game.

Ask yourself the same question, pretending TLoU had gameplay. Corridor brick throwing is technically gameplay, but is it really?

I haven't played 2 yet, but the first Hellblade had more gameplay in 6-7 hours it took me to beat than the 20~ hours of Death Stranding before I uninstalled it.

TLoU is largely a walking and talking game with some combat and brick throwing simulation mixed in. Quit pretending it's not.

Lol, OK bud. Shoot a few guys, throw some bricks, walk some more, loot some stuff, another cutscene.

Now do the same for Indiana Jones.

 

[Mortisfacio]

Maybe visit the ridiculous thread you were in where everybody was laughing at your takes






Now do the same for Indiana Jones.

As you proved with these, I never said Hellblade had more gameplay than TLoU. Thank you for confirming I was right.

 

[Klayzer]

You literally made a thread asking where people are playing Indy and specifically mention low steam ccu...is this consider living your best life?

Where are you playing Indiana Jones: The Great Circle?

Like the title says. Indy has launched and the steam numbers are not looking too great at launch. If you are playing the game, where are you playing it? Would be good, if people answer honestly to see from GAF's sample size where people have chosen to play.

www.neogaf.com

Neutral gamer persona activated.

 

[Little Chicken]

Yet Sea of Thieves reached almost 70,000 players on Steam after being avaliable on Xbox and their own PC store for more than a year.

Sea of Thieves launched on steam at like $30.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

It's on gamepass. There is no way to know if it is financially succesful because the metrics are totally different. Even if MS came out and said that it was financially succesful most of us would have doubts.
Is gamepass profitable? We don't know, and even if MS said it was we would doubt that they are taking all expenses in to account.

if we can't rely on the PR Talk from xbox and it's executives. the only thing we have is their financial reports and hard confirmations like copies sold or game pass growth (numbers of subscribers)

but here's the thing: games like this are expected to sell 10-15 million copies to be considered an unmitigated success

and if it is not about sales, it has to be about it's revenue.

i don't think it's realistic to expect around 30M NEW Game Pass subscribers thanks to this game.

So, the amount of revenue generated from copies sold on Xbox, PC (Steam/MS Store), and Game Pass (PC/Console) is always going to be less than what the game would have earned by just selling the game outright.

 

[GHG]

Neutral gamer persona activated.

And when that fails it's "PC gamer".

 

[Klayzer]

And when that fails it's "PC gamer".

 

[SEGAvangelist]

So why do people want this game to fail?

 

[Mortisfacio]

So why do people want this game to fail?

It's not day 1 on PS5. Console warring.