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[Nirolak]

* Capcom makes an intentional effort to build up the Resident Evil audience on the GameCube. They have relatively great success doing so, before deciding to announce the PS2 port of the most anticipated GameCube Resident Evil, RE4, before the GameCube version is released. Capcom then starts off brilliantly on the Wii by bringing the Director's Cut re-release of RE4 on Wii that they should've had on GameCube. They follow up that obvious desire for more Resident Evil on the system with a quick turnaround on a light-gun shooter with some addition to the overall Resident Evil mythos. 15 months later, Wii has gotten two Japan-only, direct GameCube ports with little change and Resident Evil 5 is launching exclusively on the PS360. Also see: Dead Rising 2 being announced as a PS360 exclusive before Dead Rising Wii is released.

Actually I think that one's a tad unfair to Capcom. Takeuchi said they'd have to really strip down some of the events in RE5 to get it on the Wii so instead of giving them a half-assed port they're building a new Resident Evil Wii game from the ground up. They also did entirely redo Spyborgs after people said it looked like it was going to be awful.

Though I will agree, Chop 'Til You Drop was a pretty inexcusable mess that probably should have never been made in the first place.

 

[AniHawk]

Anybody else care to add some more examples?

Sega starts off relatively strong with two original games that were made with the controller in mind: Super Monkey Ball (3): Banana Blitz and Sonic and the Secret Rings. Among a rushed NiGHTS sequel and another Samba de Amigo game, they release House of the Dead 2 & 3 Returns, building a small base for the franchise. They follow up with House of the Dead Overkill, and decide to publish games from other developers that are original and unique to the system, like MadWorld, Let's Tap, and The Conduit, while following up with another Sonic game in roughly the same vein as Secret Rings.

Oh wait, that's an example of a company doing something right. And it's Sega. This generation is fucking weird.

 

[Eteric Rice]

Actually I think that one's a tad unfair to Capcom. Takeuchi said they'd have to really strip down some of the events in RE5 to get it on the Wii so instead of giving them a half-assed port they're building a new Resident Evil Wii game from the ground up. They also did entirely redo Spyborgs after people said it looked like it was going to be awful.

Though I will agree, Chop 'Til You Drop was a pretty inexcusable mess that probably should have never been made in the first place.

I've heard nothing about this. All I've heard is the director of RE5 say they would like to make a Wii RE eventually.

RE5 not being on the Wii was a fuck up, really. If some content couldn't be replicated on the Wii, they should have replaced it with something that can. Hell, that would have given some of the RE freaks a reason to buy both.

I know one person on here who would have bought both.

And what the fuck with no Street Fighter IV on the Wii? If they do end up releasing it, I hope they add some God damn exclusive characters or some shit.

 

[Y2Kev]

Here's a great one:

*Nintendo starts off great by releasing a shitton of fun games and then releases Animal Crossing. Gaming never recovered.

 

[Nirolak]

I've heard nothing about this. All I've heard is the director of RE5 say they would like to make a Wii RE eventually.

RE5 not being on the Wii was a fuck up, really. If some content couldn't be replicated on the Wii, they should have replaced it with something that can. Hell, that would have given some of the RE freaks a reason to buy both.

I know one person on here who would have bought both.

And what the fuck with no Street Fighter IV on the Wii? If they do end up releasing it, I hope they add some God damn exclusive characters or some shit.

Well, I inferred the "from the ground up" part from this response he gave in the 1UP interview:

JT: As far as Dead Space goes, yeah, I played it in Japan. I bought it myself, and everybody on the development team thought it was a really well put-together game. It was really well designed, and the game world just had a great feel. It was just really well created, and I think it's a great piece of work. I don't know what plans they have yet, but I think they must have great technology to bring [Dead Space] over onto the Wii. As for RE5, there's just so much going on in the game that I think it's hard for us to say that we could make a Wii version, at least as it is right now on the 360 and PS3. However, we do know that there are a lot of people out there who want to experience Resident Evil on the Wii; we hear that a lot. I'm constantly trying to think of good ideas for people to experience Resident Evil in some form on the Wii.

He says RE5 would be really hard to port over followed by a statement inferring a new experience for the Wii. I'd have to imagine that would be a ground up build, or at least using a Wii minded engine and design instead.

I mean, if it wasn't ground up, why not just half-ass a version of RE5 over? It'd probably be easier and cheaper than a whole new game.

 

[Eteric Rice]

Eww, "in some form." God damn it we want a traditional RE.

Either way, they need to get RE5 on the Wii as best as they can. Hell, most major franchises should be trying to get there somehow. This is the first generation where the market leader is ignored.

 

[Nirolak]

This is the first generation where the market leader is ignored.

Actually, this is a misconception really. The Wii isn't being ignored at all, it's just the Wii's hardcore audience that's being ignored.

EA is dedicating 50% of its games this year to the Wii. Series like EA Sports Active, Grand Slam Tennis, the MySims Series, Sim Animals, Hasbro Game Night, and Spore Hero are all really big deal games, it's just that they're a big deal with the casual audience instead of the hardcore.

 

[Regulus Tera]

This is the first generation where the market leader is ignored.

I thought DS support was all fine and dandy.

 

[donny2112]

I thought DS support was all fine and dandy.

Nah. Western developers are mostly shunning the handheld market.

Here's a great one:

*Nintendo starts off great by releasing a ton of fun games and then releases Animal Crossing. Gaming never recovered.

Nah. I think gaming recovered just fine with Metroid Prime coming out a couple of months later.

 

[pseudocaesar]

I thought DS support was all fine and dandy.

Yeh why does everyone conveniently ignore handhelds when discussing hardware.

 

[Y2Kev]

Nah. Western developers are mostly shunning the handheld market.



Nah. I think gaming recovered just fine with Metroid Prime coming out a couple of months later.

I'm pretty sure I can correlate animal crossing with the housing bubble and the discovery of ebola

 

[donny2112]

I'm pretty sure I can correlate animal crossing with the housing bubble and the discovery of ebola

Tom Nook's mortgage rates are pretty bad.

 

[Link]

Welcome to my side, fellas. I hope you brought punch and pie.

Also, late ports will do shit for sales. The hype is already long gone.

 

[Nirolak]

I'm pretty sure I can correlate animal crossing with the housing bubble and the discovery of ebola

Personally I like to compare it to Brutus stabbing Caesar and the downfall of the Roman Empire.

...or gumballs machines, depending on my mood.

 

[donny2112]

Personally I like to compare it to Brutus stabbing Caesar

Last knife in wins?

Welcome to my side, fellas. I hope you brought punch and pie.

I like punch, but someone else will need to bring the pie.

 

[Eteric Rice]

Yeh why does everyone conveniently ignore handhelds when discussing hardware.

I'm talking about in the home console market.

 

[pseudocaesar]

I'm talking about in the home console market.

Ok that makes sense, but ya know what I meant. Alot of people do it.

 

[Warren Ellis]

Actually, this is a misconception really. The Wii isn't being ignored at all, it's just the Wii's hardcore audience that's being ignored.

EA is dedicating 50% of its games this year to the Wii. Series like EA Sports Active, Grand Slam Tennis, the MySims Series, Sim Animals, Hasbro Game Night, and Spore Hero are all really big deal games, it's just that they're a big deal with the casual audience instead of the hardcore.

define "big deal". All these games together will sell less than a "big deal" hd game like GTA IV or Resident evil 5. Big deal revenues ?

face it, this is the first time in videogame history that the big projects aren't on the console that sells better.

 

[Nirolak]

define "big deal". All these games together will sell less than a "big deal" hd game like GTA IV or Resident evil 5. Big deal revenues ?

face it, this is the first time in videogame history that the big projects aren't on the console that sells better.

The Hasbro games alone sold about 2 million copies in less than two months, and they're the type of software that is likely to keep on selling with the Wii casual crowd.

I also wouldn't count out a physical fitness game designed by Oprah's personal trainer and likely to be featured on Oprah later. That type of marketing alone can do a lot for a game.

But yes, they would also be very high revenue games as well, since they cost very little to make.

And hey, Sega's best selling game recently was Mario and Sonic At The Olympics, which sold over 10 million units worldwide (it's in the press release there). That's easily up there with (and often above) series like GTA and Resident Evil, so you never know when one of these casual games will just explode.

Also, we're still looking at "big projects" from the perspective of what games are a big deal to us personally. In reality, a lot of casual games are now much bigger deals than a lot of the traditional hardcore series, so many of the biggest games are still on the market leader, they're just not the ones you may necessarily want.

 

[Warren Ellis]

well, i don't want GTA, and i never played it. For me it is about as interesting as my sims.It is not an opinion. GTA4 and Resident evil 5 are big projects.. because the videogame industry calls them so. The games that you mentioned are referred as casual games even by their producers. They know what they are, and they are sold for what they are: b-games for a b-console. There are few of them that sold really well like cooking mama, but not as well as HD hits. Mario and sonic is an exception, in part because it was the official game of the olympics and because there were mario and sonic as main characters, but i don't know if mario and sonic is really a casual game.

 

[Nirolak]

well, i don't want GTA, and i never played it. For me it is about as interesting as my sims.It is not an opinion. GTA4 and Resident evil 5 are big projects.. because the videogame industry calls them so. The games that you mentioned are referred as casual games even by their producers. They know what they are, and they are sold for what they are: b-games for a b-console. There are few of them that sold really well like cooking mama, but not as well as HD hits. Mario and sonic is an exception, in part because it was the official game of the olympics and because there were mario and sonic as main characters, but i don't know if mario and sonic is really a casual game.

I didn't refer to GTA4 and RE5 as not being big projects though. They very obviously are. However, the way we judge casual games as not big projects is mostly through our lens as core gamers, and most developers are core gamers as well, so they see the games in the same way.

The Sims 3 for example is a very big project, but it has very little hype around message boards or the general gaming community. That is very odd for a series that has sold over 100 million copies, and if I were to judge it solely based upon the core gamer reaction, it'd pretty easily be considered a "b" game.

I suspect that as casual games continue to increase in sales though, you'll start seeing developers refer to certain casual titles as very big deals as well, as they'll finally understand their sales importance. We're just still at the start of the industry really understanding the casual market, especially from the perspective of third parties.

 

[HK-47]

The Hasbro games alone sold about 2 million copies in less than two months, and they're the type of software that is likely to keep on selling with the Wii casual crowd.

I also wouldn't count out a physical fitness game designed by Oprah's personal trainer and likely to be featured on Oprah later. That type of marketing alone can do a lot for a game.

But yes, they would also be very high revenue games as well, since they cost very little to make.

And hey, Sega's best selling game recently was Mario and Sonic At The Olympics, which sold over 10 million units worldwide (it's in the press release there). That's easily up there with (and often above) series like GTA and Resident Evil, so you never know when one of these casual games will just explode.

Also, we're still looking at "big projects" from the perspective of what games are a big deal to us personally. In reality, a lot of casual games are now much bigger deals than a lot of the traditional hardcore series, so many of the biggest games are still on the market leader, they're just not the ones you may necessarily want.

M&S doesnt beat any of the mainline GTAs

 

[Nirolak]

M&S doesnt beat any of the mainline GTAs

That's totally true. By the above comment I meant it sold a lot more than the mainline Resident Evil games. The wording was a bit bad on my part there.

 

[perfectchaos007]

WII | 16,973
PS3 | 16,149

Yikes!

Okay lets just say for sake of argument that the Wii never goes back to selling like it did in 2007 and 2008. Lets say that the decline in sales continue and the Wii dies out by the end of the year. Was it a fad, or was it real game console that just had a shorter lifespan?

On one hand, a FAD doesn't last more than 2 years. The Wii has been around since late 2006. On the other hand, the beanie baby fad was in full swing for at least 4 years. I don't know of anyone who doesn't consider the beanie baby era a fad. IDK. Hopefully Nintendo will release some good games for the Wii so we won't be debating on forums for decades whether or not the Wii was a fad.

And just so you guys know, the Wii is the only current gen system I own.

 

[Regulus Tera]

I'm talking about in the home console market.

It seems to me like publishers are not going "oh this Wii thing is selling tons more than the HD twins we should make games for it", but rather "oh the DS and PSP are selling tons more than the HD twins and the Wii we should make games for them".

 

[Eteric Rice]

It seems to me like publishers are not going "oh this Wii thing is selling tons more than the HD twins we should make games for it", but rather "oh the DS and PSP are selling tons more than the HD twins and the Wii, we should make games for them".

Then why isn't there a Street Fighter IV, RE5, etc on the DS and PSP?

 

[Regulus Tera]

Then why isn't there a Street Fighter IV, RE5, etc on the DS and PSP?

Capcom is special. <3

Spoiler

To be clearer, Capcom is less Japanese-centric than other companies, so they look at the HD market outside elsewhere and take advantage of it.

 

[Nirolak]

Capcom is special. <3

Spoiler

To be clearer, Capcom is less Japanese-centric than other companies, so they look at the HD market outside elsewhere and take advantage of it.

I think they've also had every HD game they make sell over 1.5 million copies this generation so far. Perhaps even 2 million copies actually but I'm not sure if Dead Rising actually passed that number.

It's odd that out of all the publishers, Capcom seems to be the one that understands the HD model best. Would have never guessed this if you asked me four years ago.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

I think they've also had every HD game they make sell over 1.5 million copies this generation so far. Perhaps even 2 million copies actually but I'm not sure if Dead Rising actually passed that number.

It's odd that out of all the publishers, Capcom seems to be the one that understands the HD model best. Would have never guessed this if you asked me four years ago.

What makes you say that?

 

[max-pain]

Then why isn't there a Street Fighter IV, RE5, etc on the DS and PSP?

I still don't understand why there isn't a RE4 port for the PSP

 

[Nirolak]

What makes you say that?

Well, the HD model so far seems to be making games that really appeal to the biggest fanbases on the systems they're on, and Capcom really seems to be able to tune into that.

They also seem to really understand the value of widespread marketing this generation, which is something that seems to have a really big effect on sales. I mean, Lost Planet had $20 million in advertising and ended up selling about 2.5 million copies despite being an early generation title with pretty mixed reviews.

I also see Resident Evil 5 ads all over when I'm going around in the real world. People I know who don't even follow games much seem to understand its coming and want it, and that's something that seems fundamental to sales success on the HD consoles.

Though I guess you could make that argument for other platforms too, but I mean, HD budgeting really seems to live or die by having giant hits.

Unless you mean why it surprised me, and that's more because after their initial success with titles like Street Fighter II and RE2, they seemed to have a period where they really couldn't get into the mainstream with their games, which is what tends to kill people in the HD market.

 

[Lightning]

Eww, "in some form." God damn it we want a traditional RE.

Either way, they need to get RE5 on the Wii as best as they can. Hell, most major franchises should be trying to get there somehow. This is the first generation where the market leader is ignored.

It's up to Nintendo to secure themselves these games and their versions. They need to discuss things with 3rd parties and work out something that can work.

They made this bed themselves. They are the ones who decided to radically change the control systems and produce a hardware machine that resembles a last gen system. That was their decision. So Nintendo can't expect 3rd parties to completely redesign their games just to get them to work on the Wii.

 

[max-pain]

Works in progress:

* Capcom makes an intentional effort to build up the Resident Evil audience on the GameCube. They have relatively great success doing so, before deciding to announce the PS2 port of the most anticipated GameCube Resident Evil, RE4, before the GameCube version is released. Capcom then starts off brilliantly on the Wii by bringing the Director's Cut re-release of RE4 on Wii that they should've had on GameCube. They follow up that obvious desire for more Resident Evil on the system with a quick turnaround on a light-gun shooter with some addition to the overall Resident Evil mythos. 15 months later, Wii has gotten two Japan-only, direct GameCube ports with little change and Resident Evil 5 is launching exclusively on the PS360. Also see: Dead Rising 2 being announced as a PS360 exclusive before Dead Rising Wii is released.

Why is this work in progress? They fucked this up 8-9 years ago

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Sega starts off relatively strong with two original games that were made with the controller in mind: Super Monkey Ball (3): Banana Blitz and Sonic and the Secret Rings. Among a rushed NiGHTS sequel and another Samba de Amigo game, they release House of the Dead 2 & 3 Returns, building a small base for the franchise. They follow up with House of the Dead Overkill, and decide to publish games from other developers that are original and unique to the system, like MadWorld, Let's Tap, and The Conduit, while following up with another Sonic game in roughly the same vein as Secret Rings.

Oh wait, that's an example of a company doing something right. And it's Sega. This generation is fucking weird.

Well SEGA moved to the Wii because there really was no where else to go. Their games bombed on the HD consoles and their ports and spinoffs performed respectable on the Wii. It only makes sense to head Wii despite moneyhats and power temptation.

Unless you mean why it surprised me, and that's more because after their initial success with titles like Street Fighter II and RE2, they seemed to have a period where they really couldn't get into the mainstream with their games, which is what tends to kill people in the HD market.

Ahh I see what you mean. Besides Resident Evil, last generation they had nothing that was mainstream. Devil May Cry was big but nowhere near as big as it is now and besides those games well...Viewtiful Joe? No. Okami? No. Uhh...yeah.

 

[Cipherr]

It's up to Nintendo to secure themselves these games and their versions. They need to discuss things with 3rd parties and work out something that can work.

They made this bed themselves. They are the ones who decided to radically change the control systems and produce a hardware machine that resembles a last gen system. That was their decision. So Nintendo can't expect 3rd parties to completely redesign their games just to get them to work on the Wii.

As far as Im concerned building the highest installbase, and selling the most software month to month is doing what they should be doing. The only bed they have made is the #1 console of the gen. If the third parties decide they dont want to bother with it, they dont have to. Its not like Capcom isnt making money on PS360.

 

[Nuclear Muffin]

The Wii can still recover from its slump, look at the PSP! One game and suddenly it rises to DS like status in Japan!

The Wii needs games and proper 3rd Party support. That is what it's lacking and that's why it is faultering in Japan right now.

 

[Lightning]

As far as Im concerned building the highest installbase, and selling the most software month to month is doing what they should be doing. The only bed they have made is the #1 console of the gen. If the third parties decide they dont want to bother with it, they dont have to.

Indeed. Hence the Wii fans crying everytime a big game is announced and released from a 3rd party and it's PS360 instead of being on the Wii.

 

[Eteric Rice]

The Wii can still recover from its slump, look at the PSP! One game and suddenly it rises to DS like status in Japan!

The Wii needs games and proper 3rd Party support. That is what it's lacking and that's why it is faultering in Japan right now.

Lol, no.

Though it's doing a lot better now. Has some pretty good games.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Indeed. Hence the Wii fans crying everytime a big game is announced and released from a 3rd party and it's PS360 instead of being on the Wii.

To be fair, the other side of the fence does the same when a Wii exclusive is announced.

 

[max-pain]

As far as Im concerned building the highest installbase, and selling the most software month to month is doing what they should be doing. The only bed they have made is the #1 console of the gen. If the third parties decide they dont want to bother with it, they dont have to. Its not like Capcom isnt making money on PS360.

The PS360 has the same intalled base as the Wii with a much more hardcore user base (bigger sales).

 

[Eteric Rice]

The PS360 has the same intalled base as the Wii with a much more hardcore user base (bigger sales).

First part isn't correct (at least from what I've heard), second part probably. But only because they haven't put any hardcore games there in the first place. How is a similar hardcore fanbase going to appear on the Wii when they refuse to put hardcore games on it?

 

[WinFonda]

Eww, "in some form." God damn it we want a traditional RE.

Either way, they need to get RE5 on the Wii as best as they can. Hell, most major franchises should be trying to get there somehow. This is the first generation where the market leader is ignored.

This is the first generation where the market leader is not cross compatible with the other platforms. If Wii could run PS360 games reasonably, this wouldn't even be an issue. But as it stands, it's not even a matter of reducing graphics to get the game on the Wii. The games themselves have to be completely redesigned and reworked.

 

[max-pain]

First part isn't correct (at least from what I've heard), second part probably. But only because they haven't put any hardcore games there in the first place. How is a similar hardcore fanbase going to appear on the Wii when they refuse to put hardcore games on it?

PS360: 49.8 million (PS3: 21.3, 360: 28.5)
Wii: 44.96 million
I think hardcore users very much care about graphics, online, etc

 

[max-pain]

This is the first generation where the market leader is not cross compatible with the other platforms. If Wii could run PS360 games reasonably, this wouldn't even be an issue. But as it stands, it's not even a matter of reducing graphics to get the game on the Wii. The games themselves have to be completely redesigned and reworked.

.

 

[Kurosaki Ichigo]

Wii must be truly fucked if it needs 3rd parties to return to 2007 sales like you guys say. I'd say you're mixing your dreams of getting the games you want with what the Wii actually needs to drive hardware sales.

And that's first party games. Its what drove it in the first place, its what drove DS all along, it is what took like 80% of all total wii software sales.

See highest Nintendo title on this week chart, its Wii Fit. Released in December 2007. If Nintendo wants to drive Wii hardware to previous heights, it needs to release more hits like that. Whether it'd be enough with Wii Sports 2 is still to be seen.

 

[TheChaos]

Nah. Western developers are mostly shunning the handheld market.

It's still amazing that DS consistently sells so well yet Western Devs are still saying "handhelds eww icky". I guess working with limitations scares them off. *shrug*

 

[Ashour]

Oh wait, that's an example of a company doing something right. And it's Sega. This generation is fucking weird.

:lol I do agree it’s been a strange generation so far another example is how EA has been releasing excellent (and sometimes original) games.

 

[test_account]

Not really. Those franchises make the top 5 of last generation. Everything else tops out at 1.2 million or less (without getting into rereleases or special editions), and many of them have already appeared this generation.

Ah ok, i guess that thought there was more console (not handheld) 3rd party million sellers in Japan in the last generation. Since many of these franchices are already out on consoles this generation as you say, i guess that we wont see too many 3rd party million sellers on the PS3, the Wii and on the Xbox 360 this generation then. Besides Final Fantasy XIII and Dragon Quest X that is. Thanks for the info!

I think it should be interesting to see if we see if any 3rd party game could be able to sell over a million copies on Japan this generation. I dont have too high hopes for it though, but who knows what will happend, but maybe some new and really popular game will be released that we dont know about yet? Who knows

EDIT: I added some text.

 

[_Alkaline_]

:lol I do agree it’s been a strange generation so far another example is how EA has been releasing excellent (and sometimes original) games.

And meanwhile Ubisoft and (for the most part) Konami have been complete shambles this gen.

 

[Johann]

A year ago you would have laughed in wrowa's face and called him/her foolish for even suggesting that such a thing were possible.

But now, well, it seems times have changed.

Versus seems to be a huge problem for Square-Enix. It needs a lot of manpower to get it off the ground and show some real progress but FFXIII needs every bit of the company's resources (it even cannibalized some of the Versus team already) since it is the company main attraction next to a Dragon Quest main entry. It wouldn't be surprising to see Versus become a multi-platform title like FFXIII.

As for a Wii version, I'd actually think that silly fake "Square-Enix insider" list with its "Versus is now a CGI movie" is more probable. A lot of Japanese companies (with the notable exception of Capcom) are having trouble transitioning into HD without their logistics going haywire.