Metallix87
Member
The PSP is perceived as a failure because of how Sony mismanaged the device in the West.
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NPD Sales Results for July 2013 [Up2: 3DS Minimum, AC:NL, LM2/NSMBU LTDs, Xbox 360]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
The PSP is perceived as a failure because of how Sony mismanaged the device in the West.
These games are launching closer to the holidays so its going to be interesting to see how this affects US sales.
Who says the PSP was a failure? 70 Million units right?
It was just up against the DS.
Metallix87
Member
It's not that. The system was piracy heaven, and software sales greatly suffered as a result. The ecosystem was so toxic that even big games like Final Fantasy Type-0 didn't come over. Sony did little to rectify the problem, and actually made it worse by seemingly treating the system like a red-headed stepchild of the theirs next to the PS2 and PS3.
I think the PSP did very well up until the piracy problems started having a noticeable effect but lets not get crazy now.
Nah, it's been touted as an all-round failure of late. People cite 3DS hardware numbers when discussing it 'beasting' too. I think it's more a case of lowered expectations.
Personally, I don't consider it a failure.
Thanks, skimmed and CTRL+F'd a bit but didn't notice them.
Hmm. 85.5% of the DS's sales isn't too bad, and there's still time to play quite a bit of catchup with Pokemon X/Y this fall. The 3+ year mark for the 3DS will probably look a bit different than the GBA's as well, since it probably won't have a "new pillar" dropped on it.
Erm, my point is that it wouldn't make a difference if Gen 5 was the first DS game. The first DS Pokemon game would likely sell around the same amount.
It being the slightly better game does not automatically give it better sales. I don't see it doing 2+ millions better. Isn't NSMB DS still ahead of every other NSMB game?
Also, what? If D/P isn't innovative then neither is B/W...
Really puts things into perspective. DS had quite a slow start which is why the PSP and 3DS look better than they should.
When talking about Japan sales maybe. Not about US sales.
goldenpp72
Member
The best selling PSP games didn't sell so hot especially after the first few years, the problem with PSP wasn't the hardware sales. The highest selling game on the PSP is probably Monster hunter and that was a big flop outside of Japan, the system just didn't have much going for it in big sellers, but i'd hardly deem it a failure, but compared to the sales Nintendo titles put up it's pretty abysmal.
Oh, didn't know about the piracy issues.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
Those who hate NSMB have been trying to spin NSMB U as a disaster and proof the series shouldn't exist, but there appears to be no basis for that narrative. NSMB and NSMB Wii weren't what pushed DS and Wii sales by themselves. It was, however, clearly a game a ton of people who already had a system wanted along with the stuff that sold the system in the first place. Even NSMB 2 for 3DS has been sitting there trucking along and selling millions.
The attach rate for NSMB U seems to suggest people with a Nintendo platform still like NSMB just fine. But NSMB by itself isn't the thing to make everyone march into a store and buy the system. If Nintendo made a mistake it was assuming that.
But given their development troubles, I half think it was more like NSMB U was the game they knew could be done and polished by launch, so they went with it and hoped for the best. And it did sell.
Over the next 3 months aligned, DS did about 1.4m~ and was taking off in a drastic way, no way will 3DS catch up.
PSP did great starting off and then fell apart once piracy and other issues started. 3DS is a beast in Japan, not in North America. No one has ever claimed the 3DS is beasting it in US. It is doing okay.
"Catch up" was the wrong way of putting it, I just meant that the Fall should move a lot of units. As in, the 3DS' best-performing months for 2013 have probably yet to occur.
I think the DS is worse than PSP when it comes to piracy. It certainly was easier on DS. Just pop in a flashcart, no modding needed.
Hell, I can't tell you how many times I've seen little kids with R4s in their DSes, and their parents downloaded the games for them. Its like the DS made piracy casual.
Yeah, the same fall for DS saw 4 mill across Nov + Dec, I can't see 3DS hitting that even with Pokemon.
Metallix87
Member
We'll see. I definitely think this Holiday will be what shapes the future of the 3DS in terms of sales and expectations.
psp did over 200k in july 2007, too. sony could have kept the system alive in america had they just dropped the price over time. it still did close to 20m though, which isn't bad by any stretch.
Can Crusher
Banned
This doesn't really matter, what matters is total units sold across consoles. Roughly same point in time we had PS2 at 50 million in N.A, Gamecube at 11 million, Xbox at 16 million.
That's 77 million consoles. We aren't taking into account price differences.
Give or take, the Xbox 360 is at 39 million units with the Wii at 40 million, and the Playstation 3 at 23 million.
That's 102 million consoles of the same generation sold when compared to same time frame. Yes it does seem like a highly inflated number given the level of success among the casuals that the Wii had, and in that sense the market might shrink. Or if the social aspects of next gen pick up, along with exclusive T.V programming, it might not.
Hmmm, you don't think so?
I always figured part of the reason why Ruby/Sapphire sold relatively poorly was because they...kind of stunk.
The NSMB comparison is a little different because each game is on a different console. And hitting 30 million again in the same franchise would be pretty difficult. It'd be like Pokemon doing Red/Blue numbers again. NSMBWii sold 26 Million though...
You're comparing NA to US there.
That may be true but DS software still sold decently unlike the PSP which I'm guessing was hurt by its hardcore audience when it came to piracy. I'm curious as to how games like NSMB or Pokemon would've done without the piracy though.
Syphon Filter
Member
Didn't 360 pass wii in the u.s? And is the gap really that big between ps3 and 360? Wow didn't know it was that much.
Not yet. There's like a 2 million difference between the two.
Nah not yet, this holiday it will.
Wii - 41.15m
360 - 39.31m
PS3 - 24.44m
PS2 - 46.2m
R/S probably sold worse because many people already grew out of Pokemon at the time. I recall some of those eventually came back to the franchise later on but I may be wrong on that.
I've honestly seen a lot of dislikes on B/W, almost as much as I saw on D/P.
If B/W was the Gen 4 game, it would probably sell slightly more than what D/P actually sold. I seriously do not think it would sell millions more than that.
Checked this out on WIki because I didn't know.
PSP's best selling game was Moster Hunter 3rd with 4.77 Million?
Then Gran Turismo with 4.22 million?
On a console that sold 71 million?
Wow...
shinra-bansho
Member
Hmm, do we have any numbers not in the OP yet?
If Pachter is being quite precise with his figures that would mean the 3DS likely isn't much more than 153K, by my count.
If Pachter is being quite precise with his figures that would mean the 3DS likely isn't much more than 153K, by my count.
Here is the more amazing thing. Monster Hunter Portable 3rd was only available in Japan.
Metallix87
Member
Poor use of Wiki. We're talking about the West. In Japan, sales were still healthy for software overall.
Oh...took out the "grew out" part.
I guess we'll never know. I assume it would have sold more, maybe not millions more.
Let's just see how X/Y does.
If X/Y doesn't match the 17 mill by D/P...then I revoke my
leatherhat
Member
I feel like they are missing the GTA stories
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
I expect further divergence.
The 3DS is doing well, all things considered. People like the hardware. There's a steady flow of games. Nintendo software titles are excellent, and they're doing very well. Animal Crossing, Luigi's Mansion, NSMB2, Mario Kart, all big titles, all doing well. And most of the 3rd party stuff that we're seeing is doing OK too. You release a high quality product, you get good results. Pokemon will do very well, and I expect hardware to follow a nice fall-christmas sales curve largely on its back.
BUT
The DS took off like a rocket. Starting just before the DS Lite, then through the DS Lite, then through the 3rd and 4th years. Guitar Hero DS. Cooking Mama. Ubisoft's Imagine line. Hannah Montana. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's all garbage, it's shovelware, embarrassing, who cares, cheap trash. But it was very important in selling DS hardware and while I didn't buy most of that junk, a lot of younger kids did. The overall software ecosystem and hardware ecosystem was sustained by a lot of that stuff.
We've seen movie games get decimated on all platforms. We've seen puzzle games move to mobile/social/F2P. We've seen the original casual market just evaporate. Nintendo's extended audience software is a non-starter (Brain Age, Nintendogs both duffo on 3DS; nothing obviously in the pipeline to hit that audience). Does anyone think their parents are going to get a 3DS the way they got a DS? Worse, their grandparents? No way. We know exactly where those people are going to get lifestyle applications or light gaming.
A lot of kids didn't buy the DS for any one title, but just because it was the thing to get for Christmas or their Birthday and they got a bunch of random software that "looked cool at the store". That's not happening now. The software sections are smaller at stores, less is being produced, and it's going to ripple through. The 3DS will be a desired object, a popular one, but it'll never be singular.
Maybe it manifests itself as having two kids but getting one 3DS and one tablet for around the house, where last generation the kids each got a DS. Maybe it means not upgrading to the latest model as often. Maybe it means the same amount of hardware but a few less games.
I'm not saying iOS killed Nintendo. They're not dead. They're doing well. But it's not going to be a growth cycle for them, and to the extent that erosion is going to impact them, I think it'll impact them more in the back half of the generation than the front half, and in every area, not just hardware. And the reason for this is a shift in terms of expectations. For older users it might be because they now expect 3G to kill time on the bus. For parents it might be because Facebook and apps are enough. For kids it might be because they just want everything, but their parents make a different decision. It might be less foot traffic to retail, less picking up boxes, and less buying. It might be that someone starts thinking that Bejeweled is worth $5 instead of $20. It might be that someone starts expecting demos or free play options. It might be that the kid likes Mario and Pokemon, but what they really love is Angry Birds and Minecraft (I challenge anyone to do an eyeball check at merchandise worn by kids under 18 in their area).
It's not death by 1000 cuts. But there are cuts.
plagiarize
Banned
library wise, and hardware sales wise, the PSP was not a failure. software sales wise in Japan the PSP was not a failure. software sales elsewhere... yeah, those sucked, but does that make the *system* a failure? what more does a system need to be successful than a solid library of consistent releases and strong hardware sales?
Actually I re-added it, realized it's still a valid point I think.
Yeah, that's what I think would happen. It would probably just sell slightly more, but nothing notable.
As for X/Y, I'm bit worried because they've been releasing Pokemon at a more rapid rate which can probably lead to a franchise fatigue... I felt B2W2 was unnecessary. But I'm going to wait and see. I'm sure it will still sell 10+ millions, but I wonder if it'll match DP's sale numbers?
Carpe Libertatem
Member
Software sales. That's the only way third parties can make money and one of the ways the actual platform holder does.
Can Crusher
Banned
As I've addressed in my previous post, which console sells the most doesn't mean much for the size of the market. Sales across all consoles do, and the intake of new console owners was mostly done by the 360 in the U.S, which after Nintendo killed the Wii started doing PS2 like numbers as that data indicates.
I agree with your point on pricing.
I agree, all you need is the right hook. I don't know what it is though.
PC and consoles compete for the same market, I agree. I don't think Nintendo competes in the same market though, which makes sense because as a company they offer a drastically different philosophy. Their main target audience is Nintendo fans and younger gamers, both in handheld and in home console. With the Wii they had a hook for the casual though, and without it they shrink considerably.
I simply don't know yet. This gen was a slow burner too aside from the Wii, and we have to wait and see if there's a new killer franchise out there, or if the social features will kick off big time and even if the whole T.V push by MS and Sony pays off.
At this point in time though there's not enough evidence to make me believe next gen is going to be a rough ride for the industry. Specially since more than ever consumers seem to spend much more on a by title basis than ever before (DLCs and what not). It just seems like revenue streams keep multiplying, and I don't know if next gen will be any different.
edit:
I don't have PS2 number for the U.S, only N.A. Doesn't even matter, because it doesn't damage the numbers that support the argument.
plagiarize
Banned
how does that make the system itself not a success though? that makes the software sales an issue, but since it had consistent good support throughout it's lifetime... what's the issue from the perspective of the platform? good hardware sales. good library of games. I'm sure Sony made money on the platform on the back of the hardware sales and Japanese software sales.
ouch at ps3. interested to see how 12gb sku does
Software units after 9 financial quarters in North America / The Americas:
GBA: 54.04 million (shipment, 8 quarters only due to lack of info for 9)
DS: 49.55 million (shipment)
PSP: 43.2 million (production shipment)
3DS: 32.75 million (shipment)
NPD sell-through:
DS: ~44m (29 months)
PSP: ~30m (27 months)
3DS: ???
GBA ???
GBA: 54.04 million (shipment, 8 quarters only due to lack of info for 9)
DS: 49.55 million (shipment)
PSP: 43.2 million (production shipment)
3DS: 32.75 million (shipment)
NPD sell-through:
DS: ~44m (29 months)
PSP: ~30m (27 months)
3DS: ???
GBA ???
So it's kind of like NES/SNES split reoccurring on a larger scale, for different reasons.
I realize why it's happening and I have no illusions of the 3DS keeping pace with the DS's meteortic rise, but as an enthusiast I'm still glad that this situation has graced us with such a great library.
Metallix87
Member
If true, that's a pretty solid month for 3DS.
Hero of Legend
Member
EOIV did 35,000 first month right? Or am I remembering too high?
PS3 did worse than 2007 montly fights against GBA