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[GoldenEye98]

Nvidia Hints at DLSS 10 Delivering Full Neural Rendering, Potentially Replacing Rasterization and Ray Tracing

The company demoed a basic neural network-rendered world back in 2018.

www.tomshardware.com

A future version of DLSS is likely to include full neural rendering, hinted Bryan Catanzaro, a Nvidia VP of Applied Deep Learning Research. In a round table discussion organized by Digital Foundry (video), various video game industry experts talked about the future of AI in the business. During the discussion, Nvidia’s Catanzaro raised a few eyebrows with his openness to predict some key features of a hypothetical "DLSS 10."

DLSS 3 debuted with the RTX 40-series graphics cards, adding Frame Generation technology. With 4x upscaling and frame generation, neural rendering potentially allows a game to only fully render 1/8 (12.5%) of the pixels. Most recently, DLSS 3.5 offered improved denoising algorithms for ray tracing games with the introduction of Ray Reconstruction technology.

The above timeline raises questions about where Nvidia might go next with future versions of DLSS. And of course, "Deep Learning Super Sampling" no longer really applies, as the last two additions have targeted other aspects of rendering. Digital Foundry asked that question to the group: “Where do you see DLSS in the future? What other problem areas could machine learning tackle in a good way?”

Bryan Catanzaro immediately brought up the topic of full neural rendering. This idea isn’t quite as far out as it may seem. Catanzaro reminded the panel that, at the NeurIPS conference in 2018, Nvidia researchers showed an open-world demo of a world being rendered in real-time using a neural network. During that demo the UE4 game engine provided data about what objects were in a scene, where they were, and so on, and the neural rendering provided all the on-screen graphics.

Catanzaro suggested the 2018 demo was a peek into a major growth area of (generative) AI in gaming. “DLSS 10 (in the far far future) is going to be a completely neural rendering system,” he speculated. The result will be “more immersive and more beautiful” games than most can imagine today

Between now and DLSS 10, Catanzaro believes we'll see a gradual process, developer controllable, and coherent. Developers are now experienced in tools that allow them to steer their vision using traditional game engines and 2D / 3D rendering tech. They need similar finely controlled tools ready for generative AI, noted the Nvidia VP

 

[analog_future]

Should be cool in 20 years, I guess?

 

[ShirAhava]

This should pair well with PS9s interactive spores

 

[Knightime_X]

Ai is going to enable some wicked shit the further it advances.

 

[Topher]

DLSS 10? Available on PS9?

Edit:

This should pair well with PS9s interactive spores

Damn.....beat me to it.

 

[intbal]

What gamers imagine DLSS 10 will be used for:
"OMG, the game can generate photorealism in real time just from a description!"

What DLSS 10 will actually be used for:
Txt2Pr0n

 

[Topher]

Ai is going to enable some wicked shit the further it advances.

 

[winjer]

DLSS 20 will be like the holodeck.

 

[Gaiff]

This should pair well with PS9s interactive spores

And upscale the Killzone 2 E3 2005 demo graphics from 1080p to 4K.

 

[OverHeat]

This should pair well with PS9s interactive spores

AMD will still be behind in AI so no

 

[UnNamed]

I think he's referring to this, at minute 26

 

[SmokedMeat]

Will they still be making GPUs?

 

[amigastar]

I'm more curious what DLSS 4 will bring to the table but DLSS 10 sounds nice in 15 years.

 

[Gaiff]

Will they still be making GPUs?

Nah, GPUs will be making themselves at that point.

 

[cyberheater]

Interesting that the game will contain a description of the objects and the A.I rendering engine will interpret those objects and render them out. At that point everything is dynamic. Should look amazing.

 

[ahtlas7]

Won’t even need graphics cards.

 

[Topher]

Nah, GPUs will be making themselves at that point.

Imagine Nvidia creating a GPU subsidiary run entirely by AIs. Not such a shocking idea now than it was a few years ago.

 

[a multicultural team of v]

It's so funny that we spent decades chasing the dream of ray tracing, and now that we are finally here it is going to just be replaced by AI generation in a year or two anyway.

 

[GoldenEye98]

There'd still be graphics cards. Though theoretically it would put a lot of traditional game devs out of work.

I mean on some level it would be good in the sense it would make AAA game development way less labour intensive and therefore cheaper and faster to make...

 

[Magic Carpet]

Coming to an Iphone near you.

 

[kikkis]

Digital foundry has to drop ray tracing as the future of rendering and embrace neural rendering.

 

[Moochi]

This kind of rendering would be a paradigm shift in the industry. 10-15 years out sounds about right, but I've been consistently wrong and underestimated AI image generation advances. Just a year after Stable Diffusion and Dall-E 2, I'm producing animated gifs with relatively good coherence at home on a 3090.
The thing that will slow this down the most, imo, is the human learning side where devs must become proficient with a totally new way of doing things. However, LLMs have an innate ability to do most of the work almost like magic. LLM engines for game creation will need to be trained, but I suspect that once they are, game development will be an order of magnitude faster and look photoreal have whatever stylistic flair you want. It isn't computationally more expensive to do photoreal than it is to do anime Studios Trigger style or make everything look like a Renaissance painting.

 

[GrayDock]

And all starting at U$10k (entry level 60 NRX card) plus a monthly U$20,00 sub...

 

[StueyDuck]

Won't mean jack considering how studios are treating dlss now and half arseing it.

Looking at you Toddy boy

 

[nemiroff]

Even today you could say up to 85% of the output from a DLSS supported game is generated, not rendered. So, yeah.. I can see it.

 

[skneogaf]

we have come a long way from the first to the most recent so maybe!

 

[Thief1987]

Slow news day?

 

[nemiroff]

It's so funny that we spent decades chasing the dream of ray tracing, and now that we are finally here it is going to just be replaced by AI generation in a year or two anyway.

IDK about in a year or two.. but yeah it is kinda funny. Good thing is, the hardware for AI acceleration is basically the same, and with more room for a bigger ratio on the die space (if that's how it works, I'm no expert).

 

[Lysandros]

Digital foundry has to drop ray tracing as the future of rendering and embrace neural rendering.

I don't think DF can embrace anything neutral.

 

[nemiroff]

I don't think DF can embrace anything neutral.

Neutral rendering.. that's funny

 

[amigastar]

Imagine Nvidia creating a GPU subsidiary run entirely by AIs. Not such a shocking idea now than it was a few years ago.

Yeah, AI really took up pace in the last months. It's really awestruck (maybe)

 

[k_trout]

dlss10 will be in pill form, take 2 in the morning with your soylent green

 

[NeonDelta]

DLSS 10 - available for only $999 a month

 

[Buggy Loop]

Nvidia Hints at DLSS 10 Delivering Full Neural Rendering, Potentially Replacing Rasterization and Ray Tracing

The company demoed a basic neural network-rendered world back in 2018.

www.tomshardware.com

" In a round table discussion organized by Digital Foundry (video), various video game industry experts talked about the future of AI in the business. During the discussion, Nvidia’s Catanzaro raised a few eyebrows with his openness to predict some key features of a hypothetical "DLSS 10.""

LOL fuckoff Toms hardware. PCMR reddit mod is called an expert

What a clickbait shit

Of course he's speculating a future iteration where DLSS is so good that AI is basically interpreting everything, its his job.

 

[Nihilum]

FSR20 will be able to design its own GPUs that beat Nvidia

 

[Hudo]

DLSS 30 will be rendering shit straight up in your mind.

 

[Buggy Loop]

DLSS 20 :



Can't wait

 

[DeepEnigma]

 

[Danknugz]

and the games will still suck for the most part

 

[HL3.exe]

All fun and interesting and all for rendering.

But they actual game you're playing and the simulation you're interacting with fundamentally still runs on the CPU.

As long as the simulation fidelity isn't keeping pace with the leaps in rendering (which it hasn't in the last decade), i'm personally less interested.

 

[Kiya's Guard]

DLSS 10 will replace gaming with a new form of interaction: going outside IRL

 

[Little Chicken]

More developers should start really pushing the tech envelope like Remedy and CDPR.

 

[SHA]

I don't care, we want great games, Nvidia dlss is just a tool.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

This will destroy the native resolution cultists.

 

[GymWolf]

By that time i bet amd is gonna reach parity with series 4000 tech, let's see who is gonna laugh for last.

 

[Sanepar]

DLSS10 for $500 a year.

 

[SportsFan581]

DLSS 20 will be like the holodeck.

Now that would probably be worth the $30k for the RTX 9060. Just hope I don't keep getting stuck in it, or otherwise held hostage in it with the safeties off, that would kill the fun.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Yeah but RDNA9 will be 2% faster at rasterization once they fix the drivers. I’m sticking with Radeon.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Yeah but RDNA9 will be 2% faster at rasterization once they fix the drivers. I’m sticking with Radeon.

Imagine if they still don't have AI assisted features by then

B bu but i get 9999 fps in Counter-Strike! EAT THAT NTARDS

 

[SHA]

Now that would probably be worth the $30k for the RTX 9060. Just hope I don't keep getting stuck in it, or otherwise held hostage in it with the safeties off, that would kill the fun.

The rtx 9000 in this mean time is nothing but racing thoughts, hyping for contents on par with the 360 is way healthier.