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Palestine to Join International Criminal Court

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GusBus

Member
Palestinians Move to Join International Criminal Court, Defying Israeli and U.S. Warnings


JERUSALEM — President Mahmoud Abbas of the Palestinian Authority signed papers Wednesday to join the International Criminal Court, a provocative move that could lead to the prosecution of Israeli officials for war crimes and risks severe sanctions from Washington and Jerusalem.

The defiant step came a day after the defeat of a United Nations Security Council resolution that demanded an end to Israel’s occupation of Palestinian territory by 2017, and was billed as part of a strategic shift by the Palestinian leadership to pursue statehood in the international arena after decades of failed American-brokered negotiations with Israel.

Mr. Abbas, whose popularity has plummeted since this summer’s battle between Israel and Hamas, has been under increasing pressure from the public and other Palestinian leaders to join the court, and use it to pursue cases against Israel’s settlement policy and military operations. But doing so could have major repercussions, both because Palestinians could also face charges at the court, and because Israel and the United States Congress have promised to respond harshly.

“There is no question mark as to what are the consequences, that there will be immediate American and Israeli financial sanctions,” said Khalil Shikaki, director of the Palestinian Center for Policy and Survey Research in the West Bank city of Ramallah. “Those sanctions will gradually become more and more crippling, and this could indeed be the beginning of the end of the P.A. They fully realize that.”

A December poll by Mr. Shikaki’s group showed 35 percent of Palestinians approved of the president’s performance, down from 50 percent before this summer’s war, and that if there were elections, Mr. Abbas, of the secular Fatah party, would lose to his rival from Hamas, the militant Islamist faction that dominates the Gaza Strip. With reconstruction of Gaza after the summer’s devastating war stalled amid ongoing acrimony between Hamas and Fatah despite an April reconciliation pact, analysts said Mr. Abbas was increasingly desperate to show he was doing something.

“They have to take some meaningful steps to recover anything of their really shredded credibility,” Nadia Hijab, executive director of Al-Shabaka: The Palestinian Policy Network, said of Mr. Abbas’s team.

“That fig leaf of action is growing steadily more tattered,” she added. “They keep saying it’s a new paradigm and they want to use international tools, but now they have actually been put on the spot.”

After a ceremony at his Ramallah headquarters marking the 50th anniversary of Fatah’s founding and a leadership meeting, Mr. Abbas signed the official papers to join the Rome Statute, the Hague-based court’s founding treaty. The Palestinians have to wait 60 days before they can file cases at the court, a window some in Washington are counting on to calm the situation.

But with Israeli elections scheduled for March 17, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and other Israeli politicians may be eager to show a strong response to what they have long denounced as an aggressive, unilateral move. Earlier on Wednesday, one of Mr. Netanyahu’s close allies, Yuval Steinitz, called Tuesday’s United Nations vote “no less dangerous than Hamas’s rockets,” saying the fact that France supported the resolution and Britain abstained “is very grave.”

Wednesday’s signing came eight months after a similar move in April, when Mr. Abbas stunned Washington and Israel by joining 15 international treaties and conventions as nine months of American-brokered peace talks neared collapse. Those included the four Geneva Conventions of 1949 and additional protocols of 1977 on the laws of war, along with ones dealing with discrimination against women and children.

The International Criminal Court is a much more significant step. Created in 2002 to prosecute perpetrators of genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes, the court currently has 122 member countries, and has mainly dealt with horrors in Africa.

The Palestinians asked the court in 2009 to investigate Israeli actions during Operation Cast Lead, a three-week military offensive in Gaza, but were rejected because they lacked the required United Nations status. A 2012 vote in the United Nations General Assembly upgraded Palestine’s status to non-member observer state, and some Palestinians have been urging Mr. Abbas to sign the Rome Statute ever since.

Said Ghazali contributed reporting from Ramallah and Majd Al Waheidi from Gaza.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/01/w...n-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0
 

Valhelm

contribute something
Seems like a good step both toward the acceptance of a Palestinian state and toward reform within Palestine.
 
Keep in mind that Palestinians are doing this because they fell one vote short of full recognition at UNSC. USA and Australia voted no. UK abstained.
 

Dai101

Banned
Just saw this on twitter. Fucking about time!!!

Great for Palestine. Can't wait for the reactions of bibi and his cronies along with fox news and their ilk.

Keep in mind that Palestinians are doing this because they fell one vote short of full recognition at UNSC. USA and Australia voted no. UK abstained.

I'm shocked, SHOCKED I TELL YA!!!

Of course, usa has to protect its little bastard no matter what.
 

Kurdel

Banned
A December poll by Mr. Shikaki’s group showed 35 percent of Palestinians approved of the president’s performance, down from 50 percent before this summer’s war, and that if there were elections, Mr. Abbas, of the secular Fatah party, would lose to his rival from Hamas, the militant Islamist faction that dominates the Gaza Strip. With reconstruction of Gaza after the summer’s devastating war stalled amid ongoing acrimony between Hamas and Fatah despite an April reconciliation pact, analysts said Mr. Abbas was increasingly desperate to show he was doing something.

Perfect, just what they need SMH...
 

Jackpot

Banned
But doing so could have major repercussions, both because Palestinians could also face charges at the court, and because Israel and the United States Congress have promised to respond harshly.

What's the fake reason they're giving for this opposition? I can't imagine they're saying in public it's because it puts them at risk of being prosecuted by an internationally recognised tribunal for war crimes?

*facepalm* yeah okay you keep thinking that.

yeah, the US's peace plan of keeping Palestine locked down and giving Israel carte blanche to attack them has been so rewarding...
 
Keep in mind that Palestinians are doing this because they fell one vote short of full recognition at UNSC. USA and Australia voted no. UK abstained.

One vote short, but that vote was the U.S. vote (Remember the veto exists) and there's basically no chance of the U.S. supporting that any time soon. If anything it more was a further demonstration of how isolated the U.S. is in its current position.
 

Dai101

Banned
One vote short, but that vote was the U.S. vote (Remember the veto exists) and there's basically no chance of the U.S. supporting that any time soon. If anything it more was a further demonstration of how isolated the U.S. is in its current position.

699G4nW.jpg


In other "water is wet" related news, the aipac....

Applauds Administration Efforts to Prevent Adoption of U.N. Resolution

AIPAC commends the Obama administration for its successful efforts to prevent adoption of a resolution by the United Nations Security Council which would have represented a severe setback to the prospect of a resumption of the Israel-Palestinian peace process. The Palestinian leadership’s attempt to advance this counterproductive resolution is an abdication of responsibility to pursue a genuine and lasting resolution to the conflict.

For almost a year, the Palestinian Authority (PA) has consistently rebuffed direct negotiations with Israel. It walked away from talks and embraced the terrorist organization, Hamas. If peace is to be achieved, the PA must break its association with Hamas and return to direct negotiations with Israel. By engaging in destructive, diversionary efforts at international bodies and avoiding direct talks with Israel, the PA is undermining the chances for peace.

AIPAC applauds the administration for its action at the U.N., and urges the United States to continue to press the Palestinians to return to direct peace negotiations with Israel.

http://www.aipac.org/learn/resource...istration Veto of Security Council Resolution
 

Lamel

Banned
Do USA and Israel not realize that threatening sanctions on Palestine for this makes them look shady as fuck?
 
Bibi building more settlements in the West Bank and bulldozing homes is a crime.

Colonialism is supposed to be dead but Israel still practices it.

Americans have not learned from the displacement of Native Americans and ghettoizing them into reservations then reducing them into sports franchise mascots?

stop supporting displacement and colonialism in the 21st Century
 

Ogimachi

Member
"prosecution of Israeli officials for war crimes"

I don't think even the biggest fanatics believe this could happen. The US would sooner bomb the entire Gaza strip.
Still, a fine irony, isn't it? That Israel and the US would commit more war crimes to prevent prosecution for it.
 
Taking a remotely nuanced view of the conflict seems anathema to many GAFers (and no, this is not a stealth "Israel can do no wrong" comment). I don't blame him/her for not going down that road.

I don't this is true at all. Most people who support Palestine here seem to also realize that their continued approval of Hamas (while somewhat understandable) only hurts them in the end.

Currently a lot of the Western World and especially in the US, we are bombarded with pro Israel media and very little objective analysis.

I think GAF's stance is a natural reaction to this rather unbalanced position the west takes.

Dat rapture tho.

Exactly.
 
Taking a remotely nuanced view of the conflict seems anathema to many GAFers (and no, this is not a stealth "Israel can do no wrong" comment). I don't blame him/her for not going down that road.

I wish our countries would take a nuanced position, now that would be a start!
 

Jackpot

Banned
Israel retaliated by arbitrarily withholding all tax revenue for Palestine

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/06/us-israel-reuven-rivlin-palestinian-tax-revenues

The decision by Binyamin Netanyahu to order the withholding of Palestinian tax revenues in response to Mahmoud Abbas’s application to join the international criminal court has been sharply criticised by Israel’s president and the US, as well as senior Palestinian figures.

#OnlyDemocracyInTheMiddleEast
 

RangerX

Banned
Hopefully any help Palestinians can get from international institutions will benefit them as there are certainly war crimes Israel has to answer for. Another attempt should be made at a unity government between Hamas and the PA as israel have no legitimate response to what they themselves have deemed "peace offensives". Netenyahu will look for any reason to resume hostilities to avoid peaceful negotiations against a unified Palestinian government. I symptahise with the Israelis who abhor the barbaric policies of their government.
 

Dead Man

Member
One vote short, but that vote was the U.S. vote (Remember the veto exists) and there's basically no chance of the U.S. supporting that any time soon. If anything it more was a further demonstration of how isolated the U.S. is in its current position.

Which makes the Australian NO rather than abstaining even more embarrassing. Fucking shithouse by our politicians.
 

Chumly

Member
Sounds like Israelis are admitting they commit war crimes. Im truly baffled why this is a big deal and why Israel and the US act like Palestine has declared war.
 

akira28

Member
well..are they in? Israel knows shits about to get real uncomfortable.

Dat rapture tho.

shit's gonna look like an anime power up sequence. lasers and fire in the sky, dragons and strange beasts roaming the land, and centered..oh yeah, over some sacred temple that was rebuilt. nothing to see here folks.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
well..are they in? Israel knows shits about to get real uncomfortable.

They are not quite in yet; there are a number of legal obstacles to overcome. The first is that legally you have to be a state to join the ICC. Prior to this point, the Office of the Prosecutor argued that Palestine required the recognition of the United Nations General Assembly to be considered a state. Palestine now has this recognition, but the court is within its remit to overrule that definition and provide a more detailed definition of a state that Palestine currently has not met. It seems unlikely it would do this, as the ICC is relatively independent of the United States of America and Israel, but the chance remains that one of those two countries, probably the United State on account of Israel having no real diplomatic capital remaining, will throw their weight around on the world stage enough that the ICC will back down.

The second problem is that the State of Palestine's territory is undefined; it's not synonymous with the Occupied Palestinian Territories and there's no clear and agreed upon idea of where the borders between the State of Palestine and the State of Israel are. By joining the ICC, Palestine is giving consent for the ICC to have remit within Palestinian territory; that means that the ICC would have to settle on what it considers the rightful and legal border between the two states before Palestine would officially be a member. This process in itself would involve a ton of litigation and a long and arduous timeframe.
 
In light of the recent Cuba reconciliation, it's really, really embarrassing that we've allowed this to drag on as long as it has.

If a policy doesn't work the first 30 goddamn years, it's not a good policy. Let's move forward in a way that makes sense.
 

Dai101

Banned
This makes them look more than ridiculous. They're basically admitting that they're scared of what the international court might rule.

The real kicker here is, whos gonna stop them? As long as they have the US as their attack dog no one is going to do something meaningful while they can kill and murder Palestinians with impunity.
 

commedieu

Banned
They are not quite in yet; there are a number of legal obstacles to overcome. The first is that legally you have to be a state to join the ICC. Prior to this point, the Office of the Prosecutor argued that Palestine required the recognition of the United Nations General Assembly to be considered a state. Palestine now has this recognition, but the court is within its remit to overrule that definition and provide a more detailed definition of a state that Palestine currently has not met. It seems unlikely it would do this, as the ICC is relatively independent of the United States of America and Israel, but the chance remains that one of those two countries, probably the United State on account of Israel having no real diplomatic capital remaining, will throw their weight around on the world stage enough that the ICC will back down.

The second problem is that the State of Palestine's territory is undefined; it's not synonymous with the Occupied Palestinian Territories and there's no clear and agreed upon idea of where the borders between the State of Palestine and the State of Israel are. By joining the ICC, Palestine is giving consent for the ICC to have remit within Palestinian territory; that means that the ICC would have to settle on what it considers the rightful and legal border between the two states before Palestine would officially be a member. This process in itself would involve a ton of litigation and a long and arduous timeframe.

Just being honest. They aren't going to get in. I'm pretty sure of that. I didn't know why exactly when I first heard the news, but these reasons seem more than enough to stifle their efforts, this time around. Israel does whatever it wants in the international world, with the help of America. And our 3 billion yearly given to that poor, poor country.

I hope im wrong as Israel needs to be brought to a justice system so that people can at least make decisions if what they are doing qualifies as war crimes. But, theres too much money involved and age-old rivalries to let their ego allow the world to review the case of Israel. Its bullshit, and they deserve to at least be on the stand at a trial.
 

mantidor

Member
It's funny how some people can be against a country joining the International Criminal Court.

I mean, wtf is wrong with them? Are they against justice?

This is the craziest part, doesn't this also mean Hamas and others could also be judge by the ICC as well? Would not that be something Israel would approve? The whole thing is insane.
 

boingball

Member
Pretty gutsy but good move. Could increase Palestines standing in Europe. Will be interesting to see whether they will fulfil their obligations once they open themselves up for prosecution. Prosecution of any Israelian crime is more for show (though obviously would be a huge PR boost), since Israel is not a member and will not really participate. (Criminal States like the USA or Israel (or Hussein's Iraq and Gaddafi's Libya ) oppose the ICC obviously).
 
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