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[Waluigilicious]

EDIT: Thanks for the title change.

Rayman Legends on the Vita and Wii U use the touch screen to control murphy while the AI controls the main character. This is not very fun to play as the AI is slow and it's just too much of a change of pace from the main game. This has been changed in the PS/Xbox versions where you simply press a button to tell Murphy what to do while controlling your character. This change is welcome.

The Switch includes both ways to play which is even more welcome.

Now that that's out of the way... For those of you who played the Wii U or Vita versions in co-op (if you haven't then you are missing out!) the Murphy levels were actually some of the most fun in the game. One player controls Murphy using the touch screen while the other controls Rayman to do the platforming. This led to some fast paced really fun co-op action where you had to work together. For my brother and I who have completed the whole game in co-op, these were the best moments of the game.

The Wii U does this by giving the gamepad to one player and the controller to the other, whilst the Vita does this by using two Vita consoles connected through local play.

The Switch is able to do BOTH these things. You can connect two Switches while one is docked and one is in handheld, and that way you can have one act as a gamepad and the other as the TV. Pac Man VS on Namco museum does this. Or you can simply do it the Vita way and connect two Switches in local play (it's pretty much the same thing actually, except if it is docked you'd expect multiple people to be able to join with their controllers).

The Switch version however completely lacks being able to do the murphy levels in co-op.

Edit: I want to correct that statement to "the Switch version lacks being able to use Murphy in co-op using the touch screen at all", as normally he can be used in every level, not just specific ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnU3qetk5_I

Doing stages like this where one person is murphy and other is Rayman for us was by far the best part of the game. Come on Ubisoft, this is the "definitive" version.

Edit: Also turns out 5 player traditional platforming from the Wii U version is missing.

 

[TheMoon]

That's why I've been eyerolling the "definitive edition" subtitle since its announcement.

 

[Flarin]

With all due respect the music levels are the best part of the game and it would be a damn crying shame if they weren't in

Spoiler

thankfully they are.

 

[The_lascar]

So the challenge app and Kung Foot are still there?
The title is wrong.

 

[Waluigilicious]

So the challenge app and Kung Foot are still there?
The title is wrong.

The challenges are there but the murphy challenges now cannot be done in touchscreen co-op.

 

[Shotgun Kiss]

THEY TOOK OUT THE MUSIC LEVE - oh, ok

 

[Waluigilicious]

Should have known not many people play locally. Explains why reviews didn't even mention this. So have any of you actually played the murphy levels in co-op on Wii U?

Here's how the Vita version handled it: (40 seconds in)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXlsVfpuL0w

Why can't we get this on the definitive edition?

 

[SporeCrawler]

Should have bundled origins in

 

[Obscuritas]

Should have known not many people play locally. Explains why reviews didn't even mention this. So have any of you actually played the murphy levels in co-op on Wii U?

Yup. Shit was hilarious. So yeah, this is not the definitive edition.

 

[TsunamiOfSwagger]

Does this version include the music level of black betty?
If it Does, then you're wrong. It's still in.

 

[Doosi]

THEY TOOK OUT THE MUSIC LEVE - oh, ok

.

 

[Waluigilicious]

Yup. Shit was hilarious. So yeah, this is not the definitive edition.

What they've basically done here is, made the Murphy levels in multiplayer be like the PS/Xbox versions where you use buttons to control him, and have not put in the option to have touch screen multiplayer with Murphy at all despite putting this functionality into the game (single player only), and previously making this possible on the Vita.

 

[stan423321]

The people who are all about those six music autoscrollers are getting boring and annoying quite quickly. Highlight of the game, perhaps, best part of the game, hell no - unless you consider the rest absolute trash, I guess?

OP, I expected your video link to illustrate the problem. It doesn't. Can you provide a more detailed explanation of what is happening on Switch multisystem play (which AFAIK is entirely to allow Murfy multiplayer)? In a review I read they added duplicated level entrances for single player to allow both modes. Perhaps you've tried one while you were supposed to try the other? Would not be intuitive, but would not be disaster either. If the video link is of any value, some challenges were always limited to single player as a "fair play" measure.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

Should have known not many people play locally. Explains why reviews didn't even mention this. So have any of you actually played the murphy levels in co-op on Wii U?

yes

it is not anywhere near the best part of the game

 

[Cheezeman3000]

This is precisely why I won't buy this game on Switch. I have it on Wii U, and if this version was the same just with portability and higher resolution, then I'd get it in a heartbeat. Sadly, it's missing the touchscreen co-op feature so it's not worth it to me.

 

[Waluigilicious]

The people who are all about those six music autoscrollers are getting boring and annoying quite quickly. Highlight of the game, perhaps, best part of the game, hell no - unless you consider the rest absolute trash, I guess?

OP, I expected your video link to illustrate the problem. It doesn't. Can you provide a more detailed explanation of what is happening on Switch multisystem play (which AFAIK is entirely to allow Murfy multiplayer)? In a review I read they added duplicated level entrances for single player to allow both modes. Perhaps you've tried one while you were supposed to try the other? Would not be intuitive, but would not be disaster either. If the video link is of any value, some challenges were always limited to single player as a "fair play" measure.

In the normal game, Murphy is controlled using buttons the PS/Xbox way. So for example, if we were to play 3 player, all three of us will be platforming, and all three of us can press the A button to make Murphy do an action.

The only way to play the Murphy levels using the touchscreen is by going into the specific mode called "Murphy's Touch". This mode is strictly one player only. If you connect a second controller it just overwrites the controlls connected in handheld mode. As soon as Murphy comes out, the AI takes over.

 

[jariw]

Should have known not many people play locally. Explains why reviews didn't even mention this. So have any of you actually played the murphy levels in co-op on Wii U?

I played it co-op, and it was certainly good and unique. Actually, those levels didn't make sense in any other way. So no, it's not a Definitive Edition of the game. But IMO, the Kung Foot and Music Levels are the best parts of Rayman Legends.

 

[Waluigilicious]

yes

it is not anywhere near the best part of the game

So many topics on GAF lately miss the point of the topic and just concentrate on one specific part, although I should have titled it better my point still stands. It's a fantastic feature that was present not only on Wii U but the Vita so there is no reason it should be missing from here, especially when the Switch can theoretically work like both consoles (especially the Vita). The fact that this is called a "definitive edition" is the icing on the cake.

I mean I just don't understand what was going through their heads. They went through that effort to add in the Murphy levels in SINGLE PLAYER which truth be told they might have got away with not even doing, yet they didn't make these playable in co-op, and it hurts even more to know that they've made this possible before on the Vita.

Hopefully I'm missing something. I see no option to access local play from there. If I somehow manage to connect a second controller the game kicks me out.

Also not to mention Murphy was actually playable in every level in co-op on the Wii U. Was great fun making the lums purple or teasing people with moving the platforms. This version basically sucks all the soul out of the co-op that was already there.

 

[Waluigilicious]

Of course, this being the ‘Definitive Edition’ – and being on a system that does indeed have a touchscreen – the Switch port has Murfy back in all his tappy and swipey glory, assuming you're playing in handheld mode, of course. That’s not to say it’s identical to the Wii U version again, mind you: the main game still plays like the non-touchscreen versions, in which Murfy is controlled with a single button. There’s just a new painting added to the hub area called Murfy’s Touch, which contains the touch-enabled versions of 14 levels from the main adventure.
This solution gives the best of both worlds, really. While the game was originally designed with touchscreen controls in mind when it was still going to be a Wii U exclusive, the reality is that controlling Murfy with button presses will feel a lot less fiddly to many players. Meanwhile, there will be others who like the feeling of interacting directly with the stage, using the touchscreen: this way both sets of players are happy, and with 14 new stages (even though it’s repeated content) that means more game to play through before you reach 100% completion.

This is from the Nintendo Life review. He fails to understand that we don't get best of both worlds as a huge point of Murphy was that he was available in every single level in co-op mode. The review also mentions local play with upto 4 players but I can't find this option anywhere (except in Kung Foot tournament). Infact on the back of the box it clearly states the game is 1-4 players in TV and tabletop mode but only 1 player in handheld mode.

Unless I'm missing something really stupid, there is no way to control Murphy on the touchscreen in co-op.

This also means like I said that this part of the review is just wrong:

There’s support for up to four players who can play simultaneously, either using a single Switch or via local wireless play. However you choose to do it, things can be a little manic and in the more difficult stages it’s possible to get in each other’s way a little too much. It’s very much something you should do when you want to have a laugh rather than when you want to make proper progress in the game.

 

[stan423321]

In the normal game, Murphy is controlled using buttons the PS/Xbox way. So for example, if we were to play 3 player, all three of us will be platforming, and all three of us can press the A button to make Murphy do an action.

The only way to play the Murphy levels using the touchscreen is by going into the specific mode called "Murphy's Touch". This mode is strictly one player only. If you connect a second controller it just overwrites the controlls connected in handheld mode. As soon as Murphy comes out, the AI takes over.

Sorry, this is still not clear enough. You tried all the above just with a single system/game pair? Did you try system linking? Can't blame you if you didn't since it doubles most expenses and a second Switch is no cheap thing, but my understanding was already that you needed two Switches with two copies of the game, just like on Vita but with more regular players possible, to access Wii U-like multiplayer.

 

[Waluigilicious]

Sorry, this is still not clear enough. You tried all the above just with a single system/game pair? Did you try system linking? Can't blame you if you didn't since it doubles most expenses and a second Switch is no cheap thing, but my understanding was already that you needed two Switches with two copies of the game, just like on Vita but with more regular players possible, to access Wii U-like multiplayer.

We have access to three Switches in the house but just one copy of the game. But I still see no option to link multiple Switches in-game other than in Kung Foot.

The back of the case clearly says 4 player local co-op and on the bottom you can see it's 1-4 in TV and tabletop modes but just 1 player in handheld (and naturally for multiplayer Murphy you will need two Switches as one Switch will have your hand obstructing the screen)

This icon on the top right only comes up in Kung Foot Tournament:

So from my observations so far:

- Despite adding a way to connect locally
- Despite already programming multilayer Murphy in the Vita version
- Despite going through the effort of letting us use Murphy in single player

There is no way to use touch screen Murphy in multiplayer. I really hope I'm missing something.

 

[Stopdoor]

This is from the Nintendo Life review. He fails to understand that we don't get best of both worlds as a huge point of Murphy was that he was available in every single level in co-op mode. The review also mentions local play with upto 4 players but I can't find this option anywhere (except in Kung Foot tournament). Infact on the back of the box it clearly states the game is 1-4 players in TV and tabletop mode but only 1 player in handheld mode.

Unless I'm missing something really stupid, there is no way to control Murphy on the touchscreen in co-op.

This also means like I said that this part of the review is just wrong:

Wait, even then, the Wii U version supports 5 players playing the traditional way as well through the non-touch-focused levels - if that's not in either, well, uh...

Man, reviews are always garbage for evaluating multiplayer features.

 

[Waluigilicious]

Wait, even then, the Wii U version supports 5 players playing the traditional way as well through the non-touch-focused levels - if that's not in either, well, uh...

Man, reviews are always garbage for evaluating multiplayer features.

5 player is gone. But the thing is the 5th player was always Murphy (or not! You could also have traditional 5 player platforming on Wii U). And from 2-4 players you can have Murphy if you wish. It was really fun letting a little kid being Murphy just making lums purple or tickling enemies, or while my brother done hardcore platforming just sitting back and interacting with the game making it easier. Those were also the most fun co-op daily challenges where one person was Murphy moving platforms for the other person.

Honestly a massive part of what made the original game so fun is missing. But like you've said, reviewers really don't care about this kind of thing. Which is stupid especially in this case... What is the point of reviewing the game again then?

Even if I need two Switches and two copies of the game to do it (which is understandable and how it worked on Vita I assume) just let me play co-op the way it was intended Ubisoft. I've emailed Nintendo Life asking about their review let's see what they say.

 

[Haganeren]

Hum, sorry for the question but... as i read some answers, should i understand that musical levels aren't in the Wii U version that i just bought ?

I knew that the PS3/360/etc all have additional levels (which is unjust since the game was for Wii U at the beginning... But that's not the point) but i didn't cared too much... Are those levels added the musical levels everyone keep saying they are the best thing of the game ? (Like the treasure chase in Origins)

I sure hope that's not the case... I thought the Wii U version was the best of all. (Because i basically could have bought any version...)

 

[BanjoLayleeYookaKazooie]

Hum, sorry for the question but... as i read some answers, should i understand that musical levels aren't in the Wii U version that i just bought ?

I knew that the PS3/360/etc all have additional levels (which is unjust since the game was for Wii U at the beginning... But that's not the point) but i didn't cared too much... Are those levels added the musical levels everyone keep saying they are the best thing of the game ? (Like the treasure chase in Origins)

I sure hope that's not the case... I thought the Wii U version was the best of all. (Because i basically could have bought any version...)

No you're mistaken the musical levels are in the Wii U version.

 

[Haganeren]

No you're mistaken the musical levels are in the Wii U version.

Now that's a relief, thanks for the answer

 

[Ridley327]

Hum, sorry for the question but... as i read some answers, should i understand that musical levels aren't in the Wii U version that i just bought ?

I knew that the PS3/360/etc all have additional levels (which is unjust since the game was for Wii U at the beginning... But that's not the point) but i didn't cared too much... Are those levels added the musical levels everyone keep saying they are the best thing of the game ? (Like the treasure chase in Origins)

I sure hope that's not the case... I thought the Wii U version was the best of all. (Because i basically could have bought any version...)

Content-wise, the Wii U/PS3/360/PC versions are identical where it concerns the levels, with the only major difference being how the PS3/360/PC handles the Murphy implementation.

 

[BassForever]

It's too bad ubisoft can't do a free murphy 2p dlc the way namco did with pacman vs so one retail copy and 2 switches would enable access to this mode. Perhaps its something that can be patched in later if there is enough fan demand.

 

[Waluigilicious]

It's too bad ubisoft can't do a free murphy 2p dlc the way namco did with pacman vs so one retail copy and 2 switches would enable access to this mode. Perhaps its something that can be patched in later if there is enough fan demand.

The problem is it doesn't seem to be included at all, let alone with one copy of the game.

 

[Stopdoor]

5 player is gone. But the thing is the 5th player was always Murphy. And from 2-4 players you can have Murphy if you wish. It was really fun letting a little kid being Murphy just making lums purple or tickling enemies, or while my brother done hardcore platforming just sitting back and interacting with the game making it easier. Those were also the most fun co-op daily challenges where one person was Murphy moving platforms for the other person.

Honestly a massive part of what made the original game so fun is missing. But like you've said, reviewers really don't care about this kind of thing. Which is stupid especially in this case... What is the point of reviewing the game again then?

Even if I need two Switches and two copies of the game to do it (which is understandable and how it worked on Vita I assume) just let me play co-op the way it was intended Ubisoft. I've emailed Nintendo Life asking about their review let's see what they say.

No, the Murphy player could turn into a normal player at any time in most levels. Traditional 5 player.

 

[Falk]

EDIT: Can a mod please change the title to 'Rayman Legends "Definitive Edition" doesn't include a fantastic part of the game' so we can get a proper discussion going. Thanks.

Feels like that'd just end up being a milder version of the same derails.

Just call a spoon a spoon and not 'a fantastic device' if you want a clear description.

 

[dopan]

Waluigilicious, you are absolutely right. The Switch port is actually inferior to the Wii U version for once. And that's why I'm not going to buy it unless they at least add the Murphy asynchronous play for handheld linked mode for multiple switches, like how they did the Vita version.

Just the other day, I fired up the old Wii U version and got my 2 year old playing his first ever console game to use Murphy to move the platforms for me and my brother in law to platform through. It was really hard at first, and he had some difficulty firing the cannons at the dragons later on, but we all got through the level in the end, and this type of experience just wouldn't be possible on the Switch version.

It's too bad ubisoft can't do a free murphy 2p dlc the way namco did with pacman vs so one retail copy and 2 switches would enable access to this mode. Perhaps its something that can be patched in later if there is enough fan demand.

This is a great idea.

 

[stan423321]

This is getting pretty weird. I distinctly remember people mentioning 5 player RL without Murfy in regular levels on Wii U. I also distinctly remember Switch RL having two Switch co-op mentioned. This needs further investigating. I can check the Wii U version if you give me a lot of time... I don't have a Switch though.

 

[Waluigilicious]

No, the Murphy player could turn into a normal player at any time in most levels. Traditional 5 player.

Wow, we never actually tried this because someone always wanted to be Murphy as it adds a new layer to the game. So this version is inferior in yet another way!

Feels like that'd just end up being a milder version of the same derails.

Just call a spoon a spoon and not 'a fantastic device' if you want a clear description.

Thanks a bunch! I did try to stick more words in there but I ran out of space I think or maybe I rushed, my bad, you're right.

Waluigilicious, you are absolutely right. The Switch port is actually inferior to the Wii U version for once. And that's why I'm not going to buy it unless they at least add the Murphy asynchronous play for handheld linked mode for multiple switches, like how they did the Vita version.

Just the other day, I fired up the old Wii U version and got my 2 year old playing his first ever console game to use Murphy to move the platforms for me and my brother in law to platform through. It was really hard at first, and he had some difficulty firing the cannons at the dragons later on, but we all got through the level in the end, and this type of experience just wouldn't be possible on the Switch version.



This is a great idea.

Wii U is still the definitive version as far as co-op is concerned. Murphy was arguably the best use of the asymmetric multiplayer which ironically is possible on the Switch using two consoles! And was done on the Vita!

What I find even funnier is they went through the hassle of making the levels where Murphy is necessary, playable in handheld mode. So now completionists have to do what is arguable the worst single player content in the game (but ironically the best co-op content) both with buttons and with the touchscreen.

I can't decide whether to sell or keep the game. What's the best way to contact Ubisoft about this?

 

[Jonneh3003]

While I agree options should be there for a game titled "Definitive Edition", would touch screen even work well in co-op? The person touching the Switch would be blocking everyones view..You're right about dual Switch play though. Odd touch isn't an option there.

 

[Waluigilicious]

While I agree options should be there for a game titled "Definitive Edition", would touch screen even work well in co-op? The person touching the Switch would be blocking everyones view..

Two Switches will be needed. Check out the Vita trailer (40 seconds in)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXlsVfpuL0w

In this case, the second Switch could even be docked allowing multiple people to platform on the big screen while one person uses the other Switch in handheld mode. They pretty much already put something similar into the Vita version. Plus, Pacman VS does exactly this in Namco Museum AND it works with "download play" (you need to download a free app from the eshop on the other Switch).

 

[Stopdoor]

Decided to get some pics of the 5 player mode on Wii U, since even super fans apparently haven't heard of this feature. Now you can't even blame reviewers for their lack of knowledge Waluigilicious!

 

[Waluigilicious]

Decided to get some pics of the 5 player mode on Wii U, since even super fans apparently haven't heard of this feature. Now you can't even blame reviewers for their lack of knowledge Waluigilicious!

That's amazing. So the local multiplayer trumps NSMB U in two ways. 5 player platforming, and also Murphy is much better than placing blocks everywhere.

Hey you can't blame me that I've never gathered 5 people where no one wanted to be Murphy

 

[TheMoon]

We have access to three Switches in the house but just one copy of the game. But I still see no option to link multiple Switches in-game other than in Kung Foot.


The back of the case clearly says 4 player local co-op and on the bottom you can see it's 1-4 in TV and tabletop modes but just 1 player in handheld (and naturally for multiplayer Murphy you will need two Switches as one Switch will have your hand obstructing the screen)

This icon on the top right only comes up in Kung Foot Tournament:


So from my observations so far:

- Despite adding a way to connect locally
- Despite already programming multilayer Murphy in the Vita version
- Despite going through the effort of letting us use Murphy in single player

There is no way to use touch screen Murphy in multiplayer. I really hope I'm missing something.

Oh, Pastagames ported the game. First time I've heard this.

(it's the guys who made Maestro: Jump in Music for DS)

edit: oh, also the guys who made the 2D engine used for the new WonderBoy remake. interesting.

 

[stan423321]

Thanks for Wii U shots, now I don't feel obligated to get away from my PC for checking this.

would touch screen even work well in co-op? The person touching the Switch would be blocking everyones view.

The thing about touch screens is that my hand tends to obscure my own view to the point of me annoying myself in action games involving pointing to things in the actual game screen, so I could imagine some ensemble being fine with view being obscured by their member's hands.

There are, however, devices which would be cool for a game with this type of gameplay - not necessarily with RL having every feature copied one by one due to some differences - that would not only not involve this problem, they would also not require a second screen. These include 3D motion pointers based on infrared or other lights and cameras and/or gyroscopes, and 2D motion pointers using rolling spheres, visible light lasers, et caetera. The fact that whoever was developing all versions of RL did not notice or did not follow the fact that many of its platforms have such devices as pretty widespread standard input controllers

Spoiler

(Wii Remotes on Wii U. Joy-Cons on Switch, though quality of pointing is controversial. Mice on PC - supported elsewhere, but ubiquitous on PC. And that's ignoring less comfortable but possible options like gyros in regular pads, Kinect and probably something else)

makes me believe in alternative of three options: they are unusually dumb on that point; they fell in love with Wii U GamePad or politically pretended to, to the point of denying reason; or they thought themselves in the end that QTE Murfy was actually better than the alternative but were afraid of getting accused on giving up on Wii U based feature or something like that.

 

[Ex-Psych]

Eh I can live without them. Would love more musical levels.

 

[Seik]

They can do whatever they want with the Murphy levels as far as I'm concerned, I always saw those as a forced touch 'initiative' over the real levels.

 

[Waluigilicious]

Eh I can live without them. Would love more musical levels.

They can do whatever rhey want with the Murphy levels as far as I'm concerned, I always saw those as a forced touch 'initiative' over the real levels.

They are still there lol. You now can't control him in multiplayer mode. They kept the worst thing about him and removed the best.

 

[Haganeren]

Content-wise, the Wii U/PS3/360/PC versions are identical where it concerns the levels, with the only major difference being how the PS3/360/PC handles the Murphy implementation.

Oh ? But weren't there version of Rayman Legends which had additional levels over the Wii U version ?

... Maybe the PS4/XBO version ?

 

[VanWinkle]

Oh ? But weren't there version of Rayman Legends which had additional levels over the Wii U version ?

... Maybe the PS4/XBO version ?

I think Vita had a few additional Murphy levels, but that's about it.

 

[Psyrgery ES]

Not a dealbreaker for me.

Portable Kungfoot is the GOAT for me

 

[atr0cious]

This is why I'm not rebuying it as this mode was the main reason I wanted the game originally. Got it on one of the last super sales for Wii U and I'll just finish it there.

 

[stan423321]

Oh, Pastagames ported the game. First time I've heard this.

(it's the guys who made Maestro: Jump in Music for DS)


edit: oh, also the guys who made the 2D engine used for the new WonderBoy remake. interesting.

Pastagames is no surprise to anyone keeping an eye on Rayman for long enough, as they are developers behind the three mobile Rayman autorunners which do run on watered down versions of RO/RL engine and thus are familiar with it.

 

[joms5]

Looks like the "definitive" version is the Wii U version.
ha

Who would have thought. Glad I kept my Wii U.

 

[dafortune]

The Murphy levels weren't the best but they're even worse now with that press a bullshit.