Support NeoGAF

[Draugoth]

Yesterday, on the night of Christmas Eve (December 24), the source code for Grand Theft Auto V (GTA V was leaked onto the internet.

Among the various pieces of information found in the code, there was an unplayable build of GTA 6, information about 8 canceled DLCs for GTA V, one of which was an expansion that would bring Liberty City to the game, as well as information about the canceled Agent, and even Bully II.

According to sources in 2014 Leslie Benzies (One of the most important producers at Rockstar) and the Housers got into a huge disagreement due to Leslie’s desire to focus more on Online titles solely over Single-Player for the future of Rockstar. Proof of this is what Benzies is currently making, an online Fortnite-esque “platform” titled Everywhere.This disagreement reached a breaking point resulting in Leslie Benzies leaving the company in mid-2014, Alongside him, a large number of the developers who were working on GTA 5’s Expansions left the company alongside him, pausing the work on the DLCs indefinitely as Rockstar got to hiring new devs and training them to work with RAGE.During this, the GTAO team was making great progress on their work and seeing huge success so Rockstar decided to lend them more resources to build out GTAO which ultimately paid off hugely. By late 2015 the dream of a GTA 5 story expansions had died as the Housers decided to shift all their focus to Red Dead Redemption 2, By 2016 a Liberty City expansion to GTA 5/GTAO had been prototyped but ultimately also cancelled as RDR2 kept growing in scale, adding in New Austin very late in development and expanding the game's insane scope even further, the scope of RDR2 got so large that every single Rockstar studio fully dedicated themselves to RDR2, placing Bully 2 and all other ideas on ice until further notice.Ultimately, RDR2 became by far Rockstar's largest ever title in sheer scale and detail, GTAO made sure Rockstar was secure financially during this time which allowed them to fully focus on one singular title over releasing multiple smaller titles so in that way, yes GTAO affected how Rockstar makes games.

In addition to Bully II, an unannounced project by Rockstar San Diego was also found in the GTA V source code files, and it is none other than Midnight Club 5. We don't know during what period the studio was developing the project, especially considering the San Diego studio's total focus on the Red Dead series, so it is possible to state that the project was also canceled during the middle of 2010-2014.

 

[Moses85]

 

[R3TRODYCE]

Why can’t we have nice things?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Why can’t we have nice things?

that's life

 

[Fake]

Would be amazing another Bully game, but take the direction Rockstar is doing now this would kill the franchise.

Leaving this game in the past is for the better of the IP respect and legacy.

 

[KyoZz]

Old news, these concepts are known:

Bully 2 and Agent concept art from way back before GTA V came out

This looks pretty interesting: I can't make a thread so bumping this for supposedly new info: http://gtaforums.com/topic/256073-bully/?p=1069664060 http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=241352694&postcount=468 Someone got his hands on what seems to be very detailed pics of concept art...

www.neogaf.com

 

[Eimran]

After 15 years I've finally recovered from the absence of Bully 2 and now this.

 

[Draugoth]

Old news, these concepts are known:

Bully 2 and Agent concept art from way back before GTA V came out

This looks pretty interesting: I can't make a thread so bumping this for supposedly new info: http://gtaforums.com/topic/256073-bully/?p=1069664060 http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=241352694&postcount=468 Someone got his hands on what seems to be very detailed pics of concept art...

www.neogaf.com

I updated the thread with the new information and asked the mods to remove Bully 2 concept art mentions, thanks

 

[dotnotbot]

So Benzies was the real devil, pushing for online crap.

 

[Hudo]

I have to admit that GTA Online is a really ambitious piece of shit.

 

[Dundar]

I NEED THE BENZ!!!!1

 

[HL3.exe]

What a waste.

If this is all true, i'm less sad Benzies left, even though he is a veteran closer.

GTAO being their lifeline is nothing new, it's just shitty for incentifying new ideas and releases. It's what happened to Valve. Successful live services ultimately stifle innovation or new titles.

 

[KyoZz]

I updated the thread with the new information and asked the mods to remove Bully 2 concept art mentions, thanks

And thanks to you I'm reminded we'll never see a Bully 2, hope you are happy now!

Just kidding of course ❤

So Benzies was the real devil, pushing for online crap.

This is the big news here. Sparks some hope for the future of R*.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Why can’t we have nice things?

You can. Have you ever played RDR2?

 

[acm2000]

i mean we all assumed this anyway but nice to confirm i guess.

 

[Big Baller]

#saveplayer1

 

[ComputerBlue]

Pretty much what everyone with a fraction of a brain cell has been saying for years, GTA online has been the death of rockstar and their games. Who suggested the other day that gta6 won’t have online? You’re nuts.

 

[mckmas8808]

So Benzies was the real devil, pushing for online crap.

So glad he's gone now. Rockstar knows how to do single player games. Keep it that way!!!

 

[Hudo]

Would also explain why Benzies is now pushing the online shit hard with Everywhere.

 

[Lucifers Beard]

Ambitious GTA online stuff? Sure... Ambitious with regard to how they could monetise the hell out of it.

 

[DeepEnigma]

So glad he's gone now. Rockstar knows how to do single player games. Keep it that way!!!

Online push is not going to change one iota with GTA6. Bet.

 

[Thabass]

So Benzies was the real devil, pushing for online crap.

That decision made Rockstar a lot of money. Can't say I blame him even if it did remove the possibility of something I really wanted.

 

[charles8771]

So Benzies was the real devil, pushing for online crap.

The multiplayer portion of GTA 4 never got microtransactions, even thought the multiplayer portion was so limited.
While GTA 5 Online got it at day one in 2013.

Grand Theft Auto Parent Publisher Defends Microtransactions

"We are not in the business of erecting toll booths along the way of gameplay," Take-Two CEO Strauss Zelnick says.

www.gamespot.com

 

[justiceiro]

Lol, I guess Leslie left for absolutely nothing then.

 

[mckmas8808]

That decision made Rockstar a lot of money. Can't say I blame him even if it did remove the possibility of something I really wanted.

But that wasn't the only decision. It looks like he wanted to go further into the GAAS route, than the Housers wanted to go in. RDR2 came out after he decided to leave, because they weren't going GAAS heavy. RDR2 went on to sell over 50 MILLION copies.

 

[DeepEnigma]

But that wasn't the only decision. It looks like he wanted to go further into the GAAS route, than the Housers wanted to go in. RDR2 came out after he decided to leave, because they weren't going GAAS heavy. RDR2 went on to sell over 50 MILLION copies.

And still no 60fps patch.

 

[Thabass]

But that wasn't the only decision. It looks like he wanted to go further into the GAAS route, than the Housers wanted to go in. RDR2 came out after he decided to leave, because they weren't going GAAS heavy. RDR2 went on to sell over 50 MILLION copies.

Still doesn't change the fact that they went the GAAS route with GTAV and hence we didn't get the DLCs. It worked for them, it's actually more strange that they didn't just continue the formula given the success it had.

 

[ChuckeRearmed]

GaaS engine goes brr brr

 

[mckmas8808]

And still no 60fps patch.

INSANE!!! It'll come, but in a remaster probably after GTA6 comes out.

Still doesn't change the fact that they went the GAAS route with GTAV and hence we didn't get the DLCs. It worked for them, it's actually more strange that they didn't just continue the formula given the success it had.

Because so far......Rockstar isn't run by a bunch of bean-counting suits. Many there still care about the art of games.

 

[kiphalfton]

Why can’t we have nice things?

Cuz stupid people fueling the GTA Online machine.

 

[DeepEnigma]

INSANE!!! It'll come, but in a remaster probably after GTA6 comes out.



Because so far......Rockstar isn't run by a bunch of bean-counting suits. Many there still care about the art of games.

 

[mckmas8808]

LOL!!!!! He is literally a suit with a head, yes. But he seems to allow the Rockstar team to do what they want for the most part. It's clear to me that they chose RDR2 over GTA5 single-player DLC. And that I Rockstar chose correctly.

 

[Negotiator101]

We get RDR2 and soon GTA6 both are games that no other developer could achieve so I'll take that over smaller far less ambitious games. Leave those to Ubisoft and other cookie cutter games.

 

[Denton]

The Benz may be a genius, but also huge disappointment. Fuck online.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Would also explain why Benzies is now pushing the online shit hard with Everywhere.

“Everywhere”?? Dear God that sounds just straight awful.

 

[Thabass]

Because so far......Rockstar isn't run by a bunch of bean-counting suits. Many there still care about the art of games.

Don't get me wrong, I disagree with Benz's incessant need for online, but you can't argue with the financial results of it. It made Rockstar a truck load of money. With that said, I do hope that we get GTAVI single-player DLC in the future. Especially with how GTAVI looks already, it's shaping up to be one of the best games of the year in 2025 (if it comes out then).

 

[Hudo]

“Everywhere”?? Dear God that sounds just straight awful.

https://www.everywhere.game/

 

[The_Observer]

In this case, I’m glad that Benz is gone.

 

[Majormaxxx]

You'll play gta online and you'll be happy

 

[Spukc]

Man FUCK
gta online

Worst fucking shit ever happened to gaming

 

[Strategize]

I mean unless you hate RDR2 why would anyone be upset at this?

GTA online provided the financial security to allow the RDR2 team to go as big, detailed and epic as they wanted, the same thing will happen with GTA6, online is the reason they can spend a billion dollars on this thing without a worry. It slowed their releases sure, but will allow said releases to be more groundbreaking and detailed than ever when they do come.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

ND redeemed?

 

[theStartupSound]

For a company like Rockstar with a seller like GTA V, I think the “but online makes them a lot of money, so I understand the shark cards” argument doesn’t count. It’s not like they were a struggling small developer before online. It’s more like a “Now I want 10 yachts and two planes instead of one” motivation, which I find disappointing for some guys who put so much love in their SP games to do so half-hearted low effort stuff for the online money making machine.

 

[SirKicksalot]

Can't wait for Everywhere to bomb like All Points Bulletin.

 

[Pagusas]

So I wonder, hypothetically what would have made more money in the same period of time:

What we got with GTA: Online and RDR2

OR what we didnt get: GTA DLC, Bully 2, Midnight Club 5 and a Smaller Scale RDR2.

 

[theStartupSound]

So I wonder, hypothetically what would have made more money in the same period of time:

What we got with GTA: Online and RDR2

OR what we didnt get: GTA DLC, Bully 2, Midnight Club 5 and a Smaller Scale RDR2.

I would hope the games and the DLC, but I think it is online. The (felt) production value is pretty low for what they make with it

 

[Strategize]

For a company like Rockstar with a seller like GTA V, I think the “but online makes them a lot of money, so I understand the shark cards” argument doesn’t count. It’s not like they were a struggling small developer before online. It’s more like a “Now I want 10 yachts and two planes instead of one” motivation, which I find disappointing for some guys who put so much love in their SP games to do so half-hearted low effort stuff for the online money making machine.

RDR2 and GTA6 wouldn't have been what it was without GTA online, it's just a fact. The amount of motion capture used in RDR2 is probably the equivalent of 10 TV seasons, it's absurd. And they're spending even more on GTA6, simply because they can now. You can say it's just simply for the money, but it's very evident that money is being used for betterment of their SP products, therefore the shark cards have a payoff for us too, not just for a bunch of men in suits.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

https://www.everywhere.game/

Ooof. Yikes, reading that site I think there’s a solid chance that thing tanks hard.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

RDR2 and GTA6 wouldn't have been what it was without GTA online, it's just a fact. The amount of motion capture used in RDR2 is probably the equivalent of 10 TV seasons, it's absurd. And they're spending even more on GTA6, simply because they can now. You can say it's just simply for the money, but it's very evident that money is being used for betterment of their SP products, therefore the shark cards have a payoff for us too, not just for a bunch of men in suits.

This basically sums up GaaS.

 

[CoreyFlawless]

I’m fine with the online. But u lose alot of ppl when you don’t have single player. That what help bring in and build gta online. As long they still make good single player games. I will always try out the online. Here and there. But if that ends. And it nothing but gta online. I would touch or even care. Lucky gta 6 coming and looking to amazing. Pretty sure they have a great new online version of it. I give it a try