thomasmahler
Moon Studios
Okay, let's quickly talk about Bioshock Infinite and why it is or is not an important game for the industry. I didn't want to put this into the Infinite OT cause I think it doesn't fit and people will want to stone me after the following.
Now, let me first state that I did not understand why Bioshock 1 got so much love, so maybe everything I'll bring up here will be bunk for Bioshock fans, but I was going into Infinite, hoping that this game will be the game that makes me understand and love Bioshock.
On a related note: Yes, the game is beautiful and the presentation is quite amazing. But that shouldn't be the point of this thread, cause graphics = decoration, in my opinion. Graphics and presentation can help making the experience better, but amazing presentation alone never makes for a great game.
I remember a year or two ago, there was another thread about overhyped games here on GAF and suddenly a whole bunch of GAF members spoke up, saying that they didn't really like Bio 1 all that much - It'll be interesting to see how those people now react to Bio Infinite. I wondered whether Bio1 was lucky to be part of some hypemachine, but it seems like Bio Infinite is getting a huge amount of love already.
Now, without further ado, let's take a look at Bioshock Infinite:
1) I feel stupid: The main character constantly seems to know things I don't know and it frustrates me:
2 minutes into this world, he knows that he has to 'find the girl' at 'the statue'. What statue? Who the hell are you? Who's the girl? What in the world am I doing here? What's Columbia? None of that is explained. Should I have finished Bio 1 and Bio 2 to get it?
Once I find Elizabeth, her character isn't being explained either. Booker constantly wants to save her, but why? Why should I feel anything for that character? In a recent developer trailer, I saw one developer saying that they watched playtesters finding it very impactful how Elizabeth helps you out during combat. The way this works is simple: She shouts something like: "Booker, you're hurt!", then you press X to catch a medikit that she's throwing at you.
Rinse and Repeat, this'll happen dozens of times in the game. That's not an interaction that makes me feel emotionally connected to the character. She's just a health dispenser now. Reference Clementine from Walking Dead for a character that you feel really emotionally connected to. Elizabeth is a stupid AI robot that sometimes throws things into my face.
2) Buildup: Now, the press complained about Lara Croft in the new Tomb Raider becoming a killing machine within minutes. In Bioshock, people find out that I'm the 'false prophet' early on and suddenly the ugliest of all videogame tropes kicks in. You literally just have to KILL EVERYTHING THAT MOVES. That's it. Just kill the whole town. No explanation. How do other characters react to Booker DeWitt being the second coming of Hitler? Here's how:
Elizabeth sees you killing all those people, at which point she reacts shocked and drops a line like: "You killed all these men!", to which Booker replies "Well, what did you expect? They kept you up in your tower, so my logical conclusion was genocide." - That's it! That line settles it for Elizabeth, after that, she's totally fine with Booker murdering hundreds of people that stand in his way.
3) Contextualization: Nothing in this game and within this world really is really being explained or makes any goddamn sense. What is the vigor mechanic? Why can I upgrade vigor at vending machines? Why do I get new pants that let me reload my weapons 25% faster? I'm now wearing a vest that gives me a 40% chance of enemies dropping ammo upon death.
The way I learn about magic is by walking up to a salt machine, then my hands start to burn away and suddenly I can cast magic. Why? What just happened? Why did my hands start burning? None of that is being explained either. But now I can shoot stuff out of my hands, so I guess it's cool.
Following me? No? Good, I wouldn't have expected anything else.
Now, I get the whole "It's a videogame! You can't expect it to be realistic!" thing - Maybe, but I should expect the world to be believable. This stuff to me just takes me out of the experience.
Now, tears are a big feature in this game, so obviously they had to explain what they are. I think the lines were something along the lines of:
"Whoa, what was that!"
"A tear, it's like a portal to another world!"
And that's how it's explained that Elizabeth can open tears to other worlds. Actually, this doesn't explain shit, I don't care what a tear really is at this point, I WONDER WHY IN THE WORLD YOU CAN OPEN PORTALS TO ANOTHER WORLD IN THE FIRST PLACE! Who the hell are you?
4) Narrative: It's basically the same stuff as what they did in Bio1. You constantly hear some audio logs and antagonists speaking to you through telepathy (or invisible speakers that are hanging everywhere in the world) and it's goddamn confusing. I already hated how story worked in Borderlands 2, with the antagonist trying to tell you a story while you're in combat - and it's the absolute same here.
There are various antagonists that throw constant waves of enemies at you and you're just wondering what the hell you're doing. The game is forcing me to kill a dozen enemies after the antagonist just opened the floodgates, you're forced to kill all of them or be killed yourself and then you hear VOs like "See, Booker, you're a murderer, too!". Well, yeah, no shit.
I'm probably halfway through the game now and I have no idea what really is going on. I don't know who Booker is, who Elizabeth is, why I'm killing all of Columbia, what my actual goal is, etc., I'm just walking through pretty environments and killing waves after waves of enemies.
5) Combat: Why am I constantly fighting waves of enemies? Every single area I enter, the first thing I hear is literally "KILL HIM!" - And on it goes again. I never run out of ammo, I never have to be strategic about it, Elizabeth constantly supplies me with health, it's always the same drag. The guns aren't anything to write home about, you have your normal selection of rifles, shotguns, rocket launchers, you name it. I am really getting sick and tired of this whole 'do the same thing over and over again!' thing. Think Uncharted gets boring near the end of the game when it's just about killing more and more waves of enemies? Try Bioshock Infinite.
To me, this is like Uncharted as a FPS up in the sky with literal rollercoasters this time around and a story that's so convoluted that I simply can't follow it. I don't get it.
Now, maybe I'm a complete nutjob and maybe I just really don't get Bioshock, but I'd be delighted if someone could explain this to me. How do I have to play Bioshock to see something more than a FPS with a really nice presentation that is being bogged down by a really convoluted, lacking story, lack of character development, mediocre gunplay with magic effects thrown in and gameplay that consists of constant waves of enemies storming in, waiting to be killed.
I'm not trying to be an asshole and I have the utmost respect of everyone at Irrational for delivering such an enormous project - But in terms of what this title means to the games industry, I just don't see the genius in it. But again, I also didn't in Bioshock 1 and that game made tons and tons of people happy. If someone can enlighten me, I'd be forever grateful.
Now, let me first state that I did not understand why Bioshock 1 got so much love, so maybe everything I'll bring up here will be bunk for Bioshock fans, but I was going into Infinite, hoping that this game will be the game that makes me understand and love Bioshock.
On a related note: Yes, the game is beautiful and the presentation is quite amazing. But that shouldn't be the point of this thread, cause graphics = decoration, in my opinion. Graphics and presentation can help making the experience better, but amazing presentation alone never makes for a great game.
I remember a year or two ago, there was another thread about overhyped games here on GAF and suddenly a whole bunch of GAF members spoke up, saying that they didn't really like Bio 1 all that much - It'll be interesting to see how those people now react to Bio Infinite. I wondered whether Bio1 was lucky to be part of some hypemachine, but it seems like Bio Infinite is getting a huge amount of love already.
Now, without further ado, let's take a look at Bioshock Infinite:
1) I feel stupid: The main character constantly seems to know things I don't know and it frustrates me:
2 minutes into this world, he knows that he has to 'find the girl' at 'the statue'. What statue? Who the hell are you? Who's the girl? What in the world am I doing here? What's Columbia? None of that is explained. Should I have finished Bio 1 and Bio 2 to get it?
Once I find Elizabeth, her character isn't being explained either. Booker constantly wants to save her, but why? Why should I feel anything for that character? In a recent developer trailer, I saw one developer saying that they watched playtesters finding it very impactful how Elizabeth helps you out during combat. The way this works is simple: She shouts something like: "Booker, you're hurt!", then you press X to catch a medikit that she's throwing at you.
Rinse and Repeat, this'll happen dozens of times in the game. That's not an interaction that makes me feel emotionally connected to the character. She's just a health dispenser now. Reference Clementine from Walking Dead for a character that you feel really emotionally connected to. Elizabeth is a stupid AI robot that sometimes throws things into my face.
2) Buildup: Now, the press complained about Lara Croft in the new Tomb Raider becoming a killing machine within minutes. In Bioshock, people find out that I'm the 'false prophet' early on and suddenly the ugliest of all videogame tropes kicks in. You literally just have to KILL EVERYTHING THAT MOVES. That's it. Just kill the whole town. No explanation. How do other characters react to Booker DeWitt being the second coming of Hitler? Here's how:
Elizabeth sees you killing all those people, at which point she reacts shocked and drops a line like: "You killed all these men!", to which Booker replies "Well, what did you expect? They kept you up in your tower, so my logical conclusion was genocide." - That's it! That line settles it for Elizabeth, after that, she's totally fine with Booker murdering hundreds of people that stand in his way.
3) Contextualization: Nothing in this game and within this world really is really being explained or makes any goddamn sense. What is the vigor mechanic? Why can I upgrade vigor at vending machines? Why do I get new pants that let me reload my weapons 25% faster? I'm now wearing a vest that gives me a 40% chance of enemies dropping ammo upon death.
The way I learn about magic is by walking up to a salt machine, then my hands start to burn away and suddenly I can cast magic. Why? What just happened? Why did my hands start burning? None of that is being explained either. But now I can shoot stuff out of my hands, so I guess it's cool.
Following me? No? Good, I wouldn't have expected anything else.
Now, I get the whole "It's a videogame! You can't expect it to be realistic!" thing - Maybe, but I should expect the world to be believable. This stuff to me just takes me out of the experience.
Now, tears are a big feature in this game, so obviously they had to explain what they are. I think the lines were something along the lines of:
"Whoa, what was that!"
"A tear, it's like a portal to another world!"
And that's how it's explained that Elizabeth can open tears to other worlds. Actually, this doesn't explain shit, I don't care what a tear really is at this point, I WONDER WHY IN THE WORLD YOU CAN OPEN PORTALS TO ANOTHER WORLD IN THE FIRST PLACE! Who the hell are you?
4) Narrative: It's basically the same stuff as what they did in Bio1. You constantly hear some audio logs and antagonists speaking to you through telepathy (or invisible speakers that are hanging everywhere in the world) and it's goddamn confusing. I already hated how story worked in Borderlands 2, with the antagonist trying to tell you a story while you're in combat - and it's the absolute same here.
There are various antagonists that throw constant waves of enemies at you and you're just wondering what the hell you're doing. The game is forcing me to kill a dozen enemies after the antagonist just opened the floodgates, you're forced to kill all of them or be killed yourself and then you hear VOs like "See, Booker, you're a murderer, too!". Well, yeah, no shit.
I'm probably halfway through the game now and I have no idea what really is going on. I don't know who Booker is, who Elizabeth is, why I'm killing all of Columbia, what my actual goal is, etc., I'm just walking through pretty environments and killing waves after waves of enemies.
5) Combat: Why am I constantly fighting waves of enemies? Every single area I enter, the first thing I hear is literally "KILL HIM!" - And on it goes again. I never run out of ammo, I never have to be strategic about it, Elizabeth constantly supplies me with health, it's always the same drag. The guns aren't anything to write home about, you have your normal selection of rifles, shotguns, rocket launchers, you name it. I am really getting sick and tired of this whole 'do the same thing over and over again!' thing. Think Uncharted gets boring near the end of the game when it's just about killing more and more waves of enemies? Try Bioshock Infinite.
To me, this is like Uncharted as a FPS up in the sky with literal rollercoasters this time around and a story that's so convoluted that I simply can't follow it. I don't get it.
Now, maybe I'm a complete nutjob and maybe I just really don't get Bioshock, but I'd be delighted if someone could explain this to me. How do I have to play Bioshock to see something more than a FPS with a really nice presentation that is being bogged down by a really convoluted, lacking story, lack of character development, mediocre gunplay with magic effects thrown in and gameplay that consists of constant waves of enemies storming in, waiting to be killed.
I'm not trying to be an asshole and I have the utmost respect of everyone at Irrational for delivering such an enormous project - But in terms of what this title means to the games industry, I just don't see the genius in it. But again, I also didn't in Bioshock 1 and that game made tons and tons of people happy. If someone can enlighten me, I'd be forever grateful.
