brandonh83
Banned
Kylo really shouldn't just let his dreams be dreams.
Kylo: "Here."
Rey: "What?"
Kylo: "I can take it. Just do it. I have prepared for this moment for a long time."
Rey: "You are fucked up."
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Star Wars Episode VIII Production Thread (Principal Photography Complete)
- Thread starter Quick
- Start date
Kylo really shouldn't just let his dreams be dreams.
Kylo: "Here."
Rey: "What?"
Kylo: "I can take it. Just do it. I have prepared for this moment for a long time."
Rey: "You are fucked up."
Alternately, he wears the mask in TFA because it makes him feel more powerful, more like Vader. He takes it off in more vulnerable situations. He thought killing Han would make him surpass Vader (because the one thing Vader couldn't do is kill his family), but it made him feel weaker. And then he got showed up by some know-nothing newcomer using Darth Vader's lightsaber. Everything has fallen apart and he probably feels even more like a loser now.
So he should immerse himself even deeper in the Vader cult.
Jack Scofield
Member
They'll probably stick to a similar style. Though Kylo still used a lot of 'twirly' moves in TFA, they were probably my favourite parts.
I loved these two moments. They give the impression that Kylo's lightsaber is a heavy, deadly weapon.
Lifejumper
Member
So people are down with the cross guard saber now? I always liked it.
I didn't like it at first but honestly the saber really grew on me, as did the character.
Cosplaying Kylo Ren at a convention very recently helped as well
WadiumArcadium
Member
Same. But then it's a lightsaber, it would take a lot for me not to like it.
Nope, that did it.
brandonh83
Banned
brandonh83
Banned
Kylo Ren said that he really likes the script for Episode VIII, and I imagine that he's also referring to his character. If Kylo likes what they wrote for Driver's character, it's probably very cool.
It doesn't have to be like this.
BrokenFiction
Member
Oscar Issac also said they're doing amazing things with the script for 8 - stuff he's never seen in a movie like this before...
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Everyone likes what Rian Johnson wrote.
Because Rian Johnson is a very good writer.
Because Rian Johnson is a very good writer.
Who the fuck thought these half second fragment of a scene gifs were ever a good idea?
brandonh83
Banned
With Johnson writing it, it all makes sense. I think it's going to absolutely be a "Star Wars" movie but after they intentionally designed Episode VII to be familiar to sort of get things back on track and show they know what they're doing I'd imagine it's their sole intent to shake it up next time.
I don't need for them to shake up Star Wars, I'm perfectly happy with SW being SW, but some experimentation especially from a good filmmaker like Johnson isn't something I'm against whatsoever. I think Episode VII was "right" and a killer movie, it's my favorite so far, but doing new things could prove to be vital for keeping Star Wars interesting and relevant.
Right, and these are good points. Let me clarify though -- he hasn't become the person who he wants to be, but I think his decision to murder Han signifies the death of the last bit of light side he had within himself. The mask he wore "protected" him from the pull to the light -- now that light is gone, so there's no reason to hide himself when he's found his fate in the dark side of the force.. wherever that might lead him.
I've always seen Kylo as a person on a ticking self destruct whose slipping further and further away from what he wants. He's slowly transforming his identity and paving his own destiny. The problem is that the path he's venturing down is uncharted territory. It's a lose-lose for him; he'll never be the person he wants to be (strong, confident, powerful) and now he's going to be punished into submission by Snoke, forever chasing Vader's shadow.
I thought TFA was very much Ben's commitment to the dark side and eradication of his weakness (the good left in him).
He doesn't need his mask because he's removed the last bit of light from within himself. Problem is now he's just a broken person leading a path of destruction for himself and everyone caught in his wake. That doesn't mean he doesn't feel pain or that he's pure evil, of course. He's just lost and his terrible decisions are now compounding on top of each other.
In some ways, he's similar to Walter White in the sense that he's endlessly chasing satisfaction. I think EP8 will run along the same theme found in "Fly" from Breaking Bad.
Come on. Rian Johnson wasn't brought in to redeem Kylo Ren.
But that's just my take on it thus far.
I don't think they're going to shake up Star Wars, I think they're just going to go in a new direction now that isn't so much Empire Strikes Back or (thank Christ) Attack of the Clones. Force Awakens was all about reminding audiences of what Star Wars should be, ideally Episode 8 will show what Star Wars can be.
Prequels were complete horse shit as far as saber duels, and no the Darth Maul fight was horse shit too.
The thing that made it remotely tolerable was that the intensity level was upped and there was not so much spinny spinny "look at me I am an asshole swatting flies" crap.
brandonh83
Banned
I don't think Kylo will be redeemed. That doesn't mean that he won't end up trying to make an effort, after seeing the error of his ways, but I think he's down the path pretty far and he's clearly a sociopath so I don't know that there's any turning back for him.
On the matter though, if he did try and repent, it'd be even more fucked up if no one let him. I mean, dude killed Han Solo, everyone's pal (except Kanjiklub), in cold blood and tried to kill Rey and Finn so imagine if they're just like, no, you're an asshole.
But Driver sells us on him legitimately trying to correct his errors, so we feel sympathy but understand why no one is giving him a chance or wants to have anything to do with him. He'd deserve that, but that would be dark. I can see him sacrificing himself in Episode IX.
On the matter though, if he did try and repent, it'd be even more fucked up if no one let him. I mean, dude killed Han Solo, everyone's pal (except Kanjiklub), in cold blood and tried to kill Rey and Finn so imagine if they're just like, no, you're an asshole.
But Driver sells us on him legitimately trying to correct his errors, so we feel sympathy but understand why no one is giving him a chance or wants to have anything to do with him. He'd deserve that, but that would be dark. I can see him sacrificing himself in Episode IX.
This isn't Star Trak
The Maul fight is logically what I expected out of a lightsaber fight featuring Jedi in their prime. The only problem I have with that fight is that there's absolutely no emotional investment in the fight because the movie does a shit job of building up Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Darth Maul. Plus that fight has some cool visual moments too, like Maul revealing the double bladed lightsaber and I like the shot of Qui-Gon meditating while Maul paces back and forth like a caged tiger.
brandonh83
Banned
ehh I'd say it did, enough anyway. Maul fought Jinn on Tatooine so there was a bit of an established rivalry there, and Jinn's death was pretty emotional and gave Kenobi the rage fuel he needed. So I thought that it was fine in that regard, with the buildup and emotional investm-- wait are we doing this again
LOL @ the gif
Jinn has the personality of cardboard though (which is amazing since he was played by Liam freakin Neason). But I don't think anyone can deny that Maul was completely underutilized.
WadiumArcadium
Member
Kid Blue's in it so Looper is canon.
brandonh83
Banned
fuck that I loved Jinn and his personality. I found him super likable and with a better idea of how the Force/Jedi should work (which ended up playing a huge factor going forward). He was really the only Jedi I cared for, but that was sort of the entire point of the prequel trilogy IMO.
You're right about Maul though. Unfortunately Star Wars has a running history of cool villains that the directors, while they think they're cool too, tends to forget about that when writing/shooting.
WadiumArcadium
Member
Maul was better after he got cut in half.
BrokenFiction
Member
Clone Wars Maul is amazing-tier.
Clone Wars Maul is so good
brandonh83
Banned
I did get around to finishing Clone Wars. Bringing Maul back was stupid to me before I saw it and it was stupid to me after I saw it. It really didn't serve a purpose whatsoever and made zero sense, at least in the show itself. I've heard he's going to be in other materials, but it's dumb as fuck.
brandonh83
Banned
It's also shit. He was cut the fuck in half and plummeted what looked like a bazillion feet into god knows where. I don't buy it and no amount of space magic can convince me otherwise. I don't care if the idea was made up of 90,000 midichlorians, it's dumb.
The most notable villain in the entire franchise had all of his limbs cut off, was set on fire, and spent the rest of his live in a mobile lung. General Grevious was a living person who was turned into a robot. Maul surviving getting cut in half isn't that crazy. Also, Luke survived a much larger fall in Empire.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
Hey, people have survived being cut in half before in real life, and those people sure don't need the force to do it. Also, the implication is that his upper half got sucked into a trash disposal tube (much like Luke), so it's not like he plummeted to the bottom of that huge abyss.
WadiumArcadium
Member
I thought it was a stupid idea as well at first but actually watching it changed my opinion completely. Maul looked great but he was completely wasted in the films. Watching him cause chaos by teaming up wiith his brother and assuming control of Death Watch was just really really fun to watch. Sam Witwer gave a great performance as Maul as well.
brandonh83
Banned
Being cut in half and remaining at the bottom of something for a while, after falling that far-- still being cut in half-- would result in death. Lucas even said that he made the death extreme on purpose so that people wouldn't want him to bring him back. It was intentionally finite, and bringing him back was nothing more than illogical fan service.
I'd argue that these things are very different. Luke didn't fall... cut in half. Anakin lost limbs and suffered terrible burns and it's definitely a miracle that he survived, but his internals were intact. I can buy that stuff. Also Luke landed at sort of an angle.
I'd argue that these things are very different. Luke didn't fall... cut in half. Anakin lost limbs and suffered terrible burns and it's definitely a miracle that he survived, but his internals were intact. I can buy that stuff. Also Luke landed at sort of an angle.
Maul's brother was a neat character mostly because he was Star Wars Brock Lesnar in that he just compensated for his lack of Force talents by being a monster with brute strength. But god damn, he had the worst name in the history of Star Wars - Savage Opress
Lucas was ultimately the one who greenlit him being brought back.
Maul surviving that is really no more ridiculous than Anakin surviving at the end of ROTS though. Anakin laid there for a while before Palpatine showed up.
Lucas was ultimately the one who greenlit him being brought back.
Maul surviving that is really no more ridiculous than Anakin surviving at the end of ROTS though. Anakin laid there for a while before Palpatine showed up.
brandonh83
Banned
Which I disagree with him there, and he didn't give a fuck because he wasn't the one who had to deal with it. For the intents of his prequel movies, Maul was dead dead dead.
To me suffering extreme burns with your internals intact, as extreme as it was, is far more believable to me than someone getting cut in half and both halves falling that far.
Maul surviving that in any way is ridiculous. I can bend logic a bit over the Anakin thing.
Indeed, the best parts to me in that fight were honestly not involving blades at all (though the reveal was indeed great especially back in the theater at the first showing...too bad toys and other things spoiled it)..but was the movement, the kicks, the strategy of keeping them in front of Maul and him then seperating them.
It was more of a chess match.
Lifejumper
Member
Skellig Michael behind the scenes for TFA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9f2y4jUYq8&feature=youtu.be
Considering where Maul was cut and the fact that lightsabers cauterize wounds, I think you can make the assumption that most of his internals were still fine as well assuming his internal anatomy is the same as a normal human. Plus, like I said, Luke fell from an even greater height plus we have no idea what was at the bottom of that pit Maul fell into in the first place - he could have gotten sucked into one of those tubes just like Luke did for all we know. It's a suspension of disbelief I'm willing to accept since the end result was Maul being brought back as a much cooler and more interesting character.
Now if there was only a way to get Grevious back and make him the really awesome Jedi Terminator we saw in the Tartakovsky Clone Wars cartoon.....
brandonh83
Banned
Ignoring all this Maul surviving nonsense, I'm with you on General Grievous. I'd take a retcon for that son of a bitch. Grievous was my favorite villain until Benjamin.
Let's say we're on terms about his survival conditions-- I still didn't think he was utilized that well in Clone Wars. I might have been okay with it if Maul and Kenobi had a final battle, but they left it unresolved, so I can't really think of any decent justification behind it. It left me with severe blue balls. I rolled my eyes at him coming back, but ran with it because I liked the show, but didn't even feel like they did much of anything interesting with him. No actual arc or payoff.
Let's say we're on terms about his survival conditions-- I still didn't think he was utilized that well in Clone Wars. I might have been okay with it if Maul and Kenobi had a final battle, but they left it unresolved, so I can't really think of any decent justification behind it. It left me with severe blue balls. I rolled my eyes at him coming back, but ran with it because I liked the show, but didn't even feel like they did much of anything interesting with him. No actual arc or payoff.
BrokenFiction
Member
If I to guess (Rebels spoilers) -
Maul's gonna get that fight with Obi-Wan, maybe next season.
brandonh83
Banned
Fair enough. Haven't watched Rebels yet but I just got season 1 in the mail the other day, so that's something to do.
If it ends up being awesome af I'll let it slide. Still dumb though.
The Elite
BOSS
I am with Brandon here. Maul's sustained injury coupled with that fall was just too much for me to believe that he could have survived even minutes after landing.
Sure, Anakin had limbs cut off but he also received medical attention in what seemed like a fairly short period of time. No internal organs would have been affected by those limbs that were cut off and the burns were severe but treatable.
Sure, Anakin had limbs cut off but he also received medical attention in what seemed like a fairly short period of time. No internal organs would have been affected by those limbs that were cut off and the burns were severe but treatable.
Grievous was a piece of shit, totally brought down an otherwise solid film in Revenge of the Sith.
I mean you had all that time wasted on a garbage character when the audience could have got I don't know, more scenes of the Jedi Temple march or whatever.
Anyway.
Would be kind of rad for Luke to be a ruthless master in this trilogy, like he'll take out Kylo with no mercy kind of thing.
I mean you had all that time wasted on a garbage character when the audience could have got I don't know, more scenes of the Jedi Temple march or whatever.
Anyway.
Would be kind of rad for Luke to be a ruthless master in this trilogy, like he'll take out Kylo with no mercy kind of thing.
I fell in love with that Tatooine Jinn-Maul fight, one of my favorite's from the prequels.
brandonh83
Banned
The fight honestly didn't do much for me, it was cool but extremely brief and I realized it was just an appetizer.
Just isn't believable to me whatsoever even in a fantasy thing. Like I said I can accept what happened with Anakin for reasons mentioned, but Maul was clearly, very intentionally dead and they only brought him back for fan service.