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Suikoden 4...Will it rekindle the magic of Suiko 2?
- Thread starter Brandon F
- Start date
SolidSnakex
Member
E3 impressions weren't good because from what i've heard all Konami did was set up a demo that had like 3 battles and a dialog scene. That was it.
fennec fox
ferrets ferrets ferrets ferrets FERRETS!!!
Worst. Demo. Ever. Though I think it was just a poorly chosen scene. Waiting for more information.
Prince of Space
Banned
Funny, I always considered Suiko 2 to be the series' weak link...
Shouta
Member
Battles moved WAY better than in Suikoden 3. It looks like they went back to the essentials and went with Suikoden 2's battle system from the lame ass demo at E3. It moves really well too btw. The total opposite of Suikoden 3 graphically.
And Suiko 2 is the series' strongest link =b.
And Suiko 2 is the series' strongest link =b.
Yea I was totally late to that party, but Suiko 2 was great. I even played Suiko 1 a second time through right before just to re-import save data to my erased mem card a few years back.
Suiko 3 was loved by the press, Alex, and Kitsune; but man I had a hard time justifying why...
Nice intro tho.
Suiko 3 was loved by the press, Alex, and Kitsune; but man I had a hard time justifying why...
Nice intro tho.
Yea I did the same thing. Got all stars in Suiko 1 twice! Got close in Suiko 2, but there were a few very odd ones I gave up on earning in that game(Run away from battle 100 times?). Still would like to go back and get em for a better ending but whatever.
fennec fox
ferrets ferrets ferrets ferrets FERRETS!!!
Suikoden Cuteness meterbjork said:
Ducks <<<<<<<<<<<< squirrels <<<< cat people <<<<<<<<< Kuromimi
From what I recall, in order to get all the stars together in Sui 2, you had to follow the side story of Clive and the person he's chasing, and make it to some particular point in the game in less than 12 hours. I think I was there at like 20 hours with exploring dungeons and whatnot, but still, shaving eight hours off would be tough, I think.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
Every game in the series has been hellasweet. 4 I'm not so sure about yet. I hate prequels and not many of the characters look that interesting so far.
SolidSnakex
Member
Brandon F said:Glad to hear they at least ended that INANE partner system from Suiko 3 battles. Seriously, that was just recklessly stupid stuff.
So seriously Ducks or Cats?
The cats seem to be doing the Thriller dance, so they win.
Jugendstil
Member
Suikoden 3 sucked. The battle system was atrocious.
Diomedeskun
Member
The Clive subquest was unecessary in 2, but it was not difficult on a replay. It just meant that you had to skip the minigames, such as the wonderful Iron Chef game; and you could not take the time to actually read most of what was in the text boxes. It added quite a bit to the story, but you only had to succeed in the first few, which were very lenient time-wise to get Clive.
Incidentally, I loved Suikoden 3. It may have felt less like the others than 2 did like 1, but I was glad the game had so much innovation. The worst part about 3 was that it made you retread so much territory and had a small world, but you really got to explore the entire cast of characters in a way the the traditional system would not allow.
My other complaint against 3 was the forgettable (aside from the opening) soundtrack. The graphics could also have used some work, although I was pleased with them at the time. IV looks like it vastly improves on both of these aspects.
III as an individual game was very good, but combined with 1 and 2 (as well as synopses of Suikogaiden 1 and 2 for the info on Nash, Harmonia, and the Fire Bringer) became the most immersive RPG experience I have ever had.
Try reading the backstory and extra Konami info at www.suikosource.com. The Manga released by tokyopop also has some info not in the game.
Incidentally, I loved Suikoden 3. It may have felt less like the others than 2 did like 1, but I was glad the game had so much innovation. The worst part about 3 was that it made you retread so much territory and had a small world, but you really got to explore the entire cast of characters in a way the the traditional system would not allow.
My other complaint against 3 was the forgettable (aside from the opening) soundtrack. The graphics could also have used some work, although I was pleased with them at the time. IV looks like it vastly improves on both of these aspects.
III as an individual game was very good, but combined with 1 and 2 (as well as synopses of Suikogaiden 1 and 2 for the info on Nash, Harmonia, and the Fire Bringer) became the most immersive RPG experience I have ever had.
Try reading the backstory and extra Konami info at www.suikosource.com. The Manga released by tokyopop also has some info not in the game.
I'm the biggest Suikoden fan ever. Guaranteed.
Suikoden II is my favorite game ever, so Suikoden 3 had high expectations. Luckily, I'm the kind of person that remembers what they loved about it and forgets what they didn't.
So Suikoden III ended up giving a good impression. 8/10 kind of rating. Which dosen't compare to the 9.9/10 for Suikoden I and 10/10 for Suikoden II for me, but it still didn't disappoint.
I think Luc redeemed what I hated about the game.
Suikoden II is my favorite game ever, so Suikoden 3 had high expectations. Luckily, I'm the kind of person that remembers what they loved about it and forgets what they didn't.
So Suikoden III ended up giving a good impression. 8/10 kind of rating. Which dosen't compare to the 9.9/10 for Suikoden I and 10/10 for Suikoden II for me, but it still didn't disappoint.
I think Luc redeemed what I hated about the game.
LittleTokyo
Member
Suikoden III sucks? Only at GA...
BobbyRobby
Member
Suikoden III was awesome. Its probably even my favorite PS2 game. Suikoden II is still the best in the series though. I'd love to see Suikoden IV be just as good, but it doesn't seem likely.
And the ducks kicked ass. They reminded me of DuckTales.
And the ducks kicked ass. They reminded me of DuckTales.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
Tabris said:
I doubt it......
I loved the first two Suikodens, but I didn't enjoy Suikoden 3 much. I didn't get very far before I gave up, and that doesn't happen much with me. Then again, I don't play RPGs anymore anyway. I'm not sure if I couldn't finish Suikoden 3 because I no longer like RPGs or because it really was that bad.
Brian Fellows said:
That sounds like a challenge. Ask me anything!
How about the fact that Georg (a badass character in Suikoden II) is wanted for the (suspected) assasination of the queen of the Falena queendom. Which located just below the island nations (in which Suikoden 4 will take place), which is just below Kannakan, which is just below the Republic of Toran (in which Suikoden took place).
He was also the famed 6th general of the Scarlet Moon Empire that was mentioned several times through out Suikoden I.
Buggy Loop
Member
Tabris said:
0_0
I believe this news!
Never played suikoden 2, but played the 3rd one, and from all the praise and positive impressions kitsune was giving it, i went in expecting big things, how disapointed i was
Neutron Night
Banned
What the FUCK is wrong with Suikoden 3? They actually tried to make the battle system more advanced, DAMN THEM TO HELL. I'm sick of these imbeciles who keep whining about S3 because they can't figure out how the buddy system worked. Well, thanks to these idiots, now we get S4 which is reduced down to 4 characters, and also apparently has reverted back to the old "back-and-forth" style. So much for progress, looks like we're going backwards because morons are more concerned about how fast the battles are than how strategic they are. If you want fast, PLAY A FUCKING ACTION GAME.
SiegfriedFM
Member
I didn't get to play Suikoden 2 until after 3, but both are great. The only real "problem" with Suiko3 is the fairly boring army battles and the uneven graphics. Regular battles are fine. I didn't mind the pair system, in fact, it made it feel even more personal with two characters sticking together.
And if you make a melee fighter pull his mage or bowman partner all the way up to the front, it's not the game's fault
And if you make a melee fighter pull his mage or bowman partner all the way up to the front, it's not the game's fault
Shouta
Member
They totally faltered on every aspect of the battle system. Rather than improving the battle system, they actually made it worse. You could only pick one command per pair, special pair attacks could only be executed when a pair is together, there was no way to control the second member of a pair to do anything, and a bunch of other missed chances or mistakes with the system. It's an excruciatingly easy system to understand but the creators did a poor ass job with it and screwed any of the potential they had. I'm damn glad they went back to the old battle system because at least that stuff wasn't a big gooey mess of garbage that tried to pass itself off for playable.
mark me down in the "suikoden 3's battle system was a failure" column. as he says, it was easy to understand what they were going for but utterly failed to achieve. it's so boring, and i can't believe nobody has mentioned all of the retarded hoofing it through brass castle you have to do to get anywhere. that game has a lot of good elements, but it's pretty much a big mess. story: 9/10, game 4/10.
suikoden 2 is IMO one of the best PS1 games. one of my faves.
suikoden 2 is IMO one of the best PS1 games. one of my faves.
Neutron Night said:
Tried is the important word in this quote. They failed miserably IMO. Battles were too slow and clunky to be any real fun. Music was boring apart from a few tribal village themes (what the hell was with the carnival battle theme?) Far too much walking back and forth in open grasslands. movement was strange, since characters lurched around as you controlled them. And then the horse riding was painful.
But on the plus side, it was fun to watch Viki bumble through plays once or twice.
Neutron Night
Banned
I didn't say it was perfect. But they should be praised for trying instead of being bashed by whiners like you. They had an interesting psuedoGrandia thing going on, instead of your party and the enemies lined up across from each other like in the PS1 games. In other words, they were trying to bring the game into the next generation. Now instead of expanding and improving on the S3 system, we're down to 4 characters for the first time in Suikoden history and apparently the battle system is back in "classic" form. 6 characters with a buddy system is preferable to 4 characters without it. I thought we wanted games to be different from each other, I guess not.
As Shouta and others mentioned, the battle system had some neat ideas, but spending a turn or two readying up that 'neutron bomb' rune and having some dumbfuck run right into ground zero territory (completely out of the players control), really killed much of the satisfaction the runes/magic could much offer in the game.
From a subjective standpoint though, death is pretty meaningless in the series. It's not like the game is all THAT tough(at least in the few chapters I played) losing a soldier to a magic bomb isn't all that devastating outside of missed xp. Actually something Suikoden always handles quite well is XP distribution! Rarely does an RPG treat benched characters so kindly when it is their time to return to the fray, 6+ level gains for a little bunny?? Nice...
Still, its hard to defend those dungeon areas... Being forced to repace through such stale environments so often wasn't a very smart move either.
From a subjective standpoint though, death is pretty meaningless in the series. It's not like the game is all THAT tough(at least in the few chapters I played) losing a soldier to a magic bomb isn't all that devastating outside of missed xp. Actually something Suikoden always handles quite well is XP distribution! Rarely does an RPG treat benched characters so kindly when it is their time to return to the fray, 6+ level gains for a little bunny?? Nice...
Still, its hard to defend those dungeon areas... Being forced to repace through such stale environments so often wasn't a very smart move either.
ferricide said:
Yeah I think that it was the presentation that hurt it. When I step back and think of all the reasons people did what they did it seems plausible but the way they explained their reasons in the scenes was just terrible and bothered me a lot. I used to think it was the US translation that made the presentation, dialogue and all, really awkward but I'm starting to lean towards it just being badly constructed in the 1st place.
Shouta
Member
Praising a shit battle system is a disservice to the company/development team and if you think they should be applauded simply for trying then you got your head in the sand. Frankly, if everyone was like you and praised a company/development team for trying to pass garbage as a playable game, the market would've crashed ages ago. Stop being a fanboy and muster up some criticism instead of praising them for doing something wrong because that's the only way they're gonna get better.
Sign me up on the "Suiko3 battle system sucks" list please.
I'm glad they go back to the winning formula. I'm glad to see there's love for Suikoden2 here. I thought this one completely slip trough or something. My personal fav is still the first though. It's the single RPG game i played the most times through ever.
I'm glad they go back to the winning formula. I'm glad to see there's love for Suikoden2 here. I thought this one completely slip trough or something. My personal fav is still the first though. It's the single RPG game i played the most times through ever.
Brian Fellows
Pete Carroll Owns Me
Tabris said:
Oh i'm not saying I'm a bigger fan(though I am
). I've played my fair share of the series and on other boards I am known as the Suikoden guy. So when ever I say something about some other game people always insult Suikoden like its gonna hurt my feelings. But I was really refering to the freaks who inhabit the Suikosourse boards. Some of those people have beat all 3 games like 30 times each.I knew this. I was also hoping that the "150 years before the first game" info was a typo like some originally thought so maybe Killey could make his return. He was such a pimp.