Bernd Lauert
Banned
And where is Ja? I need to make sense of all this.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
[Axios] Former PlayStation worker sues gaming giant, alleges gender discrimination
- Thread starter Bernd Lauert
- Start date
nush
Member
Thursday after he's finished up the contract with Sega.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Yep. And it works the other way round too. You a man and want to work in a kindergarten or be a nurse? It's gonna be easy mode.
Tripolygon
Banned
Not even worth it.
When I was doing my clinical studies in medical laboratory science, it was literally only me and one other guy in the whole group of about 20.
Certain fields are like that based on how for decades certain groups of people were pushed towards those roles and fields. For years women were pushed towards nursing and Dr were men. I know lots of men who are nurses because of that now as hospitals try to hire more men into those fields.
When I was doing my clinical studies in medical laboratory science, it was literally only me and one other guy in the whole group of about 20.
Last edited:
kuncol02
Banned
ROTFL xD
ToTTenTranz
Banned
When will Bobby Kotik express his disappointment with Jim Ryan?
Ryu Kaiba
Member
Amin_Parker
Member
I hope the young lady gets Justice and wins her case.
//DEVIL//
Member
Omg I laughed so hard at this
and yeah she can shut the fuck up.
Pathetic is the best word I can honestly describe her . She doesn’t even have shit she is trying to mainstream this thing by gathering some idiots like her.
kingfey
Banned
Eight more women allege sexism at PlayStation offices
"I believe Sony is not equipped to appropriately handle toxic environments,” one former worker said.
Eight more women, former and current employees at Sony PlayStation, have added their accounts of sexist treatment to a proposed class-action lawsuit against the gaming giant.
Why it matters: The new declarations add to former IT security analyst Emma Majo’s assertion that PlayStation, like many other game companies, has long had a workplace culture that is hostile to women.
- Majo filed a suit against PlayStation last November, not just for what she says is her own wrongful termination after complaining about sexism, but on behalf of all women who’ve worked for the company.
- Majo "fails to identify a single policy, practice or procedure at [PlayStation] that allegedly formed the basis of any widespread intentional discrimination or had a discriminatory impact on women,” Sony’s lawyers wrote at the time.
- In response, Majo’s attorney yesterday filed statements from the eight women, including a current PlayStation employee.
- Marie Harrington, a veteran of Sony Online Entertainment and Sony PlayStation for more than 16 years, cited a lack of women considered for senior roles during “calibration sessions.” During one session, she said, only four women were considered for promotions, compared to nearly 70 men. She described hearing comments about female candidates’ family lives that weren’t made about male candidates.
- In a 2018 email to superiors regarding bullying by men at the company, Harrington linked to a New York Times article about women revolting against toxic males at Nike, asking, “Can we address this before PlayStation has its own national news article?”
- Another woman cited a third-party study that found a “great imbalance in terms of employee distribution” in her team.
- She noted she was aware of 10 women who’d left her office in Rancho Bernardo, California, in the four months preceding her departure, a sign to her of systemic problems.
- Her declaration includes a letter she shared with female employees when she left the company in January, citing repeated attempts to notify superiors about gender bias, alleged discrimination against pregnant women and resistance from a senior man in HR to act on these accounts.
What’s next: Yesterday’s filing met a deadline for replies to Sony’s attempt to drop the suit.
- A hearing on that request won’t happen until next month, at the earliest.
Victor Omega
Member
Why doesnt IGN and the likes drop these new!? arent they in bed with dev for game code?! im sure they have heard things over the years. THey must play the blind eye
Last edited:
kingfey
Banned
70 vs 4?
I think there is a big problem, when that much gets promoted, while the other side gets 4. You dont get almost 70 men to be qualified for promotion, while there are 4 women, who get those promotion.
Kuranghi
Member
What data exactly are you basing that on? Just a feeling? I'm not saying it couldn't be an actual real problem, but just thinking "oh this seems wrong to me" isn't really meaningful. No offence mate, I agree 70 vs. 4 seems like a large difference but then I don't have the context of the many factors involved, so I wouldn't say what you did.
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Didn't Ryan or someone from Sony taking a huge public stand against sexism around the Activision reveal, and said that such things as these would never find place at Sony?
Edit: partly found it.
"Ryan said he and the leadership were “disheartened and frankly stunned” to see that Activision Blizzard has “not done enough to address a deep-seated culture of discrimination and harassment.”
Ryan reportedly said they reached out to Activision immediately after the article was published, to express “deep concern” and ask how the company plans to address the claims made. “We do not believe their statements of response properly address the situation,” said Ryan.
www.google.com
Now this is in no way Ryan's fault, but it just backfires every time someone takes a stand. It always bites them in the ass.
Just say you disagrees with their actions instead of looking like a Saint.
Also fun to see how people in here react versus when kotick got heated up.
Edit: partly found it.
"Ryan said he and the leadership were “disheartened and frankly stunned” to see that Activision Blizzard has “not done enough to address a deep-seated culture of discrimination and harassment.”
Ryan reportedly said they reached out to Activision immediately after the article was published, to express “deep concern” and ask how the company plans to address the claims made. “We do not believe their statements of response properly address the situation,” said Ryan.
PlayStation head criticizes Activision Blizzard response to recent report
PlayStation chief Jim Ryan has reportedly said the response to a recent report on Activision Blizzard and its CEO is not enough.
www.google.com
Now this is in no way Ryan's fault, but it just backfires every time someone takes a stand. It always bites them in the ass.
Just say you disagrees with their actions instead of looking like a Saint.
Also fun to see how people in here react versus when kotick got heated up.
Last edited:
kingfey
Banned
The problem is that only 4 women were promoted. That is 5% compared to men, who were 95%. At this age, such disparity shouldn't exist, especially with college education and other tools women have.
Bullshit. I studied in very demander free-to-entry engineering school where they had positive discrimination for girl because there were too little in the STEM fields, but guess what? The number of women trying to enter or going for recruitment remained low because women just don't want to study in STEM fields. And it's not because they're not capable, but because some women are privileged, infantilized, spoiled c.....people.
There's no equal rights without equal responsibilities, and that's why I can bet there's just vastly less women interested in working at Sony than men.
ToTTenTranz
Banned
What do they do on "Playstation Offices"? These aren't studios.
Online and retail distribution?
Online and retail distribution?
I'm not saying this is not a problem, in fact what is described is pretty true in many structures. And I agree that the lack of hiring, consideration, promotion and representation is a problem.
But fuck the rest. The representation is far from being 50/50, and although it should probably be at least 70/30, most women are factually and statistically less interested in working in fields like STEM, tech or video games.
The rest, anything that is a remark, I don't tolerate hearing those infantilized, spoiled and privilege woman complaints. "Man-up" or give-up your majority status ie. being consider an adult AND responsible person.
But fuck the rest. The representation is far from being 50/50, and although it should probably be at least 70/30, most women are factually and statistically less interested in working in fields like STEM, tech or video games.
The rest, anything that is a remark, I don't tolerate hearing those infantilized, spoiled and privilege woman complaints. "Man-up" or give-up your majority status ie. being consider an adult AND responsible person.
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
First, find out if there's any validity to the complaints.
Kuranghi
Member
You're saying "it shouldn't", but we don't know the data, you can't just say that. What does the year 2022 have to do with whether or not people deserve/ask for promotions?! Anyway, I don't want to argue with you, so lets agree to disagree on this one.
kingfey
Banned
Your answer to your question
Its pathetic, that you didnt think what you typed clearly.
Why would the girls study in STEM field, when there is clear discrimination? You are the type that ignores these signs, and scream about it later.
Last edited:
kingfey
Banned
70/4 shouldnt happen at all. That is statically impossible for a company like Sony. Its just shows that women working there, aren't qualified for promotion, while their male coworkers gets promoted.
Kuranghi
Member
I'm sorry you don't understand. People should get promotions if their work shows they should and importantly if they actually ask for one, with the former evidence to back it up.
kingfey
Banned
I understand your point. People should get promoted for their work. But when you promote 70 men, and only 4 women, then that isnt promotion on skills.
That is the issue. The promotion process is a mess. There is no fair for women down there. Of all the women working on those offices, only 4 got the promotion ticket. It paints as the men there are alot better, than the women working there.
If you are women, how will you feel about these process? Do you think you stand a chance to get promoted?
Kuranghi
Member
Its not just "skills" or experience, or time put in. Its actually asking/pressing for the promotion because you think you deserve it as well. Women are traditionally less likely to think they deserve a promotion, or to ask for it, or be aggressive in the process if they do ask for it.
If I were a woman I'd work hard and ask for a promotion based on my hard work, then if I didnt get it I would reflect on why that might be.
Dr Bass
Member
You don't know that and you have zero insight into the company or process. You literally know nothing and here you are describing a broken process. Get your head out of your rear.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Without knowing the details (unless it's in the info and I didnt bother reading it), 70 vs 4 sounds huge, but it also comes down to how many men and women there are. I dont think PS divisions are so skewed to be men, but who knows.
I've worked in manufacturing and repair plants during university and on the shop floor and shipping bays there were literally zero women. Not one there to work the forklifts, lathes, internal cranes, or blast heater room. But there were a bunch in the office.
Pretty hard to promote women when they have none on the floor.
Last edited:
Sega Orphan
Banned
Where is Jason Schreier? He needs to get down to Sony HQ immediately. I don't care if you can't find your LGBTQ pin, no time can be wasted. They need a white knight down there ASAP.
You could also ask them about Crunch while you are at it.
You could also ask them about Crunch while you are at it.
kingfey
Banned
I am sorry, but that shouldnt be the case. If that was the case, then they wouldnt have put this lawsuit there. No fool believes that 70 men can go ask for promotion, while only 4 women ask for promotion. If the numbers were 15, that would have been somewhat on the grey line. But 4, that paints something different. It discourages other female employees, and that their contribution means nothing to the company.
Kuranghi
Member
Right, you're calling me a fool now because I disagree with you when you don't even understand how to think critically or understand what I'm saying. Kindly shove off now please and don't reply to this message.
kingfey
Banned
Manual labor skews heavily towards men, while office heavily towards women. I have seen tons of women work on office, while more men worked on the floor.
For Sony, most of their work are office, were you will find alot of women on that field.
kingfey
Banned
I didnt call you a fool. That wasnt my intention.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
"Eight more women come out to share their stories..."
What are the stories about?
So hearsay and general stuff that isn't in any rationally conceivable way tantamount to sexism or discrimination?
Califonia? Why am I not surprised.... Your wokeism BS has bred a generation of self-entitled women who victimise themselves whenever they aren't placed on a high pedestal.
There is not a shred of tangible evidence of sexism or discriminatory policies in any of this. Just women using modern gender-identity politics/wokeism and the media to strongarm their employer into giving them a fat payout.
Hey, it's a proven formula and it works. Ask the US women's soccer team.
What are the stories about?
So hearsay and general stuff that isn't in any rationally conceivable way tantamount to sexism or discrimination?
Califonia? Why am I not surprised.... Your wokeism BS has bred a generation of self-entitled women who victimise themselves whenever they aren't placed on a high pedestal.
There is not a shred of tangible evidence of sexism or discriminatory policies in any of this. Just women using modern gender-identity politics/wokeism and the media to strongarm their employer into giving them a fat payout.
Hey, it's a proven formula and it works. Ask the US women's soccer team.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Some people really need to learn respect and to be consensual.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
100% true. It goes beyond STEM too. Basically any career field that requires someone to get dirty or slave away in the summer heat or winter cold (ie. construction work, garbage man etc...) is probably 90% guys. Maybe even more depending on the occupation and job site.
But amazingly(!!!), crossing guards seem 100% women. I don't think I've ever seen a guy do it.
The fact some people want 50/50 men and women in jobs doesn't even make sense because that view focuses on male dominated jobs. But female dominated jobs are left untouched where it's probably an 80/20 ratio for women (teaching, nursing, shopping mall jobs etc....). So cant have it both way keeping the ratio high in some sectors, but want 50/50 in other sectors. There wouldnt even be enough skilled woman to fill all the roles to hit these ratios based on performance. That's why they force it in with gender quotas.
Kuranghi
Member
Fair enough, but you wrote:
"No fool believes that 70 men can go ask for promotion, while only 4 women ask for promotion."
and I'm saying I believe that could happen. Ergo...
Anyway, peace to you man, lets leave it here.
rofif
Can’t Git Gud
"demeaning comments, unwelcome advances..."
What kind of accusations are that ?!
Of course you will have "unwelcome advances". You are a person, not a rock on the parking lot... someone going to flirt with you sooner or later.
I've not read too deep into this but I already have a mental image.
I work in a huge international company and there are always assholes. It's work.. with people. The company policy is open and I can't imagine it's different in playstation US. Most of HR managers are women too. They do not discriminate.
Depending what positions. We have many engineering positions open but most of people applying are men. It's just facts.
What kind of accusations are that ?!
Of course you will have "unwelcome advances". You are a person, not a rock on the parking lot... someone going to flirt with you sooner or later.
I've not read too deep into this but I already have a mental image.
I work in a huge international company and there are always assholes. It's work.. with people. The company policy is open and I can't imagine it's different in playstation US. Most of HR managers are women too. They do not discriminate.
Depending what positions. We have many engineering positions open but most of people applying are men. It's just facts.
fallingdove
Member
Your narrative is flawed.
What's the distribution of men to women on those teams? If there were 74 employees total and 4 were women, and there are 10 promotions available, it's "statistically impossible" to promote the same number of women as men. And that's ignoring how qualified these people are.
McHuj
Member
These numbers are completely meaningless unless you know the totals. Was it 4 women out of 5 total and 70 men out of 70000? or was it 4 women out 10000 and 70 men out of a hundred that were promoted.
Dr Bass
Member
This is just not true. Men go into engineering more. There were hardly ANY women/girls in my college courses back in the day. There is no "discrimination" on who is admitted, or who is to apply to those programs. There could be a number of reasons why that is the case, but it ain't discrimination.
Men also tend to put in longer hours at offices. Software engineering is a white collar job. If one group tends to put in longer hours who is more likely to get those promotions? And yes studies back this up.
And women complaining that they were "interrupted" and chalking it up to being a woman is stupid. Everyone gets interrupted, including every man who has had a job where discussions take place. Men are out there eating a shit sandwich every day of the week, just like everyone else. The idea that everything that inconveniences you or displeases you happens to you because you are a woman is absurd. I can't imagine going through life with that attitude.
kingfey
Banned
Its idiom for things that are hard to believe. You wrote that women are less to ask for promotion. That 70/4 pants something else.
for every 5-8 men, there should be 1 women. here its close to 18 per 1 women. For every 18 men, there is 1 women that got the promotion. It doesnt make a sense at all.
Only possible answer, is that the women working there are low, compared to men.