• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Déjà Vu: Is PS5's Performance Mode a Rehash of the Early HD Debacle?

Roxkis_ii

Member
So just as a heads up, this is an AI GENERATED ARTICLE of some ideas I couldn't articulate on my own.

Constructive criticisms are WELCOMED, but you have been warned.

The title is inflammatory on purpose, you know I love yall lol.

Using google Gemini

Prompt:
If you were a black male gamer who was born in 1986, how would imagine he write an article drawing a parallels between the transition of console games into the HD generation, and how they were initially sub HD resolutions, then becoming ture HD on the Playstation 4 compared to how many games in the Playstation 5 generation have a performance mode aiming for 60 frames per second but aren't always able to hold that frame rate and how that could possibly be remedy with a PlayStation 6.

Results:
Yo, what is up, everyone? This is Darius, back again to break down some real gamer history. Remember back in the day, like early 2000s, when we were all hyped about the HD revolution? We traded in our chunky CRT TVs for these sleek flat screens, but the games themselves weren't quite there yet. We were playing "HD-ready" games, but the resolution was kinda blurry, like a bad dream. It wasn't until the PS4 dropped in 2013 that we finally got true 1080p HD gaming, visuals so crisp you could practically count the wrinkles on Kratos' face (man, that dude has seen things).
Now, here we are in the PS5 era, and developers are all about this thing called "performance mode." It's supposed to give us butter-smooth 60 frames per second gameplay, making everything feel crazy responsive. But hold up – ain't that the same promise they made about HD back in the day? Sometimes, these performance modes drop frames, making the experience kinda stuttery, like a scratched DVD. It's frustrating, you know? We got the power in the PS5, so why can't all games hold a steady 60 FPS?
Here's where things get interesting. Looking back at the PS3 to PS4 jump, the hardware leap was massive. The PS4 could finally render true HD graphics that the PS3 just couldn't handle. So, maybe the PS5 is just in that awkward early HD phase. Perhaps a PS6, with even more processing muscle, is what it'll take for developers to consistently deliver those silky smooth 60 FPS experiences we crave.
Imagine it, fam: a future where every game runs flawlessly at 60 FPS, with next-level graphics that blow our minds. That's the dream, right there. Until then, we gotta hold tight and hope the next generation irons out these performance mode hiccups. In the meantime, drop a comment below and tell me your thoughts on the whole frame rate situation. Let's keep this conversation going!

Prompt 2:
Could you rewrite this to sound a little more sophisticated it aimed at a slightly older audience

Results: Version 2 (see below)

≠================================≠
Version 2.


Alright, folks, let's delve into a bit of recent gaming history. Recall the early 2000s, when the transition to high definition (HD) consoles ignited a firestorm of excitement. We eagerly swapped our bulky CRTs for sleek flat screens, only to find the games themselves lagging behind. We were promised "HD-ready" experiences, but the resolutions remained stubbornly fuzzy, a far cry from the promised clarity. It wasn't until the arrival of the PlayStation 4 in 2013 that true 1080p HD gaming became a reality, delivering visuals so sharp you could practically map the emotional topography of Kratos' weathered face.

Fast forward to the PlayStation 5 era, and the industry is buzzing about "performance mode." This mode promises a buttery-smooth 60 frames per second (FPS) experience, ensuring lightning-fast responsiveness in gameplay. However, a sense of déjà vu washes over us, doesn't it? After all, similar promises were made during the HD revolution. Unfortunately, these performance modes can be fickle, occasionally dropping frames and introducing unwelcome stuttering, akin to a malfunctioning DVD player. It's a source of frustration, considering the undeniable processing power housed within the PS5. Why can't all games consistently achieve a rock-solid 60 FPS?

Here's where the plot thickens. When we consider the monumental hardware leap from PS3 to PS4, it becomes clear that the PS4 possessed the capability to render true HD graphics that were simply beyond the reach of its predecessor. Perhaps the PS5 finds itself in a similar transitional phase. It's possible that a PlayStation 6, equipped with even more processing brawn, might be the key for developers to consistently deliver the coveted 60 FPS experiences we yearn for.

Imagine a future, a glorious future, where every game operates flawlessly at 60 FPS, adorned with next-generation visuals that leave us speechless. That, my friends, is the ultimate aspiration. Until then, we patiently await the next generation, hopeful that it will refine these performance mode inconsistencies. In the meantime, feel free to share your thoughts on the current frame rate landscape in the comments below. Let's keep the conversation flowing!


Yo, what is up, everyone? Back again to break down some real gamer history. Remember back in the day, like early 2000s, when we were all hyped about the HD revolution? We traded in our chunky CRT TVs for these sleek flat screens, but the games themselves weren't quite there yet. We were playing "HD-ready" games, but the resolution was kinda blurry, like a bad dream. It wasn't until the PS4 dropped in 2013 that we finally got true 1080p HD gaming, visuals so crisp you could practically count the wrinkles on Kratos' face (man, that dude has seen things).

Now, here we are in the PS5 era, and developers are all about this thing called "performance mode." It's supposed to give us butter-smooth 60 frames per second gameplay, making everything feel crazy responsive. But hold up – ain't that the same promise they made about HD back in the day? Sometimes, these performance modes drop frames, making the experience kinda stuttery, like a scratched DVD. It's frustrating, you know? We got the power in the PS5, so why can't all games hold a steady 60 FPS?

Here's where things get interesting. Looking back at the PS3 to PS4 jump, the hardware leap was massive. The PS4 could finally render true HD graphics that the PS3 just couldn't handle. So, maybe the PS5 is just in that awkward early HD phase. Perhaps a PS6, with even more processing muscle, is what it'll take for developers to consistently deliver those silky smooth 60 FPS experiences we crave.

Imagine it, fam: a future where every game runs flawlessly at 60 FPS, with next-level graphics that blow our minds. That's the dream, right there. Until then, we gotta hold tight and hope the next generation irons out these performance mode hiccups. In the meantime, drop a comment below and tell me your thoughts on the whole frame rate situation.

≠≠=================================≈≠

Bam!
 
Last edited:

A.Romero

Member
I don't think it's a rehash. We still have the option to play as we feel better suit our tastes. Back in the beginning of the HD generation not only we didn't have Full HD resolutions, we also had 30fps or less.

I think in general it will always be difficult to manage all the elements involved: hardware limited by price, new engines all the time, development constraint, etc. PC only gets to offer the best experience by sheer brute force.
 

reinking

Gold Member
My AI response to your AI OP. (this is our future)

Yo, what's up! Ah, the nostalgia hits hard with that early 2000s HD revolution, right? Swapping out those bulky CRTs for sleek flat screens was a game-changer, literally. But you're spot on about the struggle with "HD-ready" games back then. It's like we were dipping our toes into the HD pool but couldn't fully dive in until the PS4 came along, delivering those crispy 1080p visuals that we'd been craving.

Now, with the PS5, we're in the era of performance modes. It's all about that buttery-smooth 60 frames per second gameplay, but sometimes, it feels like we're back to square one with dropped frames and stuttery experiences. It's a frustrating deja vu moment, no doubt.

You bring up a solid point about the hardware leap from PS3 to PS4 being massive, enabling true HD graphics. Maybe the PS5 is just in that awkward adolescence phase, waiting for its muscles to fully develop for consistently smooth gameplay. And hey, imagining a future where every game runs flawlessly at 60 FPS with mind-blowing graphics? That's the ultimate gamer dream right there.

So, while we wait for the next-gen to iron out these performance mode hiccups, let's keep the faith and hope that the future holds nothing but silky smooth experiences. Drop your thoughts below, folks. Let's keep the conversation going on this frame rate situation!
 

danklord

Gold Member
30fps on Console is the minimum viable product for any game, until that criteria is no longer acceptable, developers will choose to target that in the effort of putting in as much visual fidelity as possible so their games exceed expectations with as many people as possible. "State of the art" has real consequences.

Plus games age like wine, they improve with hardware, and are able to continuously be sold many years after their "minimum viable product" phase. Remastering is a huge business.

Perhaps we'll get there when we are streaming off a server farm that features constantly optimized hardware, but don't expect to see guaranteed 4k60 on the PS6.
 
Last edited:

Roxkis_ii

Member
30fps on Console is the minimum viable product for any game, until that criteria is no longer acceptable, developers will choose to target that in the effort of putting in as much visual fidelity as possible so their games exceed expectations with as many people as possible. "State of the art" has real consequences.

Plus games age like wine, they improve with hardware, and are able to continuously be sold many years after their "minimum viable product" phase. Remastering is a huge business.

Perhaps we'll get there when we are streaming off a server farm that features constantly optimized hardware, but don't expect to see guaranteed 4k60 on the PS6.

I'm not so sure anymore. Hardcore console gamers are digging games on just being 30 fps. It didn't do Starfield and isn't doing Drangon's Dogma 3 any favors.
 

jshackles

Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
My response isn't AI generated, my opinions are my own, etc.

It's all just iterative.

PS3 we got 720p, but low frame rates unless the resolution was lowered
PS4 we got 1080p, but low frame rates unless the resolution was lowered
PS5 we get 2160p, but low frame rates unless the resolution is lowered

Every generation we've clamored to have full resolution and 60fps be the norm, and every generation we've been disappointed by the results of commoditized hardware built and priced for mass production.
 

danklord

Gold Member
I'm not so sure anymore. Hardcore console gamers are digging games on just being 30 fps. It didn't do Starfield and isn't doing Drangon's Dogma 3 any favors.

FPS was not the main issue for Starfield and Dragon's Dogma 2 is going to sell insanely well.

I agree that hardcore audiences (like myself, with a 360hz monitor) want a more fluid experience. But we are talking about mass-hardware for mass audiences. They really don't care.

And core audiences are more likely to double dip. In my case, I got GTA 5 on PS3 because it's out and I had to be there, bought again on PC for the increased performance and functionality.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
It's nothing near the same with many 7th gen titles running deeply sub-HD. Ok well I mean Immortals somehow managed to get there on modern consoles, but with modern upscaling it's still not the same.

In an ideal world developers would target hitting 60fps perfectly first and then do everything else, but software has never been larger and more complicated and there's budgets and time, even with 10th gen power we will never have perfect frame rates on all titles, it is what it is
 

Roxkis_ii

Member
FPS was not the main issue for Starfield and Dragon's Dogma 2 is going to sell insanely well.

I agree that hardcore audiences (like myself, with a 360hz monitor) want a more fluid experience. But we are talking about mass-hardware for mass audiences. They really don't care.

And core audiences are more likely to double dip. In my case, I got GTA 5 on PS3 because it's out and I had to be there, bought again on PC for the increased performance and functionality.
When making the ps5, I don't think Sony or even devs anticipated the demand for 60 fps in console games after the cross gen phase. I think it one of the reasons current games are having issues with performance mode now, is because when they were making the foundations of the games like FF16 or Ff7:RB, it was probably only with 30 fps in mind, and added performance mode midway through development. Hopefully devs and Sony now see that 60 fps is part of the holy Holy Grail of console gaming, and maybe we can get closer to the dream.
 

JaksGhost

Member
When making the ps5, I don't think Sony or even devs anticipated the demand for 60 fps in console games after the cross gen phase. I think it one of the reasons current games are having issues with performance mode now, is because when they were making the foundations of the games like FF16 or Ff7:RB, it was probably only with 30 fps in mind, and added performance mode midway through development. Hopefully devs and Sony now see that 60 fps is part of the holy Holy Grail of console gaming, and maybe we can get closer to the dream.
Again, why the emphasis on just Sony and the PS5? This discussion should be geared towards next-gen consoles in general. Also towards developers and game engines, too.
 
Last edited:

Roxkis_ii

Member
Again, why the emphasis on just Sony and the PS5? This discussion should be geared towards next-gen consoles in general.
I'm not sure about the Xbox part of this story, because I got off the Xbox train after the 360.

I don't want to attribute my experience on one platform, to all platforms, because I don't have experience on all platforms.
 
Even COD looked crisp to be back then at 640p.
Sure It did.
eyIo4JZ.gif

😂🤣
 

mhirano

Member
If the OP couldn’t ever bother to write a f*cking essay on their own articulating their own ideas, why would I waste me time reading some AI written bullsh*t?
This is outrageous!
GTFO, OP!
 

MikeM

Member
I'm not so sure anymore. Hardcore console gamers are digging games on just being 30 fps. It didn't do Starfield and isn't doing Drangon's Dogma 3 any favors.
Some tech, like FSR3, calls for a 60fps minimum to be adequate. The standards are moving and devs need to figure it out.
 

IAmRei

Member
And when ps6 is out, people will still say its not enough, need more fps, need more (x)Ks

I recall this kind of cycle is like if you are chasing graphic only, you will run in "intended cycle" and the game will be more expensive to make, and soon if the game is fail... Yeah You know our situation right now...
 

Hunnybun

Banned
I do think there's something to the idea that this could be another kind of 'ugly' generation like the PS360, in the sense that display technology has advanced too fast for GPUs to handle. There's no doubt that those consoles couldn't REALLY handle 720p with any grace, and the same is true of this one and 4k. It's only a small minority of first party games that have produced next gen-like visuals at 4k30. And while 1440p or so is fine on a 4k screen, the 60fps equivalent of sub 1080p definitely is not. Throw RT into the mix and the whole thing just looks unmanageable.
 
SSD is a big upgrade for me, almost no loading screens in most of the games I own.

And I don't usually have complaints with resolutions, graphical details are way higher with the ps5 compared to the ps3.
 

killatopak

Gold Member
The only way for console gaming to make 60fps a majority again is for TV to be restricted to a resolution for more time just like the CRT. It just can’t catch up along with the increase workload of graphical improvements such as RT. Pick your poison. Though to be honest 4k is already pushing the limits. Any higher and we would need to be living on mansions with gigantic tvs to maximize its worth.
 

Roxkis_ii

Member
The only way for console gaming to make 60fps a majority again is for TV to be restricted to a resolution for more time just like the CRT. It just can’t catch up along with the increase workload of graphical improvements such as RT. Pick your poison. Though to be honest 4k is already pushing the limits. Any higher and we would need to be living on mansions with gigantic tvs to maximize its worth.

I think it's a lot more people who prefer higher frame rate over graphical improvements. You can see this in every poll on neogaf of 30 vs 60 fps, or Graphics mode vs proformance mode polls. You can also even see it threads where games are just 30 fps. (Starfield and drangon's dogma 3)

Pubs want to sell games and if they are paying attention, they see how hardcore gamers are starting to shun 30 fps only games. So I believe 60 fps will be a proitry for many pubs and devs in upcoming games (if their smart).
 
Last edited:

RoadHazard

Gold Member
Most games have solid performance modes. Yeah, they will be a bit softer etc, but most I've experienced so far don't look bad at all. The primary exceptions seem to be everything done in UE5. Which more and more stuff will be, so I guess this will only get worse. And that's why we need that Pro.

(Don't ever do an AI thread again.)
 
Last edited:

Roxkis_ii

Member
Most games have solid performance modes. Yeah, they will be a bit softer etc, but most I've experienced so far don't look bad at all. The primary exceptions seem to be everything done in UE5. Which more and more stuff will be, so I guess this will only get worse. And that's why we need that Pro.

(Don't ever do an AI thread again.)

When I'm thinking about problemic proformance modes, I'm thinking like FF7:RB and to a lesser extent FF16. They give a higher framerate, but it seems to cost a lot for these games.

Also in regards to ai, it's not the tool that defines the output, but the person using it.
 

RoadHazard

Gold Member
When I'm thinking about problemic proformance modes, I'm thinking like FF7:RB and to a lesser extent FF16. They give a higher framerate, but it seems to cost a lot for these games.

Also in regards to ai, it's not the tool that defines the output, but the person using it.

Are you really too lazy to write your own posts? You probably spent more time getting GPT to generate what you wanted than you would have had you just written it yourself.
 
Last edited:

Roxkis_ii

Member
Are you really too lazy to write your own posts? You probably spent more time getting GTP to generate what you wanted than you would have had you just written it yourself.
Im not good at long forum writing. Like embarrassingly bad. If it were not for ai, this op would not exist at all.

You shouldn't judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree.
 

MetalRain

Member
My dearest author of topic, I'm praising the sun of fidelity of your original thinking. If you may, shall I add my five cents to discussion?

While beloved PlayStation® 4 was indeed mostly capable of running some newest and award winning computer entertainment games, widely called video games, there were significant amount of triple A (AAA) titles, most funded and industry coveted games, that didn't indeed run on glorious FullHD® 1920x1080 progressive scan. Namely Battlefield® 4 whom utilized lower render resolutions like 1600x900 pixels.

Henceforth assuming that upcoming PlayStation® 6, computer entertainment system will also fall short of enthusiast expectations of UHD® 3840x2160 progressive scan resolution. Industry at large has explored wide array of such called upscaling methods, which take lower resolution render target such as 3200x1800 progressive scan and then uses applied mathematics and calculus to transform that image data to higher output resolution like UHD®.

Inclusion of advanced graphics rendering methods, like path tracing and mesh shading, in modern games like Alan Wake® 2 has shown that compute intensity, has increased even if target resolution has not. This trend will no doubt be challenge looking forward to so called next generation consoles.

Dearest author, I urge you to temper your expectations and support game developers and publishers with monetary aid, such that we could see future where sixty frames per second (60FPS) video gaming is within bounds of normalcy and not just for the wealthiest computer game enjoyers.
 
Last edited:

Celcius

°Temp. member
Should we ban AI generated threads?
Like, if the OP isn’t going to put in the effort to make their own thread then why shouldn’t all the replies just be AI generated too?
 

Roxkis_ii

Member
Dude write your own posts. Are you really that crippled by technology you can't organize your own thoughts and type them?

Why do we assume everyone is capable of writing long forum content? I had some ideas and used ai get them down in a coherent matter. Do you have any criticisms of the ideas of the article itself?
 

Roxkis_ii

Member
Should we ban AI generated threads?
Like, if the OP isn’t going to put in the effort to make their own thread then why shouldn’t all the replies just be AI generated too?

I'm starting to think maybe we should ban ai disclaimers, so maybe people will actually engage with the subject instead of getting hung up on the tool used to create the content.
 

sendit

Member
Should we ban AI generated threads?
Like, if the OP isn’t going to put in the effort to make their own thread then why shouldn’t all the replies just be AI generated too?

Gen AI in its current public form is a tool only as good as the user. It needs constant iteration of prompts from the user. If the user is retarded, not much can really be gained from using gen AI.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom