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[Thief1987]

It’s sold 16+ million units.

It didn't. Players ≠ sales

 

[willothedog]

Who is Herman?

the patriarch of the Munsters

 

[JaksGhost]

“Well known” is subjective. But there are very very few new IPs that break through and succeed. It’s sold 16+ million units. For a new IP, that is a very significant number, and thus in that context is “well known”.

Those sales weren't just from the PlayStation platform though. The man has whored this game out as much as he could under 505 Games publishing.

 

[SHA]

And you're giving it to the rats for bargin bin prices? Really? REALLY?

You stupid fucking cunt

If xbox users are the women from the right side, they're natural selectors, they want the best from the other side cause they look down on men, it's the same with xbox users, they're natural selectors.

But men, relatively speaking, want anything from their opposite sex.

 

[TerribleAtThisGame]

This is very valid criticism for the game.

The first 2 chapters put off many players, and even the Death Stranding community unanimously agreed that it was bad pacing, incredibly slow.

But once you get past that, it's an incredible ride, throughout. The gameplay loop is amazing.

MGSV is still his best, but this is no short of excellence.

Being originally of that opinion as well, the DC release really improved the pacing of the starting area with the additional content including introducing a bit of combat much earlier. I can't remember the exact additions but it felt noticeably better pacing-wise.

Even as a huge fan of the game, the first area is very slow. Game opens up so much in Chapter 3.

 

[shamoomoo]

Go fuck yourself Herman you stupid cunt

Maybe Kojima worked something out with Sony.

 

[nial]

Anyway, IP was given to Kojima by late 2022 at the very least, so people complaining about Hermen Hulst are clueless.

Why is this bad news for some? It's not like Sony didn't get something out of this. I wonder what though.

It wouldn't surprise me if every following sequel has to be made with SIEI, and considering that Kojima was happy enough to make Physint with Sony, it's very plausible.

Weren't Sony literally complaining recently that they don't have enough well known current IP? Now they are selling off one of their recent successful ones?

Yeah but current Sony leadership has no idea wtf they are doing.

Sony is not one company.

 

[Fbh]

Good for him, I wonder if it was part of his demands to agree to make that "not Metal Gear" for Sony that he is supposed to do at some point in the future after he is done with all his current projects.

 

[Caffeine]

Awesome news for Kojima-san!

 

[Dafegamer]

The Jim Ryan/Hermen Hulst era will be one for the History Books..... And not in a good way :/
Losing more and more exclusives, while also releasing bunch of commercial failures/flops, Remaster galore, constant price hikes, Betting literal 70% of your portfolio games on GAAS with most being cancelled or in development hell. Hardly any new IPS that started on PS5 and banking on past IPs. To make things worst, Hulst is still failing upwards(being a CEO now) bruh.... :/

 

[JaksGhost]

The Jim Ryan/Hermen Hulst era will be one for the History Books..... And not in a good way :/
Losing more and more exclusives, while also releasing bunch of commercial failures/flops, Remaster galore, constant price hikes, Betting literal 70% of your portfolio games on GAAS with most being cancelled or in development hell. Hardly any new IPS that started on PS5 and banking on past IPs. To make things worst, Hulst is still failing upwards(being a CEO now) bruh.... :/

Yet they're making record profits.

 

[Dafegamer]

Yet they're making record profits.

I don't care about profits as a customer. I don't own stock from them.

 

[nial]

releasing bunch of commercial failures/flops

A bunch...? At most it's been only one major example. They've also released some of their most successful games EVER during this era.

Remaster galore

That was the case in every gen prior, and you don't to pay full price for them again now.

constant price hikes

I agree it sucks, but you can't ignore the current conditions and why it's that way. It was also a thing obviously pushed by the top Sony Group management rather than just Jim Ryan.

Betting literal 70% of your portfolio games on GAAS with most being cancelled or in development hell.

Literally never happened.

Hardly any new IPS that started on PS5 and banking on past IPs.

I kiiinda agree, but it's also what happens when you finally have a selection of both critically and comercially succesful IPs from past gens. Plus, we know that they're investing in new IP, even from some of their top teams.

To make things worst, Hulst is still failing upwards(being a CEO now) bruh.... :/

This is not a thing at Sony (or probably any other company, but won't get into that), but I wonder if you also have a problem with Nishino being a CEO as well?
They were both chosen by the same top management.

 

[BennyBlanco]

I don't care about profits as a customer. I don't own stock from them.

Then why do you care about exclusives as a customer?

 

[Dafegamer]

A bunch...? At most it's been only one major example. They've also released some of their most successful games EVER during this era.

That was the case in every gen prior, and you don't to pay full price for them again now.

I agree it sucks, but you can't ignore the current conditions and why it's that way. It was also a thing obviously pushed by the top Sony Group management rather than just Jim Ryan.

Literally never happened.

I kiiinda agree, but it's also what happens when you finally have a selection of both critically and comercially succesful IPs from past gens. Plus, we know that they're investing in new IP, even from some of their top teams.

This is not a thing at Sony (or probably any other company, but won't get into that), but I wonder if you also have a problem with Nishino being a CEO as well?
They were both chosen by the same top management.

There was a chart on their future first party releases, it showed that 70% will be dedicated to gaas or service games, while the rest will be single player. I can't comment on Nichino, I have no opinion on him, but I'd be lying if I say that Hermen Hulst has been doing a great job as Head of SIE regarding first party releases. The actual good ones that did release (TLOU, GOW, Returnal, Ratchet etc) were in development before both him and Ryan took over.

 

[Dafegamer]

Then why do you care about exclusives as a customer?

I have more actual games to play and reasons to own a console? Did you start gaming in the current era? There used to be things called "Killer Apps" to decide what console to get regarding games.

 

[mckmas8808]

Just came for the meltdowns.

Not disappointed.

I'm happy more people get to play Kojima's crazy bs.

Why are people acting as if the first game didn't go to PC and iPhones? What's wrong with you people?

 

[mckmas8808]

think og contract allways sated, the ip would revert back to kojima after so many years and hitting certain conditions, don’t think a Xbox port is part of the contract tho, so Xbox fans don’t get ur hopes up lol.

It's confusing to me that many seem to automatically think it's DS2 is coming to everything day one due to this news.

 

[BennyBlanco]

I have more actual games to play and reasons to own a console? Did you start gaming in the current era? There used to be things called "Killer Apps" to decide what console to get regarding games.

So multiplatform releases aren’t actual games? This makes no sense. Consoles in the past were very different from each other and PCs. It made sense to make a PS2 or PC exclusive in the early 2000s. Literally the only benefit of an exclusive now is list wars.

Reminds me of PS fanboys on twitter forcing themselves to like Concord

 

[pasterpl]

Don’t get that Sony GaaS failure, they so far released 2 concord (massive flop) and helldivers 2 (massive success and bestselling game this gen released by Sony) so I would say they are still 50/50 on this.

 

[Dafegamer]

So multiplatform releases aren’t actual games? This makes no sense. Consoles in the past were very different from each other and PCs. It made sense to make a PS2 or PC exclusive in the early 2000s. Literally the only benefit of an exclusive now is list wars.

Reminds me of PS fanboys on twitter forcing themselves to like Concord

I like my consoles a bit more "unique" from the competition regarding it's games. What would be the difference in owning consoles then if both play the same games? What about PlayStation Fanboys forcing themselves to like Concord? The hell are you even talking about? More power to you I guess

 

[Dafegamer]

It's confusing to me that many seem to automatically think it's DS2 is coming to everything day one due to this news.

I think it's more about the implications if anything. Sony is probably starting to copy MS bullshit take on first party on all consoles. First it was Horizon on Switch, then Freedom Wars, now it's Death Stranding. Which would be weird cause MS doing all that Bullshit because they're forced to do so(blame it on Gamepass) while Sony has no reason to do the same.

 

[kaizenkko]

It's the best for the IP, but seems like a really dumb decision for Sony.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Don’t get that Sony GaaS failure, they so far released 2 concord (massive flop) and helldivers 2 (massive success and bestselling game this gen released by Sony) so I would say they are still 50/50 on this.

nope. it's a mega failure (so far).

Helldivers 2
MLB
Gran Turismo

Would have been a success without the GaaS push/Bungie's acquisition.

 

[nial]

There was a chart on their future first party releases, it showed that 70% will be dedicated to gaas or service games, while the rest will be single player.

It most definitely wasn't 70% versus 30%.

I can't comment on Nichino, I have no opinion on him

If you like your PS5, that tells enough.

but I'd be lying if I say that Hermen Hulst has been doing a great job as Head of SIE regarding first party releases. The actual good ones that did release (TLOU, GOW, Returnal, Ratchet etc) were in development before both him and Ryan took over.

Are you not mentioning Astro Bot in purpose (and I know that I saw you a lot in AB threads) or...? First-party projects that had no involvement from previous leadership did not release until April 2024 (you could guess why, something something current development cycles); so we're looking at Stellar Blade, Concord, Astro Bot, Until Dawn, Lego Horizon Adventures, Death Stranding 2: On the Beach, etc. here.

nope. it's a mega failure (so far).

Helldivers 2
MLB
Gran Turismo

Would have been a success without the GaaS push/Bungie's acquisition.

You literally can't get Helldivers 2 *without* the GaaS push.

 

[near]

Directed by Hideo Kojima
Written by Hideo Kojima
Produced by Hideo Kojima
Owned by Hideo Kojima

 

[Dafegamer]

It most definitely wasn't 70% versus 30%.

If you like your PS5, that tells enough.

Are you not mentioning Astro Bot in purpose (and I know that I saw you a lot in AB threads) or...? First-party projects that had no involvement from previous leadership did not release until April 2024 (you could guess why, something something current development cycles); so we're looking at Stellar Blade, Concord, Astro Bot, Until Dawn, Lego Horizon Adventures, Death Stranding 2: On the Beach, etc. here.

You literally can't get Helldivers 2 *without* the GaaS push.

Stellar Blade is good and all but I'm talking about in-house devs, not partnerships. All Sony did was constantly cancel projects, even from prestige studios like ND, Close down more studios than ever etc. It's ok if you like how things currently are, but to me it's simply not good enough, especially if you compare it to the first 4 years of the PS4 era. ASTRO BOT being a fantastic game doesn't stop from the fact that the PS5 era has mostly been disappointing so far

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

You literally can't get Helldivers 2 *without* the GaaS push.

my boy, HD2 was in development before the push. furthermore; it was praised for its monetization, which is opposite to Destiny´s.

GT Sport established the foundations for GT7 in terms of being a Live game.
MLB is a yearly release that has had MTXs before the GaaS push.

So no. Sony and its GaaS have been a complete embarrassment

 

[nial]

Stellar Blade is good and all but I'm talking about in-house devs, not partnerships.

So you agree that this is one aspect that his leadership has been good at?

All Sony did was constantly cancel projects, even from prestige studios like ND

Yeah, this is something that literally never happened before. I'm still waiting on Den-Sen, Splash Dive and Darkside.

Close down more studios than ever etc.

Sounds like you're forgetting 2012.

It's ok if you like how things currently are, but to me it's simply not good enough, especially if you compare it to the first 4 years of the PS4 era. ASTRO BOT being a fantastic game doesn't stop from the fact that the PS5 era has mostly been disappointing so far

If it has mostly been the case that case so far, it's probably due to games being first developed by the previous leadership.

my boy, HD2 was in development before the push. furthermore; it was praised for its monetization, which is opposite to Destiny´s.

GT Sport established the foundations for GT7 in terms of being a Live game.
MLB is a yearly release that has had MTXs before the GaaS push.

So no. Sony and its GaaS have been a complete embarrassment

My man, it was only in development for three years before the GaaS initiative, and considering the first fucking game's existence, it probably started very differently compared to the final product.
MLB The Show still counts as part of Sony's GaaS investment, BTW.

 

[xrnzaaas]

It's a pretty risky move considering how expensive it looks and that DS1 didn't sell a billion copies (before major discounts). I was actually surprised they found funding for the sequel.

 

[Kacho]

It's the best for the IP, but seems like a really dumb decision for Sony.

Nah, it doesn't matter at all for Sony. The game is too niche.

 

[Dafegamer]

So you agree that this is one aspect that his leadership has been good at?

Yeah, this is something that literally never happened before. I'm still waiting on Den-Sen, Splash Dive and Darkside.

Sounds like you're forgetting 2012.

If it has mostly been the case that case so far, it's probably due to games being first developed by the previous leadership.

My man, it was only in development for three years before the GaaS initiative, and considering the first fucking game's existence, it probably started very differently compared to the final product.
MLB The Show still counts as part of Sony's GaaS investment, BTW.

No offense, but this is the mindset of an apologist. Cancelling a game from a prestige studio like ND(like its ND for heaven's sakes), shows that things aren't going well behind the scenes. Yeah we need to wait more years for ND to finally release a ps5 exclusive IP or even game. I'm not forgetting 2012, but they literally never closed like 6 studios in a span of 4 years, that's a lot. I'm also afraid for Media Molecule and hope they make it to 2026 at this point.
When I say First Party I mean their own devs, also given the Kojima situation, do we even know that Stellar Blade or Rise of the Ronin are actually "first party" releases or will they release on xbox at a different time? You never know .

Also the previous leadership ended in 2019, how long are we going to give the previous leadership the blame for the current one?

 

[peronmls]

So the production value is going to be less I assume.

 

[yogaflame]

The bottom line is DS2 will still be release for Ps5 ( possibly ps5 pro showcase ) exclusively at launch and maybe release to other platform after a few years just like DS1.

 

[Wastelander92]

PS Studios may as well rename themselves The Last of Horizon Studios at this point.

 

[R6Rider]

Can't wait for all the opinion switches on the series.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

My man, it was only in development for three years before the GaaS initiative, and considering the first fucking game's existence, it probably started very differently compared to the final product.
MLB The Show still counts as part of Sony's GaaS investment, BTW.

and Gran Turismo too. That is not the point champ.

Look at these jim ryans quotes:

"The advantages Bungie offers Sony is in its ability to make huge, multiplatform, live-service online games, which is something the wider organization is eager to learn from"

"We have an aggressive road map with live services. And the opportunity to work with, and particularly learn from, the brilliant and talented people from Bungie... that is going to considerably accelerate the journey we find ourselves on.

"I would back us to do [live-service games] ourselves, but when you have the potential to have a partner like Bungie who has been there, done it all before, learned the lessons and have got this wonderful, brilliant team who is there and has the potential to help us... we think we can take something that would have taken a certain number of years, and significantly decrease the time it will take to get it right."


GT, MLB and Helldivers are games outside the Bungie´s bubble, the games where bungie was supposed to have a bigger input have been a complete disaster.

i don't need to post the shitshow that has been this GAAS initiative and the Bungie acquisition itself.

 

[Gojiira]

Kojima Productions has announced that the Death Stranding IP now belongs to the developer.

The announcement, which came via automaton-media, read, “In addition, KOJIMA PRODUCTIONS announced that the IP for this work will belong to the studio. They said that they will continue to connect more fans around the world in various forms of entertainment”.

Death Stranding 2: On The Beach is scheduled to release for the PlayStation 5 in 2025. However, recent news could suggest that the game could launch on day one on the Xbox platform and PC, too, if PlayStation didn’t get some form of marketing/exclusivity deal.

Death Stranding IP Now Belongs to Kojima Productions

Kojima Productions has also announced that the Death Stranding IP now belongs to the developer, meaning Death Stranding 2 could come to Xbox.

insider-gaming.com

Lmao no, no DS2 is not launching day one on Xbox..Its codeveloped and published by Sony. Its exclusive. Maybe in a year or two.

 

[Gojiira]

I'm pretty sure it was at least partially owned by PlayStation (maybe fully?) because they helped fund his studio getting setup to make that first game. It seems to have done well enough over time that Kojima had the money to buy out the IP rights from Sony. From Software did something similar with Elden Ring a while back, buying the IP from Namco.

This is exactly it. Sony originally fully owned the IP when they funded not only Kojimas studio as well as DS1.
Honestly I think selling it back is actually part of the PHYSINT deal, its being positioned as a Metal Gear successor which is waaaaaay higher profile and again Sony owns the IP.

 

[Lokaum D+]

Now Death Stranding is somehow relevant to the green ppl ?

 

[Dafegamer]

and Gran Turismo too. That is not the point champ.

Look at these jim ryans quotes:

"The advantages Bungie offers Sony is in its ability to make huge, multiplatform, live-service online games, which is something the wider organization is eager to learn from"

"We have an aggressive road map with live services. And the opportunity to work with, and particularly learn from, the brilliant and talented people from Bungie... that is going to considerably accelerate the journey we find ourselves on.

"I would back us to do [live-service games] ourselves, but when you have the potential to have a partner like Bungie who has been there, done it all before, learned the lessons and have got this wonderful, brilliant team who is there and has the potential to help us... we think we can take something that would have taken a certain number of years, and significantly decrease the time it will take to get it right."


GT, MLB and Helldivers are games outside the Bungie´s bubble, the games where bungie was supposed to have a bigger input have been a complete disaster.

i don't need to post the shitshow that has been this GAAS initiative and the Bungie acquisition itself.

Exactly, but I guess people still in their denial bubble at this point, which is crazy.

 

[nial]

No offense, but this is the mindset of an apologist. Cancelling a game from a prestige studio like ND(like its ND for heaven's sakes), shows that things aren't going well behind the scenes.

That's where I was going, did you have this same concern when Santa Monica Studio cancelled Darkside back in 2014? And keep in mind that it was single-player, something that SMS is obviously good at. We know that TLOU Online was canned because ND didn't want to invest its development resources on a single GaaS project, while abandoning single-player games. And honestly, this is more on ND's local management than anything else, but I firmly believe that they do deserve a second chance.

I'm not forgetting 2012, but they literally never closed like 6 studios in a span of 4 years, that's a lot.

First of all, even if you count Japan Studio (which was factually an internal restructuring, that's why you got fucking Astro Bot in the first place), it's just 5, not 6. And they literally did? They closed 4 whole studios in the span of 3 frickin' years! Three of them at the same time, even!

I'm also afraid for Media Molecule and hope they make it to 2026 at this point.

We know Sony is willing to give them another chance, so no worries until they finally release their new game; if that bombs ONCE AGAIN, it's sadly on Media Molecule.

When I say First Party I mean their own devs

I don't care about what you say. If Sony says that those games are first-party, then they are first-party. Plus, Hermen Hulst supervised both Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade, why would they not count, at all? You know his job is more of overseeing projects rather than managing studios, right? Local studio management exists for a reason.

also given the Kojima situation, do we even know that Stellar Blade or Rise of the Ronin are actually "first party" releases or will they release on xbox at a different time? You never know .

Even if that actually happened, they would still be first-party. MLB The Show isn't suddenly not first-party just because it's multiplatform, you're bringing exclusivity out of nowhere here.
Death Stranding is still a first-party game, DS2's copyright doesn't state that it's produced by SIE without reason.

Also the previous leadership ended in 2019, how long are we going to give the previous leadership the blame for the current one?

The blame for what? Because for what I'm seeing, Sony has been producing a fair amount of games once the Hulst-era projects started to roll out.

 

[nial]

and Gran Turismo too. That is not the point champ.

Actually no, not Gran Turismo. It's not part of Sony's GaaS investment.

Look at these jim ryans quotes:

"The advantages Bungie offers Sony is in its ability to make huge, multiplatform, live-service online games, which is something the wider organization is eager to learn from"

"We have an aggressive road map with live services. And the opportunity to work with, and particularly learn from, the brilliant and talented people from Bungie... that is going to considerably accelerate the journey we find ourselves on.

"I would back us to do [live-service games] ourselves, but when you have the potential to have a partner like Bungie who has been there, done it all before, learned the lessons and have got this wonderful, brilliant team who is there and has the potential to help us... we think we can take something that would have taken a certain number of years, and significantly decrease the time it will take to get it right."


GT, MLB and Helldivers are games outside the Bungie´s bubble, the games where bungie was supposed to have a bigger input have been a complete disaster.

i don't need to post the shitshow that has been this GAAS initiative and the Bungie acquisition itself.

What is your point? We can discuss Bungie's acquisition all you want, but the GaaS initiative within PSS was still its own thing.
How the fuck does Bungie have zero input on Helldivers 2 but it's full-on with Concord, if both games were released 6 months apart from each other?

 

[Loomy]

It's the best for the IP, but seems like a really dumb decision for Sony.

Not really. Sony only published the PS version of the first one. PC was handled by 505 and that's what happening to DS2 as well. My guess is DS2 is the last Death Stranding game. So Sony is again publishing the PS version - as per the original agreement, and 505 is handling PC.

As for why? Sony announced a number of partnerships/collaborations with Kojima Productions. Returning the IP to Kojima in exchange for other work in the future is not outrageous.

 

[nial]

So the production value is going to be less I assume.

No, because DS2 is still funded, produced and published by SIE.

 

[FoxMcChief]

Mandatory

That photo is 1000x cooler than anything inside the actual game.

 

[Badlucktroll]

i would trip out if it says Metal Gear solid ip now belongs to kojima productions. Why don't they!!!

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Actually no, not Gran Turismo. It's not part of Sony's GaaS investment.

so... its a live game independently from their GaaS investment ....you realize how is that even worst?... they didn't need Bungie's bullshit consultancy and so called "expertise".

What is your point?

you just made it.

Sony acquired Bungie as a cornerstone/foundation to expedite sony's success on GaaS

We can discuss Bungie's acquisition all you want, but the GaaS initiative within PSS was still its own thing.

Bungie's acquisition was intrinsically tied to sony's GaaS initiative.

How the fuck does Bungie have zero input on Helldivers 2 but it's full-on with Concord, if both games were released 6 months apart from each other?

again, Helldivers 2 was in development way before any gaas initiative, I fact; it was in "development" about the same time as Concord. difference?

Arrowhead was/is a second party sony studio which means Sony was involved in HD2's development from day one.

we all know the story about Concord's development. but just a clue: Firewalk was acquired AFTER Bungie's. you know, AFTER their announcement of their OG plan to release 12 live service games too... it's easy.

 

[nial]

so... its a live game independently from their GaaS investment ....you realize how is that even worst?... they didn't need Bungie's bullshit consultancy and so called "expertise".

Gran Turismo 7 is not a live service game.

you just made it.

Sony acquired Bungie as a cornerstone/foundation to expedite sony's success on GaaS

Bungie's acquisition was intrinsically tied to sony's GaaS initiative.

The GaaS initiative, however, was not inherent to the Bungie acquisition.

again, Helldivers 2 was in development way before any gaas initiative, I fact; it was in "development" about the same time as Concord. difference?

And I already brought up the strong possibility of HD2 not being the exact same project as what originally started in 2016. I bet everything on the game massively changing once the GaaS initiative started to roll out in 2019.

we all know the story about Concord's development. but just a clue: Firewalk was acquired AFTER Bungie's. you know, AFTER their announcement of their OG plan to release 12 live service games too... it's easy.

You know Sony was producing Concord way before they acquired Firewalk, right?
Exactly the same case as what you said here:

Arrowhead was/is a second party sony studio which means Sony was involved in HD2's development from day one.

 

[Chuck Berry]

That photo is 1000x cooler than anything inside the actual game.

Just three dudes chillin. I want that Kojima hoodie Reedus is wearing