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HD Retrovision has upscaler in development - HDMIzer will compete w/ OSSC & XRGB Mini

Peltz

Member
I didn't see a thread for this.

1415085609260


HDMIzer

Not all TVs are created equal. Some accept all signals and process them correctly. Others reject signals completely and mis-process the rest (see here for more info). We would like to eliminate this once and for all, and most importantly, do it in an affordable way. The HDMIzer will be a product that takes almost any standard definition analog video format, processes it correctly, and leaves you with a clean 480p/576p HDMI output, compatible with anything that has an HDMI port. Here are some initial, proposed specifications:

Inputs:

Component Video (YPbPr 240p/288p/480i/576i/480p/576p)
S-Video (Y/C)
Composite Video (CVBS)
USA Channel-3 & Japan Channel-1 RF (RCA)
Stereo Analog Audio (2x RCA)
External DC Power
Outputs:

240p/288p/480i/576i/480p/576p HDMI
15-pin D-sub - supporting 640x480 VGA & 480p/576p YPbPr
Stereo Analog Audio
Controls:

Scanline Switch - ON/OFF
Black Level Correct Switch - ON/OFF
Smoothing Filter (for dithered game graphics) - ON/OFF
Analog Output Select Switch - VGA/YPbPr

http://www.hdretrovision.com/development/

Some of my thoughts:

This will purportedly convert RF to HDMI/VGA/Component "correctly," which is a pretty big deal for pre-NES era consoles. We don't really have a good solution for this yet.

One glaring omission - no SCART support. That makes it a big non-starter for many people, but bear in mind, these guys are selling their own Component cables for many previously SCART-based systems like Genesis, SNES, and even Dreamcast. So I could see someone buying this + one or two cables from them to connect their system of choice.

Alternatively, I could also see this box + a SCART to Component converter being a great setup for many people too. Depending on the price point, the two devices together may still be cheaper than an OSSC.

They say they're trying to make it affordable, and everyone knows that we haven't found a good sub-$200 solution for this that works well. Their track record looks pretty good and so hopefully they deliver. If they can make a sub-$100 box that is as good as the OSSC, they'd be the go-to resource for people who are looking to play old consoles on new displays.

I'm curious to see how it handles composite and S-Video. Stock NES and N64 systems are, at best, capable of composite and S-Video respectively. If the conversion is handled well enough, it could save people from needing to mod their systems. XRGB Mini's handling of Composite leaves a lot to be desired. I hope they can do better.

480p is the maximum resolution. Hopefully this means no frame buffer and minimal lag. But the ability to add smoothing and scanlines could mean that this will, indeed, have a framebuffer. Then again, Behar Bros. products and OSSC are able to add scanlines without introducing any lag, so the jury is still out on what type of method they're using.

It has HDMI, VGA and Component output. Very versatile at first glance. But all of it appears locked to 480p output which is disappointing. The ability to convert RF/composite/S-Video to Component while retaining 240p could have been a huge boon.
 

Adam Blue

Member
I've semi-retired from RGBing because it was a full time hobby conflicting with my other hobbies, so I've been looking for streamlined solutions.

I didn't know about the component option opposed to SCART. Anyone here have any experience? If it's as easy as HDMIzer and non-scart, I could be down to jump into this again.
 

Peltz

Member
Well that drawing certainly looks like this thing is far along and worth buying

These things take time. But it may be worth discussing while it's still in the development stage in case there are any ideas about how the product could be better.
 

Peltz

Member
I've semi-retired from RGBing because it was a full time hobby conflicting with my other hobbies, so I've been looking for streamlined solutions.

I didn't know about the component option opposed to SCART. Anyone here have any experience? If it's as easy as HDMIzer and non-scart, I could be down to jump into this again.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004XSSDPO/?tag=neogaf0e-20

This will convert SCART to component. It's lag free and does a great job. It's as easy as could be.
 
I'm #TeamCRT for life, but it will be interesting to see how this compares to the OSSC and XRGB, assuming it ever releases.
 

Jockel

Member
Could be interesting, but yeah, needs SCART input and a lower price to compete with the Framemeister or OSSC.
 

oneida

Cock Strain, Lifetime Warranty
The OSSC supports medium resolution.

I have no reason to bother with other upscalers because of this.
 
Nice. Competition is always good, but they'll have to make quite the impression on me to make the switch from OSSC, which is basically the holy grail of playing retro games on modern displays IMO
 

Ceallach

Smells like fresh rosebuds
This will purportedly convert RF to HDMI "correctly,"

I need details on this to take it seriously.

And as said, yeah no SCART is a no go for me. Got too many consoles/computers hooked up with SCART(Saturn, SNES, PCDuo, MSX2) and would rather not have to convert them before they get converted.

But that's just me. I mostly play systems designed for CRT on a CRT anyways. I'm probably not the target audience.
 

Mantrox

Member
I wish them all the best.
It is a hard project to get right.

There are a lot of variables to account for in terms of inputs and outputs.
 

Peltz

Member
How much are OSSC and Framemeister at now? Are they easily available?

$200 for OSSC and +$300 for Framemeister depending on exchange rate at any given time.

Not sure as to availability these days. But if you want one bad enough you'll catch it in stock sooner rather than later.

I wish them all the best.
It is a hard project to get right.

There are a lot of variables to account for in terms of inputs and outputs.

No doubt.
 

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Did they make a new announcement about progress or did you just notice the page they've had on their site forever and thought to make a thread?
 

BigPete

Member
As someone who hasn't gone the SCART route yet, I actually would be very interested in something like this.

Subscribed! Thanks OP.
 

Mupod

Member
dunno how interested in this I am, but I have their Genesis cable and it's great. They take their time with this stuff though, so don't expect it soon.
 

Danneee

Member
If they can make it sub $100 I'm definitely interested. Even if my retro collection is sold off and on hiatus right now.
 
Framemeister is by far the more convenient choice, while OSSC will give you more options to customize your setup.
Here's My Life in Gamings take on the OSSC.
Personally, I wouldn't want to have to buy and hook up an external device for scanlines and deal with the audio stuff. But it's got its advantages.

The new OSSC version 1.6 outputs via HDMI with no modding required

Scanlines also look fine on the OSSC without any external device IMO
 

Mihos

Gold Member
I will keep an eye on it, but honestly, no scart is pretty much a non starter for me. Maybe if I was just starting out it would be more interesting..
 

Fularu

Banned
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004XSSDPO/?tag=neogaf0e-20

This will convert SCART to component. It's lag free and does a great job. It's as easy as could be.
No it doesn't. It can't display my Amiga 1200 signal for example. Same with my Philips MSX device.

It may work with north american unit using a 60hz signal but it failed miserably with everything I threw at it (unlike the OSSC).

For me this means no scart no buy, it's a glaring omission that is cutting them from one of the main retrogaming markets
 

televator

Member
If they're not even bothering with RGB it's probable that all processing is brought down to component color space.

I wonder if has a frame buffer? If it does windowed nearest neighbor scaling and good deinterlacing, it'll have some things going for it.

Edit: oh, it's a false alarm.
 
Kind of insane that there's no SCART input on it. No thanks. My OSSC 1.6 waiting list spot remains.

EDIT: looks like I ordered ONE DAY TOO LATE to get in on the early batch :(
 

Aeana

Member
I'm interested. I was in a waiting list for an XRGB Mini from Solaris Japan for 8 months before they finally sent me one, and it turns out it's defective. They don't have any units to replace it right now, so I'd have to wait... seems like it's not going to be around for much longer or something if supply is that hard to come by.
 

baphomet

Member
This looks to be more geared for people who just want to be able to hook consoles up to their newer TV's with HDMI.

There is literally no way to clean up composite, let alone rf, and make it look good.
 

Peltz

Member
This looks to be more geared for people who just want to be able to hook consoles up to their newer TV's with HDMI.

There is literally no way to clean up composite, let alone rf, and make it look good.

But at least you can scale it from 240p properly which is better than most HDTV's out there.

I'm interested. I was in a waiting list for an XRGB Mini from Solaris Japan for 8 months before they finally sent me one, and it turns out it's defective. They don't have any units to replace it right now, so I'd have to wait... seems like it's not going to be around for much longer or something if supply is that hard to come by.

That sucks :(

What was wrong with it? The folks in the AV thread could help you troubleshoot it if you still have it.
 

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I'm a Framemeister guy... but more competition is always good. Maybe it will be cheaper. Maybe it will be better.


Edit: no scart? I dunno about better :p
 

Rektash

Member
The omission of SCART is such a baffling decision for a product like this, I don't even know what to say.

Goes from neat to lol, no thank you for me.
 
I'm interested. I was in a waiting list for an XRGB Mini from Solaris Japan for 8 months before they finally sent me one, and it turns out it's defective. They don't have any units to replace it right now, so I'd have to wait... seems like it's not going to be around for much longer or something if supply is that hard to come by.

well when my OSSC gets in come October I'm probably selling my Framemeister if you don't have anything by then...
 

Jinroh

Member
I'm interested. I was in a waiting list for an XRGB Mini from Solaris Japan for 8 months before they finally sent me one, and it turns out it's defective. They don't have any units to replace it right now, so I'd have to wait...
You should ask Yakumo on the assemblergames forums, he's a moderator there and he regularly has some in stocks, I bought mine from him.
 
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