Support NeoGAF

[West Texas CEO]

Admittedly, I was a massive R. Kelly and MJ fan prior to their troubles.
I’m talking one of his biggest fans probably in the Dallas / Fort Worth area. I find their music to be unparalleled by any other R&B singers of their generation.
Not just their voices, but the themes they picked up on.

But now, after some contemplation, I find myself ashamed to be such a big fan.
I haven’t listened to their music in several months.

As someone who wants to do the right thing, is it OK to still listen to them or should I never hear their beautiful music again?

 

[TintoConCasera]

Of course it's fine, always separate the art from the artist.

 

[K' Dash]

Admittedly, I was a massive R. Kelly and MJ fan prior to their troubles.
I’m talking one of his biggest fans probably in the Dallas / Fort Worth area. I find their music to be unparalleled by any other R&B singers of their generation.
Not just their voices, but the themes they picked up on.

But now, after some contemplation, I find myself ashamed to be such a big fan.
I haven’t listened to their music in several months.

As someone who wants to do the right thing, is it OK to still listen to them or should I never hear their beautiful music again?

if you can't separate the art from the artist, the list of entertainment you will be able to enjoy will be pretty short.

 

[ssringo]

I dont give a fuck about what either of them did or may have did. While I wouldnt say I'm a fan of their entire body of work, there are some fantastic songs from both. I'm now listening to both because of this thread. Enjoy a couple of the obvious ones.

 

[Days like these...]

I was huge Wacko Jacko fan as a kid even had Thriller on vinyl but the weirder he became the less of a fan I was. Once the kiddy diddling accusations started I stopped listening to his music and am no longer a fan. I think it speaks to some level of psychopathy if you can still be a fan.

 

[BlackTron]

if you can't separate the art from the artist, the list of entertainment you will be able to enjoy will be pretty short.

I think it speaks to some level of psychopathy if you can still be a fan.

 

[Bring Back Scalebound]

As someone who wants to do the right thing, is it OK to still listen to them or should I never hear their beautiful music again?

Remember when Activision/Blizzard was reveled to be a shithole place to work in for YEARS, filled with jock-like dipshits, a light hearted attitude about rape, and all of it led to someone committing suicide?

If you didn't, now you do.

And after learning that information, you can be a part of 2 groups, or a sub-group of both.

1 - I'm not going to play Blizzard games anymore.

Either because you want to "do the right thing", or because you feel uncomfortable playing them.

Completely valid.

2 - I don't give a shit, I will keep playing them, and people are making too big of a deal about this.

Those people existed, believe it or not. And you can be a part of that camp.

And 2-1 - I acknowledge what happened at Blizzard, and I will keep shitting on them at every opportunity that shows up.
But I will keep playing their games, because they happen to make games I like.


Out of all of these groups, please either be 1 or 2-1.

If you want to keep listening to R.Kelly, you have all the right to. He made great music.
And I don't believe people should shit on you for it.

But, just because you like his music, does not mean you have to defend or downplay him.

And if you end up finding yourself in group 2, I believe people have every right to shit on you for it.

 

[ssringo]

I think it speaks to some level of psychopathy if you can still be a fan.

Hrm, guess we need to find out if this guy listened to MJ.

NJ Man Flies To FL, Assaults Fellow Gamer With Hammer

https://dailyvoice.com/new-jersey/essex/nj-man-flies-to-fl-assaults-fellow-gamer-with-hammer-while-he-sleeps-sheriff-says/ Around 2 a.m. Sunday, June 23, Nassau County Sheriff's deputies were called to a blood-covered home in Fernandina Beach, where a man was woken by his step-son screaming...

www.neogaf.com

 

[TheInfamousKira]

No, it isn't.

If you keep doing so, there will be problems.

 

[calistan]

Michael Jackson had some good grooves but that hiccuping vocal thing he did just ruined it for me. I could never stand listening to him. The older he got, the more he did it - I suspect his voice was failing so he resorted to weird vocal tics to cover it up.

That, and he was a massive kiddy fiddler with a dissolving face. He'd be in prison now if his doctor hadn't done him a favour.

 

[TheAtomicPile]

I was huge Wacko Jacko fan as a kid even had Thriller on vinyl but the weirder he became the less of a fan I was. Once the kiddy diddling accusations started I stopped listening to his music and am no longer a fan. I think it speaks to some level of psychopathy if you can still be a fan.

I was never much of a fan in the first place so I'm not that bothered one way or another, but it's an interesting topic because it does seem like people have largely moved towards just flat out not caring what he did and enjoying the music.

You don't feel ok listening to the music even though he was never convicted of anything?

 

[West Texas CEO]

if you can't separate the art from the artist, the list of entertainment you will be able to enjoy will be pretty short.

Facts.

 

[Days like these...]

No, I didn't feel ok listening to his music. No one ever stops to think he turned into a ghoul to diddle little boys. Imagine a manly "normal" man having sleepovers with little boys that shit would have never flew

 

[jufonuk]

Of course it's fine, always separate the art from the artist.

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

 

[TintoConCasera]

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

Not the same lol. I don't remember MJ singing about turning white or touching children.

Not a big MJ fan tho so I might be wrong.

 

[West Texas CEO]

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

 

[BlackTron]

"This content is very good"

"Now that I realize the person who made it wasn't very good, nevermind. It actually was bad"

Meh. I feel like it comes from a place of not wanting to have the wrong opinion or be supporting the wrong thing. Which is obviously a massive trend as everyone gets sucked into falling for information warfare and side-picking. Nuance has gone out the window.

I still play Sonic 2 even though Yuji Naka got busted for insider trading. Clearly my devotion to a popular cartoon game character from over 30 years ago means I'm showing my support for financial crime and am a massive pos.

edit: actually I'm a POS for playing Sonic 3 because MJ is in it

 

[Miles708]

Depends on how much weight you give to gossip.
I don't even know the faces of my favourite musicians.

 

[GladiusFrog]

You'll never get me to stop listening to Michael Jackson. Music is too good.

 

[Mossybrew]

As someone who wants to do the right thing

Riiiight.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

I try to separate the art from the artist, but listening to R. Kelly songs and knowing the possible inspiration for them is kinda sicking.


"My minds telling no...... , but my body, MY BODY is telling me YEeaHHHHHH"

hit different when it's a minor involved.

Michael Jackson was never convicted, so I don't feel anyway about listening to his music. Plus his music is hard to see in a creepy light like R. Kelly's stuff.

 

[winjer]

Of course its ok yo listen to their music.
There is no crime by association here.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

I think the world at large has basically said that R-Kelly's music is blacklisted and Jackson's is basically unavoidable. So, unlikely anyone would care about you listening to Beat It or Thriller. R-Kelly, would avoid.

 

[joeygreco1985]

If you let some constantly moving target moral purity test dictate what media you can enjoy you will have very little to choose from in the end.

R Kelly still sucks though

 

[West Texas CEO]

 

[Represent.]

Yes

And MJ was innocent

 

[Werewolf Jones]

Michael Jackson is the greatest artist of all time. There will never be another one like him and I'm yet to see any successful allegations against him.

R Kelly is guilty as fuck and has poor social skills but can make a hit record in under 30 minutes in the studio according to Nick Cannon. He is also incredibly talented and has a bunch of bangers, people were throwing out shapes to his music in the club like "He DID piss on that girl though... I DON'T SEE NOTHING WRONG. WITH A LIL BUMP AND GRIND."

It's complicated I guess but when you got a fucking Gary Glitter on Spotify thanks to Joker you end up getting the pass somewhere down the line.

 

[Woggleman]

I still have a Phil Spector compilation in my record collection though I haven't listened to it in over a decade so I can separate the art from the artist.

Many of my favorite were are not so good people.

 

[JBat]

Fine I'll post it... Can't believe this thread want this long with out it


Ignition remix is a banger though

 

[BadBurger]

I voted yes. Separate the art from the artist and all. But truthfully I never liked either of their works so

 

[Zathalus]

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

That is not really a counter. Mein Kampf isn’t terrible because Hitler wrote it, Mein Kamf is terrible because of its content. Thinking one of Hitlers paintings looks nice doesn’t inherently make you a bad person, but reading Mein Kampf and thinking it’s full of good ideas probably does.

 

[BadBurger]

That is not really a counter. Mein Kampf isn’t terrible because Hitler wrote it, Mein Kamf is terrible because of its content. Thinking one of Hitlers paintings looks nice doesn’t inherently make you a bad person, but reading Mein Kampf and thinking it’s full of good ideas probably does.

I had to read this in college for some history course. Aside from the hatred in it, it's just a very poorly written book. No editor could save this thing. It's a book written by a moron, for morons.

 

[RaduN]

Was there ever any actual evidence of pedophilia or whatever against Michael?
I mean, the FBI raided his home twice in 90s/00s and never found anything. Literally nothing.

All that was proven was that he was a child with a (dubiously degrading) grown-up face.

I love MJ's music, not all but many songs are simply biblical.

R.kelly was a piece of shit human and his big hits were mostly the same song.

 

[FunkMiller]

I bet nobody here is still listening to Lost Prophets though...

 

[AJUMP23]

Just don't listen to it while you molest people.

Listen to what you want.

I like MJ or some of his stuff. I never cared for R Kelly.

 

[West Texas CEO]

It's a book written by a moron, for morons.

yep, that's mien kampf in a nutshell.

 

[jufonuk]

That is not really a counter. Mein Kampf isn’t terrible because Hitler wrote it, Mein Kamf is terrible because of its content. Thinking one of Hitlers paintings looks nice doesn’t inherently make you a bad person, but reading Mein Kampf and thinking it’s full of good ideas probably does.

I dont know I never read it. I dont want to I was just making a joke.

 

[kanjobazooie]

.

 

[bender]

There are horrible people that have committed horrible deeds behind almost everything we consume.

 

[6502]

Seeing as MJ was basically cancelled until his death, it seems society has decided it is now OK. Wasn't he found not guilty in the court case? Not defending him but where do you draw the line?

Should you get a criminal record check done before you allow a chef to cook your meal in a restaurant? What if he/she was a murderer? Should I avoid if someone once called him a nonce??? Does that mean you are a degenerate proliferator of filth for enjoying that steak?

Perhaps society created the construct of justice and official due process for a reason?

 

[calistan]

Sometimes the decision is made for you. Here in the UK we have constant late-night reruns of the weekly music show Top of the Pops from the 1970s to early 90s. However, the BBC will never broadcast any of the countless episodes hosted by Sir Jimmy Savile, a prominent charity fundraiser and friend of the royal family, after he was posthumously outed as a serial kiddy fiddler on a scale that even Michael Jackson would have baulked at.

Like Jackson, he was never convicted of anything, but they even removed his gravestone in an attempt to erase him from history.

 

[YCoCg]

I voted Yes, but R-Kellys stuff feels a bit gross to listen to knowing his backstory.

 

[SF Kosmo]

I think it depends on the music. It's pretty hard to hear "Age ain't nothing but a number" or "Do you know where your children are" at this point.

I helps that MJ is dead and that most of his music is owned by Paul McCartney, I don't really have to grapple with he "financial support" question.

I get into the same thing with Woody Allen, like I can still watch Sleeper or Hannah and Her Sisters, but Manhattan? That's a nah, dawg.

 

[Big Baller]

I checked the results first so yes

 

[IntentionalPun]

Only at the same time, with headphones on, one artist in each ear, dressed in a schoolgirl outfit.

 

[Space Runaway]

It's fine though there's no reason to feel guilty over MJ anyway as he didn't do anything.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

My serious answer here is "you like what the fuck you like,"

It's like saying "Should I stop being 5' tall?" It's your chemistry. Sure, you can alter it, but is it honest to yourself? I mean, how many people are living in between your ears? If it's just one, then that's the only one you need to appease. We live presumedely once. Don't waste that one accommodating others endlessly.

Hitler made some decent art. That has nothing (tangibly) to do with The Wacky Adventures of the Nazis. Rowling and her opinions have nothing to do with Harry Potter. Separate art from artist. Now, if the media being created was actively indoctrinating or preaching, trying to coerce "normal," people into adopting their viewpoint - yeah, don't support that.

But Michael Jackson never had any hit songs with refrains like "Ooh ooh, touch them children, chchch nanaaaa," There were no Cosby Show episodes where Heathcliff prescribed tramadol to white girls. There were no Nine Inch Nails albums that told you to shoot heroin. There were no Marilyn Manson songs that gave you the URL for the Church of Satan webpage.

Thought experiment: if art is defined and inextricably linked to the artist, then should we stop listening to Soundgarden because Chris Cornell committed suicide? Should we use our phones because they're linked to sweat shops? If you have a gun to your head in an alleyway and a mass-rapist comes to your rescue, should you just take the bullet? This line of thinking falls apart the more substantial the scenario. No one is going to die because their hero doesn't hold acceptable values. They're gonna say "Fuck yeah, mag dump that guy, Mister stranger mass rapist," It's because, deep down, we all understand my first point at a primal level: This benefits me, regardless of who provided it.

 

[Werewolf Jones]

I bet nobody here is still listening to Lost Prophets though...

Shinobi vs Dragon Ninja bangs wym.

 

[efyu_lemonardo]

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

Is there a clearly defined boundary where you can draw the line between utility vs. rewarding harmful behavior?

Is it ok own an iphone that was made by workers suffering in extremely poor labor conditions? What about buying organic fruit and vegetables that contribute to raising the average price above what a poor family can afford? (Land used to grow organic comes at the expense of land which could be used to grow a much larger amount of non pesticide-free produce).

I think ultimately most of us strive to bring more good into this world than we cause harm, but as to how we actually measure that, we're all just eyeballing it.

 

[daffyduck]

I think it depends on the music. It's pretty hard to hear "Age ain't nothing but a number" or "Do you know where your children are" at this point.

I helps that MJ is dead and that most of his music is owned by Paul McCartney, I don't really have to grapple with he "financial support" question.

I get into the same thing with Woody Allen, like I can still watch Sleeper or Hannah and Her Sisters, but Manhattan? That's a nah, dawg.

I don’t need a reason to not watch any of the guys work, but what did he actually do?
His wife was never his child, nor had he been living with Mia Farrow.