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[West Texas CEO]

I dont know I never read it. I dont want to I was just making a joke.

What are your thoughts on Vom Kriege?

 

[jufonuk]

What are your thoughts on Vom Kriege?

I haven’t heard any of their songs, so it’s like the art of war? TBH I don’t have an opinion about having an opinion.

 

[Days like these...]

I try to separate the art from the artist, but listening to R. Kelly songs and knowing the possible inspiration for them is kinda sicking.


"My minds telling no...... , but my body, MY BODY is telling me YEeaHHHHHH"

hit different when it's a minor involved.

Michael Jackson was never convicted, so I don't feel anyway about listening to his music. Plus his music is hard to see in a creepy light like R. Kelly's stuff.

Of course it hits different he couldn't sing about diddling kids.

 

[West Texas CEO]

Riiiight.

 

[Sgt.Asher]

Michael Jackson is dead and r kelly is in prison. so does it really matter?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Thank you!!

I have three rooms in my house devoted to Hitlers finest paintings (prints only) and everyone tells me how weird that is. But it's not weird is it. I'm not weird.

I feel seen.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

Thank you!!

I have three rooms in my house devoted to Hitlers finest paintings (prints only) and everyone tells me how weird that is. But it's not weird is it. I'm not weird.

I feel seen.

"Where do you want this painting, boss?"

"RIGHT OVER THERE,"

 

[Hudo]

What? Why wouldn't it be OK? Just listen to what you like. If you start to not consuming stuff that has been made by (heavily) flawed human beings, you'd be consuming nothing.
The converse is true as well: You can like someone as a person but still think his/her creations are fucking shit.

 

[Robot Carnival]

if you dig deep enough, EVERY artist would have some skeletons in the closet. only thing that matters is if that skeleton matters to you or not.

R. Kelly I never really listened to him all that much to start with, so it's easy for me to continue doing what I've been doing. Michael thou, that's a more complicated matter. I have some mixed opinions on him but in the end I choose to let it pass and keep listening to his hits. if anything, Kanye West should get this treatment instead of MJ.

 

[Putonahappyface]

Call me strange but I tend to avoid any form of media when it comes to nonce's.

Obligatory...

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Of course it hits different he couldn't sing about diddling kids.

But that's the thing, he was singing about diddling kids, we just ain't find out until after the fact.

 

[Days like these...]

But that's the thing, he was singing about diddling kids, we just ain't find out until after the fact.

I never paid much attention to his lyrics. Dirty Diana raised an eyebrow though and Billie Jean of course he's not the father he's not into women.

 

[TheInfamousKira]

I never paid much attention to his lyrics. Dirty Diana raised an eyebrow though and Billie Jean of course he's not the father he's not into women.

SHE'S JUST A GIRL
WHO THINKS THAT I AM THE ONE
BUT I DID NOT TOUCH HER SON

 

[12Goblins]

Difference is R Kelly's music is shit and is manipulative piece of trash, when MJ was emotionally stunted and really was a child trapped in adult body so ofc he wanted to be surrounded by children, while his music was actually good. big difference

 

[SF Kosmo]

I don’t need a reason to not watch any of the guys work, but what did he actually do?
His wife was never his child, nor had he been living with Mia Farrow.

The family accused him of raping his 6 year old biological daughter. There's a whole documentary about it, it's pretty damning. That's the thing that got him effectively cancelled, not the marriage to Sun Yi.

More relevantly to the comment about Manhattan, he dated a 16 year old when he was in his 40s, who is generally understood as the inspiration for the age gap relationship in that movie. And it's an utterly delusional portrayal of that dynamic that speaks a lot to the problem, so it's a bit hard to watch.

With all that said, I don't want to totally wave off the Sun Yi thing either though. Even if you believe the official story on when their relationship began (and there are a number of people who claim otherwise), we're still talking about a 55 year old with a teenager, and not just any teenager, but one that he watched grow up from the time she was a small girl. That's still pretty gross.

 

[STARSBarry]

 

[Days like these...]

Difference is R Kelly's music is shit and is manipulative piece of trash, when MJ was emotionally stunted and really was a child trapped in adult body so ofc he wanted to be surrounded by children, while his music was actually good. big difference

Like fucking clockwork parroting this bs to defend a pedo. You know how many kids grow up without parents or have no childhood because they had to go work? How many do you think grew up to be ghoulish looking pedos. I can tell you that number is ONE.

 

[belmarduk]

R. Kelly, no.
Michael Jackson, yes.

I'm not entirely sure Michael Jackson is guilty... although I certainly wouldn't trust him if I had kids.

R. Kelly has been convicted and will hopefully never leave prison.

 

[lame gag1990]

You're a grown ass man. Do what the fuck you want.

Certified banger:

 

[Chuck Berry]

How about this doozy

Anyone here still listen to LostProphets?

Their albums all just got released on Spotify recently too

 

[6502]

I never paid much attention to his lyrics. Dirty Diana raised an eyebrow though and Billie Jean of course he's not the father he's not into women.

How was dirty dianna bad? I always took it as a psycho bird was trying to seduce a guy who was not up for it.

 

[Banjo64]

Of course it's fine, always separate the art from the artist.

Correct.

Can any Americans put me straight - from memory the MJ case in the UK was essentially covered retroactively as though his accusers were very dodgy and there were lots of holes in their allegations and attempts to settle for huge sums which made it seem like an extortion attempt.

I see a few people talk about him like he’s a cast iron sex offender though.

 

[DeafTourette]

Admittedly, I was a massive R. Kelly and MJ fan prior to their troubles.
I’m talking one of his biggest fans probably in the Dallas / Fort Worth area. I find their music to be unparalleled by any other R&B singers of their generation.
Not just their voices, but the themes they picked up on.

But now, after some contemplation, I find myself ashamed to be such a big fan.
I haven’t listened to their music in several months.

As someone who wants to do the right thing, is it OK to still listen to them or should I never hear their beautiful music again?

I'll say this ...

I refuse to listen to R. Kelly music any longer. I believe he's guilty based on that video that got leaked of that 14 yr old girl and all the rest of the evidence against him.

I still listen to MJ music because there was no evidence against him... Even the documentary (mockumentary really) that was thoroughly debunked can't be used as evidence... I believe he made some poor but legal choices as far as his image ... He didn't do anything to anyone (unless you count his buying the Beatles catalog from under McCartney to be illegal) ... He was just a lonely and tortured soul who was in a lot of pain. He'll be forever missed.

 

[DeafTourette]

Correct.

Can any Americans put me straight - from memory the MJ case in the UK was essentially covered retroactively as though his accusers were very dodgy and there were lots of holes in their allegations and attempts to settle for huge sums which made it seem like an extortion attempt.

I see a few people talk about him like he’s a cast iron sex offender though.

You're correct. The leaving Neverland mockumentary was full of holes and whole lies ... Oprah backed away from them when it came to light how they've grifted her and others when they tried to sue for money with lies and baseless accusations. They basically took the past accusations and built a story around it. Actual therapists called their whole story into question

 

[SF Kosmo]

R. Kelly, no.
Michael Jackson, yes.

I'm not entirely sure Michael Jackson is guilty... although I certainly wouldn't trust him if I had kids.

R. Kelly has been convicted and will hopefully never leave prison.

Michael Jackson was so fucking weird that there's always going to be that element of doubt. He's just inscrutable. I wouldn't hang my argument on believing he's innocent though, realistically there's a lot of smoke there. But he's also dead and that's the main reason I feel like I can leave the question alone.

But R. Kelly, man... I don't think most people realize the level of evil that man did. I think R. Kelly is worse than almost anyone. Like, what he did goes so far beyond just child abuse, he dismantled women and girls mentally, tortured them, kept them captive, ruined them in ways they can never recover from. He's like serial killer levels of evil.

How about this doozy

Anyone here still listen to LostProphets?

Their albums all just got released on Spotify recently too

I think that story flew under the radar for a lot of people, because they're not as big as R. Kelly or MJ, but... Hell no. Just Hell no. Sorry to the other members of that band and everyone who came up with them, but I can't hear it without thinking about that nightmare.

 

[clarky]

R. Kelly, no.
Michael Jackson, yes.

I'm not entirely sure Michael Jackson is guilty... although I certainly wouldn't trust him if I had kids.

R. Kelly has been convicted and will hopefully never leave prison.

Pretty much were i'm at. Although personally I lean towards avoiding MJ as well these days.

Would anyone still listen to Gary Glitter? (Ok he was shite anyway but still).


Each to their own.

 

[DeafTourette]

How was dirty dianna bad? I always took it as a psycho bird was trying to seduce a guy who was not up for it.

It was about Diana Ross... He never confirmed it but .. read between the lines

 

[Laptop1991]

Yes it is, the art of an artist and the person themselves should always be separate, if you like a song then you will always like a song, i mean Gary Glitter, awful man, but you can't have the Glam Rock era without his songs, or god knows how many songs will disappear from history.

 

[rkofan87]

to the 8 no reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

 

[mitch1971]

Just don't listen to it while you molest people.

 

[bitbydeath]

if you can't separate the art from the artist, the list of entertainment you will be able to enjoy will be pretty short.

I bet everyone here still watches Harvey Weinstein movies.

 

[Puscifer]

I bet nobody here is still listening to Lost Prophets though...

I think seemingly dubious legal issues (thanks to amazing lawyers and PR spinning) make the general public feel like it's okay

Vs

"Lost prophets lead singer had plans to have sex with meth addicted newborn children and had a laptop with the password if**kids"

 

[Mattdaddy]

Im still bumping Ignition remix.

Im still putting Thriller on repeat every Halloween.

Im still watching Doc 360 no scope highlight videos.

 

[DeafTourette]

Whoever said Paul McCartney owns MJ's music is wrong. MJ's family owns all of his music. They only sold the stake in Sony MJ had back to Sony. Paul only got The Beatles catalog back. That's it.

 

[M1chl]

How’s your copy of Mien Kampf?

Weird definition of "Art" not going to lie

 

[Nobody_Important]

If you were to stop listening to any music made by someone that's an asshole or a criminal you would be stuck listening to classic opera and nothing else.


All you can do is try to limit how much you spend on the content and limit how much the artist can make.

 

[SF Kosmo]

Whoever said Paul McCartney owns MJ's music is wrong. MJ's family owns all of his music. They only sold the stake in Sony MJ had back to Sony. Paul only got The Beatles catalog back. That's it.

Oh you're right, I had the story backwards, but regardless MJ's family is not who anyone is bothered by.

 

[GeorgioCostanzaX]

R. Kelly, no.
Michael Jackson, yes.

I'm not entirely sure Michael Jackson is guilty... although I certainly wouldn't trust him if I had kids.

R. Kelly has been convicted and will hopefully never leave prison.

That’s kind of where I’m at it helps that MJ’s music is way better than R Kelly’s. Jackson was certifiably insane based on the tragic shit he did to his own face alone so I can buy the argument that he thought a grown man hanging out with kids and having non-sexual sleepovers was normal. But that also set him up as a lawsuit target because it did look super shady but equally shitty of money grubbing parents for putting their kids into that situation.

IDK McCauley Culkin and numerous other former child celebs vouched for him so unless they recant it’s good enough for me.

 

[Toons]

MJ did questionable stuff. I dont think he ever went as far as some of reh accusations claimed.

R Kelly 1000% did all of that is tho lol

I will play one or 2 R Kelly tracks on occasion bit I ain't bumping him regularly . MJ tho? No issue.

 

[Porcile]

You can't listen to I Wish and take that shit seriously

 

[Kamina]

MJ was found not guilty
R Kelly was found guilty
So there you can already distinguish the two.
Apart from that: if we discarded everything a person achieved during their lifetime just because of the radical „no forgiveness politics“ woke people push these days, we would have to get rid of a lot.

 

[CGNoire]

Celebrating Human Excellence or Unique Qualities is always ok reguardless the source.

 

[CGNoire]

My serious answer here is "you like what the fuck you like,"

It's like saying "Should I stop being 5' tall?" It's your chemistry. Sure, you can alter it, but is it honest to yourself? I mean, how many people are living in between your ears? If it's just one, then that's the only one you need to appease. We live presumedely once. Don't waste that one accommodating others endlessly.

Hitler made some decent art. That has nothing (tangibly) to do with The Wacky Adventures of the Nazis. Rowling and her opinions have nothing to do with Harry Potter. Separate art from artist. Now, if the media being created was actively indoctrinating or preaching, trying to coerce "normal," people into adopting their viewpoint - yeah, don't support that.

But Michael Jackson never had any hit songs with refrains like "Ooh ooh, touch them children, chchch nanaaaa," There were no Cosby Show episodes where Heathcliff prescribed tramadol to white girls. There were no Nine Inch Nails albums that told you to shoot heroin. There were no Marilyn Manson songs that gave you the URL for the Church of Satan webpage.

Thought experiment: if art is defined and inextricably linked to the artist, then should we stop listening to Soundgarden because Chris Cornell committed suicide? Should we use our phones because they're linked to sweat shops? If you have a gun to your head in an alleyway and a mass-rapist comes to your rescue, should you just take the bullet? This line of thinking falls apart the more substantial the scenario. No one is going to die because their hero doesn't hold acceptable values. They're gonna say "Fuck yeah, mag dump that guy, Mister stranger mass rapist," It's because, deep down, we all understand my first point at a primal level: This benefits me, regardless of who provided it.

I adore this.

 

[lame gag1990]

It was about Diana Ross... He never confirmed it but .. read between the lines

Eh? It's clearly about a groupie called Diana...

 

[Days like these...]

It's fine though there's no reason to feel guilty over MJ anyway as he didn't do anything.

Tell yourself that if it helps you sleep better at night.

 

[IDKFA]

if you can't separate the art from the artist, the list of entertainment you will be able to enjoy will be pretty short.

The only time I can't do this is with the Lost Prophets.

Admittedly I was never a huge fan and only liked a couple of their songs. However, what Ian Watkins did was so sick and twisted that I can't separate what he did from the music. It's impossible for me not to be reminded of his crimes whenever I hear a LP tune.

 

[Futaleufu]

As good as watching movies featuring Klaus Kinski

 

[StueyDuck]

Yes

Just remember, music isn't this idealized version in our heads that we usually paint where solo artists Just pull themselves up from their bootstraps.

There would easily be 15+ or more people involved in creating those songs.

It's even bigger today.

So sure the you don't wanna support the person singing but there were many other people that worked on that song too. So it's ok to listen to

 

[Braag]

I hear MJ being played at super markets and shit constantly. I don't think most people are bothered.

 

[West Texas CEO]

you would be stuck listening to classic opera and nothing else.

I'm not so sure about even that.