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[Datschge]

Which franchise is bigger in Japan now? Inazuma Eleven or Kingdom Hearts?

That's like comparing apples to oranges at the moment. I11 has the (way) bigger legs, while KH has the bigger out of the gate sales even in the face of apparent franchise milking. If Level 5 manages to make the I11 3 both have higher out of the gate sales and keep at least some kind of the series' current legs it will have surpassed KH in Japan.

 

[Chris1964]

2010 doesn't look too good. Maybe something big will be announced... or maybe Ninokuni will be big

Everyone is forgeting this huge title that will sell easily at least 1 million.

Fist of the North Star: Musou

500k for Fist of the North Star and 500k for Musou.

First half top game will be a battle between DQVI and NSMBW. They should be close but I'll go with DQVI.

 

[frankie_baby]

First half top game will be a battle between DQVI and NSMBW. They should be close but I'll go with DQVI.

how much did dq4 and dq5 do?

 

[Stumpokapow]

how much did dq4 and dq5 do?

1.21 / 1.17 for the DS remake-ports. Some claim that VI would be bigger because it's never been ported or remade before whereas IV had been ported to PS1 and V remade on PS2.

 

[Chris1964]

Famitsu
[NDS] Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen (Square Enix) - 601.737 / 1.214.610
[NDS] Dragon Quest V: Hand of the Heavenly Bride (Square Enix) - 679.442 / 1.190.404

Media Create
[NDS] Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen (Square Enix) - 597.301 / 1.288.085
[NDS] Dragon Quest V: Hand of the Heavenly Bride (Square Enix) - 643.764 / 1.237.125

I expect bigger numbers from DQVI

 

[selig]

That's like comparing apples to oranges at the moment. I11 has the (way) bigger legs, while KH has the bigger out of the gate sales even in the face of apparent franchise milking. If Level 5 manages to make the I11 3 both have higher out of the gate sales and keep at least some kind of the series' current legs it will have surpassed KH in Japan.

that´s the dumbest spin i´ve seen in a while. the game that sells more is the bigger franchise. the end.

 

[frankie_baby]

I expect bigger numbers from DQVI

more than mario's almost ineveitable couple of million though?

 

[Stumpokapow]

that´s the dumbest spin i´ve seen in a while. the game that sells more is the bigger franchise. the end.

Franchise A: 1 million, 1 million, 1 million, 1 million
Franchise B: 150k, 350k, 650k, 850k.

Franchise A 5 and Franchise B 5 are about to release. Which is going to be bigger?

 

[distantmantra]

Everyone is forgeting this huge title that will sell easily at least 1 million.

Fist of the North Star: Musou

500k for Fist of the North Star and 500k for Musou.

:lol Koei's expecations for that title are ridiculous. I figure it will do 250k at the very most.

 

[selig]

Franchise A: 1 million, 200k, 40k, 15k
Franchise B: 150k, 350k, 650k, 850k.

Franchise A 5 and Franchise B 5 are about to release. Which is going to be bigger?

Fixed and: B

We were talking about front loaded vs legs

 

[Chris1964]

Now that I think of it where is Dragon Quest Monsters: Joker 2?

Famitsu
[NDS] Dragon Quest Monsters: Joker (Square Enix) - 633.084 / 1.467.179

Media Create
[NDS] Dragon Quest Monsters: Joker (Square Enix) - 593.994 / 1.486.979

It's been more than 3 years since the first one. Going by logic this or Final Fantasy VI have a chance to be S-E next releases on DS. They have almost nothing after DQVI on DS.

 

[Chris1964]

more than mario's almost ineveitable couple of million though?

Yep. I predict ~2 million for DQVI.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Fixed and: B

We were talking about front loaded vs legs

Well, then, to return to the original question:

1) Kingdom Hearts sells more than Inazuma Eleven.

2) Kingdom Hearts has a pretty consistent fanbase (both console versions similar, both handheld versions similar, BBS on track to fall in between in line with its scope and promotion). Inazuma Eleven, it's hard to say where it'll end up, but it's clearly growing.

3) Many major franchises are front-loaded. Many franchises on the upswing experience long legs as positive word of mouth extends the life of current installments feeding in to bigger launches for new installments. CF Monster Hunter. Yakuza. Layton. Inazuma Eleven--perhaps the four biggest upswing franchises this generation.

4) As a matter of plot and theme, Kingdom Hearts tends to double down on core fans of the series with subsequent installments while I assume Inazuma Eleven more closely resembles the Pokemon model of building on the previous installment without raising the barrier to entry.

My conclusion is that, if you were to ask me "Which franchise is holistically the bigger deal at this point", I'd say IE because it seems healthier in the long term. If you were to ask me "Which franchise is going to sell more today", the answer would probably be KH.

 

[pickwick]

It's been more than 3 years since the first one. Going by logic this or Final Fantasy VI have a chance to be S-E next releases on DS. They have almost nothing after DQVI on DS.

I will bet on an unannounced yet DQ (1, 2 or 3) remake on Wii.

 

[d+pad]

Still say they should look at a nicely-timed run of Famicom Red Wii + NSMB Wii bundles, perhaps some time in February or March to give it a little oomph going into Spring. Tie it into the launch of Super Mario Galaxy 2 and use the success of NSMB Wii to try and drive sales for SMG2 out of the gate with appropriate advertising.

I sincerely hope they don't do that--because then I would have to buy one

 

[schuelma]

I will bet on an unannounced yet DQ (1, 2 or 3) remake on Wii.

Why?

 

[markatisu]

I will bet on an unannounced yet DQ (1, 2 or 3) remake on Wii.

I would expect DQVIII Remake/Release before I would expect 1,2, or 3 since they could seriously just port over the PS2 game to Wii for a cheap cash in prior to DQX

 

[Dash Kappei]

Samurai Warrios 4 will sell 100k confirmed :lol

Well, maybe non that bad since 200k/300k will still probably be the core audience of the franchise from now on, but man what a decline. Maybe a new hardware generation could reinvigorate the franchise, just a bit (the first two were PS2 games so there hasn't been a big leap in gfx with the new game).
Koei should probably stick to the Wii for another game and then give the franchise a nice boost with PS3/Wii2

The first game went past 1 million (Famitsu 1m27k), the second one only a tad more than half of that (Famitsu 562k) and both games had a first week >50% LTD (60% and 53% respectevely)
Samurai Warriors 3 could maybe reach 260k, how many shipments it had after the first one?

 

[Stumpokapow]

Why?

this conversation has gone down 2349847792387489 times before now so i will predict it:

1) yadda yadda you gotta build support for the main series entry

2) yadda yadda look at these platforms in the past where there have been dq remakes before main series entries

3) can't reconcile these apparently "bulletproof" arguments with the fact that 4-6 just got remade and 8 wouldn't gain anything substantial from being remade, so i guess it's gotta be 1-3.

(i do not endorse or deny any of these arguments, simply summarizing it to prevent a prolonged torture session of reliving past mc threads)

 

[schuelma]

this conversation has gone down 2349847792387489 times before now so i will predict it:

Yeah, and I believe I probably participated in those discussions in the past :lol ..I guess now I'm struggling to see any concrete reason other than the extremely vague DQX announcement we got more than a year ago to expect anything significant from SE.

 

[manueldelalas]

IMO they should remake DQ1 on the DS with the original action battle system of DQIX.

But I think the most logical step would be port-upgrade DQVII on the Wii

I highly doubt we will see a DQVIII port, because it was released recently.

 

[Brazil]

this conversation has gone down 2349847792387489 times before now so i will predict it:

1) yadda yadda you gotta build support for the main series entry

2) yadda yadda look at these platforms in the past where there have been dq remakes before main series entries

3) can't reconcile these apparently "bulletproof" arguments with the fact that 4-6 just got remade and 8 wouldn't gain anything substantial from being remade, so i guess it's gotta be 1-3.

(i do not endorse or deny any of these arguments, simply summarizing it to prevent a prolonged torture session of reliving past mc threads)

I honestly think that a VIII port is more likely to happen than I-III remakes.

It's so easy.

 

[duckroll]

DQVII remake on Wii announced at TGS 2010.

 

[selig]

I honestly think that a VIII port is more likely to happen than I-III remakes.

It's so easy.

it´d be kind of nice, but who would buy that?

 

[botticus]

I honestly think that a VIII port is more likely to happen than I-III remakes.

It's so easy.

They should just port DQIX to Wii, EoT-style. I'm sure someone hasn't bought it yet.

 

[Majmun]

FFVII-VIII-IX remakes on Ps360 and DQ remakes on the Wii.

I'm ok with that. Remaking a DQ game should be much easier, though.

 

[Chris1964]

Is there a point on remaking DQVIII on Wii? There are brand new unsold copies of the PS2 game everywhere for 1000 yen. The engine S-E will use for DQX (and the potential remake) will be probably similar to PS2 so I don't see why someone would buy the same game again. DQ I-III and VII are a different situation.

 

[duckroll]

I will be pretty disappointed if DQX ends up looking like DQVIII. I don't want Level 5 to develop another DQ game, and I certainly hope DQX has a different developer and a new art direction.

 

[manueldelalas]

FFVII-VIII-IX remakes on Ps360 and DQ remakes on the Wii.

I'm ok with that. Remaking a DQ game should be much easier, though.

I don't think the PS1 FF titles will get remade any time soon, because fans expect too much of the remakes, which would make those games very expensive to make and take long development times. It doesn't make much business sense, I think the resources used in remaking in HD any of those games (especially VII) are on par with the expense of making a new one...

 

[schuelma]

I don't want Level 5 to develop another DQ game, and I certainly hope DQX has a different developer and a new art direction.

Are there any other logical candidates?

 

[Stumpokapow]

dq1 should not be remade for anything on its own

1) it's been released fifteen trillion times
2) it's not a particularly good game except to see how its tropes grew into much better games
3) it's already been bundled with another game so trying to sell it separately would be a little silly
4) given that the game has essentially a one paragraph scenario and storyline and a world that has maybe 10 landmarks total, remaking the game with a new battle system is basically the same as making a new game and just called it dragon quest

(i mean all of this with great reverence for the fact that it was a major game at the time, remains decently playable today, and inspired a truly great series that followed it)

 

[duckroll]

Are there any other logical candidates?

ArtePiazza, Genius Sonority, Artoon, Matrix, h.a.n.d., <insert lesser known developer here>.

There are always candidates. DQ is bigger than any single developer, and no one would have guessed Level 5 would be developing DQ games before they were chosen anyway.

 

[donny2112]

this conversation has gone down 2349847792387489 times before now so i will predict it:

I thought the "Why?" was due to predicting remakes of 1-3. The previous discussions have centered around a remake of VII.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

3) it's already been bundled with another game so trying to sell it separately would be a little silly

Not that this is a bad point, but we've already seen Square Enix unsplit the first two Final Fantasy games. Not that it went particularly well.

 

[manueldelalas]

I will be pretty disappointed if DQX ends up looking like DQVIII. I don't want Level 5 to develop another DQ game, and I certainly hope DQX has a different developer and a new art direction.

It's probably being developed by Genius Sonority (and we haven't heard anything from them since the awesome compilation of books they released on DS)

 

[manueldelalas]

dq1 should not be remade for anything on its own

1) it's been released fifteen trillion times
2) it's not a particularly good game except to see how its tropes grew into much better games
3) it's already been bundled with another game so trying to sell it separately would be a little silly
4) given that the game has essentially a one paragraph scenario and storyline and a world that has maybe 10 landmarks total, remaking the game with a new battle system is basically the same as making a new game and just called it dragon quest

(i mean all of this with great reverence for the fact that it was a major game at the time, remains decently playable today, and inspired a truly great series that followed it)

:lol you are absolutely right, I thought this after posting, sorry =P

 

[frankie_baby]

It's probably being developed by Genius Sonority (and we haven't heard anything from them since the awesome compilation of books they released on DS)

i've been thinking that too but at the moment its all just speculation, hopefully we "might just possibly" get some information after DQ6 is released

 

[Cosmonaut X]

this conversation has gone down 2349847792387489 times before now so i will predict it:

1) yadda yadda you gotta build support for the main series entry

2) yadda yadda look at these platforms in the past where there have been dq remakes before main series entries

3) can't reconcile these apparently "bulletproof" arguments with the fact that 4-6 just got remade and 8 wouldn't gain anything substantial from being remade, so i guess it's gotta be 1-3.

(i do not endorse or deny any of these arguments, simply summarizing it to prevent a prolonged torture session of reliving past mc threads)

Heh

I do think that we're likely to see some kind of "pump primer" for DQX, assuming it's still on track (and I see no reason to doubt it yet).

Wishful thinking would peg that as a remake of either Dragon Quest 1 (linking the very beginning of the series with the most recent entry) or Dragon Quest 3 (IIRC the only one that hasn't been remade in the past 10+ years).

 

[Stumpokapow]

ArtePiazza, Genius Sonority, Artoon, Matrix, h.a.n.d., <insert lesser known developer here>.

There are always candidates. DQ is bigger than any single developer, and no one would have guessed Level 5 would be developing DQ games before they were chosen anyway.

i vote for artepiazza so the profits can be used on opoona 2.

I thought the "Why?" was due to predicting remakes of 1-3. The previous discussions have centered around a remake of VII.

the arguments being used exclude 4-6 and 8, but not 7 or 1-3. 1-3 strike me as poor candidates because of my series of arguments made about why 1 is not a good candidate apply to a lesser extent to 2 and 3, but the actual impetus to have those remakes produced for the wii applies similarly for 1-3 as it does for 7

Not that this is a bad point, but we've already seen Square Enix unsplit the first two Final Fantasy games. Not that it went particularly well.

frankly ff1 and ff2 psp were the most embarrassing value proposition i've seen in a long time, and this is coming from a guy who bought one of them. certainly dq1 could get remade if we keep these releases in mind!

 

[Datschge]

that´s the dumbest spin i´ve seen in a while. the game that sells more is the bigger franchise. the end.

Since you didn't clarify to what you refer as "dumbest spin in a while", I guess the bigger franchise for you is I11 already?

 

[selig]

Since you didn't clarify to what you refer as "dumbest spin in a while", I guess the bigger franchise for you is I11 already?

i actually dont care about neither game, because i most likely wont buy either.
It was just the stupid "thats comparing apples and oranges" when it really wasnt. We´ll know whats the bigger franchise when all is said and done. But saying that you cant compare a franchise because of it being front loaded while the other one depends on its legs, was just a silly way to avoid a clear answer. the smartest answer would have been "we´ll see".

and i´d like to repeat that we still havent gotten an updatet mario-chart :/

 

[Yoshi]

ArtePiazza, Genius Sonority, Artoon, Matrix, h.a.n.d., <insert lesser known developer here>.

Nooooo, then we'll never see a Wii Yoshis Island .

 

[Bel Marduk]

Eh...what's wrong with Level 5 developing DQ? If anything I want to see L5 develop it for graphical purposes since DQ VIII looked amazing IMO. But they need a good storyteller. Doesn't DQ5 have a really good story?

 

[jj984jj]

Eh...what's wrong with Level 5 developing DQ? If anything I want to see L5 develop it for graphical purposes since DQ VIII looked amazing IMO. But they need a good storyteller. Doesn't DQ5 have a really good story?

Level 5 has never had anything to do with the story in DQ games.

I'd prefer if Level 5 was involved with DQX, even if they brought in another company like ArtePiazza to handle the art direction while Level 5 would be responsible for the engine.

 

[charlequin]

As a broad and general rule, you're probably not going to see Square-Enix try to sell for full price on Wii a DQ title that they've sold in the last two or three years on phones for < $10, so that pretty much puts 1-3 out of the running.

 

[frankie_baby]

As a broad and general rule, you're probably not going to see Square-Enix try to sell for full price on Wii a DQ title that they've sold in the last two or three years on phones for < $10, so that pretty much puts 1-3 out of the running.

They'll probably turn up on the virtual console some time

 

[sphinx]

As a broad and general rule, you're probably not going to see Square-Enix try to sell for full price on Wii a DQ title that they've sold in the last two or three years on phones for < $10, so that pretty much puts 1-3 out of the running.

What about the 1-3 trilogy in one DS cartridge? I'd buy that.

Not sure if they can remake them all and make them fit in one cart but I would definitely buy that.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Yeah! Kingdom Hearts steals all the hearts. :lol

 

[jeremy1456]

What about the 1-3 trilogy in one DS cartridge? I'd buy that.

Not sure if they can remake them all and make them fit in one cart but I would definitely buy that.

I'm pretty sure that they could.

The original Dragon Quest is a tiny, tiny game. Plus, the games could share graphical resources to save space. Dragon Quest III is the only one of the trilogy that has a particularly large world with tons of locales.

 

[grandjedi6]

Actually I'm wondering how it does in comparison to 358/2, nevermind KH1 or 2.

What an unfair fight :lol

Crisis Core, one of the PSP's better selling games, has only managed to do 708k. KH DS did more than half of that in just the first two NPD months. Its imaginable, if not likely, that November + December + future sales will push 358/2 Days to Chain of Memories 1 million total. And keep in mind, Crisis Core released before the PSP software sales dried up entirely. Nowadays, as this holiday has shown us, everything does poorly on the PSP no make how big the IP. Even Dissidia only managed a measely 130k before vanishing into the void. Kingdom Hearts PSP will probably be lucky if it can reach anywhere close to Crisis Core's sales, let alone competing with DS sales.