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Miniature Gaming-Age (WH40k, Warmachine, Etc.)
- Thread starter BattleMonkey
- Start date
BattleMonkey
Member
Been a long time, but since activity has been up in the thread figure I continue doing some reviews/previews. Well this is for a game that has been a big hit with our group and has been around for quite a while now; INFINITY
What is it?
- Infinity is a sci fi 28mm skirmish miniature game. You create small forces of around 10 models and battle it out in probably one of the most innovative game systems ever. Made by Corvus Belli, a Spanish company and products currently in 5 different languages. Game uses a very unique game system where technically both players are taking their turn at the same time that makes for both very tactical, and lethal gameplay. The setting is heavily influenced and based off of Ghost In the Shell and Appleseed. The human race has colonized various worlds and giant faction/corporations fight in shadow wars. Factions themes include a Middle Eastern coalition, an Asian conglomerate controlled by the Chinese (the Japanese are treated like 2nd rate citizens), Europeans, high tech hacker society (space 4chan... they got furries), and many others including the great AI that brings everything together as the overseer with it's own forces. There is also an Alien faction that is like Halo's Covenant, made up of multiple races that are invading Human space.
The rules
- The biggest draw of the game besides the amazing Corvus Belli figs has to be it's innovative rule system. The game itself is very simple, but at the same time very complex in large part due to how unique it is from any other game on the market, which tend to carry over concepts from each other. The basic gist of the game system is that players are both actively playing instead of one player taking his turn, followed by the other. Now the game does have a turn structure in that a person is considered the active player for taking actions, the difference here is that all figures on the board are considered to be active and alert. The system may remind you of "overwatch" that is found in old editions of 40k and many other wargames, and that is essentially it, but here it's much more pronounced and not simple wait and shoot.
Models in Infinity are considered to always be acting and reacting, so for example if a miniature were to move across a street, a sniper up in a tower that can see this would have the opportunity to react by firing or even dive for cover himself if he figured this moving model was a threat. Model that shoots at a model in the open does not simply fire and kill the opponent, but can be fired back out creating a shootout where the best roll/stat combo determines who the winner is. If you want to shoot someone without having return fire, you have to make the shot come from out of his arc of view like from a far flank. Characters also all have an 8" radius of alertness, that prevents a person to simply move models around behind them, as all figures are supposed to be able to "hear" or "detect" things going around them. Try to sneak up close to an enemy fig from the rear, and he will possibly hear you and be allowed to turn around his fig to face yours. Toss a grenade at an opponent, he can attempt to move out of the blast radius, or stand his ground and try to shoot you down before the grenade is even lobbed.
This system of game creates a very lethal and actually one of the more realistic miniature rule sets on the market. Being skirmish level it has lot of little detail also with all gear and weapons having very specific rules instead of so much abstraction you find in larger scale games. Your assault rifle for example will have different fire modes, alternate ammos to choose from, and a range of stats also attached. Being skirmish also means it involves few models with average army size being only around 10 models max, while some armies will have even less. As said the game is lethal and when dealing with so few models, it means games can move VERY quickly. I have seen games be over by turn 2 because the whole reaction system can create a chain reaction of actions which plays out like multiple turns of most normal wargames.
Further Notes:
- Infinity has been around for quite a few years now, and has alot going for it. It's popularity in the US has been fairly muted but it's definitely got it's fan bases spread around in pockets. The game also requires very little investment, as best of all, the games entire rules including that of the expansions are posted for free on the company's website! Having the book is great of course as it includes tons of fluff material not found in the free rule pdfs, but a person can play essentially for the cost of a handful of figs. Fig prices are not the greatest and are a bit on the high side, but not grossly so and again you don't need a ton of figs to play. Just a couple extra figs and you have lot of options to swap out between matches.
Infinity is also well known for being one of the most balanced of miniature wargames. Large reason being is that the game uses a D20 for resolution so you have a much broader range of statistics to work with unlike the common D6 systems where a single or two digit stat difference makes a 25%+ statistical boost. Every faction has an advantage stat wise on average in a particular catergory (Yu Jing on Close Combat, Pan O on Range), but it's really only a minor boost and with D20 you have larger range of variable results. As mentioned skirmish games like this feature often more detail, and the high tech setting of Infinity includes lot of options and unique gear. Hackers for example can hack into guided missiles and take them over to redirect them, or delay air dropped troops by hacking into their aircraft. A high tech optic camo ninja can have a EMP grenade go off nearby turning off all his/her systems forcing them to get repairs or basically pull out a blade and charge.
Game has a wealth of options and features that help create a very balanced game with lot of possible outcomes controlled by player creativity. It can overwhelm a person at first but once you understand the game and break away from the thinking of your average games like Warhammer/Warmachines/40k/Etc, you will see the genius of Infinity. The company besides giving away free rules also regularly adds new stuff to the game and posts up new rules online for download, and they also have a built in army builder on their site for players to use!
Pros:
+ Free rules
+ Fantastic quality miniatures
+ Unique and quick playing rule set
+ Incredibly balanced forces
+ No downtime for anyone, both players are actively playing and involved during a turn
Cons:
- Rules can be a challenge for newer players, it has lot of difficult to grasp rules.
- Individual model prices can be a bit high.
- Acquiring the models can be difficult as distribution is not the best. The US currently only has one distributor that supplies our retailers so when a product sells out, it can take a long while for restocks.
- D20 dice rolling can create for very random results at times.
- The miniatures while fantastic, are true 28mm scale and detailed, so they can be fragile and have very difficult to assemble parts.
If you got any questions on Infinity or about my review, let me know! Also check out the official site at http://www.infinitythegame.com/
What is it?
- Infinity is a sci fi 28mm skirmish miniature game. You create small forces of around 10 models and battle it out in probably one of the most innovative game systems ever. Made by Corvus Belli, a Spanish company and products currently in 5 different languages. Game uses a very unique game system where technically both players are taking their turn at the same time that makes for both very tactical, and lethal gameplay. The setting is heavily influenced and based off of Ghost In the Shell and Appleseed. The human race has colonized various worlds and giant faction/corporations fight in shadow wars. Factions themes include a Middle Eastern coalition, an Asian conglomerate controlled by the Chinese (the Japanese are treated like 2nd rate citizens), Europeans, high tech hacker society (space 4chan... they got furries), and many others including the great AI that brings everything together as the overseer with it's own forces. There is also an Alien faction that is like Halo's Covenant, made up of multiple races that are invading Human space.
The rules
- The biggest draw of the game besides the amazing Corvus Belli figs has to be it's innovative rule system. The game itself is very simple, but at the same time very complex in large part due to how unique it is from any other game on the market, which tend to carry over concepts from each other. The basic gist of the game system is that players are both actively playing instead of one player taking his turn, followed by the other. Now the game does have a turn structure in that a person is considered the active player for taking actions, the difference here is that all figures on the board are considered to be active and alert. The system may remind you of "overwatch" that is found in old editions of 40k and many other wargames, and that is essentially it, but here it's much more pronounced and not simple wait and shoot.
Models in Infinity are considered to always be acting and reacting, so for example if a miniature were to move across a street, a sniper up in a tower that can see this would have the opportunity to react by firing or even dive for cover himself if he figured this moving model was a threat. Model that shoots at a model in the open does not simply fire and kill the opponent, but can be fired back out creating a shootout where the best roll/stat combo determines who the winner is. If you want to shoot someone without having return fire, you have to make the shot come from out of his arc of view like from a far flank. Characters also all have an 8" radius of alertness, that prevents a person to simply move models around behind them, as all figures are supposed to be able to "hear" or "detect" things going around them. Try to sneak up close to an enemy fig from the rear, and he will possibly hear you and be allowed to turn around his fig to face yours. Toss a grenade at an opponent, he can attempt to move out of the blast radius, or stand his ground and try to shoot you down before the grenade is even lobbed.
This system of game creates a very lethal and actually one of the more realistic miniature rule sets on the market. Being skirmish level it has lot of little detail also with all gear and weapons having very specific rules instead of so much abstraction you find in larger scale games. Your assault rifle for example will have different fire modes, alternate ammos to choose from, and a range of stats also attached. Being skirmish also means it involves few models with average army size being only around 10 models max, while some armies will have even less. As said the game is lethal and when dealing with so few models, it means games can move VERY quickly. I have seen games be over by turn 2 because the whole reaction system can create a chain reaction of actions which plays out like multiple turns of most normal wargames.
Further Notes:
- Infinity has been around for quite a few years now, and has alot going for it. It's popularity in the US has been fairly muted but it's definitely got it's fan bases spread around in pockets. The game also requires very little investment, as best of all, the games entire rules including that of the expansions are posted for free on the company's website! Having the book is great of course as it includes tons of fluff material not found in the free rule pdfs, but a person can play essentially for the cost of a handful of figs. Fig prices are not the greatest and are a bit on the high side, but not grossly so and again you don't need a ton of figs to play. Just a couple extra figs and you have lot of options to swap out between matches.
Infinity is also well known for being one of the most balanced of miniature wargames. Large reason being is that the game uses a D20 for resolution so you have a much broader range of statistics to work with unlike the common D6 systems where a single or two digit stat difference makes a 25%+ statistical boost. Every faction has an advantage stat wise on average in a particular catergory (Yu Jing on Close Combat, Pan O on Range), but it's really only a minor boost and with D20 you have larger range of variable results. As mentioned skirmish games like this feature often more detail, and the high tech setting of Infinity includes lot of options and unique gear. Hackers for example can hack into guided missiles and take them over to redirect them, or delay air dropped troops by hacking into their aircraft. A high tech optic camo ninja can have a EMP grenade go off nearby turning off all his/her systems forcing them to get repairs or basically pull out a blade and charge.
Game has a wealth of options and features that help create a very balanced game with lot of possible outcomes controlled by player creativity. It can overwhelm a person at first but once you understand the game and break away from the thinking of your average games like Warhammer/Warmachines/40k/Etc, you will see the genius of Infinity. The company besides giving away free rules also regularly adds new stuff to the game and posts up new rules online for download, and they also have a built in army builder on their site for players to use!
Pros:
+ Free rules
+ Fantastic quality miniatures
+ Unique and quick playing rule set
+ Incredibly balanced forces
+ No downtime for anyone, both players are actively playing and involved during a turn
Cons:
- Rules can be a challenge for newer players, it has lot of difficult to grasp rules.
- Individual model prices can be a bit high.
- Acquiring the models can be difficult as distribution is not the best. The US currently only has one distributor that supplies our retailers so when a product sells out, it can take a long while for restocks.
- D20 dice rolling can create for very random results at times.
- The miniatures while fantastic, are true 28mm scale and detailed, so they can be fragile and have very difficult to assemble parts.
If you got any questions on Infinity or about my review, let me know! Also check out the official site at http://www.infinitythegame.com/
BattleMonkey
Member
Leunam said:
The figs are tons of fun and they put out new ones each month on schedule. They constantly out do themselves I think with unique stuff. They recently came out with these Tachikoma looking bots that come with a transformation mode where they assume a bipedal mecha mode.
I always recommend people check out the game, the rules being online it's worth a read. Also you can look up Corvus Belli channel on youtube where they have posted lots of videos about the game with very detailed gameplay explanations also.
rukland
Member
BattleMonkey said:
Wow great review and even better this is a game that has some how slipped under my radar. I am going to be looking into this closer as it looks like a ton of fun.
So glad this thread popped back up I have it in my subscription list now, and reviews like that are why. Thanks a ton sir.
BattleMonkey
Member
Those interested in learning more about Infinity can learn alot from the company's official youtube page: http://www.youtube.com/user/CorvusBelliSLL
They got all kinds of videos with simple break downs of how the game works and other info about the game setting.
Yea the new website is great with tons of info including awesome pictures for all the units. The built in army builder is great too also. When I play I usually also have up the game's wiki which has most of the special rules listed along with faq questions included on my tablet for quick rule searches.
Thanks, the thread in general kinda went into hibernation for a long while and then rose back up recently so I hope to keep it updated and also do more preview/reviews for many other games I'm familiar with. Obviously can do 40k/WHF/Warmachine and such, but trying to put out there some more unique and perhaps obscure games that need more exposure.
They got all kinds of videos with simple break downs of how the game works and other info about the game setting.
hoverX said:
Yea the new website is great with tons of info including awesome pictures for all the units. The built in army builder is great too also. When I play I usually also have up the game's wiki which has most of the special rules listed along with faq questions included on my tablet for quick rule searches.
rukland said:
Thanks, the thread in general kinda went into hibernation for a long while and then rose back up recently so I hope to keep it updated and also do more preview/reviews for many other games I'm familiar with. Obviously can do 40k/WHF/Warmachine and such, but trying to put out there some more unique and perhaps obscure games that need more exposure.
rukland
Member
BattleMonkey said:
Anything unique and obscure would be awesome. I am always looking for something new to try. My shop is mostly a GW store which is fine. But I can only play so much 40k and Fantasy each week.
We just got Warmachine in again after people asked for it and it's still not selling. Which is too bad as it's not a bad game.
Right now we are in our WHF tourny season which since I am running my poor Skaven are sitting out of. Looking forward to our next 40k tourny as I did not have my nids ready for the last one. And I am flat out tired of playing Dark Angels under the current codex.
GarthVaderUK
Banned
BattleMonkey said:
Cool, keep it up - always enjoy seeing this thread bumped
BattleMonkey
Member
Any Heavy Gear players? New faction finally previewed for the game/universe http://www.beastsofwar.com/heavy-gear/nucoal-faction-heavy-gear-blitz/
Always liked this universe, and it's nice to see them actually moving forward with the storyline as it was stuck for nearly a decade in the same spot, and now we got lot new factions that are playable instead of the game being just North Vs South as it used to be.
Always liked this universe, and it's nice to see them actually moving forward with the storyline as it was stuck for nearly a decade in the same spot, and now we got lot new factions that are playable instead of the game being just North Vs South as it used to be.
BattleMonkey
Member
Heh well I was thinking of doing a write up for Heavy Gear as well sometime soon but got several other games that I was debating on.
Play lots of games and always jumping into new ones... sadly often get stuck with few people to play as usual, everyone is playing 40k and warmachine basically here. There are lot of players who are doing other games around at least here, but there is nothing really organized, so most people just play with a couple of their friends or home game in private. I usually stick with some of my close friends who are very open with their gaming choices and we play whatever we can. Just recently got some to plunge into Dystoian Wars so hoping it goes well.
Course for some games it sometimes pays off to make two forces/armies that you can introduce to friends the game with and if they like they might also invest into the game.
Play lots of games and always jumping into new ones... sadly often get stuck with few people to play as usual, everyone is playing 40k and warmachine basically here. There are lot of players who are doing other games around at least here, but there is nothing really organized, so most people just play with a couple of their friends or home game in private. I usually stick with some of my close friends who are very open with their gaming choices and we play whatever we can. Just recently got some to plunge into Dystoian Wars so hoping it goes well.
Course for some games it sometimes pays off to make two forces/armies that you can introduce to friends the game with and if they like they might also invest into the game.
pseudocaesar
Member
I bought a basic starter pack and am starting to paint my first models. I got the LOTR one, and it has some tiny ass orcs in it. I am struggling to see properly, so I figure I will get one of those magnifying lamps. Does anyone here use one? What sort of magnification should I be looking at, I can see some on ebay that are like 2x, some are 5-6x, some are 25x. Whats the best?
BattleMonkey
Member
Leunam said:
Ah thats cool, been trying to get my friends into that too since we are playing the other Spartan games. How many parts did the models come in? I know they were reworking them to require less parts as the original molds had them split into 4-6 pieces each and a bit of a pain to put together. New molds were supposed to make lot of them one piece models or 2-3 only.
pseudocaesar said:
Well I would imagine 2x is enough, but depends I guess how difficult of a time you are having with them. LOTR models are true 28mm scale so they are smaller usually than your typical warhammer fig as they are more realistic proportioned. I would imagine the higher magnifications are more for working with stuff like jewelry or if you are working with models of incredibly tiny scale.
BattleMonkey said:
The Sorylians were three parts for the big and medium sized ships and two for the smallest. The Dindrenzi were three parts for the smaller ships, four for the mid-sized and the largest one was seven parts, but that was mostly the smaller fiddly bits like the turrets.
BattleMonkey
Member
Not too bad I guess. I got a Battlefleet Gothic fleet to put together some time, but Firestorm grabbed me as new hotness heh.. and I like the cheap cost of Spartans games and size of the figs. Very interested in the Aquans myself.
For those interested in Uncharted Seas, miniaturemarket has a couple of the fleets on clearance right now, I guess they are trying to lower stock since the entire model line of that game is being redone with new 3D sculpts like they have been using for Firestorm and Dystopian Wars.
For those interested in Uncharted Seas, miniaturemarket has a couple of the fleets on clearance right now, I guess they are trying to lower stock since the entire model line of that game is being redone with new 3D sculpts like they have been using for Firestorm and Dystopian Wars.
SillyEskimo
Member
pseudocaesar said:
I use a magnifying lamp I bought on Amazon for about 75$. I threw the package out years ago, so don't know the exact stats. What was important for me was the light it casts because sometimes I paint at night. I also wanted one where I could close the magnifier when not using it to prevent dust from collecting on the lens (and it just looks better too).
Here is my desk setup, which is immediately to the right of my PC set up. I barely have to swivel my chair.
Underneath it on the shelves I have my airbrush, Dremel, and heat gun (not pictured). And of course, the mini fridge filled with sodas! You can also see the suction vice I use as well, which is a godsend and something I should have gotten years ago.
This hobby has an expensive barrier of entry. Not only are the minis themselves expensive, but you have all of your supplies as well. Airbrush, paints, washes, inks, chalks, primers, sealers, all the materials for basing and conversion work, exactos, pliers, saws, miter box (don't forget storage for all this!) and no matter how much crap you compile throughout years of involvement with the hobby, you'll always need more or be replenishing what you already have!
Here are my paint/parts/basing supplies:
Games that I paint (That Talisman has all the expansions in 1 box):
Current WIP (a mini for Descent):
Crappy photo of my completed Descent minis (I'll post close ups if anyone is interested):
I've been painting minis for about 25 years, although I've had huge breaks within that time. I'm currently taking a break from 40k and working on board game stuff. I've amassed quite a collection, but the vast majority is not painted.
GarthVaderUK
Banned
How are the Terran Alliance faction in Firestorm Armada? Thinking about getting some ships once I've finished my Ogres.
Captain_Spanky
Member
(Cross posted from the boardgame thread)
Missed the UPS guy this morning because I was at rehearsal only for him to very kindly drop by at the end of his shift to attempt to redeliver my package. Inside was a coveted copy of Dreadfleet. As an ex-Warhammer addict (as most British geeks are) I've found myself redrawn to the hobby thanks to games like Warhammer Invasion, Horus Heresy and Chaos In The Old World. This game is just the ticket, a complete skirmish game in a box full of all that lovely Warhammer fluff.
I've only just opened it and skimmer the rulebook (which is great, although the binding seems a bit off) as I don't have clippers to cut off the sprues, will pick some up tomorrow I imagine. Anyway it's one of the best rulebooks I've read in ages, it's full of tons of personality, diagrams, examples and clear, bolded key rules. It's got that wonderful slightly lame humour that Warhammer is known for too, full of terrible terrible puns, sort of Terry Pratchett's slightly simple cousin. It's a very punny book. The artwook is absolutely lush too so I'm very impressed with it on a presentation level. The rules seem very simple, but with lots of options for manoeuvring and so forth, about what you'd expect if you followed the game at all. Can't wait to grab an eye patch, some friends and a bottle of rum and go at it.
Missed the UPS guy this morning because I was at rehearsal only for him to very kindly drop by at the end of his shift to attempt to redeliver my package. Inside was a coveted copy of Dreadfleet. As an ex-Warhammer addict (as most British geeks are) I've found myself redrawn to the hobby thanks to games like Warhammer Invasion, Horus Heresy and Chaos In The Old World. This game is just the ticket, a complete skirmish game in a box full of all that lovely Warhammer fluff.
I've only just opened it and skimmer the rulebook (which is great, although the binding seems a bit off) as I don't have clippers to cut off the sprues, will pick some up tomorrow I imagine. Anyway it's one of the best rulebooks I've read in ages, it's full of tons of personality, diagrams, examples and clear, bolded key rules. It's got that wonderful slightly lame humour that Warhammer is known for too, full of terrible terrible puns, sort of Terry Pratchett's slightly simple cousin. It's a very punny book. The artwook is absolutely lush too so I'm very impressed with it on a presentation level. The rules seem very simple, but with lots of options for manoeuvring and so forth, about what you'd expect if you followed the game at all. Can't wait to grab an eye patch, some friends and a bottle of rum and go at it.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Probably a stupid question but is there a casual entry point for these types of games? My MTG circle is kind of interested in trying tabletop gaming like this, but where does one begin?
GarthVaderUK said:
I can give you some insight from the rulebook when I get home. There is a little summary for each fleet in their entry which describes their advantages and disadvantages and playstyle.
WanderingWind said:
I would say pick a theme (fantasy, modern, historic, sci-fi, cyberpunk even) and type of battle (skirmish, big battles, air/space/naval combat) and look into games around those settings. If I wanted skirmish level sci-fi I could choose Necromunda or if I wanted fantasy naval combat I could play Uncharted Seas. BattleMonkey can probably provide better suggestions than I can.
Also, check out the reviews in this thread. Again, BattleMonkey has provided some awesome insight for several very different games.
BattleMonkey
Member
WanderingWind said:
Well having a theme your into is usually best step at figuring out where to go from. Lot of different types of games and themes out there. Comic books, Warhammer Universe stuff, Naval, Space, Historical?
Leunam said:
Terrans big advantage is there shield technology.
As with most Spartan games, the starter basic things usually just have slight stat difference between them to try and keep them balanced, while each race is tuned for some specialty. Terrans have some of the best shields, Drindenzi (sp) have strong long range (but have sharp firing angles), etc.
Dust Tactics is probably pretty good for a starting point. It's got cool miniatures, but you don't have to assemble or even paint them (they a preassembled and primed to different colors for each faction). It has customizable armies, but they are cheap. The rules are more board game than miniature (actually uses a board, and units move in a grid) but there are miniature rules coming out soon. You can use the same minis and "graduate" to the hardcore stuff later. It's cheap to get into (I think the revised core set, which has two basic armies is under $50), plays quick, is fun, and seems to be well supported by Fantasy Flight Games.WanderingWind said:
However, if you want the full effect, just go for Warmachine/Hordes or Warhammer 40k. There are ways to make your entry more casual (for example, buy pre-made armies), but it won't be cheap.
BattleMonkey
Member
Captain_Spanky said:
I couldn't pull the trigger on Dreadfleet. Splurged recently on 2 trips and a big board game shopping spree and it's just a big unknown to me. If it wasn't a limited thing and ended up being a fully supported game, I would have dived in with more faith.
Sqorgar said:
Heh i was going to do a write up on Dust Tactics next actually
I always think Warmachine/Hordes makes for an easy game to get into if players go into it as a group and just start off with playing just with a starter set each. Learn the game and add on and expand from there.
Holy cool threads batman!
I used to be into Warhammer 40k in a HUGE way when I was in my late teens/early 20s. I got out of it when I decided to get married and take on responsibilities and all that jazz. I still do miss it dearly. Not necessarily the playing so much as the painting/collecting aspect of it. I had amassed a couple of armies and painted every last one. I got pretty good at it and enjoyed the creativity of it all.
My teams of choice were Dark Eldar, of which I had about 4,000 points worth and Chaos of which I preferred and had about 8,000 points worth. I would only field and play usually 3,000 point battles, but always had fallback guys and different squads depending on what kind of play style I wanted to do that day.
Looking through this thread, that Infinity looks really cool! I'm actually looking to see what it might take to find a few of those for purchase.
Question for you guys though. I'd be interested in strictly the painting part of the hobby for relaxation and enjoyment. I used to have a bunch of Citadel paints and of course those are all gone. Looking at even a decent starter set of paints and inks and the total is a bit hard to swallow. What paints does everyone use that dont break the bank trying to acquire?
I used to be into Warhammer 40k in a HUGE way when I was in my late teens/early 20s. I got out of it when I decided to get married and take on responsibilities and all that jazz. I still do miss it dearly. Not necessarily the playing so much as the painting/collecting aspect of it. I had amassed a couple of armies and painted every last one. I got pretty good at it and enjoyed the creativity of it all.
My teams of choice were Dark Eldar, of which I had about 4,000 points worth and Chaos of which I preferred and had about 8,000 points worth. I would only field and play usually 3,000 point battles, but always had fallback guys and different squads depending on what kind of play style I wanted to do that day.
Looking through this thread, that Infinity looks really cool! I'm actually looking to see what it might take to find a few of those for purchase.
Question for you guys though. I'd be interested in strictly the painting part of the hobby for relaxation and enjoyment. I used to have a bunch of Citadel paints and of course those are all gone. Looking at even a decent starter set of paints and inks and the total is a bit hard to swallow. What paints does everyone use that dont break the bank trying to acquire?
BattleMonkey
Member
Davedough said:
I just go to a local craft store like Micheals or Joans. You can get decent cheap big bottles of acrylic paints in large variety of colors. You get ton more paint in a bottle and it's less than a dollar a bottle.
Infinity is very cool and if you just want in for painting, they are still awesome models just to paint up. http://www.thewarstore.com/ is excellent for all hobby gaming at a discount and they carry Infinity
Davedough said:
I'm slowly phasing out Citadel paints and replacing them with Vallejo Game Color paints. I'll still keep using Citadel metals, washes and foundation paints, though. Pretty sure Vallejo is slightly cheaper and it comes in a more convenient bottle.
BattleMonkey said:
The only online shop I buy stuff from for wargaming.
BattleMonkey
Member
Davedough said:
Yea I usually get a citadel wash or any other hobby wash. Also helps that washes don't dry out on you and also last much much longer than paints do.
I haven't been using as much washes anymore as I have been having lot of fun using dip painting techniques for tabletop "quality" figs.
Leunam said:
I use them or miniaturemarket. miniaturemarket is closer to me so I get orders faster and they are very competitive price wise. Warstore though I think is better in service and has a much broader selection.
GarthVaderUK
Banned
WanderingWind said:
You should probably start with a skirmish scale game so there isn't a large cost investment from the off.
Warmachine and Hordes can be played with a small force consisting of a handful of models but can be added to over time, and the game systems are compatible with one another so you can play any faction from either game against any other faction from either game - they're all from the same setting. Warmachine covers the technologically advanced factions while Hordes covers the more primal factions.
The basic rules are free so it's quick and easy to get started and each model comes with a card with their rules on it. Warmahordes is growing in popularity (especially on the tournament scene) and the game system promotes combos similar to what you'd maybe see in MTG (a model's rules will benefit other models in certain ways for instance), so it could appeal to you and your friends.
http://privateerpress.com/warmachine
http://privateerpress.com/hordes
If large scale battles are what you're looking for, Warhammer Fantasy and Warhammer 40K (sci-fi, not compatible with Warhammer Fantasy) are both great fun and very popular but require more time and money to build reasonably sized armies. eBay and online discounts will lessen the blow.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/landing.jsp?catId=cat440002a&rootCatGameStyle=wh
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/landing.jsp?catId=cat440130a&rootCatGameStyle=wh40k
BattleMonkey
Member
Davedough said:
Dipping is looked down by alot of more hardcore painters because it can give a bit sloppy results and nowhere as good as full blending/highlighting techniques. Dipping though does work well and is also really popular for when you have tons of figures to do for an army. It really speeds up the process and I just started using it not to long ago. It works well and you just gotta be careful to check each fig before letting it sit to dry as most errors come from too much stain collecting in spots and not flowing naturally, so you have to soak up the excess with a brush or some paper towel quickly.
BattleMonkey said:
I could understand that, to be honest. And there will always be a benefit to doing the tried and true method if you're going for masterpiece quality stuff. But there's a hardcore bitch about everything these days isn't there? They're just salty because a technique made things easier. If used sparingly, I'm sure you could get some decent results using the dip with a brush method. If you're going for a good looking table-able mini, then I see nothing wrong with it. If you're going for a display queen, you'll want to take your time with it anyway and use "proper" methods.
For instance, use the poly on things like clothes. Backpacks, robes, leather wraps, etc and it'll give depth to what you're painting. I can see it being a problem for cool colors though, like the blues and pinks. For that, I'm thinking you could use clear varnish mixed with some ink base to achieve a similar result for skin tones and such. Cover the entire thing with a matte finish when done and it'd probably be pretty boss.
BattleMonkey
Member
Davedough said:
Yes you have to be careful when dipping as it's going to really darken your figs. I tend to now do my figs in much brighter tones since most dips are going to really darken the entire thing and completely change how it looks.
http://www.thearmypainter.com/ sells a line of specially designed dips that are supposed to be formulated to better work on models but many also swear by just buying a can of stain at a hardware store for much cheaper. But they do have videos that show you lot of the before and after results and how easy it is to do.
But do like Army Painter's line of colored base coat primers.
So I've been browsing The War Store. I really like Infinity: Yu-Jing sect. The Japanese and Chinese influences on the designs is a really nice effect mixed with the sci-fi nature of the universe. Those are some really nice looking minis. I could see me putting together a good little set out of those bits. I may have to pull the trigger on a starter set.
BattleMonkey
Member
Yup I play Yu Jing, with toying and slowly buying models for an Ariadne force. Love the Ninjas myself.
I would also recommend being careful buying anything with little fins on the model, they always come separate and are a pain in the ass to get on the models heh. Our group seems to always have a fin break off one of our models during play. Small realistic scale bodies and such details.... fragile.
I would also recommend being careful buying anything with little fins on the model, they always come separate and are a pain in the ass to get on the models heh. Our group seems to always have a fin break off one of our models during play. Small realistic scale bodies and such details.... fragile.
SillyEskimo
Member
BattleMonkey said:
Yes, this is the correct answer. Pretty much all the paints I have ever used needed a little bit of watering down to work properly anyway. When I restarted the hobby recently, I bought about 100 "Americana" acrylic paints that were on sale at Michael's, 2 for 1$. Those are 2 fluid oz and cost .50 each. They work great once watered down for direct application and paint brushing. I have about 5-6 shades of each color, so there is little to no need to mix as I layer or wet blend. I did splurge on a full set of Secret Weapon washes. For inks, I use India Ink. You have to water it down, but that shit is unreal when used correctly. For weathering powders you can simply file down chalk. Any chalk will do. Don't spend 75$ on weathering powders, for christ's sake! There are lots of shortcuts in the hobby!
Speaking of shortcuts...
Quickshade is fucking awesome. I have all 3 tones (dark, medium, light) and they all have their place. I also have a can of minwax I tried out, and that stuff is a mess. I thought I ruined the mini I dipped in that stuff. It took a lot to clean it up, but I salvaged it just fine. After I tried that, I just bought the other 2 tones of Quickshade I was missing. (you can see these in my pics above!)
The thing to keep in mind about Quckshade is that it is just another tool in your painting arsenal. It isn't just base coating, dipping, and clear coating. I mean, you can do that (like their website advertises!), but for the best results you still have to go over it once the dip has dried and highlight, blend, and detail. If that's all you did, it would be no different than someone who just put a basecoat, than a darker ink on everything and called it a day. The more you get involved in the hobby, you can figure out the tricks to almost every Golden Demon award winner out there. So what if people think dipping "cheating". Fuck those people. It honestly does give great results. For most people, it is a godsend. It took my already good painting up another level when I figured out how to use it correctly. Also, Quickshade adds a really strong layer of protection to your minis.
Here are some other essential supplies I have picked up along the way:
Tamiya clear red X-27 - for BLOOD! Here is a simple, yet great tutorial-
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.php?showtopic=130329&hl=gore
Tamiya masking tape - used for all your masking needs. Works great doing geographic designs and patterns on everything from tanks to Harlequins.
Dental Tools - get a set of 26 (13 double sided) on ebay for 10$. Great for sculpting.
Micron Pens - These fine tipped pens can be used to simply draw on your minis. Need a tiny intricate tattoo or design? Grab your micron in any color and just draw it on there, stupid!
Airbrush - fuck priming and 3 layers of thinned out color so there are no brush lines, just spray your base color straight over the model. Save time, money, and get onto the best part of painting faster! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUNT5we4BWc
Start mixing up and combining all of these techniques and you can do some amazing things. Keep in mind that in most cases, the *tools* are just as important as the techniques.
BattleMonkey
Member
For all those picking up dreadfleet, a nice little add on to get is the foam trays from battlefoam, designed to hold all the parts and fits all in the game box! They also got a kit for Space Hulk also that fits right in the box. Battlefoam is pricey but they are nice stuff.
BattleMonkey
Member
SillyEskimo said:
Yea I'm not an amazing painter, and really all the shortcut methods I have found just make it easier and my paint jobs to come out better than before.
Airbrushes are great help, used my first to do Flames of War miniatures and the results were fantastic. And I was using that cheap little Citadel one that uses propellant. It definitely makes a huge difference for base coating figs. I also as mentioned before have found and liking the Army Painter colored primers for a similar purpose, but of course you neve get as great as coverage as you can apply with an airbrush.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Sorry for the late reply guys. Thanks for the tips.
Okay, thanks!
So Warhammer has premade armies? Does anybody beside Dust Tactics make a big box with two complete armies so we can just pick up and play?
Yeah, the small time version without a huge cost investment is what we'd be looking for. Basically, we want to try it among ourselves without having to deal with the people at the game store who snivel at n00bs or whatever. (Which I kinda understand, they're there to play games, not teach casuals about dice rolls)
Leunam said:
Okay, thanks!
BattleMonkey said:
Sqorgar said:
So Warhammer has premade armies? Does anybody beside Dust Tactics make a big box with two complete armies so we can just pick up and play?
GarthVaderUK said:
Yeah, the small time version without a huge cost investment is what we'd be looking for. Basically, we want to try it among ourselves without having to deal with the people at the game store who snivel at n00bs or whatever. (Which I kinda understand, they're there to play games, not teach casuals about dice rolls)
Cosmic Schwung
Member
SillyEskimo said: