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NY Attorney General says DraftKings and FanDuel are illegal gambling business

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D

Dr.Acula

Banned
The one thing I don't get is the hangup on the "game of skill" aspect.

I can play poker as long as no money is involved, because the MONEY part makes it gambling.

If I play a purely skill game like darts or pool, but place money on that game I am GAMBLING on that game.
 
M

mreddie

Member
johnoliver1.gif
 
B

BlastProcessing

Member
Dr.Acula said:
The one thing I don't get is the hangup on the "game of skill" aspect.

I can play poker as long as no money is involved, because the MONEY part makes it gambling.

If I play a purely skill game like darts or pool, but place money on that game I am GAMBLING on that game.
Click to expand...

Well said.
 
X

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Dr.Acula said:
The one thing I don't get is the hangup on the "game of skill" aspect.

I can play poker as long as no money is involved, because the MONEY part makes it gambling.

If I play a purely skill game like darts or pool, but place money on that game I am GAMBLING on that game.
Click to expand...

It's because the loophole in the act that banned online poker that fantasy sports is exempt because it's a "game of skill" and "has an outcome that reflects the relative knowledge of the participants, or their skill at physical reaction or physical manipulation (but not chance), and, in the case of a fantasy or simulation sports game, has an outcome that is determined predominantly by accumulated statistical results of sporting events, including any non-participant’s individual performances in such sporting events…”

Which is dumb, because there's still chance involved to some degree with fantasy sports stuff. Maybe not as much as poker, which is why they never deemed that game as meeting the definition of "game of skill."

The people making that argument are basically pointing to the act trying to say it's not considered gambling by the law. Of course, that doesn't mean things can't change. But if they do make fantasy sports for money legal on the federal level, I can't see how they keep online poker out for much longer.
 
R

RBH

Member
A state judge has barred daily fantasy sports sites DraftKings and FanDuel from doing business in New York.

The order issued Friday by state Supreme Court Justice Manuel Mendez also denied attempts from the country's two biggest daily fantasy sports to block the state's attorney general enforcement action. Eric Schneiderman has called the games illegal gambling based on chance, not skill. His office sued the companies in state court to force them to stop.

The companies argue their games are based on skill and are therefore lawful. Messages seeking comment from Boston-based DraftKings and New York-based FanDuel were not immediately returned.
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http://espn.go.com/chalk/story/_/id...judge-bars-draftkings-fanduel-operating-state
 
Paltheos

Paltheos

Member
border said:
Maybe I don't know enough about it then. My impression was that you're always in a league, competing against dozens or perhaps hundreds of other people and the top xx% of players get some kind of payout. I didn't think that it was ever a situation of a single player versus another single player. Even then I'm not sure if you can call it a "skill game." If two people bet on their ability to predict the outcome of 20 horse races, would betting on horses become a skill game? It's weird to me if you simply add another meta-layer to your gambling wagers that suddenly makes it a game of skill.
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Oh, yeah. It's totally a game of skill. Technical skill.

The top winners are statisticians who've written complex algorithms that tell them who to bet on based off a myriad of factors ranging from past player performance in similar situations to weather conditions.

A respectable skillset, for sure, but definitely not representative of what Daily Fantasy advertises. Not everybody can win, unless they mean everyone can be an intelligent, tech-able mathematician.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Paltheos said:
Oh, yeah. It's totally a game of skill. Technical skill.

The top winners are statisticians who've written complex algorithms that tell them who to bet on based off a myriad of factors ranging from past player performance in similar situations to weather conditions.

A respectable skillset, for sure, but definitely not representative of what Daily Fantasy advertises. Not everybody can win, unless they mean everyone can be an intelligent, tech-able mathematician.
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Also, don't forget that these companies got in trouble for cheating. Employees would enter, and with access to information the general public doesn't have, win a lot of money.
 
W

witchedwiz

Member
3Sixty said:
You guys should just embrace legal gambling.

It's great.
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Frankly?
No..
I would rather they remove gambling alltogether..
It's only making the poor poorer from my point of view, as there are a LOT of weak willed individuals that will plunge into gambling money that they can store little by little and hope to at least stash something at some point..
I look at gambling as a serious problem in Italy..
Minimum social pension is 600 eur more or less, and it happens often that when i go for a coffee before going to office in the morning i see a LOT of older (retired) people burning loads of money on scratch-to-win, lotterie a and slot machines..
Like.. No..
 
B

biggersmaller

Banned
Kelsdesu said:
We all know what this is. The right people are not getting paid.
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Exactly. In MN I can buy lottery numbers at the damn gas pump, but the legislature treats new gambling like the legalization of crack thanks to the "Citizens Against Gambling Expansion" (tribe affiliated). Horse tracks fought for years to have slot machines and were always stonewalled on moral grounds. That is until tribal casino's got a cut - now "everyone" is happy with slots being paired with ponies. Fantasy sports are in their sights now.
 
A

abolisher6812

Member
With the constant advertising and coverage that fantasy football as gotten this year has taken the fun out of it for me. The part that irks me is player has a serious injury and not 3 minutes later ESPN or NFL Network is trying to tell us how that will impact our fantasy lineups. Also I heard someone say how fantasy players are being screwed by the Odell suspension since this is championship week for most leagues.
 
L

Limited Edition

Banned
biggersmaller said:
Exactly. In MN I can buy lottery numbers at the damn gas pump, but the legislature treats new gambling like the legalization of crack thanks to the "Citizens Against Gambling Expansion" (tribe affiliated). Horse tracks fought for years to have slot machines and were always stonewalled on moral grounds. That is until tribal casino's got a cut - now "everyone" is happy with slots being paired with ponies. Fantasy sports are in their sights now.
Click to expand...

Isn't the law in MN that you can't have casinos that aren't operated by the Tribes, or some such nonsense?
 
P

Phobophile

A scientist and gentleman in the manner of Batman.
witchedwiz said:
Frankly?
No..
I would rather they remove gambling alltogether..
It's only making the poor poorer from my point of view, as there are a LOT of weak willed individuals that will plunge into gambling money that they can store little by little and hope to at least stash something at some point..
I look at gambling as a serious problem in Italy..
Minimum social pension is 600 eur more or less, and it happens often that when i go for a coffee before going to office in the morning i see a LOT of older (retired) people burning loads of money on scratch-to-win, lotterie a and slot machines..
Like.. No..
Click to expand...

If you completely remove legal gambling, then even more people will turn to illegal gambling. There are already people gambling illegally where they can do so legally. At least with state run lotteries, gambled monies (theoretically) go back to pay for public programs. And private gambling can also be regulated and taxed by the state. So if people are gonna keep doing vices that have been around since the beginning of civilization, might as well try to have it benefit society in some way.
 
T

tuffy

Member
Limited Edition said:
Isn't the law in MN that you can't have casinos that aren't operated by the Tribes, or some such nonsense?
Click to expand...
The courts decided that the semi-autonomous Chippewa and Ojibwe reservations are allowed to operate casinos under the original treaties they signed with the government. They weren't granted any special rights to operate casinos by the state of Minnesota.
 
X

XiaNaphryz

LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Cyriades said:
If the government not getting the majority cut they will deem it illegal.

This stuff is no different from lottery
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The main issue aside from the tax side of things is regulation - stuff like regular accounting reviews of financial transactions and server side data, ensuring that whatever algorithms or mechanisms used for things like randomization meets some set standard verified by independent review, etc. Lotteries, table games, slot machines, online poker, all of that stuff (where legal) is heavily regulated.
 
B

Baraka in the White House

2-Terms of Kombat
On the one hand, I think gambling should either be legal across the board or, preferrably, illegal.

On the other, fuck Draft Kings and Fan Duel. Fucking Magic: The Gathering for sports goobers.
 
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