Support NeoGAF

[ergem]

Nintendo's Switch and the Switch 2 forces the entire console to be docked for TV play, rendering the screen and internal battery effectively useless while docked. It's an inefficient design that wastes cloud streaming potential.

Sony has an opportunity with the PS6 Portable to deliver a smarter hybrid solution. Instead of docking the entire handheld, only the core processing unit (APU, RAM, SSD, etc.) should be removable and inserted in the dock. The portable portion equipped with a screen, battery, and streaming capabilities would function similarly to the PS Portal, allowing users to use it for remote play or cloud gaming even while the main processing unit is docked and running local gameplay. This setup is efficient and allows parallel use.

Edit: And then in a year or two, offer the core processing unit without the screen and battery for sale.

Edit: The "new ps portal" is also its pack-in controller.

 

[diffusionx]

Sony should avoid all this nonsense altogether.

 

[SweetTooth]

Most important thing is having PS6 family games to be built on a scalable single game code. That would ensure fantastic support for the system and less headache for devs.

 

[ergem]

Sony should avoid all this nonsense altogether.

Probably, but it's already in the works as confirmed by KeplerL2. It will use a 15w SOC probably using ARM architecture. The power should be between XSS and PS5.

 

[Zacfoldor]

So you want something like the Wii-U then?

Sony's making the next Wii-U?

I think you are on to something my guy. They are going to fuck this up royal.

Nintendo tried that and it didn't spark joy. It's a novelty to use a tablet with a game you already have on a TV screen and it won't help like you think it will. Just copy Nintendo like Valve did, don't try to think for yourself Sony, you can't do it.

 

[Nankatsu]

PS6...Portable?

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

Hmm. Interesting. So this would stream from the dock assuming you don't have a ps6 to stream from? Or you travel with the dock?

I'm fine with Sony just making the current Portal work with the ps6 tbh.

 

[spons]

ARM? Dead in the water if they have to port everything over or have to make games from scratch.

 

[ergem]

So you want something like the Wii-U then?

Sony's making the next Wii-U?

I think you are on to something my guy. They are going to fuck this up royal.

Nintendo tried that and it didn't spark joy. It's a novelty to use a tablet with a game you already have on a TV screen and it won't help like you think it will. Just copy Nintendo like Valve did, don't try to think for yourself Sony, you can't do it.

Nope. Wii-U is not portable. Think harder my guy.

 

[TheUnicornGuy]

I don't understand the purpose of this. If you're only doing local streaming why not just leave the guts in the handheld part? A better way to do it would be to allow docked level performance while plugged into the mains so you get the benefit of better frame rates and higher resolution and such without adding any lag with the streaming part.

 

[ergem]

Hmm. Interesting. So this would stream from the dock assuming you don't have a ps6 to stream from? Or you travel with the dock?

I'm fine with Sony just making the current Portal work with the ps6 tbh.

You should not stream from the dock. You insert the core processing behind the screen and battery and travel.

Or, you could leave the core processing at home and use the screen,battery,buttons to cloud stream while another person use the docked system at home.

 

[Kupfer]

I am oldschool. I want my shit rendered natively on the screen.
No streaming, no upsampling - raw pixels straight from the processor.

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

You should not stream from the dock. You insert the core processing behind the screen and battery and travel.

Or, you could leave the core processing at home and use the screen,battery,buttons to cloud stream while another person use the docked system at home.

I think they'll keep the core processing as the PS6.

 

[Woopah]

So to clarify, you want this to have two SoCs. One of which can be removed from the device. Is that it?

 

[ergem]

I am oldschool. I want my shit rendered natively on the screen.
No streaming, no upsampling - raw pixels straight from the processor.

You could do that not unlike Switch. You insert the core processing behind the battery and screen. Imagine a PS Portal with a rectangular hole at the back. Hardware design can make it look nice.

 

[Miles708]

Sony should avoid all this nonsense altogether.

Precisely. They are still struggling to support their ONE existing piece of hardware, i can't imagine how this can be good in any shape of form.

Sony's train of thought lately seems to be simply "looks like they're making money over there, we'll like some too" and that's the entire strategy.

 

[ergem]

I think they'll keep the core processing as the PS6.

A portable device from Sony is real. It's coming.

A traditional PS6 is also coming. Don't confuse the two.

I'm only saying the the portable one should have a different docking system than the switch which would allow the screen and battery (think PS Portal) still usable.

 

[diffusionx]

A portable device from Sony is real. It's coming.

A traditional PS6 is also coming. Don't confuse the two.

I'm only saying the the portable one should have a different docking system than the switch which would allow the screen and battery (think PS Portal) still usable.

A portable system that requires a dock to do the computing so you can stream... what's the fucking point? You can keep selling the PS Portal and just link it to the Ps6.

 

[SweetTooth]

I am oldschool. I want my shit rendered natively on the screen.
No streaming, no upsampling - raw pixels straight from the processor.

You get PS6. It will be most powerful console.

 

[Bitstream]

I'm only saying the the portable one should have a different docking system than the switch which would allow the screen and battery (think PS Portal) still usable.

From what I see, you can use the switch2 while its charging with a cable, and don't need to connect it to the dock to charge it, only if you want to get it on your TV

 

[ergem]

Most important thing is having PS6 family games to be built on a scalable single game code. That would ensure fantastic support for the system and less headache for devs.

I agree. This is the deal breaker. If Sony can accomplish this, we will see 99% if not 100% of PS6 games come to this device.

I think both systems should have exactly the same amount of RAM to avoid XSS and XSX development headaches.

 

[hinch7]

Yeah that isn't going to work. Modular design is going to make the system more complex to manufacture and maintain thus costs will be high. Plus, it doesn't help sell more units when they can charge consumers full price and more for refreshes. And multiple SKU's in the same system is a big no-go as well.

They need to land the basics first. Not added complexity for the sake of it. The games come first and they need to make it actually enticing for the customer, which means not making it a $600-700 beast. If Sony can manage a quarter of what PSP in sales did, they would be happy.

 

[ergem]

A portable system that requires a dock to do the computing so you can stream... what's the fucking point? You can keep selling the PS Portal and just link it to the Ps6.

You don't need a dock to do the computing.

 

[Physiognomonics]

You get PS6. It will be most powerful console.

And probably the most expensive ever...

 

[Lionel Richie]

If shit was like LEGO blocks, then yeah, sure.

 

[SweetTooth]

I agree. This is the deal breaker. If Sony can accomplish this, we will see 99% if not 100% of PS6 games come to this device.

I think both systems should have exactly the same amount of RAM to avoid XSS and XSX development headaches.

Also Sony's main advantage is they can utilize their robust Cloud infrastructure for people who wants full PS6 fidelity through Cloud

 

[MMaRsu]

What ps6 portable?

 

[ergem]

If you're only doing local streaming

You can also cloud stream. Think PS Portal.

 

[diffusionx]

You don't need a dock to do the computing.

Okay. Is this what you are ennvisioning?

1. You have the screen/battery/controller piece.
2. You have some other module with the CPU/RAM/etc.
3. You can insert the computer module inside a dock and stream with the screen/battery piece
4. You can also take out the module and insert it into the screen/battery piece and play natively

This is wayyyyy too complicated, more expensive to manufacture, and quite frankly, kind of stupid. Especially when we are all talking about the existence of a proper PS6 console whuich will be technically advanced.

Needless to say, a "PS6 Portable" that doesn't run the exact same games as the PS6 in the same way (accounting for screen size) is not a PS6 portable, it is a different console. The appeal of the Switch is in the name, you can play the exact same game in the exact same way on either handheld or on TV.

 

[ergem]

Okay. Is this what you are ennvisioning?

1. You have the screen/battery/controller piece.
2. You have some other module with the CPU/RAM/etc.
3. You can insert the computer module inside a dock and stream with the screen/battery piece
4. You can also take out the module and insert it into the screen/battery piece and play natively

Cool. You got it.

This is wayyyyy too complicated,

I don't agree.

more expensive to manufacture,

I don't think that's the case.

Needless to say, a "PS6 Portable" that doesn't run the exact same games as the PS6 in the same way (accounting for screen size) is not a PS6 portable, it is a different console.

We don't know that. Kepler is calling this PS6 Portable. I'm guessing this portable device will be Sony's base model and all PS6 games will be made for it. If Sony can hit that goal then this portable device will sell. Probably not as much as Switch, but it will get games and it will sell and be successful as a companion device or even a full fledge standalone device for many budget-conscious gamers.

 

[diffusionx]

Cool. You got it.

Yay.

I don't agree.

What happens when Little Timmy loses the computing module? Then you have a paperweight.

I don't think that's the case.

Modular/removable components are more expensive to manufacture, yes. Google tried to do it with a smartphone for years and gave up.

We don't know that. Kepler is calling this PS6 Portable. I'm guessing this portable device will be Sony's base model and all PS6 games will be made for it. If Sony can hit that goal then this portable device will sell. Probably not as much as Switch, but it will get games and it will sell and be successful as a companion device or even a full fledge standalone device for many budget conscious gamers.

They can call it whatever they want, a "PS6 Portable" that is different hardware (or, like ARM vs. x86) is not a PS6. This is just fundamental reality. A portable Switch is exactly the same hardware as a docked Switch, just running at different frequencies.

 

[existensmaximum]

You could do that not unlike Switch. You insert the core processing behind the battery and screen. Imagine a PS Portal with a rectangular hole at the back. Hardware design can make it look nice.

So a serious question. Do you actually think that this is realistic?

 

[ergem]

Yay.

Took you so long but ok.

What happens when Little Timmy loses the computing module? Then you have a paperweight.

Cool story bro.

Modular/removable components are more expensive to manufacture, yes. Google tried to do it with a smartphone for years and gave up.

Not necessarily. Smartphone is a different battlefield.

They can call it whatever they want, a "PS6 Portable" that is different hardware (or, like ARM vs. x86) is not a PS6. This is just fundamental reality. A portable Switch is exactly the same hardware as a docked Switch, just running at different frequencies.

The same game will run docked or undocked for portable device. Same with switch. The traditional PS6 will offer better visuals and performance. Imagine Nintendo releasing a Switch 2 Pro that is the size of PS5 that plays Switch 2 games with all visual fidelity.

 

[TheUnicornGuy]

You can also cloud stream. Think PS Portal.

But why would you? Why not just take the docked part with you?

 

[ergem]

So a serious question. Do you actually think that this is realistic?

Yes, of course. Why not, tell me.

 

[ergem]

But why would you? Why not just take the docked part with you?

You should take the docked part with you when you want to travel.

But seriously, you can't think of a use case for this? How about parallel use at home? How about offering the core processing unit as a standalone for a lot less for better market penetration?

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I don't think they will make a hybrid.

It shouldn't have any TV out at all, they will want to sell you a PS6 for that.

Which I feel is right approach.

 

[diffusionx]

Took you so long but ok.

It's not like your initial description was great. I'm trying to engage with you, don't be sarcastic.

Cool story bro.

You may not care about these sorts of cases but the manufacturers do, because they have to deal with the fallout from it. Remember people breaking TVs with the Wii remote? Nintendo had to deal with that.

Not necessarily. Smartphone is a different battlefield.

Yea, if anything, the price margin for this is even tighter than a smartphone.

The same game will run docked or undocked for portable device. Same with switch. The traditional PS6 will offer better visuals and performance. Imagine Nintendo releasing a Switch 2 Pro that is the size of PS5 that plays Switch 2 games with all visual fidelity.

Nintendo won't do that, though, because it hurts the core conceit of the device, and as the Series S has shown, forcing your dev to code to a crappy low end device has consequences.

 

[Schmendrick]

Incredible bullshit completely removed from any hardware/electronics reality.
/thread

 

[Three]

Nintendo's Switch and the Switch 2 forces the entire console to be docked for TV play, rendering the screen and internal battery effectively useless while docked. It's an inefficient design that wastes cloud streaming potential.

Sony has an opportunity with the PS6 Portable to deliver a smarter hybrid solution. Instead of docking the entire handheld, only the core processing unit (APU, RAM, SSD, etc.) should be removable and inserted in the dock. The portable portion equipped with a screen, battery, and streaming capabilities would function similarly to the PS Portal, allowing users to use it for remote play or cloud gaming even while the main processing unit is docked and running local gameplay. This setup is efficient and allows parallel use.

Edit: And then in a year or two, offer the core processing unit without the screen and battery for sale.

I do not see the benefits of this other than reduced cost of modular upgrades in the future. What would be the benefit of docking a SoC? Surely all you would need is the detachable controller since the screen for TV docked mode is pointless.

 

[HRK69]

Let's act like Nintendo didn't completely change the damn game with their "flawed" design, right?

Lmfaoooo

Nintendo nailed it. If Sony tries to reinvent the wheel with some clunky two piece modular mess, they're gonna end up with another Vita situation. Good luck with that.

This isn't innovation, it's tech-bro fantasy.

 

[ergem]

You may not care about these sorts of cases but the manufacturers do, because they have to deal with the fallout from it. Remember people breaking TVs with the Wii remote? Nintendo had to deal with that.

The core processing unit will be sold standalone as the cheapest gateway to next-gen PS gaming.

Yea, if anything, the price margin for this is even tighter than a smartphone.

One added benefit is the possibility of selling the core processing unit as a standalone device. And the PS Portal device with rectangular hollow at the back be will be made available to latch that thing on (or use it as a standalone cloud streaming device, your choice).

Nintendo won't do that, though, because it hurts the core conceit of the device, and as the Series S has shown, forcing your dev to code to a crappy low end device has consequences.

I think it was the RAM capacity of XSS that made the port difficult. Sony just need to ensure easier scalability for developers. I don't know if they can get to that. But I'm optimistic they can pull it off.

 

[ergem]

I do not see the benefits of this other than reduced cost of modular upgrades in the future. What would be the benefit of docking a SoC? Surely all you would need is the detachable controller since the screen for TV docked mode is pointless.

That's a better idea. Scratch the dock then. We don't need the dock. Just connect it directly to the TV with HDMI.

 

[Schmendrick]

The core processing unit will be sold standalone as the cheapest gateway to next-gen PS gaming.

One added benefit is the possibility of selling the core processing unit as a standalone device. And the PS Portal device with rectangular hollow at the back be will be made available to latch that thing on (or use it as a standalone cloud streaming device, your choice).

I think it was the RAM capacity of XSS that made the port difficult. Sony just need to ensure easier scalability for developers. I don't know if they can get to that. But I'm optimistic they can pull it off.

 

[AJUMP23]

Sony making a new handheld seems like a bad business move. Just like MS making one.

 

[nial]

Precisely. They are still struggling to support their ONE existing piece of hardware, i can't imagine how this can be good in any shape of form.

Sony's train of thought lately seems to be simply "looks like they're making money over there, we'll like some too" and that's the entire strategy.

They aren't struggling to support the PS5 and, for the fifth time, it's not supposed to have unique hardware.

 

[rodrigolfp]

The portable portion equipped with a screen, battery, and streaming capabilities would function similarly to the PS Portal, allowing users to use it for remote play or cloud gaming even while the main processing unit is docked and running local gameplay. This setup is efficient and allows parallel use.

You should not stream from the dock. You insert the core processing behind the screen and battery and travel.

Or, you could leave the core processing at home and use the screen,battery,buttons to cloud stream while another person use the docked system at home.

That would require secondary processor(s) and memory(ies).

 

[TheUnicornGuy]

You should take the docked part with you when you want to travel.

But seriously, you can't think of a use case for this? How about parallel use at home? How about offering the core processing unit as a standalone for a lot less for better market penetration?

If you're at home why not just allow it to run full speed if your charger is providing at least xW of power? If you sell it as a standalone the you have an XSX/S situation, or worse, a PSTV situation. I can understand what you're trying to sell but I don't think there's a need to make it as convoluted as having a removable APU. If you're at home and want to play on your TV then pop in in the dock and grab a controller, if you're at home and someone else is using the TV then plug in a charger and get docked speeds while still being handheld, if you're out and about just take it with you. The only niche situation I can think of is wanting full docked speed while taking a dump or something but that wouldn't warrant the extra cost of having an extra APU/SoC that would be needed to allow the streaming function to work.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Instead of docking the entire handheld, only the core processing unit (APU, RAM, SSD, etc.) should be removable and inserted in the dock. The portable portion equipped with a screen, battery, and streaming capabilities would function similarly to the PS Portal, allowing users to use it for remote play or cloud gaming even while the main processing unit is docked and running local gameplay. This setup is efficient and allows parallel use.

I cannot even imagine how badly people will fuck this up.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I don't think they will make a hybrid.

It shouldn't have any TV out at all, they will want to sell you a PS6 for that.

Which I feel is right approach.

PS6 will be more expensive, this would be a cheaper option ala XSS.

Doing this will allow a larger user pool for PlayStation, because a lot of people aren't going to be able to afford the PS6 Digital which will probably end up at like 600-700 dollars.

I agree though HDMI out directly on the system will probably make it too big. USB-C out will suffice. Sell separately two products a USB-C to HDMI adapter w/power source and an HDMI dock with ethernet and maybe an extra USB-C port potentially with additional cooling.


PS6 Handheld - SOC 1 (plays PS4-PS6 games, reduced resolution/frame rate, optional dock, can pair with a Dual Sense 2) ~500 USD
PS6 TV - SOC 1 (same as above but doesn't come with a screen or controls no disc attachment but comes with a Dual Sense 2) ~350 USD
PS Portal 2 - (plays cloud and remote) ~200 USD
PS Portal 2 OLED - (same as above) ~250 USD
PS Portal 2 TV Stick (same as above but doesn't come with a screen or controls, does not come with a Dual Sense controller) ~50 USD
PS6 Digital - SOC 2 (Standard Ps6, but digital, works with attachment, advanced upscaling and RTX) ~550 USD
PS6 Standard - SOC 2 (standard PS6 with attachment, advanced upscaling and RTX) ~600
PS6 Pro - SOC 3 (Path tracing, more tensor cores) ~800 dollars