• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Tim Burton on Why 'Miss Peregrine's Home For Peculiar Children' is Mostly White

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

Choppasmith

Member
Discotheque said:
Yeah I think if he just mentioned the setting and time period he has pretty solid reasoning. Dude dug the whole further with his musings tho.
Click to expand...

2b68c30420e60c3e41238eecf39f5be1.jpg



I mostly wanted an excuse to post this.
 
J

JP_

Banned
I remember back when I was a child watching The Brady Bunch and they started to get all politically correct. Like, OK, let’s have an Asian child and a black. I used to get more offended by that
Click to expand...
giphy.gif
 
QuantumZebra

QuantumZebra

Member
"Nowadays, people are talking about it more," he says regarding film diversity. But "things either call for things, or they don’t. I remember back when I was a child watching The Brady Bunch and they started to get all politically correct. Like, OK, let’s have an Asian child and a black. I used to get more offended by that than just... I grew up watching blaxploitation movies, right? And I said, that’s great. I didn’t go like, OK, there should be more white people in these movies."
Click to expand...
giphy.gif
Click to expand...
As a white person I apologize that this guy exists and I share a skin tone with him
 
A

AtomskEater

Member
Lol.
I can hardly even believe he said it. He's offended. By seeing a black and asian child on a show with 99.9% white characters. The horror.

Why are some people so offended by so much as seeing ethnic minorities/women/lgbt people on a screen (and sometimes not even in a lead role)? I saw a handful of people on another forum who started crying about "pandering!" when there was a female lead on some inconsequential show or another. Who gives a fuck. Straight white male leads could also be considered pandering, just to your hateful insular ass.
 
L

lightskintwin

Banned
AtomskEater said:
Lol.
I can hardly even believe he said it. He's offended. By seeing a black and asian child on a show with 99.9% white characters. The horror.

Why are some people so offended by so much as seeing ethnic minorities/women/lgbt people on a screen (and sometimes not even in a lead role)? I saw a handful of people on another forum who started crying about "pandering!" when there was a female lead on some inconsequential show or another. Who gives a fuck. Straight white male leads could also be considered pandering, just to your hateful insular ass.
Click to expand...

It's because those "others" shouldn't be there. Everything was better before then, why are they here now invading my entertainment that was specifically made for me and only me.
 
S

Steve Youngblood

Member
That's such an amazingly tone deaf response in 2016 that it's almost unbelievable. I almost feel like I need to verify the validity of this on Snopes to be sure that he really answered the question this stupidly.
 
V

vinnygambini

Why are strippers at the U.N. bad when they're great at strip clubs???
Samuel L. Jackson stars in the movie, and is perhaps the most predominately featured person of color in all of the 36 Burton-directed films. As Bustle notes, Billy Dee Williams was featured in 1989’s “Batman” and Michael Clarke Duncan was in 2001’s “Planet of the Apes,” both only in supporting roles. Jackson told the publication that he did indeed “notice” the lack of diversity in “Miss Peregrine,” but it obviously didn’t keep him from taking the role.

“I had to go back in my head and go, how many black characters have been in Tim Burton movies?” he said. “And I may have been the first, I don’t know, or the most prominent in that particular way, but it happens the way it happens. I don’t think it’s any fault of his or his method of storytelling, it’s just how it’s played out. Tim’s a really great guy.”
Click to expand...

http://variety.com/2016/film/news/t...e-for-peculiar-children-diversity-1201874146/
 
F

Frodo

Member
It's almost like he lives in a bubble and has never spent more than a second to think about the issue.


That answer was tough to read.
 
U

Usobuko

Banned
They only want your money because they know the other races eat their shit up regardless.

I wish poc all over the world are brought to awareness of such trends.
 
J

Jonm1010

Banned
Steve Youngblood said:
That's such an amazingly tone deaf response in 2016 that it's almost unbelievable. I almost feel like I need to verify the validity of this on Snopes to be sure that he really answered the question this stupidly.
Click to expand...

The guy is 58 years old, does it really surprise people he isn't on the up and up of American liberal millennial ideals of race related behavior?

Its a shitty response but eh, the real issue IMO is the internal structural problem in Hollywood. Same stance I took with the whole Oscars uproar. Burton is merely a reflection of that system. One which I am fine being a voice within that structure because he is a unique and talented voice, but going forward I would like to see more diversity so we can have more diverse voices and frankly, better products. In an increasingly global market it seems both ideal from a ethics standpoint and an economic one. To get there though Hollywood likely needs to reform from the inside out, then the products they produce will be more reflective of the shifts in society.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
AtomskEater said:
Lol.
I can hardly even believe he said it. He's offended. By seeing a black and asian child on a show with 99.9% white characters. The horror.

Why are some people so offended by so much as seeing ethnic minorities/women/lgbt people on a screen (and sometimes not even in a lead role)? I saw a handful of people on another forum who started crying about "pandering!" when there was a female lead on some inconsequential show or another. Who gives a fuck. Straight white male leads could also be considered pandering, just to your hateful insular ass.
Click to expand...
If we're going to be upset at Burton, especially in the face of people struggling to understand our perspective, I think we have a responsibility to fairly represent exactly why he was being ignorant. He wasn't offended simply because there were minorities. He was offended that someone intervened to ensure there were visible minorities on the show. ie, that it was a conscious decision to feature those characters for diversity's sake.

Don't do any favours for those who wish to characterize you as a hysterical reactionary, is my point.
 
L

lightskintwin

Banned
Socreges said:
If we're going to be upset at Burton, especially in the face of people struggling to understand our perspective, I think we have a responsibility to fairly represent exactly why he was being ignorant. He wasn't offended simply because there were minorities. He was offended that someone intervened to ensure there were visible minorities on the show. ie, that it was a conscious decision to feature those characters for diversity's sake.

Don't do any favours for those who wish to characterize you as a hysterical reactionary, is my point.
Click to expand...

How do you know this though? Since when was an American show that aired in 1969 to 1974 concerned with diversity? It couldn't possibly be that particular episode called for two actors of color to be in it, right? No, of course it couldn't; it must've been somehow forced.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
lightskintwin said:
How do you know this though? Since when was an American show that aired in 1969 to 1974 concerned with diversity? It couldn't possibly be that particularly episode called for two actors of color to be in it, right? No, of course it couldn't; it must've been somehow forced.
Click to expand...
I don't know this. That isn't the point. It was Burton's assumption and the basis for his analogy.
 
H

hipbabboom

Huh? What did I say? Did I screw up again? :(
Really beginning to feel like I need to begin keeping a spreadsheet of celebrities in done with and why. I can't stomach the idea of accidentally funding this form of stupidity.
 
H

hodayathink

Member
AlexMeloche said:
....this doesn't make sense. Burton movies has aleays been about people who are different and stuff. :(

This make me sad.
Click to expand...

Big Fish is about a dude who basically travels the country. That lives in the South (Alabama). And it ostensibly only has one black character in it, in a bit part.
 
C

Claude Augario

Member
Not really a surprise coming from Tim "A black" Derpon when you look at his filmography. I am a bit curious about the book though since I never read it - are the characters diverse or not, or is it left up to interpretation?

Socreges said:
If we're going to be upset at Burton, especially in the face of people struggling to understand our perspective, I think we have a responsibility to fairly represent exactly why he was being ignorant. He wasn't offended simply because there were minorities. He was offended that someone intervened to ensure there were visible minorities on the show. ie, that it was a conscious decision to feature those characters for diversity's sake.

Don't do any favours for those who wish to characterize you as a hysterical reactionary, is my point.
Click to expand...

It was a backdoor pilot for a show about kids adopted from different racial backgrounds. No one "intervened" or forced color on Burton's sensitive eyes "for diversity's sake." It's literally the premise.
 
H

hurricanes

Member
Unless the book specify that all peculiar children are white, I don't think his excuse making even the tiniest bit sense.

Good that I am never a fan of him to begin with, I guess.
 
J

Jonm1010

Banned
Tence said:
My parents are 10 year older and not as tone deaf as he is. So yeah it surprises me.
Click to expand...

My parents are similar but I wouldn't make the mistake of painting all baby boomers with the brush of my parents.

There is a lot of tone deafness from that age bracket.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
Claude Augario said:
Not really a surprise coming from Tim "A black" Derpon when you look at his filmography. I am a bit curious about the book though since I never read it - are the characters diverse or not, or is it left up to interpretation?



It was a backdoor pilot for a show about kids adopted from different racial backgrounds. No one "intervened" or forced color on Burton's sensitive eyes "for diversity's sake." It's literally the premise.
Click to expand...
It's his perception. That such an episode manifested due to political correctness (unless I'm mistaken, I don't think we know the machinations that led to that unique episode). I am not Tim Burton. I do not share his views. My post was to address those suggesting, e.g., that he's simply offended by seeing minorities on-screen.
 
W

Wuthering_Heights

Banned
Certainly not the best answer he could have given, but I still support his right to make what he wants and cast who he wants. Looking forward to seeing this tomorrow night.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
Claude Augario said:
Not really a surprise coming from Tim "A black" Derpon when you look at his filmography. I am a bit curious about the book though since I never read it - are the characters diverse or not, or is it left up to interpretation?
Click to expand...

I've never read the book, but it's set on a remote island in Wales. According to the last census in 2011, 95.6% of the Welsh population was white, 2.3% was Asian, and only 0.6% was black.
 
H

Henkka

Banned
That's a poor response... Although, I'm wondering what kind of response would be better. Trying to answer why your film is mostly white seems like a minefield, unless it's set in Victorian era England or some other, historical setting that was mostly white.
 
D

Dabanton

Member
A lot of these directors are tone deaf to this stuff. They don't care their worldview is white. It's why it was gutting to see the Coens get asked a question about lack of diversity in the junket for their last film, and pull the same pathetic response. Same with Ridley Scott and the whitewashed main cast in exodus.
 
C

commedieu

Banned
Henkka said:
That's a poor response... Although, I'm wondering what kind of response would be better. Trying to answer why your film is mostly white seems like a minefield, unless it's set in Victorian era England or some other, historical setting that was mostly white.
Click to expand...

"Lol I didn't even notice, ah well, we've got one in there. That counts for something to them right?"

Would have been more appropriate.
 
D

Dabanton

Member
Henkka said:
That's a poor response... Although, I'm wondering what kind of response would be better. Trying to answer why your film is mostly white seems like a minefield, unless it's set in Victorian era England or some other, historical setting that was mostly white.
Click to expand...

Even that doesn't fly Victorian England had a sizable ethnic presence.
 
N

NimbusD

Member
Like, take a step back and listen to what you're even saying Burton...

You were MORE offended by seeing asian and black kids on screen than off screen. As if their representation were binary, and they could only exist as token, or not at all.

Things CALL for minorities, or, by default, they are white.

Come on man. For fucks sake.

EDIT: essentially it boils down to, "What's the problem? White people are default."
 
L

lightskintwin

Banned
eyeball_kid said:
I've never read the book, but it's set on a remote island in Wales. According to the last census in 2011, 95.6% of the Welsh population was white, 2.3% was Asian, and only 0.6% was black.
Click to expand...

Not this tired and awful argument, the film is a big budget FANTASY movie made to be seen by the widest audience possible. Samuel L. Jackson is freakin' in it. Being historically accurate isn't what they're going for and even then casting one of the kids as ironically enough an "Asian kid or a black" would still fit within your demographics that you pathetically used to justify the casting.

I'm all for Tim Burton to cast whoever he wants in his movies but the demographics one is always used to maintain the status quo up into the demographics shift and then other arguments are used to maintain it. It's a bullshit argument but it keeps being carted out as if it means anything.

Funny it's never used the other way, as the Angry Asian Man put it best, "You can set a story anywhere in the world, in any era of history, [regardless of the demographics] and Hollywood will still somehow find a way for the movie to star a white guy. You can count on it".
 
C

CloudWolf

Member
mattiewheels said:
Well, it was also same with the Coen brothers. You can tell that thoughts like this never cross their mind, and they're caught off guard and scramble to not look like a racist, giving an awkward answer that ends up feeling kinda racist anyway.

I feel the same way I did when the Coens gave their answer, I don't think they're racist at all, but they obviously never give this stuff a second thought and just stay in a comfort zone.
Click to expand...
I think the main difference between this an the Coens is that the casting for this film almost had to be deliberate. The book is pretty diverse and then you have a completely white cast for the adaptation, which is weird. Burtons comment also feels like he thought about it and then decided, "fuck that noise I don't wanna be PC".

The Coen situation was a case of someone basically baiting the Coens to make up an awkward statement at a Q&A. Their answer was also a lot better worded than Burtons excuse here. The Coens said that they don't understand why this question is aimed at independent movie directors like them and P.T. Anderson and that they think it's silly to single out films when the problems is with the system not individual movies/directors. They never said they didn't understand the need for diversity. They openly supported the need for diversity at the Oscars this year.
 
E

eyeball_kid

Member
lightskintwin said:
Not this tired and awful argument, the film is a big budget FANTASY movie made to be seen by the widest audience possible. Samuel L. Jackson is freakin' in it. Being historically accurate isn't what they're going for and even then casting one of the kids as ironically enough an "Asian kid or a black" would still fit within your demographics that you pathetically used to justify the casting.

I'm all for Tim Burton to cast whoever he wants in his movies but the demographics one is always used to maintain the status quo up into the demographics shift and then other arguments are used to maintain it. It's a bullshit argument but it keeps being carted out as if it means anything.

Funny it's never used the other way, as the Angry Asian Man put it best, "You can set a story anywhere in the world, in any era of history, [regardless of the demographics] and Hollywood will still somehow find a way for the movie to star a white guy. You can count on it".
Click to expand...

Excuse me? I didn't make any arguments, nor was I "justifying the casting". The parent poster asked what the racial makeup of the book was. It's set in Wales, which is a hundred shades of white, so I assume the book is similar, but I have no idea. I already made my opinion of Burton's default white attitude known earlier in the thread.
 
L

lightskintwin

Banned
eyeball_kid said:
Excuse me? I didn't make any arguments, nor was I "justifying the casting". The parent poster asked what the racial makeup of the book was. It's set in Wales, which is a hundred shades of white, so I assume the book is similar, but I have no idea. I already made my opinion of Burton's default white attitude known earlier in the thread.
Click to expand...

Oh yeah, you're right. I have no idea how I missed the context. I guess you mistakenly got in the crossfire of my internet outrage. LOL I apologize.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Ridley Scott interview - sharks in the colosseum, Maximus returning from the afterlife to kill Jesus Christ, asleep at the wheel for Prometheus
45
3K
dem replied
  • Locked
Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children - Review thread
39
9K
jett replied
John Lithgow Still Regrets Passing on Playing the Joker in Tim Burton’s Batman
2
88
11K
itwasTuesday replied
Kotaku bitching about CoD Vanguard - it's too woke, apparently, to the point it defies history ... *SPOILERS*
Opinion Spoilers Drama 2 3 4 5
204
32K
Spukc replied
  • Locked
First trailer for Tim Burton's "Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children"
2 3
101
10K
Blue Lou replied
Top Bottom