64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
The video's mostly a criticism of S.T.A.L.K.E.R 2 and its performance and graphics, all the stuff that comes with it as a product of Unreal Engine.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
"Unreal Engine is Killing Games" - Vex
- Thread starter 64bitmodels
- Start date
The video's mostly a criticism of S.T.A.L.K.E.R 2 and its performance and graphics, all the stuff that comes with it as a product of Unreal Engine.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Unreal Engine and its consequences have been a disaster for gaming
ChorizoPicozo
Member
LectureMaster
Gold Member
There are plenty Unreal games released in a much better polished state.
It takes dev's dedication to optimize ambitious games.
It takes dev's dedication to optimize ambitious games.
Last edited:
lh032
I cry about Xbox and hate PlayStation.
UE games runs worse on PC with similar or even better setups lol
Last edited:
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
its disgusting how 90% of the industry have decided to all coalesce onto this one unoptimized, slow and resource-heavy engine with terrible performance on all platforms.
Epic promised us the world back in 2020 and we got peanuts.
If the mainstream, modern most popular hardware is struggling with your engine, that's not an issue with the hardware that's an issue with the engine. These are consoles that are 4 years old, with decent mid-range GPUs and CPUs. Why are they struggling to run games with PS4 quality graphics? They're supposed to be an upgrade over the PS4.
Last edited:
kevboard
Member
Unreal Engine 4 was originally designed to be licensed by studios, who then customise the engine to best suit what their game needs.
over the years it sadly became more and more common for devs to just use the default version of the engine, with all its bloat, which is not optimised for any specific genre or type of game design.
Epic Games then started catering to these types of devs, making the engine a jack of all traits and easier and easier to use. this in return allowed worse and worse developers to makes games with it. which then slowly leads to worse and worse optimised games by worse and worse developers.
over the years it sadly became more and more common for devs to just use the default version of the engine, with all its bloat, which is not optimised for any specific genre or type of game design.
Epic Games then started catering to these types of devs, making the engine a jack of all traits and easier and easier to use. this in return allowed worse and worse developers to makes games with it. which then slowly leads to worse and worse optimised games by worse and worse developers.
Shake Your Rump
Member
Unreal Engine has been crippling games since the PS3 era.
I recently tried playing Jedi Fallen Order and UE fucks it up. Geometry and objects pop-in during cutscenes. I/O stutter, even on the PS5 version. This is a PS4 port and it can't even run perfectly on a PS5 strictly due to Unreal Engine issues.
I recently tried playing Jedi Fallen Order and UE fucks it up. Geometry and objects pop-in during cutscenes. I/O stutter, even on the PS5 version. This is a PS4 port and it can't even run perfectly on a PS5 strictly due to Unreal Engine issues.
ChorizoPicozo
Member
as the video suggests. The real issue is the chase of photorealism. Thats it. unoptimized/poorly implemented technology. And a lot of devs don't have the correct people to deal with that shit.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Yea, it's tough to blame the hardware when I could load up Spiderman 2 for example and get RT in every mode, and the 60fps mode works great, and it looks great, and runs great, and the IQ is excellent, on a base PS5.
Last edited:
intbal
Member
Management likes cheap labor.
Since a huge percentage of the game development labor force has experience with Unreal, then everybody becomes
It makes sense from a financial standpoint. No training required for all your new hires. Cut development time and thus costs.
They don't really take into consideration that a poor final product that's "Generically Unreal" will cut into their sales.
But hey, if that happens, just fire everybody and replace them. Maybe with ultra-cheap Chinese contractors. Everybody knows how to use Unreal, right?
Spukc
always chasing the next thrill
You have no idea how stupid that shit sounds
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Don’t blame UE. Blame publishers who can’t be bothered to invest in in-house engines and training. UE5 is merely a response to market trends. More and more devs are using it because maintaining custom engines is too costly and it takes too much time to get contractors and new employees up to speed with them. Everyone knows UE, so that saves a lot of time and money on training.
Last edited:
sono
Gold Member
Why - devs arent forced to use it. -Some companies have their own engines.
Can you add more detail
intbal
Member
Banishers works well.
Although it doesn't push hard on any high end features or world design.
Yeah but if it is a one size fits all engine it isn't going to be able to do something that developers want it to do.
Gone are the days were say the original Stalker had a vision and they made an engine for that game and vision.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
That's silly, I use UE5 a lot and it's an awesome tool
Klosshufvud
Member
UE5 seems to struggle madly large scale games. Especially games with fast changing scenery seems to really challenge the engine's limitations. I therefore think UE works great for smaller scaled games. Fighting games like Tekken and GG works great on UE. Tekken 8 also has an insanely low input delay, lowest in the whole series. Ace Combat 7 also looked and played great. Also those games were easily converted to decent PC ports too.
Can't watch the video atm.
Can't watch the video atm.
ShirAhava
Plays with kids toys, in the adult gaming world
UE5 sucks donkey balls its killed my interest in this generation (not that it was all that high to begin with but still)
MGS Delta being UE5 and not FOX ENGINE is the letdown of the generation
Early impressions were correct
www.neogaf.com
MGS Delta being UE5 and not FOX ENGINE is the letdown of the generation
Early impressions were correct
Was the switch to Unreal Engine 5 a mistake?
So far, I have hardly liked any Unreal Engine 5 games. They have very high hardware requirements and run barely on mid-range PCs and not exactly great on the consoles. They also look just ok visually. The Matrix demo was impressive and Fornite in Ue5 looks good too, but all the rest so far has...
sono
Gold Member
Mostly frame rate performance stating UE5 requires an expensive graphics card.
He also says that UE5 allows developers to produce photo realistic graphics
I found the frame rate comparisons of various nvidia and amd graphics cards useful
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
we had similarly photorealistic games in 2016-2019 that did not have the same optimization problems and are on par with many games releasing today visually. Look at something like Battlefield 1. If that game were made today you'd need a 5090 just to get 1080p 60fps
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Battlefield wasn't Unreal. And remember what happened with mass effect Andromeda and Anthem.
Magic Carpet
Gold Member
The cut and paste engine.
Fisher Price instructions for Fisher Price level developers.
Fisher Price instructions for Fisher Price level developers.
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
My point exactly. Photorealism is not the problem. it doesn't have to always be taxing on hardware to have a beautiful, realistic game. as RDR2 running on the infamous toaster Xbox One would prove.
People complain now because for the graphics we get the performance in response is apalling. And the common trend with all these enhanced-PS4 looking games comes back to them Mostly using UE5. There's more of them that run like shit and are poorly optimized than there are that aren't.
Fbh
Member
I don't think this running gaming but my interest on any new game is instantly diminished when it's in UE because there is a good chance it will run like shit on consoles. I'll probably skip most UE5 games until next gen.
Though I think it has more to do with devs destroying performance and image quality for the sake of diminishing graphical improvements.
Though I think it has more to do with devs destroying performance and image quality for the sake of diminishing graphical improvements.
Buggy Loop
Member
Might as well insert this here
Mainly sad that studios that had made Fox engine, CDPR's REDengine, Frostbite, and others, are switching to UE.
UE runs like dogshit.
Lumen has so much light bleed problems that upping the precision kills the performance where just RT performs better on accelerated hardware. Nanite is brutal on performances. Only worth it for super dense geometry and not many games actually require it. So devs are using nanite as buzzwords to raise up interest in their games but I bet most often, really not needed. Auto-LOD or bigger draw distances would be fine, there's so many smart systems to cull nowadays, because nanite is the opposite, it has so much overdraw in a scene.
Really sad for REDengine especially which is arguably the best looking and arguably optimized (for what it does) engine.
Decima engine is now defacto KING.
Like, I'm fine with the way unreal engine 5 looks, although its built on the foundation of temporal AA to hide its problems, but the performance for what you get in graphics... just always end up disappointing imo. Barely a game has managed to look better than the Last of us part 2, barely a few, and it didn't fucking run on all these tech buzzwords that kneecap a 4090.
I know new engine iterations of UE are improving things but, it just wasn't an engine ready for this gen. Sad really. What's next gen gonna be like again? Unveil UE6 for PS6 and again have a borked experience until late gen?
Mainly sad that studios that had made Fox engine, CDPR's REDengine, Frostbite, and others, are switching to UE.
UE runs like dogshit.
Lumen has so much light bleed problems that upping the precision kills the performance where just RT performs better on accelerated hardware. Nanite is brutal on performances. Only worth it for super dense geometry and not many games actually require it. So devs are using nanite as buzzwords to raise up interest in their games but I bet most often, really not needed. Auto-LOD or bigger draw distances would be fine, there's so many smart systems to cull nowadays, because nanite is the opposite, it has so much overdraw in a scene.
Really sad for REDengine especially which is arguably the best looking and arguably optimized (for what it does) engine.
Decima engine is now defacto KING.
Like, I'm fine with the way unreal engine 5 looks, although its built on the foundation of temporal AA to hide its problems, but the performance for what you get in graphics... just always end up disappointing imo. Barely a game has managed to look better than the Last of us part 2, barely a few, and it didn't fucking run on all these tech buzzwords that kneecap a 4090.
I know new engine iterations of UE are improving things but, it just wasn't an engine ready for this gen. Sad really. What's next gen gonna be like again? Unveil UE6 for PS6 and again have a borked experience until late gen?
Last edited:
ChorizoPicozo
Member
Photorealism IN Unreal Engine IS the issue.
why? because Photorealism/simulation (Ray Tracing) is the Holy Grail in 3D Graphics. but it's also the most sophisticated/complex/expensive to achieve.
In reality, most devs chasing that "art style" can't even afford to do so, either from a budget or a technical/technological perspective.
in order words: photorealism in 3D graphics is the most demanding "discipline".
to do it "right" it requires several Phds in their field, a lot of money and time.
the vast majority of studios can't afford it. so, they need to use "off the shelve" solutions. aka Unreal Engine
bitbydeath
Member
Was going to mention UE3 as well.
Now that was bad.
Codes 208
Member
I thought this was about unreal, not unity
Magic Carpet
Gold Member
Dude!
bitbydeath
Member
Codes 208
Member
You *did* say copy and paste engine, which happens to be the biggest strength of unity
Take for example house flippers and phasmophobia, up until phasmo hired new artists to make original content, they shared a TON of the same assets despite having no direct similarities
Last edited:
mrqs
Member
That era was all about textures not loading and massive amounts of bloom. Basically every game looked horrible hahaha. People complain these days while getting to play some of the most visually striking games ever made.
This isn’t an argument.
ResilientBanana
Member
These guys were amidst surviving the war in Ukraine. I think slack can be given to them here.
darrylgorn
Member
It kills CPUs not games.
FalconPunch
Member
Yea, tell your consumers they're wrong for liking what they like...... Seems like a great strategy
Heaven Angel
Member
The engine is new and devs are still learning, I think the graphical quality needs to be pushed forward. It's not the most important aspect but it's one of the top 5 what we see in games, maybe top 3. Being static at same UE4 will get stale after a while and UE5 can do a lot good if developers learn to implement it and optimize it perfectly. BMWK what I feel did great and it was on UE5.