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[Angry Grimace]

Cena beating the Nexus was just insanity.

Super Cena was gross but with the more recent guys Cena has "buried" it's less Super Cena and more that WWE never brings in new guys to be main eventers ever. You have to earn your dues in the midcard unless you're Seth-kun or Reigns-sama.

Owens still looks pretty good but he's not a main eventer at this point. I'm fairly certain he will be when they throw him at Reigns post-Mania (he is not winning that feud though). Rollins won't be ready and possibly won't be a heel and Owens has heel charisma to talk his way through the feud even if he will lose (unlike the Cena feud I would expect Owens to eat pins every single time).

 

[Google]

Let's recap 2015 for Cena

- Feud with Rusev; loses a match, wins at Mania and Extreme Rules. Rusev death spiral into the worst angle of 2015 and now being a mook in an awful stable.

- US Open Challenge; beats a bunch of midcarders on the roster and some NXT people in some entertaining kick out spot fests. This branches off into the Owens/Rollins feuds.

- Feud with Owens; loses a kick out spot fest that wouldn't be out of place in ROH. Wins two kick out spot fests that wouldn't be out of place in PWG.

- Feud with Rollins: Loses to Rollins thanks to a comedian. Gets his win and his title back the next PPV

- US Open Challenge redux: beats every other midcarder that's left, loses to Del Rio in an awful match with a finish that is never brought up or used ever again. Gets injured.

Summary: Wins all his feuds, nobody gets anything concrete off his "rub" in his kick out fest matches (although this is the fault of the creative rather than Cena tbf), still jokes around and says bizarre psychology smashing stuff. Seems p super to me.

I mean, I enjoyed all of that TV so I'm not sure what the problem is.

Cena has never been the draw for me. When I think of the wrestlers I like:
Rollins
KO
Finn Balor
Dolph
Sandow
Miz
I'm not concerned with their win/loss ratio, I'm concerned with the entertainment value of watching them on TV. I'll go weeks without watching NXT or RAW but as long as I can turn on a PPV or TV recap and watch a great KO promo or see the chiseled abs of Rollins, Dolph or Finn I'm happy.

I dont think I'm a stereotypical wrestling fan. I'm a 30 year old, heterosexual man who enjoys watching muscled dudes in spandex dance around. I dont care who wins or loses - I only care about the spectacle. The Rusev / Cena stuff was fucking great. I didnt care that Cena won in the end because watching Rusev in a tank was amazing!

Anyway- I'm not sure if I'm being clear but I dont care that someone is being 'buried' because there's always other guys in various guises that I enjoy so I can always enjoy something from the show.

Also, I've been to two live events in the past 12 months and the amount of people wearing shirts of the guys you people all hate is insane...

 

[Angry Grimace]

I mean, I enjoyed all of that TV so I'm not sure what the problem is.

Cena has never been the draw for me. When I think of the wrestlers I like:
Rollins
KO
Finn Balor
Dolph
Sandow
Miz
I'm not concerned with their win/loss ratio, I'm concerned with the entertainment value of watching them on TV. I'll go weeks without watching NXT or RAW but as long as I can turn on a PPV or TV recap and watch a great KO promo or see the chiseled abs of Rollins, Dolph or Finn I'm happy.

I dont think I'm a stereotypical wrestling fan. I'm a 30 year old, heterosexual man who enjoys watching muscled dudes in spandex dance around. I dont care who wins or loses - I only care about the spectacle. The Rusev / Cena stuff was fucking great. I didnt care that Cena won in the end because watching Rusev in a tank was amazing!

Anyway- I'm not sure if I'm being clear but I dont care that someone is being 'buried' because there's always other guys in various guises that I enjoy so I can always enjoy something from the show.

Also, I've been to two live events in the past 12 months and the amount of people wearing shirts of the guys you people all hate is insane...

You are the stereotypical wrestling fan. The average viewer age is like 44.

Again, I don't think the anger at the booking is necessarily that people really hate Reigns, its the feeling that Reigns is permanently in the title picture.

 

[Google]

You are the stereotypical wrestling fan. The average viewer age is like 44.

Then how does that make stereotypical if the average fan is a whole generation older than me?

My point was (that I dont think I made clear) is that I get as much enjoyment out of looking at Rybacks deltoids as I do watching The Miz tell the crowd to shut up. I'm not there to follow the story or get drawn into my favourite guy. This thread is made up of people upset about the way a specific story was spun whereas I watched the event while doing my weeks ironing enjoying Sheamus' irish banter unconcerned with the rest of the story.

I'm easily pleased.

 

[Serpens007]

Yeah, and he's had an seven year career with WWE culminating with his in-ring retirement in Seattle (which I was at, BTW) and the entire roster applauding him.

He won multiple championships and was in some fun story-lines.

One could argue it could've come sooner but I assume these things are often a culimnation of skill, motivation, timing, health and fortitude.

Fan support and fan shitting over the Royal Rumble 14' was a big reason of his push during that Wrestlemania season.

Not only that, but actual media backlash about cancelling the Network, and even wrestlers and former members of the business backing the fans with critizing WWE for not listening. Even Batista said that his win was a bad idea from the beginning, and supposedly said before his return that doing that, and as a face, was a bad idea.

And combining that with the CM Punk thing, WWE wasn't on a bright position media wise.

I remember during his run from '14-'15 and the fans being so butt-hurt that Vince and Co. weren't listening to them. "Why wont they give Daniel a chance?"

It's fucking great booking in my opinion. The authority gets great heat and builds it up over time as the major heel. The face gets more and more support. Then it explodes at the biggest event in the calendar and the fans get the result they want in the best way possible.

What's not to like about that?

And the thing is that all of that "genius booking" wasn't really planned from the beggining. The Bryan push during that Summer was that, a summer storyline, and was crushed by the stocks droping. In panic mode, they switched the storyline, and didn't wanted to give Bryan another run. They went with Cena vs Orton of all people. Bryan went to a upper midcard position.

Reports said that Bryan was set to a long program with the Wyatt, ultimately facing Bray at WrestleMania, which was changed due to the popularity of Bryan reaching levels of outside-wrestling influence. Then the reports said that the plan was Bryan getting a "redemption" match against Sheamus. He wasn't even in the Rumble match, they really didn't wanted him in the title picture.

Batista winning and facing Orton was actually the plan, this was well known, even months after all of it happened Steph and Triple H said it.

When they finally realised, it went smooth. It was great, and it paid off.


The thing is that now, a lot of people don't like Reigns, but WWE doesn't care because there is a good portion of the people that likes him and buy his stuff. There isn't enough media backlash either with Reigns winning so... we're stuck.

 

[klonere]

stuff...

Hey I was just pointing out that Cena is still booked very strongly. I don't even watch Raw anymore. I watched 3 matches from this PPV. I don't care anymore, I'm on watching a ton of other stuff so to each his own.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Then how does that make stereotypical if the average fan is a whole generation older than me?

My point was (that I dont think I made clear) is that I get as much enjoyment out of looking at Rybacks deltoids as I do watching The Miz tell the crowd to shut up. I'm not there to follow the story or get drawn into my favourite guy. This thread is made up of people upset about the way a specific story was spun whereas I watched the event while doing my weeks ironing enjoying Sheamus' irish banter unconcerned with the rest of the story.

I'm easily pleased.

You're in the correct demographic and level of caring, but I don't really know what to tell you when as far as I can tell, your underlying point is that people are being unreasonable simply for care more about it than you do. Like, how is there really a discussion to be had with the position that you don't care what happens at all as long as people wrestle?

 

[Hisoka]

Whoa you guys are demanding lol

I loved fastlane XD
Ambrose "against" Reigns against Lesnar was so hilarious!

AJ Styles vs Jericho was really nice, just didn't understand why the Styles-Clash was not enough.

Ziggi and Bella losing was a given somehow. Poor Ziggi, i like him.

The match wyatts against the fatties was abysmal tho, want dem wyatts to finally win some matches again.

New Day still rocks, funniest guys alive. Edge+Christian are fun.

All in all one of the best PPV i ever saw.
Maybe i'm just too easy to entertain :/

Spoiler

Actually like Roman Reigns

 

[Nekofrog]

Nothing says great ppv like having a stable of literal jobbers headline right before the main event eh

 

[Ithil]

All in all one of the best PPV i ever saw.

 

[Toki767]

Fans were also correct about Steve Austin. 19 years ago today he was still a heel who was getting cheered by a vocal minority. Then the double turn happens and he's the hottest act in the business.

 

[Google]

Like, how is there really a discussion to be had with the position that you don't care what happens at all as long as people wrestle?

That's a good question.

Like, I'm not just happy with people wrestling. I really dont enjoy anything The Wyatt's do. Their style does not jive with me in anyway and I cannot become emotionally attached to anything they're involved in. So I pretty much skip that stuff.

My argument sprouted up from my question regarding the love and adoration for someone like Dean Ambrose when put up against Reigns and Co. To which you responded with an argument regarding Cena's bookings.

So you're incorrect in your summation that I only care about people wrestling. I care about entertainment and I dont understand what's entertaining about Ambrose.

 

[Chopper]

This quote from Stroud's Best and Worst is distressingly on-the-nose:

As it stands, it’s Triple H threatening to bomb his fourth WrestleMania main-event — the sh*tty fourway in 2000, the overshadowed match with Jericho and the pile of vomit with Orton — and Reigns not having a Seth Rollins Money in the Bank out to survive 100,000 people booing him. What’s even the point, you know? Roman already got his big win and his coronation a few months ago. It’s not like this is the end of a big story. It’s his fourth title shot and third title reign since November. Woo?

And that's really why last night pissed me off. Once again, the most predictable possible scenario, which will climax into a wet, embarassing fart. That is not what mania should be about.

 

[HazySaiyan]

Finally got around to watching it:

How can they be so fucking tone deaf?

 

[giancarlo123x]

What are the odds we all get swerved and triple h retains? Gives a reason for Rollins to go against him and take his title back.

 

[Angry Grimace]

I think the worst thing about the show was the pre-main event half-hour or so. The whole thing was just hot garbage from start to finish.

Like, who didn't cringe when Sheamus walked out there?

 

[UberTag]

Oh I understand, but it just...it's kind of dumb. I think what would be AMAZING is to have someone like Darren Young just turn heel and not be a Fandango or a Goldust but the calculated villain with an air of sexual ambiguity (think Disney/Bond villains) you see in the movies. THAT would be a compelling use of homosexuality to tell a story. Instead we're getting the comedic depth of a YouTube short produced by high schoolers. Paired with Cena/Style's history, it just seems kind of gross. I shouldn't let it get under my skin but there's NO F-ING POINT to the Truth/Goldust storyline. Like, are they trying to add depth to the tag division? Are they trying to put the aging Truth over? I just can't figure out why the writers put it in other than to have a gay-joke-of-the-week. Whatever, my two cents.

The point is to make Vince laugh.
There is no other point.

If it makes Vince laugh, it's a successful segment.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

The WWE is listening. They're listening to the fact that no matter what they do, the smarks will pay hundreds of dollars to boo somebody.

Absolutely correct.

 

[ngower]

The point is to make Vince laugh.
There is no other point.

If it makes Vince laugh, it's a successful segment.

Speaking of Young, where the hell is he? Is he even wrassling on Superstars/Main Event?

 

[excelsiorlef]

Whoa you guys are demanding lol

I loved fastlane XD
Ambrose "against" Reigns against Lesnar was so hilarious!

AJ Styles vs Jericho was really nice, just didn't understand why the Styles-Clash was not enough.

Ziggi and Bella losing was a given somehow. Poor Ziggi, i like him.

The match wyatts against the fatties was abysmal tho, want dem wyatts to finally win some matches again.

New Day still rocks, funniest guys alive. Edge+Christian are fun.

All in all one of the best PPV i ever saw.
Maybe i'm just too easy to entertain :/

Spoiler

Actually like Roman Reigns

You're free to like it but to rank it as among the best you've ever seen makes me think you've only watched December to Dismember and some of WCWs worst work

 

[HazySaiyan]

The point is to make Vince laugh.
There is no other point.

If it makes Vince laugh, it's a successful segment.

And Vince has the sense of humour of a four year old which makes it even better

Spoiler

/s

 

[klonere]

The WWE is listening. They're listening to the fact that no matter what they do, the smarks will pay hundreds of dollars to boo somebody.

Yup, Nailed it. Many people in WrassleGAF had Mania plans well before tickets went on sale or a card was known. They are the only game in town so they can do what they want and have shown people will pay more and more to see what that "whatever" is.

 

[UberTag]

Cena's history is a graveyard of people who haven't been the same since Cena won their feud:

Barrett, Wyatt, Rusev
Sandow to a lesser extent.
Not to mention he derailed Zack Ryder.

I can't think of a guy he truly elevated.

Edge... although that was a mutual elevation due to their long-term multi-year feud where Edge kept finding ways to work his ultimate opportunist gimmick to screw Cena over.

That's about it, though.

 

[StylesClash]

So I just watched Fastlane and I wish that Styles and Jericho could have had a cleaner match.

And fuck Roman.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

So I just watched Fastlane and I wish that Styles and Jericho could have had a cleaner match.

And fuck Roman.

Roman's pretty great, that main event was a lot of fun. I too wish Styles and Jericho had been better.

 

[Ziltoidia 9]

I call the League of Nations the country you go to when you hit the cena ceiling.

 

[jmdajr]

I call the League of Nations the country you go to when you hit the cena ceiling.

lol

Fucking Rusev man.

 

[radioactivez0r]

I'm still kinda pissed about how clumsy Ryback is in the ring. He couldn't have taken a few more seconds to make sure he didn't fuck up Harper's shoulder.

He usually hooks the neck of his opponent so they fall straight on their back; he didn't do that this time (adrenaline? excitement? who knows) and the result is Harper dropping awkwardly on his shoulder.

Question for those who have been watching much more (read: any Raw/Smackdown) than I have - does Charlotte always sound like she is talking to a deaf person and thinks she has to speak slower? Her promo on Brie was so....very....spaced....out.

 

[UberTag]

Fucking Rusev man.

Rusev was the legit funniest man in the ring during that comedy segment with 9 guys last night and he was the only one who got no lines to deliver during it.

Question for those who have been watching much more (read: any Raw/Smackdown) than I have - does Charlotte always sound like she is talking to a deaf person and thinks she has to speak slower? Her promo on Brie was so....very....spaced....out.

That's how she cuts her heel promos. She talks to her opponent like they're a 6-year-old special needs child.
This is still an improvement over how she cuts her face promos.

 

[The Silver]

it's possible to still have wrassinmaniac star end in cheers, just make it all about Vince and Rock. Main event is a bunch of shenanigans and Roman ends up overshadowed by Rock who takes out Vince, Roman is out in he corner almost off camera posing and shit but everyone's really cheering for Rock.

Now with this WWE can edit the footage so they can show Roman posing with a bunch of cheers and act like it was all for him.

Now this isn't full proof so for 100% certainty have Stone Cold come out and stun someone.

 

[Angry Grimace]

Adding Vince, Shawn Michaels or the Rock to the main event of Mania is actually a waste of appearances by those guys. The Rock trying to rub his pheromones all over Roman does not and never has worked.

Roman's not even fucking related to the Rock and as far as I know, does not actually know him outside kayfabe.

 

[The Silver]

Adding Vince, Shawn Michaels or the Rock to the main event of Mania is actually a waste of appearances by those guys. The Rock trying to rub his pheromones all over Roman does not and never has worked.

Roman's not even fucking related to the Rock and as far as I know, does not actually know him outside kayfabe.

Royal Rumble was extreme circumstances, god himself wouldn't have been able to get Roman over that night.

Vince already successfully got Roman over in Philly, if there is any possibility of mania ending in cheers it's with Vince and Rock

 

[Kuroyume]

I feel like Reigns being over in Philly had more to do with an unexpected title change on a Raw moreso than him winning it.

 

[Sweeney Tom]

What are the odds we all get swerved and triple h retains? Gives a reason for Rollins to go against him and take his title back.

If your best case scenario is HHH still holding a belt and relying on the champ who started the shit ratings cycle to come back and play hero, you'd be better off just admitting every possible outcome sucks

 

[ramoisdead]

I feel like Reigns being over in Philly had more to do with an unexpected title change on a Raw moreso than him winning it.

Plus look who had it before him. I would cheer even Reigns if it meant Sheamus wasn't champion.

 

[s_mirage]

I think the worst thing about the show was the pre-main event half-hour or so. The whole thing was just hot garbage from start to finish.

Like, who didn't cringe when Sheamus walked out there?

That part was so awesome that I actually fell asleep and ended up missing most of the main event.

 

[Ferulci]

Wake me up when Seth Rollins is back.
I dont have anything against Roman Reigns or Ambrose or Cena (even though I like some characters more than others) but am I the only one to see a problem when you're able to predict what will happen in Wrestlemania from 3 to 6 months before it actually happen ?
Roman Reigns Wrestlemania moment is the most predictable thing in the whole television and I dont see how that's a good thing.
For a good feud/storyline, wrestling is important but suspense as well. My most favorite matches (Punk vs Cena mitb/Bryan vs Wyatts/Cena vs Brock) were good not only because of what happens in the ring, but also because you dont know what will be the outcome or how huge the stakes are. We all know Roman is the golden boy, that nothing will change this and he will always be put over. If he had a good character arc, people would love him.

 

[blackaroni]

I feel like Reigns being over in Philly had more to do with an unexpected title change on a Raw moreso than him winning it.

Dude got a "You deserve it" chant...I think it was about him.

It was a great moment too.

 

[Sephzilla]

I feel like Reigns being over in Philly had more to do with an unexpected title change on a Raw moreso than him winning it.

Dude got a "You deserve it" chant...I think it was about him.

It was a great moment too.

He got that chant because WWE managed to actually have competent booking for a few weeks in a row.

 

[The Silver]

Predicatability isn't the core issue, the minute Daniel Bryan's match against HHH at mania was announced it was 150% obvious he would be winning and then go on win the title. No one cared how obvious it was because they were invested in the story, that's the issue here with Roman, no one is truly invested in him.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Whoa you guys are demanding lol

I loved fastlane XD
Ambrose "against" Reigns against Lesnar was so hilarious!

AJ Styles vs Jericho was really nice, just didn't understand why the Styles-Clash was not enough.

Ziggi and Bella losing was a given somehow. Poor Ziggi, i like him.

The match wyatts against the fatties was abysmal tho, want dem wyatts to finally win some matches again.

New Day still rocks, funniest guys alive. Edge+Christian are fun.

All in all one of the best PPV i ever saw.
Maybe i'm just too easy to entertain :/

Spoiler

Actually like Roman Reigns

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Predicatability isn't the core issue, the minute Daniel Bryan's match against HHH at mania was announced it was 150% obvious he would be winning and then go on win the title. No one cared how obvious it was because they were invested in the story, that's the issue here with Roman, no one is truly invested in him.

Yep, Roman's not the problem. He's atrociously miscast.

He's a super good-looking, strong, ripped, and charismatic guy from a legendary pro wrestling family. He has everything. And we're supposed to think this guy is an underdog?

It's the same wacky bullshit that makes everyone hate Cena. They put these guys into baffling roles that don't make any sense. We just want them to be cast in a part that makes sense and that plays along with what the fans feel. Instead it's a non-sensical, tone-deaf character again.

 

[Sephzilla]

Yep, Roman's not the problem. He's atrociously miscast.

He's a super good-looking, strong, ripped, and charismatic guy from a legendary pro wrestling family. He has everything. And we're supposed to think this guy is an underdog?

It's the same wacky bullshit that makes everyone hate Cena. They put these guys into baffling roles that don't make any sense. We just want them to be cast in a part that makes sense and that plays along with what the fans feel. Instead it's a non-sensical, tone-deaf character again.

And he's a 2 time WWE Champion

 

[Entropia]

- WWE stock jumped today as it was up 6.58%, closing at $16.36 per share. Today's high was $16.64 and the low was $15.44.

Reigns not only a TV draw but a stock draw!!

 

[Gumbie]

All in all one of the best PPV i ever saw.

 

[kirblar]

Yep, Roman's not the problem. He's atrociously miscast.

He's a super good-looking, strong, ripped, and charismatic guy from a legendary pro wrestling family. He has everything. And we're supposed to think this guy is an underdog?

It's the same wacky bullshit that makes everyone hate Cena. They put these guys into baffling roles that don't make any sense. We just want them to be cast in a part that makes sense and that plays along with what the fans feel. Instead it's a non-sensical, tone-deaf character again.

People don't understand how to write/book Superman in the modern era, because people like Batman better.

 

[blackaroni]

Reigns not only a TV draw but a stock draw!!

 

[Ithil]

Yep, Roman's not the problem. He's atrociously miscast.

He's a super good-looking, strong, ripped, and charismatic guy from a legendary pro wrestling family. He has everything. And we're supposed to think this guy is an underdog?

It's the same wacky bullshit that makes everyone hate Cena. They put these guys into baffling roles that don't make any sense. We just want them to be cast in a part that makes sense and that plays along with what the fans feel. Instead it's a non-sensical, tone-deaf character again.

Where?

 

[truly101]

They should have followed the Diesel/Shawn Michaels story and made him Seth's enforcer for a year or so.

Yep. Its easy, and a lot of guys are better able to find themselves as heels than faces. I think that would help Reigns tremendously.

 

[kiguel182]

Yeah, and he's had an seven year career with WWE culminating with his in-ring retirement in Seattle (which I was at, BTW) and the entire roster applauding him.

He won multiple championships and was in some fun story-lines.

One could argue it could've come sooner but I assume these things are often a culimnation of skill, motivation, timing, health and fortitude.

I remember during his run from '14-'15 and the fans being so butt-hurt that Vince and Co. weren't listening to them. "Why wont they give Daniel a chance?"

It's fucking great booking in my opinion. The authority gets great heat and builds it up over time as the major heel. The face gets more and more support. Then it explodes at the biggest event in the calendar and the fans get the result they want in the best way possible.

What's not to like about that?

Are we pretending Mania 30 was planned all along? Because it wasn't. Batista was winning the title against Orton.