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[vaibhavpisal]

Lol, i find it funny you want a story about “choice and consequence” but not really.

I want choice AND consequence. With this sort of design, it doesn’t give me much of a choice. I don’t know what I am buying into unless I have gone through with it.

There are plenty of games where this is handled well. Recently played through Wasteland 3. There too a companion quest is tied to main story. But game is well written and explains everything beforehand. Your choices dont block out other companions.

 

[Raven117]

I want choice AND consequence. With this sort of design, it doesn’t give me much of a choice. I don’t know what I am buying into unless I have gone through with it.

There are plenty of games where this is handled well. Recently played through Wasteland 3. There too a companion quest is tied to main story. But game is well written and explains everything beforehand. Your choices dont block out other companions.

Then you don't really want choice and consequence. Just the illusion of it.

Its a campaign, make the choice and roll with it. If you are truly roleplaying, then, yes, some party members may leave. That just makes sense.

I fought this mentality for awhile as well...looking up guides...all that...then, I realized...i had more fun when I just went with it. Its how these things are designed.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

And then there's the player problem: most players don't want to play a game twice, which just justifies the notions held by aforementioned producers.

I think this is wrong. Everyone wants to play a game twice. They don't because the math of it being fun just isn't there.

 

[SHA]

You sound like a physical npc, your words mean business, I don't like that attitude, I prefer being part of the plot, not playing God.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Then you don't really want choice and consequence. Just the illusion of it.

Its a campaign, make the choice and roll with it. If you are truly roleplaying, then, yes, some party members may leave. That just makes sense.

I fought this mentality for awhile as well...looking up guides...all that...then, I realized...i had more fun when I just went with it. Its how these things are designed.

What gives you the idea I read guides online?

If you have finished BG3, enlighten me how choosing between finish Kalrach quest or Lazael quest, which one to finish is a good thing?

 

[Raven117]

What gives you the idea I read guides online?

If you have finished BG3, enlighten me how choosing between finish Kalrach quest or Lazael quest, which one to finish is a good thing?

I said I did. Didn't say you did. And I have.

I finished both of those, no one left the party. Both completed, and both had good endings in my view.

Dude, just say you don't actually want consequence and choice. You only want the illusion of it.

If you are straight up roleplaying (Say a good guy), then yeah, your actions and choices are going to affect how the evil characters react to you, if not leave. It makes sense. Sometimes, you don't know how it will all play out.

Its your complaint on why we got games more like Skyrim (love it, but its not choice and consequence), and less like Ultima and BG3. Everyone wants everything all the time.

 

[Fahdis]

OP the only consequence we have is playing these games isn't it?

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I said I did. Didn't say you did. And I have.

I finished both of those, no one left the party. Both completed, and both had good endings in my view.

Dude, just say you don't actually want consequence and choice. You only want the illusion of it.

If you are straight up roleplaying (Say a good guy), then yeah, your actions and choices are going to affect how the evil characters react to you, if not leave. It makes sense. Sometimes, you don't know how it will all play out.

Its your complaint on why we got games more like Skyrim (love it, but its not choice and consequence), and less like Ultima and BG3. Everyone wants everything all the time.

Let me finish the game. If I am able to finish all companion quests I will be fine with it.

I role play and I don’t care if someone leaves due to ideological reasons.

Currently my objective for Lazael quest takes me straight to one of the endings apparently. Maybe it does not?

 

[Raven117]

Let me finish the game. If I am able to finish all companion quests I will be fine with it.

I role play and I don’t care if someone leaves due to ideological reasons.

Currently my objective for Lazael quest takes me straight to one of the endings apparently. Maybe it does not?

Don't know. The choices I made let me finish both. Maybe others don't. I didn't get to play other companions quests. Hell, I didn't even find them all.

Choices and consequences. They actually have to mean something to be real. Losing a companion makes you actually feel the consequences. That's the point. To pull up lame on that is to not really have choices and consequences at all.

I have my issues with BG3, but this isn't one of them.

 

[Clear]

First mistake is thinking that all consequences are desirable. They aren't, or at least aren't "fun", or meaningful.

As a designer/writer/whatever why would you want that for your audience?

The plain truth is that gamers will BLAME you, not THANK you for allowing them to fuck themselves over.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

Don't know. The choices I made let me finish both. Maybe others don't. I didn't get to play other companions quests. Hell, I didn't even find them all.

Choices and consequences. They actually have to mean something to be real. Losing a companion makes you actually feel the consequences. That's the point. To pull up lame on that is to not really have choices and consequences at all.

I have my issues with BG3, but this isn't one of them.

Agree to disagree here.

I would like to see more choices and options, in say how you deal with goblin camp in act 1. Maybe some infighting?

And act 2 while awesome, is devoid of any choices. Some options regarding shadow curse would be awesome.

But would prefer companions left alone.

 

[Hudo]

The only real consequence I experienced was when I realized that video games betrayed me: Girls in real life generally don't actually like when you go for the harem route.

 

[Raven117]

Agree to disagree here.

I would like to see more choices and options, in say how you deal with goblin camp in act 1. Maybe some infighting?

And act 2 while awesome, is devoid of any choices. Some options regarding shadow curse would be awesome.

But would prefer companions left alone.

I don't disagree, but sorry you don't want actual consequences due to actual roleplaying. You see the disconnect, yes? And thats fine, if that is what you want. So long as you recognize that it is an inconsistent position (again, which is fine).

 

[tr1p1ex]

Can I get a TLDR please?

there is no real consquential choice in games. IT's an illusion. Developers shouldn't claim otherwise

 

[tr1p1ex]

It's tough enough to make a great game. The odds of having a great game that also has 20-100x the content to deliver on this choice thing while also keeping up the quality are zero.

There's a reason choose your own adventure books peak in middle school or earlier.

On top of it, way too many players would complain they are missing content when they play a game. They don't get to play the cool stuff.

And that's part of another problem with the current limited 'choice' we do have in games. As a player I don't know which of the choices you're asking me to make is the most fun. Whereas I feel the developer often has a good idea which is the more fun route. I'm there to have fun most of all.

It's trial and error to see what feels the most fun or works the best.

 

[Nickolaidas]

As a player I don't know which of the choices you're asking me to make is the most fun.

Personally, in a game where I am supposed to have agency, the most fun I'd have would be to actually see my character being able to shape events the way I wanted them to be shaped.

 

[tr1p1ex]

Personally, in a game where I am supposed to have agency, the most fun I'd have would be to actually see my character being able to shape events the way I wanted them to be shaped.

that's easy to do. if you don't care about anything else.

 

[Trogdor1123]

Honestly, this is one of the things that will really benefit from ai. Once a story writer creates a few branching paths, the ai will be able to fill in the gaps

 

[Nickolaidas]

that's easy to do.

Really? Because last time I checked, I can't become High King of Skyrim, or ally myself with Alduin, or or or.

 

[GigaBowser]

GIGGeST lie??

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I don't disagree, but sorry you don't want actual consequences due to actual roleplaying. You see the disconnect, yes? And thats fine, if that is what you want. So long as you recognize that it is an inconsistent position (again, which is fine).

Either you dont know what choice and consequences are. And thats fine.

Or you haven’t played the game and are simply trolling (again, which is fine).

 

[Nickolaidas]

GIGGeST lie??

The gake is a lie.

 

[Guilty_AI]

Really? Because last time I checked, I can't become High King of Skyrim, or ally myself with Alduin, or or or.

What he likely means is that you can have a game where everything you do has consequences if you throw out any notion of storytelling and curated content out of the window.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

Tldr go play Alpha protocol.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

I think this is wrong. Everyone wants to play a game twice. They don't because the math of it being fun just isn't there.

I disagree thanks to achievements/trophies we have the completion rates.

Much respect to developers for creating content that barely anyone even plays.

 

[clarky]

Every time i open gaff i just see:

GIGA CHAD.

Its been doing my head in all week.

But nice OP.

 

[IAmRei]

this game, open world 2D in GBA, translated ROM and using emulator anyway
has lot of decisions:
- you lack 3 second to visit certain NPC in first 30 minutes? -> You dont get x character
- you fight the boss and lost? -> you continue story with different story
- you forgot to give npc antidote? -> npc brother is dying
- you choose female other than male as your MC? -> different starting place + different intro story
- and many more

almost all decision are not only choosing x decision, but also based on time, action, or output battle. the game story also simple yet awesome at the time.

 

[Bernoulli]

this is one thing that only AI can do and every player will have it's own story based on the choices

 

[Raven117]

Either you dont know what choice and consequences are. And thats fine.

Or you haven’t played the game and are simply trolling (again, which is fine).

Clearly you don’t understand what choice and consequence means. This will be my last post responding to you as I can’t be bothered any longer speaking to someone who doesn’t have a fundamental understanding of concepts, reading comprehension, potential troll, or otherwise so dull, they can’t realize they are spectacularly dimwitted.

Good luck out there. You are going to need it

 

[Evil Calvin]

WTF is 'giggest' ????

 

[Evil Calvin]

I got as far as "When I was a young boy"............................................

 

[Nickolaidas]

I got as far as "When I was a young boy"............................................

Bet you were sleeping in class all the time when you were at school.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I disagree thanks to achievements/trophies we have the completion rates.

Much respect to developers for creating content that barely anyone even plays.

Two entirely separate issues.

Just because some games aren't built to be fun after a certain point doesn't mean players don't want them to be fun after a certain point.

 

[tr1p1ex]

Really? Because last time I checked, I can't become High King of Skyrim, or ally myself with Alduin, or or or.

yep if that's all you care about. if that's the fun for you then yes.

go back to 2d sprites and text dialog etc and put most of the budget into working on all the various paths one could take.

Better yet go back to the 2d top down Ultima RPG days. You can develop alot more content aka choice when you can create art/dialog assets much more quickly and cheaply.

IT's all the more easier if you just care about having a choice not whether the choices are fun or not.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

Two entirely separate issues.

Just because some games aren't built to be fun after a certain point doesn't mean players don't want them to be fun after a certain point.

Well then clearly most games, including the most critically acclaimed titles, aren't fun.