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[Mr Reasonable]

Can we quit it with the Marx-larping here?

Sorry, but definitely not.

Also: Lols all around at the idea that it's Marxism to suggest that a business needs to pay it's staff enough money to live, even if it means the C-suite has to take a paycut.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

I think in a vaccum, this is great news, but the reality is it will drive costs up further, fast-track automation, reduce hours for those workers, etc. - especially in a poorly managed state like California.

To some extent, if it needs to happen, you can't stop it. You can't just create an underclass of people who end up homeless and then say that it has to be done or ...they end up homeless as a result of wage stagnation on and rising costs.

 

[Chaplain]

You can't just create an underclass of people who end up homeless and then say that it has to be done or ...they end up homeless as a result of wage stagnation on and rising costs.

This underclass is what is being created:

In the 19th century the Industrial Revolution created a huge urban proletariat, and socialism spread because no other creed managed to answer the unprecedented needs, hopes and fears of this new working class. Liberalism eventually defeated socialism only by adopting the best parts of the socialist program. In the 21st century we might witness the creation of a massive new unworking class: people devoid of any economic, political or even artistic value, who contribute nothing to the prosperity, power and glory of society. This “useless class” will not merely be unemployed — it will be unemployable. (Source)

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Depends on where you live. 50,000 is more than enough to live off of. I was making 19,000 in grad school just before covid and I was still able to live/function. It all just depends on where you are in the US. If you want to live in San Fran? Well you see shit out of luck. Kansas? You will be more than fine.

Usually any thread or internet article you see about high prices skews to metro areas. That’s where you’ll get the biggest roller coaster ride of high and low paying jobs while the general real estate prices are high.

What they never do is talk about how if you live in a low cost province or state or drive an hour or two away from the metro hub you can get a place for probably half price or less. Are the jobs crappier and lower paying? Probably. But the wages to cost of living ratio will increase a lot.

It’s like when I chatted long time ago with an old coworker working in fucking Regina! My condo I was living it at the time I bought for $320k. His detached house with a two car garage and yard he said he bought for $180k. He thought he hit the lottery because he said it’s now worth $250k. I told him dude…. Last year my condo was over $300k. And he was like…. Whoa!

And he made more money than me to boot.

All comes down if someone need to be in a high priced metro area or not. He and his fam didn’t care. He loved small town living and outdoorsy stuff. But if someone loves downtown life and big city head office jobs, fancy restaurants, pro sports and broadway theatre stuff then ya. Pay up because a lot of people like that too.

I think a lot of people assume if you live in a small town or place with low costs of living it means you get paid dirt shit. And that only the metro area head office kind of people make good money. Not true. I will say that in my experience that companies will pay you less if you live in small town USA or Canada, but it’s not like it will be linear. If a job pays $100,00 in Toronto and the cost of living is double a small town, that guy over there isn’t going to get gimped to $50,000. He’ll probably still get $80,000. The affordability improves a lot typically the farther away you get from the core or metro area.

 

[Mistake]

Sorry, but definitely not.

Also: Lols all around at the idea that it's Marism to suggest that a business needs to pay it's staff enough money to live, even if it means the C-suite has to take a paycut.

Well, to be honest, people are kind of doing this to themselves. If we stopped buying as much stuff, then things might turn around.

 

[Puscifer]

Crazy. That’s the equivalent of $27/hr cdn to flip burgers.

I hope all you Californians know as wages go up so do prices.

But there is hope to keep prices down. It goes like this:

McDonald’s: Hello, I’d like to place an order.

Sales guy: According to our systems your restaurants have an average of one self serve screens per store.

McDonald’s: Yes. I’d like to make it 4 self serve double sided screens per store please

Sales guys: Thank for the order!

FWIW chick fil a and inn and out we're paying 20/17 respectively for the past several years, and CFA has benefits packages that are better than some six figure jobs, so McDonald's, Taco Bell, etc should all be able to do the same without much issue. The prices didn't increase till the inflation started hitting near the end of COVID

 

[Mr Reasonable]

Well, to be honest, people are kind of doing this to themselves. If we stopped buying as much stuff, then things might turn around.

Agree that consumerism is absolutely fucking everything to what is likely the point of no return.

 

[Mikado]

What's weird to me, is that of all minimum wage jobs, I thought fast food was never intended be a "hurr-durr mah livin' wage" thing?

It was literally for kids, who don't need money to pay for any necessities, and who live at home with their parents, to get a tiny bit of Real World experience with an infinitesimal amount of accountability and responsibility, while also making a couple of bucks to spend on videogame * s. Then they graduate junior high school or w/e and go get a Real Job.

On the plus side - since this will inevitably raise prices across the board - this could be the 5-Dimensional Chess move required to encourage people to stop buying shit fast food that's making them fat and sick.

* And yes ofc, for McDonald's Corporation to save a bunch of money but that's beside the point - it was a cheap wage because it was not-very-difficult, limited time work with no real need to retain "trained" employees.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Agree that consumerism is absolutely fucking everything to what is likely the point of no return.

Good luck with going against that mantra.

You’d think credit cards charging 20% interest would be enough to scare anyone to not buy too much shit on debt as it’ll be forever interest payments into the toilet forever. It worked on me even since I got my first credit card in the 90s. Always paid on time (except for a few times I forgot to pay…. (When there wasn’t automated payments yet).

All that shit like being able to overdraw a bank account, payday loan stores, high credit card fees etc… are a suckers game.

If that doesn’t scare off people nothing will.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

On the plus side - since this will inevitably raise prices across the board - this could be the 5-Dimensional Chess move required to encourage people to stop buying shit fast food that's making them fat and sick.

* And yes ofc, for McDonald's Corporation to save a bunch of money but that's beside the point - it was a cheap wage because it was not-very-difficult, limited time work with no real need to retain "trained" employees.

I'm not sure it would. McDonald's will be priced to serve their market - if they could make more money selling Big Macs for 10 times the price, they probably would.

So, if they raise the prices it won't be enough to put people off.

But, if we look at the big picture, the breakdown of what your burger costs - the rent, the tax, the ingredients, etc. as well as the worker's wage, then take into account the number of burgers sold in an average shift.

I'm pretty sure that if McDonald's couldn't swallow this cost with approximately zero harm done to their business, then nobody would be applying to be a franchisee - they'd be going out of business every time the ice cream machine broke down.

But, if it means that there are fewer McDonald's restaurants out there, then I won't mourn their loss anyway.

 

[thefool]

>here's the new colleague I was telling you about

 

[Kamina]

Thats like what? 3k/month?
What’s the average?

 

[dem]

McDonalds are super depressing now..
Its like a food kiosk.

Remember when kids used to have birthday party's at McDonalds?



But on the subject of wage... it really goes to show how completely thunderfucked the Canadian worker is getting these days. Fast food workers on the other side of the border getting the equivalent of $27 CAD. And the cost of living in Canada is out of control to boot.

 

[Mikado]

>here's the new colleague I was telling you about

Don't have sex with your co-workers is finally going to become relevant advice.

 

[KimDongHwan]

classic market manipulation with the "best of intentions"

 

[SoloCamo]

Depends on where you live. 50,000 is more than enough to live off of. I was making 19,000 in grad school just before covid and I was still able to live/function. It all just depends on where you are in the US. If you want to live in San Fran? Well you see shit out of luck. Kansas? You will be more than fine.

Where in this country could you live off 19k a year in 2019?

"The median monthly gross residential rent in Kansas was $862 in 2019 according to the Census ACS survey. Average gross rent was $880 in 2019."

and now

"As of March 2024, the average rent in Kansas City, MO is $1,126 per month. This is 25% lower than the national average rent of $1,499/month," Sure it was cheaper back then but I just don't see how that's feasible unless you walk to work and only eat rice.

 

[Outlier]

If people want more, they should pay more.
Maybe if so many people didn't live in such a place, it wouldn't be so bad.
Similar has been happening here in Austin, Tx. It's becoming more like California.

 

[jason10mm]

What's weird to me, is that of all minimum wage jobs, I thought fast food was never intended be a "hurr-durr mah livin' wage" thing?

It was literally for kids, who don't need money to pay for any necessities, and who live at home with their parents, to get a tiny bit of Real World experience with an infinitesimal amount of accountability and responsibility, while also making a couple of bucks to spend on videogame * s. Then they graduate junior high school or w/e and go get a Real Job.

VERY much this. Damn near every teenager started out at fast food or basic service jobs that paid squat but were good for learning some essential responsibility and customer service skills, as well as a good dose of humility. The only folks making a decent wage were the managers riding herd on the kids. Somehow that basic "Zero-skill" job turned into a lifestyle, probably because the factories that would have taken those kids on as they became adults were boarded up and shipped overseas.

There is NO WAY these types of jobs are EVER gonna support an adult with a family.

So now what do kids do? All the basic jobs pay too much and can get adults. Kids just stay in school forever until they can jump fast food/retail/service jobs entirely or they nope out of the whole thing and go straight to OF or the gig economy.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

VERY much this. Damn near every teenager started out at fast food or basic service jobs that paid squat but were good for learning some essential responsibility and customer service skills, as well as a good dose of humility. The only folks making a decent wage were the managers riding herd on the kids. Somehow that basic "Zero-skill" job turned into a lifestyle, probably because the factories that would have taken those kids on as they became adults were boarded up and shipped overseas.

There is NO WAY these types of jobs are EVER gonna support an adult with a family.

So now what do kids do? All the basic jobs pay too much and can get adults. Kids just stay in school forever until they can jump fast food/retail/service jobs entirely or they nope out of the whole thing and go straight to OF or the gig economy.

Even lower than fast food scrub. The traditional 11 year old paperboy. Lol

That’s probably the lowest youngest job you can get without it being an overseas child labour job.

Are people saying a paperboy should get paid $20/hr too? Lol

People are just lazy. And they expect good pay, job security, or government bail outs. In a nut shell. Adult supervised babysitting of fellow adults.

You don’t even have to be Einstein to get a decent job that pays decent. The receivables and payables clerks and junior analysts at my company probably get paid $70,000 each. Maybe even more. Good people, they seem to do a good job, but trust me. They aren’t exactly Mensa graduates here. If they can pull off low level office work making $70,000 anyone can. They aren’t even the most personable people either as sometimes they get pissy fast. We’ll they still got hired and have a job.

Going a step further that’s why pension deductions are done as per babysitting. To scrape up money and give it back to workers when they are 65 because they know the avg numbnut will blow his money when it’s time to retire and nobody wants to hire them anymore.

So in essence, similar to parents forcing their kids to use a piggy bank so Timmy Jr. can accumulate $50 over time, the gov does this to Timmy Sr. So he can have $5000 later in life. Both scenarios are babysitting people’s money.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

Kids just stay in school forever until they can jump fast food/retail/service jobs entirely or they nope out of the whole thing and go straight to OF

Obviously once OF starts employing AI, that gig is up too.

 

[Eiknarf]

If people want more, they should pay more.
Maybe if so many people didn't live in such a place, it wouldn't be so bad.
Similar has been happening here in Austin, Tx. It's becoming more like California.

Of course
Because the Dems goal is to flip Texas to blue

 

[Faust]

Where in this country could you live off 19k a year in 2019?

"The median monthly gross residential rent in Kansas was $862 in 2019 according to the Census ACS survey. Average gross rent was $880 in 2019."

and now

"As of March 2024, the average rent in Kansas City, MO is $1,126 per month. This is 25% lower than the national average rent of $1,499/month," Sure it was cheaper back then but I just don't see how that's feasible unless you walk to work and only eat rice.

Averages include overpriced housing and often doesn’t take into account applied low income housing. Say that 80% of your towns housing is 650 USD a month, but 10% are 1250, and 10 more percent is 1500+? That will readily skew results to making the “average” far higher than it actually is.

Not going to dox myself, but the average rent was around 1200 according to statistics, but the majority of places are 600-900 a month. Plenty to live off of if you live semi-frugally.

 

[0neAnd0nly]

I get its not a "hard" job, but half of you wouldn't want to do these jobs. Nobody should have to work 2 full time jobs to support a family. This should not impact any of the massive food franchises in anyway other than if they want to stay greedy

On paper, it’s cute for sure.

But IRL, let’s look top down, shall we?

Let’s say CEO of big company, who btw - probably has a pretty stressful job, but regardless - homeboy makes 7 Mill. A year. (He’s the tip of the umbrella)

His next down make 1 Mill. (The small portion holding the tip up on an umbrella)

Their next down make ~400k. (Top 1/3 of the umbrella)

Their next down make 100K. (Middle part of umbrella)

And finally, their entry workers make ~ 40k. (Largest part of the umbrella, widest coverage by far)

So now, states and “feel good vibes” increase the minimum super high.

So you think, CEO of said company will voluntarily be like “meh, I don’t need to make 7 Mill a year, I can just make 1 Mill instead!”

Nah. Not gonna happen.

It will pass on to consumer, prices will go higher, money will print and the increase in minimum wage =/= no real gain. What it will affect is everyone who is lower-mid - middle class, because there jobs will not do the same percentage increase if they get an increase at all. A nurse doing 25/ Hour, isn’t suddenly going to get the same 33% increase in wage, that would mean they would now get ~36ish an hour. Nope, never going to happen. So all we do is close the gap between poor and middle class by bringing the middle class down, not the minimum up.

It’s a dumb economic move, period. So easy to poke holes in, a middle schooler could see it.

And this isn’t a personal diss on you at all, please don’t take it as such. I get your thinking which is just “don’t be greedy”. But the people at t he top, many times worked hard to get there, and are now accustomed to that lifestyle and money for their family. Do you think they would voluntarily rip that away? We would be talking losing millions for a company like McD, which has THOUSANDS of locations, hundreds of thousands of employees. Nah,

 

[Krappadizzle]

My wife isn't thrilled with this. Her pay didn't go up comparatively so her same work that she does in California is now worth less.

 

[Eiknarf]

My wife isn't thrilled with this. Her pay didn't go up comparatively so her same work that she does in California is now worth less.

That’s what I’m hearing, too
You got pharmacy technicians making $16 to $19 an hour in California, while someone putting salt on your fries is getting $20.

 

[*Nightwing]

 

[Synless]

I get its not a "hard" job, but half of you wouldn't want to do these jobs. Nobody should have to work 2 full time jobs to support a family. This should not impact any of the massive food franchises in anyway other than if they want to stay greedy

Alternatively, no one should be trying to make a living off two part time jobs but instead working a career not in those sectors. These jobs should be entry for young people 14-18 at the most.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Alternatively, no one should be trying to make a living off two part time jobs but instead working a career not in those sectors. These jobs should be entry for young people 14-18 at the most.

Exactly.

Problem is people assume every job has to be a high paying career job. Nobody in life has ever said low skilled food service workers are the kind of job for a career or raise a family. Similar to shopping mall jobs, part time servers and working a concession stand at a theatre or amusement park, these are meant to be jobs for young people looking for experience and want some pocket money. They aren’t designed to be for someone to work there for 40 years at full time 40 hour weeks.

I don’t think anyone classified a paperboy as a career job. I don’t see that low level job any different than making burgers. In fact, the old school grade school kid delivering papers in rain or snow is a lot harder than making fries. Yet nobody says a student doing it should make $15 or $20 per hour. Yet somehow a fry cook deserves it.

 

[Bridges]

This law actually (apparently) doesn't impact Panera Bread because there is an exception that exempts restaurants that serve and bake specific types of bread products, and the wording is such that only Panera Bread qualifies. Gov. Newsom is also apparently friends/former business associate with the largest Panera Bread franchise owner that happens to reside in California. Kinda interesting if true

 

[chonga]

On paper, it’s cute for sure.

But IRL, let’s look too down, shall we?

Let’s say CEO of big company, who btw - probably a pretty stressful job, but regardless - homeboy makes 7 Mill. A year.

His next down make 1 Mill.

Their next down make ~400k.

Their next down make 100K.

And finally, there entry workers make ~ 40k.

So now, states and “feel good vibes” increase the minimum super high.

So you think, CEO of said company will voluntarily be like “meh, I don’t need to make 7 Mill a year, I can just make 1 Mill instead!”

Nah. Not gonna happen.

It will pass on to consumer, prices will go higher, money will print and the increase in minimum wage =/= no real gain. What it will affect is everyone who is lower-mid - middle class, because there jobs will not do the same percentage increase if they get an increase at all. A nurse doing 25/ Hour, isn’t suddenly going to get the same 33% increase in wage, that would mean they would now get ~36ish an hour. Nope, never going to happen. So all we do is close the gap between poor and middle class by bringing the middle class down, not the minimum up.

It’s a dumb economic move, period. So easy to poke holes in, a middle schooler could see it.

And this isn’t a personal diss on you at all, please don’t take it as such. I get your thinking which is just “don’t be greedy”. But the people at t he top, many times worked hard to get there, and are now accustomed to that lifestyle and money for their family. Do you think they would voluntarily rip that away? We would be talking losing millions for a company like McD, which has THOUSANDS of locations, hundreds of thousands of employees. Nah,

Plus we need to remember that top execs do earn a lot, but there's not a lot of them.

So if you're heading up a big massive company with tens of thousands of employees earning low wages, dividing by that many people doesn't go very far. Every $1m of your salary you give up could give 10,000 workers a whopping 5 cents extra an hour assuming they work an 8 hour day.

It is nothing.

 

[Muffdraul]

If you can't afford to both A) pay your workers the salary they deserve and B) stay in business, then you failed at your business and you failed at capitalism. Get a job.

 

[Rival]

Imagine trying to exist in California on $20 an hour.

 

[Red5]

As it should be, the more your citizens earn the more they spend and the smoother the wheels of economy roll.

 

[Trogdor1123]

If you can't afford to both A) pay your workers the salary they deserve and B) stay in business, then you failed at your business and you failed at capitalism. Get a job.

To be clear here, you are saying the people flipping burgers and salting fries deserve $20 an hour?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

If you can't afford to both A) pay your workers the salary they deserve and B) stay in business, then you failed at your business and you failed at capitalism. Get a job.

And what is the definition of deserve?

And besides, the boost in low scrub wages will just help longer term wages for more skilled people. And those people's higher wages can afford price increases. That's why the $15 protest years ago means nothing now as prices amped up. I knew longer term $15 would be a bust. Now they look like idiots begging for more wages because $15 suddenly is no good anymore.

As more low level people get churned, that will eventually lead to more profits for companies which means higher stock prices, higher office worker salaries and bonuses, and of course higher exec pay. Office workers arent going anywhere except in overhired industries like tech. If i was a Mcdonalds office worker, I'd be loving it (no pun intended) as the potential for higher profits and annual bonus there will be. And people at the office will shift to new tasks of analyzing more and more kiosk sales vs cashier sales, finance guys analyzing capital costs of tons more touch screens etc....

 

[Muffdraul]

To be clear here, you are saying the people flipping burgers and salting fries deserve $20 an hour?

I'm being more general than that.

When you look at long term graphs of various corporate/company profits, high level exec compensation, and worker wages/salaries, the real problem is that the people at the top are taking more and more and more than their fair share, pocketing profits that should have gone to worker pay, which flatlined ages ago. In a heathly economy, everything goes up and down proportionally. Not just CEO bonuses.

But yeah, anyone working a full time job probably deserves $20/hr in today's economy. Sounds about right to me. I'm not gonna nitpick about the exact specific duties they have.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

But yeah, anyone working a full time job probably deserves $20/hr in today's economy. Sounds about right to me. I'm not gonna nitpick about the exact specific duties they have.

But the government doesn't agree with you because aside from California fast food worker wages, no US state or Canada province supports $20/hr. The vast majority are somewhere between $10-15/hr.

So if even the government doesn't support higher wages, why should any company force themselves to pay more than they should? As long as they can find minimum wagers who can work the job cooking and wiping tables, that's good enough. And if these short term stinters quit, who cares. There's probably 100 people on list who will do it and be trained fast and do the job.

 

[Muffdraul]

But the government doesn't agree with you because aside from California fast food worker wages, no US state or Canada province supports $20/hr. The vast majority are somewhere between $10-15/hr.

So if even the government doesn't support higher wages, why should any company force themselves to pay more than they should? As long as they can find minimum wagers who can work the job cooking and wiping tables, that's good enough. And if these short term stinters quit, who cares. There's probably 100 people on list who will do it and be trained fast and do the job.

The government, siding with business and screwing over workers/laborers? WHA-WHA-WHAAAAAT?! HOW COULD THAT EVER HAPPEN

 

[jason10mm]

If you can't afford to both A) pay your workers the salary they deserve and B) stay in business, then you failed at your business and you failed at capitalism. Get a job.

"What are the requirements for this job?"

"Well, to show up on time, stay awake, assemble food exactly the way these pictures cards show you, wash your hands after you go to the bathroom, and try not to drool too much in front of the customer"

That's basically the job in fast food. It ain't worth $20/hr and no one should be trying to live off that level of work unless you are barely able to function and it's mostly a social work program.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

"What are the requirements for this job?"

"Well, to show up on time, stay awake, assemble food exactly the way these pictures cards show you, wash your hands after you go to the bathroom, and try not to drool too much in front of the customer"

That's basically the job in fast food. It ain't worth $20/hr and no one should be trying to live off that level of work unless you are barely able to function and it's mostly a social work program.

$20/hr at FT hours is $40,000/yr.

Making burgers, fries and shakes can actually get you $40,000/yr. A job a high schooler can do juggling schoolwork, with zero training and experience, and being half stoned.

If anything, if government is setting wage floors, they should set wage ceilings so that you dont get society dumbing down with people all lining up to flip burgers as a career path. Think of it like getting government unemployment insurance when you're out of a job. There is a limit how much you get and it's dirt cheap even if someone makes a millionaire salaries. The point is you dont make a lot off government assistance so it's a kick in the ass to get back to a better job that pays better like before. If everyone got huge UI payouts, why would anyone be pressured to work? Everyone would just sit back and coast.

 

[Draugoth]

Fun fact: Billionaries pay less taxes than you.

I hear a lot that $20 an hour isnt enough to survive in the US anymore. Companies are forcing people to survive on paycheck after paycheck as modern day slaves

 

[Unknown Soldier]

This underclass is what is being created:

The full transcript of this is an amazing read

Homo Deus: A Brief History of Tomorrow

Soon, humankind may be able to replace natural selection with intelligent design and to create the first inorganic lifeforms, says Yuval Noah Harari. If so, this will be the greatest revolution since life began. But what are the dangers, and are they avoidable?

www.carnegiecouncil.org

 

[Grildon Tundy]

When I read these stories it seems Oxford University's 2013 AI study is coming to pass and the elite are doing nothing to stop it:



I assume most fast food workers will be out of a job within the next 5-years:

Legislation/safeguards like UBI aren't going to be in place for WHEN this tidal shift comes, and it will. My hope is that after an initial period of pain and mass unemployment, governments and corporations will realize that they need people making money to give them money back and that's when we'll get better safety nets.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

In the 19th century the Industrial Revolution created a huge urban proletariat, and socialism spread because no other creed managed to answer the unprecedented needs, hopes and fears of this new working class. Liberalism eventually defeated socialism only by adopting the best parts of the socialist program. In the 21st century we might witness the creation of a massive new unworking class: people devoid of any economic, political or even artistic value, who contribute nothing to the prosperity, power and glory of society. This “useless class” will not merely be unemployed — it will be unemployable. (Source)

The problem is that anyone expecting a rise in people's efforts, skills and interests as technology fixes all the mundane and boring jobs was mistaken.

I think just everyone has thought that if you go from: Totally manual labour --> Industrial revolution with the start of machinery --> High tech modern day which has lots of old stuff (from the left) done for you or made easy by PCs and manufacturing lines that people would evolve and strive for better. People would shrug off all the boring crappy jobs and try to advance better just like the engineers and business guys who started all the manufacturing stuff in factories 200 years ago did.

Some do strive for better, some try and dont have the skills and fail, and some just plainly dont give a shit and try to coast (ie. all the people who voted for Andrew Yang and want $1000/mth UBI and do nothing in life as long as possible).

Historically, if you do bad or are broke, thats youre problem. You live like a pauper. So you had to work and do something or you had nothing. But modern day is tons of social assistance, burger flippers getting $20/hr and basically a coddling/boosting of low skilled and paid people because they cant make it on their own.

Nothing is in a vacuum. So any kind of policy changes like this can either grill companies, customers, government or holistic taxes.

 

[dave_d]

Seeing someone post that AI has a 72% chance of making carpenters lose their job makes me wonder 2 things(I'm guessing they mean a robot with AI)

• Where can I invest?
• How much cheaper can it build the house I want built in the next few years?

(Yeah, I look at it as an opportunity which is the only way to look at these things.)

 

[dave_d]

The problem is that anyone expecting a rise in people's efforts, skills and interests as technology fixes all the mundane and boring jobs was mistaken.

I think just everyone has thought that if you go from: Totally manual labour --> Industrial revolution with the start of machinery --> High tech modern day which has lots of old stuff (from the left) done for you or made easy by PCs and manufacturing lines that people would evolve and strive for better. People would shrug off all the boring crappy jobs and try to advance better just like the engineers and business guys who started all the manufacturing stuff in factories 200 years ago did.

Some do strive for better, some try and dont have the skills and fail, and some just plainly dont give a shit and try to coast (ie. all the people who voted for Andrew Yang and want $1000/mth UBI and do nothing in life as long as possible).

Historically, if you do bad or are broke, thats youre problem. You live like a pauper. But modern day is tons of social assistance, burger flippers getting $20/hr and basically a coddling/boosting of low skilled and paid people because they cant make it on their own.

Nothing is in a vacuum. So any kind of policy changes like this can either grill companies, customers, government or holistic taxes.

Honestly when I watch people's reactions to what you write you'd have to think if they'd agree with the Roman Empire's point of view, IE never automate anything. (The Romans could have advanced so much further than they did.)

 

[The Pleasure]

Crazy. That’s the equivalent of $27/hr cdn to flip burgers.

I hope all you Californians know as wages go up so do prices.

But there is hope to keep prices down. It goes like this:

McDonald’s: Hello, I’d like to place an order.

Sales guy: According to our systems your restaurants have an average of one self serve screens per store.

McDonald’s: Yes. I’d like to make it 4 self serve double sided screens per store please

Sales guys: Thank for the order!

A burrito costs 12 dollars in California when minimum wage is 16 an hour. That same buritto costs the same in Texas where the minimum wage is 7.25 an hour. That's not inflation. That's fucking greed.

 

[Trogdor1123]

I'm being more general than that.

When you look at long term graphs of various corporate/company profits, high level exec compensation, and worker wages/salaries, the real problem is that the people at the top are taking more and more and more than their fair share, pocketing profits that should have gone to worker pay, which flatlined ages ago. In a heathly economy, everything goes up and down proportionally. Not just CEO bonuses.

But yeah, anyone working a full time job probably deserves $20/hr in today's economy. Sounds about right to me. I'm not gonna nitpick about the exact specific duties they have.

I’m not questioning your comment at all, just wondering how you came by the determination at they deserved it.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

A burrito costs 12 dollars in California when minimum wage is 16 an hour. That same buritto costs the same in Texas where the minimum wage is 7.25 an hour. That's not inflation. That's fucking greed.

Possibly.

But that chain selling the burrito might be using national pricing. Same price anywhere you buy it.

Stores and restaurants can have different pricing strategies.

- National
- Regional
- Zone
- Store by store (every man for himself where it can be a franchise model and they have freedom to price it what they want within a range)

 

[Trogdor1123]

Fun fact: Billionaries pay less taxes than you.

I hear a lot that $20 an hour isnt enough to survive in the US anymore. Companies are forcing people to survive on paycheck after paycheck as modern day slaves

I don’t believe that is true. They pay a smaller marginal rate because they get paid in dividends but the vast majority of taxes is paid for by the rich already.