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[Trazyn the Infinite]

What can I say other then I don't agree..

Steiner was probably my favourite out the bunch, Vivi is fine but I don't get the Best character some FFIX fans throw around.

Bad choice for an example.
The Best battles I've had in a FF game features heavily in VIII.
In FFIX The battle system wasn't just long winded because of animations, the inclusion of the 4th member in battle made it longer too.
The only thing I did like was the Summons designs

Sorry I just don't have any that stick in my head like FFVII/VIII and X for that matter.
I can't agree when I don't remember them.

Early development started in 1998 a year before FFX started development.
In less then half a year Project X was in development with the biggest team SE had ever put together for a game.
So I'm sure the people that worked on it went *Hard* into making it, but SE didn't

Yeah I give him that, but like I said I'm waiting on him to make a new mainline FF that's not online, and FFXVI is his proving ground.

Oh it's definitely a FF game and it's definitely one of the best MMORPG...

I own this for PS4, I also upgraded to the PS5 version

and

I did it's probably the first time in long time it felt like I was playing a Final Fantasy game, but it's a remake... so.

Don't get me wrong I like FFIX, and I would be there day one if they did a Remake.
I just believe it's the weakest of the 3 on PSX

Ok, I guess we can agree to disagree! Personally it is my favorite game of all time, but I do respect your differing opinion.

 

[TGO]

Ok, I guess we can agree to disagree! Personally it is my favorite game of all time, but I do respect your differing opinion.

And that's okay..

 

[Trazyn the Infinite]

And that's okay..

 

[Mibu no ookami]

It is struggling because they are rudderless.

They used to do 3 mainline Final Fantasy games a generation and then that was cut down to 1-2 with on mainline game being an MMORPG.

NES saw FF1-3
SNES saw FF4-6
PS1 saw FF7-9
PS2 saw FFX-XII
PS3 saw FFXIII and XIV
PS4 saw FFXIV and XV

The last three Final Fantasy single-player games have not captured the hearts and minds: 12, 13, 15.

What's worse is that they've actually been milking FF dry.

FFX-2, XIII-2, Lightning Returns... all of these efforts should have been put towards a mainline game.

That actually brings the total of games purely disappointing to 6 of the last 6 and even FF15 wasn't supposed to be a mainline game.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Octopath/Bravely Default is basically the series for people who want an old school Final Fantasy experience.

Funny that Octopath is on everything but PlayStation.

 

[Trazyn the Infinite]

It is struggling because they are rudderless.

They used to do 3 mainline Final Fantasy games a generation and then that was cut down to 1-2 with on mainline game being an MMORPG.

NES saw FF1-3
SNES saw FF4-6
PS1 saw FF7-9
PS2 saw FFX-XII
PS3 saw FFXIII and XIV
PS4 saw FFXIV and XV

The last three Final Fantasy single-player games have not captured the hearts and minds: 12, 13, 15.

What's worse is that they've actually been milking FF dry.

FFX-2, XIII-2, Lightning Returns... all of these efforts should have been put towards a mainline game.

That actually brings the total of games purely disappointing to 6 of the last 6 and even FF15 wasn't supposed to be a mainline game.

They were actively working on XIII during FFXII’s development. Development costs and standards increased dramatically during the jump to HD. XIII-2 and LR were quick releases to recuperate costs while they worked on Versus XIII and XIV. Versus XIII/XV is as much a mainline game as any other.

As for not ”capturing the hearts and minds”, XII did very well and is quite beloved. 13 is almost universally hated and XV is somewhere in between. As for “milking the series dry”, that couldn’t be further from the truth. This was true during the PS1/PS2 era given how many spinoffs, movies, and alternate media releases there were.

 

[TLZ]

There's only one FF king.

Hironobu Sakaguchi.

 

[lifa-cobex]

clickbait article? cos ff14 and 15 are no way strugling, others jrpg can dream to have their success

7 are also doing great so far

They certainly aren't struggling now.
But development for both titles were a massive shit show.

I'm sure FF14 got it's money back but I do wonder about 15

 

[Fake]

 

[NT80]

I really liked FF XV. The story was truly moving, I loved the combat, and the whole "four besties go on an adventure together and go camping and get into shenanigans" was something really special. And from what I've seen of 16, it does not look so good. It looks like a regression, to be honest. XV had it's issues, but the core gameplay loop was actually really fun. Some of the side quests were filler and a bit tedious, but they can work on that for the next one. 16 not being open-world is a bummer, and from what I've seen of the combat, it just really does not look so good.

Definitely a wait and see for me.

I enjoyed XV quite a bit too. Really good atmosphere and graphics on PC but it's a bit of an up and down experience. The story is really good but the problem is too much of it is left out of the core game and is instead in the DLC's, the book and the film. The book especially fills you in a lot.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

They were actively working on XIII during FFXII’s development. Development costs and standards increased dramatically during the jump to HD. XIII-2 and LR were quick releases to recuperate costs while they worked on Versus XIII and XIV. Versus XIII/XV is as much a mainline game as any other.

As for not ”capturing the hearts and minds”, XII did very well and is quite beloved. 13 is almost universally hated and XV is somewhere in between. As for “milking the series dry”, that couldn’t be further from the truth. This was true during the PS1/PS2 era given how many spinoffs, movies, and alternate media releases there were.

I'm not saying that there weren't hurdles that they faced. I'm saying their response to the hurdles has diminished the value of the brand.

12 did well but was seen as a step-down and began the road in the overall wrong direction. One of the benefits of Final Fantasy was if you didn't love the story, it was one and done, but Square wanted to put so much focus on expanding universes starting with X and XII. It was a mistake because if people don't love it, the resulting games really have little chance. 13 was a great example of this continuing trend.

FF7-9 were the only mainline games on PS1 and all were largely well received. Final Fantasy Tactics is one of the spinoff games of the series that is as highly received as the mainline games.

FFX was extremely well received. XI was fairly well received as well and as you mentioned XII did not perform terribly. Kingdom Hearts was another spinoff that was extremely well received.

The PS3 era and beyond represent the low threshold mark for the franchise.

 

[fran.fernandez]

If they are making tons of money then is not struggling for sqex. Even if the game sux .

 

[Trazyn the Infinite]

I'm not saying that there weren't hurdles that they faced. I'm saying their response to the hurdles has diminished the value of the brand.

12 did well but was seen as a step-down and began the road in the overall wrong direction. One of the benefits of Final Fantasy was if you didn't love the story, it was one and done, but Square wanted to put so much focus on expanding universes starting with X and XII. It was a mistake because if people don't love it, the resulting games really have little chance. 13 was a great example of this continuing trend.

12 really wasn’t, even at its time. The game was really well liked, but since it was at the tail end of a console generation many had moved on. Similar to the issue with 9. It wasn’t a “step-down” nor seen as such by anyone but very angry purists. As for expanding universes, X-2 was only developed because of fan demand. There was no initial plans to continue it. XIII also was not planned to be “Continued” in the strict sequel sense, but was later changed due to the absurd costs of developing the title and trying to make as much money back with as little effort as possible.

Regardless, this all began before both titles with Final Fantasy 7‘s expanded universe.

FF7-9 were the only mainline games on PS1 and all were largely well received. Final Fantasy Tactics is one of the spinoff games of the series that is as highly received as the mainline games.

FFX was extremely well received. XI was fairly well received as well and as you mentioned XII did not perform terribly. Kingdom Hearts was another spinoff that was extremely well received.

The PS3 era and beyond represent the low threshold mark for the franchise.

And I agree with you entirely. The 7th generation was a remarkable step back for the franchise. I just think we disagree on *why* that is, not that it was a very frustrating time for FF fans.

 

[xellos2099alpha]

King is absolutely silly and shouldn’t be used to describe Yoshi P

Come now... king is such a lowly title. He is the oldest and the most powerful of Primial.

 

[SlimeGooGoo]

.

 

[Cao Cao]

ok, what would you consider "good" then?

FF 4,6,7,8,9,10,12,13 do it better. Not to mention countless other JRPGs.

 

[TLZ]

Yes

Now kiss me

 

[IDKFA]

Struggling?!?

FF is a series that gets better with every game.

I've never played XIV, but XIII was one of the greatest RPGs ever made. I didn't think it was possible to be topped. Then came along XV and not only is it the best FF game, it's also probably one of the best RPG games ever made.

Hopefully XVI continues the trend.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

I'm not sure where they got the idea that new gamers don't like turned-based.

Look at the popularity of Pokemon. You think that would dispel that idea entirely. Not to mention that with turn-based these games would port to mobile way easier in the long run.

They've lost so much of their identity over the last 20 years.

 

[Mercador]

In case you don;t know, Sakaguchi is a big fan of xiv as well.

Yeah I know but without FFI-VI, there would be no XIV.

 

[Kev Kev]

Struggling?!?

FF is a series that gets better with every game.

I've never played XIV, but XIII was one of the greatest RPGs ever made. I didn't think it was possible to be topped. Then came along XV and not only is it the best FF game, it's also probably one of the best RPG games ever made.

Hopefully XVI continues the trend.

 

[pleaseinsertdisctwo]

They were actively working on XIII during FFXII’s development. Development costs and standards increased dramatically during the jump to HD. XIII-2 and LR were quick releases to recuperate costs while they worked on Versus XIII and XIV. Versus XIII/XV is as much a mainline game as any other.

As for not ”capturing the hearts and minds”, XII did very well and is quite beloved. 13 is almost universally hated and XV is somewhere in between. As for “milking the series dry”, that couldn’t be further from the truth. This was true during the PS1/PS2 era given how many spinoffs, movies, and alternate media releases there were.

Lol XIII is not “almost universally hated.” I can’t stand people who hate XIII (and I love IX, but I also hate snobby medieval FF stans), y’all always have to exaggerate and form some kind of false narrative. I hate XV and even I can say that it’s in the “contentious” territory, where I would say half the people loved it, and the other half hated it.

 

[pleaseinsertdisctwo]

I mean, I agree with it being slow with all the starting and ending animations - but are you seriously trying to say this si worse than FF8? The game with the incredibly long, drawn out, and grindy draw system? The system that actively punishes you for leveling and engaging in combat?

You barely have to engage with Drawing. You can just teach your GFs to refine items. You could also refine cards from Triple Triad.

FFVIII gave tons of customization options for battles that, IMO, made things feel fresh and exciting. You have 4 slots, which can fit: Attack, GF, Draw, Item, Card, Magic, Mad Rush, Recover, Revive, Mug, Defend, Lvl Down, Lvl Up, etc. etc.

The “punishment” you get from leveling is so easily countered by having remotely decent Junctions. Teaching Ifrit Strength +20% and +40% can make whoever equips Ifrit a laughably strong powerhouse super early. You could Junction Curaga to HP and watch it jump from 1200 to 5000-something.

GFs provide extremely useful abilities outside of battle that can either dramatically improve your stats (via learnable support abilities you can equip, or additional Junction slots) or can offer some cool features like a portable shop.

Limit Breaks were also fun and you had a lot of control on activating them, especially once you have the magic Aura.

Final Fantasy IX, in comparison, features an extremely basic and safe combat system and that also applies to its customization. It’s also painfully slow and a lot of time in battle is spent waiting for queued commands to be executed, in addition to the game throwing quite a few enemies that have insane Speed stats.

Trance is easily the worst Limit Break system in the series.

Synthesis is DUMB. It forces you to keep all your useless weapons (or buy extras) in order to combine it into something new. All it amounts to is lots of running back and forth between the Weapon shop and Synthesis shop!

So, again: I love Final Fantasy IX but its gameplay is not very good. I can only stomach it in the Remastered version.

 

[Trazyn the Infinite]

Come now... king is such a lowly title. He is the oldest and the most powerful of Primial.

Lol XIII is not “almost universally hated.” I can’t stand people who hate XIII (and I love IX, but I also hate snobby medieval FF stans), y’all always have to exaggerate and form some kind of false narrative. I hate XV and even I can say that it’s in the “contentious” territory, where I would say half the people loved it, and the other half hated it.

XIII since its launch has been almost universally despised by fans and critics alike. It has nothing to do with “medieval stans” or any sort of excuse you have to dismiss people’s opinions. Also yes, XV is contentious. That is quite literally what I said.

You barely have to engage with Drawing. You can just teach your GFs to refine items. You could also refine cards from Triple Triad.

FFVIII gave tons of customization options for battles that, IMO, made things feel fresh and exciting. You have 4 slots, which can fit: Attack, GF, Draw, Item, Card, Magic, Mad Rush, Recover, Revive, Mug, Defend, Lvl Down, Lvl Up, etc. etc.

The “punishment” you get from leveling is so easily countered by having remotely decent Junctions. Teaching Ifrit Strength +20% and +40% can make whoever equips Ifrit a laughably strong powerhouse super early. You could Junction Curaga to HP and watch it jump from 1200 to 5000-something.

GFs provide extremely useful abilities outside of battle that can either dramatically improve your stats (via learnable support abilities you can equip, or additional Junction slots) or can offer some cool features like a portable shop.

Limit Breaks were also fun and you had a lot of control on activating them, especially once you have the magic Aura.

Final Fantasy IX, in comparison, features an extremely basic and safe combat system and that also applies to its customization. It’s also painfully slow and a lot of time in battle is spent waiting for queued commands to be executed, in addition to the game throwing quite a few enemies that have insane Speed stats.

Trance is easily the worst Limit Break system in the series.

Synthesis is DUMB. It forces you to keep all your useless weapons (or buy extras) in order to combine it into something new. All it amounts to is lots of running back and forth between the Weapon shop and Synthesis shop!

So, again: I love Final Fantasy IX but its gameplay is not very good. I can only stomach it in the Remastered version.

Yes, FFIX is basic, simple, but it functions near flawlessly (aside from the battle speed which is a legitimate problem). FFVIII has a tremendous amount of potential, but it was squandered by poor design choices, horrendous balancing, and a rushed development. Even the developers have said as much in the Ultimania. Personally I would have loved to see FFVIII get the remake long before FFVII given how much untapped potential is there. It has the makings to be one of the greatest games in the franchise if it was given the time and attention it rightfully deserves.

 

[Comandr]

End of Gen filler, people have a hard on for it because of its (back-to-roots) medieval setting.
But in reality the characters are probably the most forgettable in the series and the best character is a fucking Black Mage
combat was probably the worse out the 3 PSX titles and its painful slow.
And the music aren't even on par with the music you don't remember from FFVII & FFVIII...wait there isn't any you don't remember from them games, silly me
Not to say it isn't a good FF, it is.
but it definitely felt like a Phone in effort just to release something that year while they was working on FFX for the PS2.

So.. yeah. This guy gets it. People have such a hard on for FF9 and I don’t get it. Despite owning the game on ps1 steam and psn I only just finally beat it after all these years, about two weeks ago. It occurs to me now - why that is. I stopped the first time because I got all the way to disc 4 and my memory card got corrupted and I wasn’t going to do all that shit over again. Every other attempt gets me about to the same place. Just after meeting Cid I just… stop caring. This time I powered through it and was left extremely disappointed. The story felt flat. Most if the characters were super forgettable and went through nearly zero growth. Vivi was the stand out character and he doesn’t even have a face.

The best final fantasy game in recent memory is Bravely Default (1) and I will DIE ON THAT HILL. An excellent return to form. Too bad 2 was such an abortion.

And you know what? I’m just going to put it all out there. Xenoblade fucking sucks. It’s cringey as shit. From the uwu animu waifus who all 1) look like 15 year olds but ARE ACTUALLY 10,000 year old robots or dragons or swords SO ITS OK 2) have tits bigger than their heads to the awful overdesigned characters to nonsensical plot to the terrible UI. Jesus Christ. Just throw the whole series away.

Bring on the rage, nerds!

 

[MagiusNecros]

I wish they could make Final Fantasy games consistently good like they seem to do with Dragon Quest. With Dragon Quest I always know I'm getting something special. That or the likes of NieR Automata.

As I said before FFIX just hits all those marks that many love about jRPGs which is the world, characters, music and story.

Outside of maybe Yuna from FFX and her ensemble the whole world and setting of FFX is completely dull.

If you can stomach FFXI and enjoy it the world in Vanadiel is really amazing.

FFXII has a lot of Matsuno touches and has a more adult feel with what is talked about and it's deal with the different politics of different nations.

The main issue with XIII that stops it from being great is how it is entirely reliant on supplemental material to tell the full story and that the characters are portrayed as stupid angry children with the exception of a character or two.

XIII had potential to be good. XIV was ass at launch and was flipped by YoshiP and was made by learning from Tanaka's mistakes while capitalizing on the lessons that made Tanaka great to begin with.

And part of XIV's success is primarily it's story and it's reliance on fanservice from past FF games to serve as the meat of most of the content. After that the game goes quiet as it takes a World of Warcraft approach and relies on endgame raiding and relic grind padding to stay afloat. You could say that part of it's success is because WoW is slowly dying a painful agonizing slow death and draws in more players then most MMO's. And most MMO's are cash shop scams that close up shops after 6 months.

FF15 is a clear example of having a interesting concept but being completely flawed in it's own execution. And completely rewriting your scenario and canceling DLC expansions and completely ruining the original narrative you set up for it.

I personally don't have high hopes for FF16 because they spend waaaaaay too much money on graphical fidelity over making an engaging RPG.

I do think Action RPG is the way to go but open full of life worlds I feel are also necessary which I really only see Monolithsoft doing rather well. Xenoblade X is still probably my favorite big boy jRPG. The thing I see with FF and why it struggles is it constantly feels it needs the BEST graphics, has to CONSTANTLY reinvent the wheel but always underperforms in what it is trying to do which is tell a story about adventurers that are prophesized they are going to save the world.

And most of the time FF has become a series that functions in a straight linear line on rails. You got some nice artistic backdrops but it's just a one and done tunnel with very little to do after you beat the game.

I find it very cute that Yoshi P wants to set trends with the franchise but given XIV sticking to a formula that hasn't changed he seems to want to follow old school WoW's trends instead of setting his own.

 

[ShadowLag]

I don't get the confusion or the over-analysis.

If you poll ~1000 FF fans on what their favorite FF games are, you are guaranteed to see FF7, FF8, FF9, and FFX in the top spots every single time, even decades after their release.

Yet, SE has been hell-bent on creating the exact opposite of those games ever since the end of the PS2; pseudo-action games with tech that can barely handle the weight of their own ambitions. Just go back to what worked and improve the visuals... give me FFX-3 in the style of the original FFX and I'll buy the damn collector's edition.

This goes for a lot of devs lately, too

 

[xellos2099alpha]

FFX-3

Trust me, you don't want ffx-3 if you know what was planned.

 

[xellos2099alpha]

squandered

Another Emet reference?

 

[ShadowLag]

Trust me, you don't want ffx-3 if you know what was planned.

You're right, I want more of a spiritual successor to FFX. Or a good FFX-3.

 

[IDKFA]

No, just my personal opinion. I don't expect everyone to agree with me.

 

[Dr.brain64]

Make a good story and the game will sell...

 

[Fuz]

End of Gen filler, people have a hard on for it because of its (back-to-roots) medieval setting.
But in reality the characters are probably the most forgettable in the series and the best character is a fucking Black Mage
combat was probably the worse out the 3 PSX titles and its painful slow.
And the music aren't even on par with the music you don't remember from FFVII & FFVIII...wait there isn't any you don't remember from them games, silly me
Not to say it isn't a good FF, it is.
but it definitely felt like a Phone in effort just to release something that year while they was working on FFX for the PS2.

As for that article title...the dude wasn't even with Square when the best FF's was made so how is he the King of Final Fantasy?
because he save FFXIV and made a shit load of money from a subscription service?
we've yet to see if he can actually make a proper FF, and despite the hype... which is due to the same reason IX is seen with Rose tinted glasses.
I'm not convinced.
but we have FFVIIR.... despite the changes they've made in it, which is another wall if text.
it's still the best SE has produced in long time.

Oh my.
That's a whole load of NOPEs.

 

[Fuz]

No, just my personal opinion. I don't expect everyone to agree with me.