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Audiophile GAF

Korranator

Korranator

Member
Broke out my old CD player and hooked it though optical out into my Bifrost. Probably haven't used it in 10 years. Jaw drops.....holy crap.

Thankfully I still have a huge collection, It feels like I'm hearing a lot of these for the first time.

I find it kind of funny how older CDs by older bands have better and higher Dynamic Range than modern bands. Lot's of metal bands for some reason record in DR6-8. It's not common to see DR9s or above. However, Black Sabbath - Sabotage has an average DR11, and Bauhaus of all bands (yes not metal but still) really went to the next level with their recording with high DR12-14s.

For those interested, https://dr.loudness-war.info/ is a great source and data base for DR rating.
 
T

tsumake

Member
Korranator said:
Broke out my old CD player and hooked it though optical out into my Bifrost. Probably haven't used it in 10 years. Jaw drops.....holy crap.

Thankfully I still have a huge collection, It feels like I'm hearing a lot of these for the first time.

I find it kind of funny how older CDs by older bands have better and higher Dynamic Range than modern bands. Lot's of metal bands for some reason record in DR6-8. It's not common to see DR9s or above. However, Black Sabbath - Sabotage has an average DR11, and Bauhaus of all bands (yes not metal but still) really went to the next level with their recording with high DR12-14s.

For those interested, https://dr.loudness-war.info/ is a great source and data base for DR rating.
Click to expand...

What kind of CD player do you have? They say TOSLINK is better than optical so you should try that. You’re basically using your cd player as a transport, which is what is usually recommended.
 
rofif

rofif

Can’t Git Gud
Meanwhile I sold my presonus speakers because new lg c1 speakers sound so good !
And I am enjoying Sony Pulse 3d more than any other wired headphones in last years.. and it's wireless.
Some may say I am regressing but I feel like I've found freedom and peace again :p
No more cables, amplifiers, dacs and weird setups... I can live again !

Edit: christ... Fixed grammar errors
 
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Maiden Voyage

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
rofif said:
Meanwhile I sold my presonus speakers because new lg c1 speakers sound so good :p
And I am enjoying Sony pulse 3d more than any other weird headphones in last years.. and it's wireless.
Some may say I am regressing but I feel like I've found freedom and how again :p
No more cables, amplifiers, dacs and weird setups... I can live again :p
Click to expand...
Whatever sounds best to you is what matters. Everyone has separate taste and preferences. I want a wireless setup for travel but while at home, the wires don't bother me at all.

tsumake said:
My bad, I meant coax cables (rca).
Click to expand...
RCA (2 cables-Red & Black/white) cables and coax are separate things. RCA transmits an analog signal and coax (or SPDIF) a digital signal (1 cable/1's & 0's).

The only difference in the case of a CD player would be the DAC and analog audio path on the board to the amp via RCA vs sending the digital signal externally for DA conversion on the Bifrost and handling the analog path from there. Which sounds better will vary by listener. I would venture to guess the Bifrost has better sound for most listeners as it is a mid-to-high-end DAC, with a lot of considerations taken into account that would be limiting factors in the Sony CD player.

Fun fact: a CD player without a DAC is called a CD Transport (it can't play the files, it can only transport them to an analog source).
 
Can't decide

Can't decide

Member
Whew did I wake up in a bad mood today.
Occasionally my neighbours decide that I don't need to sleep as they cause my walls to thump and vibrate along with the beat of their dance music. I'm not sure if they keep forgetting that I live next door or if they actually enjoy my childish retaliations of shaking the living shit out of their house. I find a 2 minute, 27Hz bass tone at around 130Db is a good "Don't bother and turn that nonsense down" warning message, it reverbs/pressurizes beautifully through both our properties and makes everything wobble. Big Bertha (the 15" sub) gets switched on and I add another +10Db to the volume if I still hear music afterwards.

Wasn't any need for big bertha today and haven't heard anything for a few hours now. Will be the same situation again in a couple of months no doubt.

j7QZcR4.jpg


While it's definitely not a mature way of dealing with people, over the years I've found this method works every single time, it's been far more effective than knocking on people's doors, asking them to turn their music down, then receiving verbal abuse and the music continues.
 
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TastyPastry

TastyPastry

Member
Maiden Voyage said:
They definitely look beautiful. What made you change your want? Looks, reviews, or other?
Click to expand...

reviews and listening to them in a hifi store. i am a huge sennheiser fanboy and the hd800s were always my holy grail but then i listened to the denon's for the first time and i was blown away. as someone who mostly listens to lots of bass heavy electronic music and ambient techno the denon's are a much better fit for me, i was really dumb being such a brand loyalist for such a long time.
 
regawdless

regawdless

Banned
TastyPastry said:
reviews and listening to them in a hifi store. i am a huge sennheiser fanboy and the hd800s were always my holy grail but then i listened to the denon's for the first time and i was blown away. as someone who mostly listens to lots of bass heavy electronic music and ambient techno the denon's are a much better fit for me, i was really dumb being such a brand loyalist for such a long time.
Click to expand...

The 800S are obviously great headphones. A lot of people say that they are the best ones for gaming especially, because of their huge soundstage and top tier accuracy regarding the positioning of sounds.

For music, this is also the case and the very detailed sound is top notch. But I just don't find them to be that enjoyable to listen to, something bugs me regarding their sound.
And for gaming, in some cases the sound feels almost too wide and some sounds appear to "distant". If that makes any sense. Also, they lack the ability to create an exciting, slamming bass that I want for gaming.

Still incredible cans, but not for everyone. I've listened to the D9200, but only for a couple minutes unfortunately. Oh boi did I like them. They look and feel amazing, while the HD800s look like shit in my opinion. I also liked the sound of the Denon a lot during my short time with them.

But I'm currently only after open backs, because of the kids. Especially the babies, need to hear them when something is wrong. So yeah, maybe down the road sometime....
 
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manfestival

manfestival

Member
Maiden Voyage said:
Click to expand...

This is awesome. These are the pair of cans we were talking about on discord that I own. Love them and I totally agree with what he is saying. I just don't have the experience that he has with headphones. Makes total sense that for their price range($700) that they are competitive but don't do anything to blow away competition. Basically they are no equivalent to a Sundara but man they are so good. Had my roommate try them out the other day and he was so blown away. The V shape sound signature does help for untrained ears lol
 
Korranator

Korranator

Member
Streaming service update

Amazon Music HD -

Now that my trail is over, I seriously doubt I would actually pay for the service. It's a pain in the ass to setup to allow a pure pass through to a DAC. Sure you can go into your sound drivers and configure everything, but for people who want simple plug and play it just wasn't designed well. They have a exclusive button which is designed to give exclusive excess to the audio driver but I honestly really don't hear much difference.

Their "Ultra HD" 24bit does not always equal better. I noticed on some big name bands like Aerosmith "Rocks" the 24bit version is worse than the CD recording. The 24bit is DR8 while the CD is DR12. I'll personally prefer 16bit at DR12 over 24bit DR8. It would be fine if they offered the CD version but they don't. This isn't just one example I found the same issue with some of Joe Satriani's music files too. I'm sure there is a lot more. Not sure where Amazon is getting these 24bit versions.

Not recommended.
 
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T

tsumake

Member
I use Spotify and the Spotify plugin for Foobar for playback. With the WASAPI shared driver I think it’s cleaner but maybe it’s a placebo? You have to copy the link from Spotify and “open location” on Foobar to stream the music so it isn’t as easy as just using the app.
 
D

dusty_cookies

Member
tsumake said:
How do you like Audirvana?
Click to expand...
I like it.

Its a noticible improvment playing music from my windows laptop. Interfaces with qobuz, tidal and my library, making it easy to search everything. Android app is a nice bonus, lets me select the music from my phone and not have to bother with the laptop.

Huge resource hog, couldn't run it on my desktop and play games at the same time. Thats why it's on the laptop.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
Nice stuff in here!

SMSL SU-8 DAC
THX AAA 788 Amp
Audeze LCD-X
Huge collection of flac and uncompressed music, then trusty ol YouTube music for all my other stuff.


regawdless said:
Very interesting comparison.

Click to expand...

Just seen you requested a ban 😢 but I was deciding between the clear and the arya's. Actually i got offered the clears for 800 brand new from focal. And I'd always go for plantar magnetics over dynamic drivers... But those clears are pretty impressive. Too bad i love the sound sig. of Audeze, which is why I went with the X's. And it has the most impressive bass I've heard yet.
 
shoegaze

shoegaze

Member
What cans would be an improvement over HD650 for Nu Metal? (Slipknot, SOAD, Korn, Disturbed, Ill Nino etc.). I don't like bright headphones mind you. So.. similar mid range, rolled off treble, but lower reaching bass with same mid bass hump? Looking for a "bigger sound" so to say. Never tried planars.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
shoegaze said:
What cans would be an improvement over HD650 for Nu Metal? (Slipknot, SOAD, Korn, Disturbed, Ill Nino etc.). I don't like bright headphones mind you. So.. similar mid range, rolled off treble, but lower reaching bass with same mid bass hump? Looking for a "bigger sound" so to say. Never tried planars.
Click to expand...
Planars are the way to go honestly. They excell at literally everything, minus bass impact. Which it still can still be great at, but they are better at sub bass, extension, decay, control, speed, etc. Obviously sound signature and soundstage will be dependant on brand/model, etc.

The question is, would you like something very similar sound to the hd650's, or would you like to see what else is out there, while maintaining some of the things you love in them? Do you live near any audio shops that you can possibly demo a couple headsets? (Also bring in your own music!!! There's no point in demoing cans with music you are not exactly familiar with)


I doubt you will like the HD800/S from your post. Audeze LCD 2C might be a great set, Hifiman Sundara, etc
 
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shoegaze

shoegaze

Member
DonJuanSchlong said:
Planars are the way to go honestly. They excell at literally everything, minus bass impact. Which it still can still be great at, but they are better at sub bass, extension, decay, control, speed, etc. Obviously sound signature and soundstage will be dependant on brand/model, etc.

The question is, would you like something very similar sound to the hd650's, or would you like to see what else is out there, while maintaining some of the things you love in them? Do you live near any audio shops that you can possibly demo a couple headsets? (Also bring in your own music!!! There's no point in demoing cans with music you are not exactly familiar with)


I doubt you will like the HD800/S from your post. Audeze LCD 2C might be a great set, Hifiman Sundara, etc
Click to expand...
No headphone shops near me unfortunately, but funnily enough these two cans you mentioned was the exact ones I converged to as well. Sundara might be 90% of LCD 2C but a lot cheaper, but I'd be worried about the treble. Probably best bet would be to try out Sundara and see if I'll like the planar sound.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
shoegaze said:
No headphone shops near me unfortunately, but funnily enough these two cans you mentioned was the exact ones I converged to as well. Sundara might be 90% of LCD 2C but a lot cheaper, but I'd be worried about the treble. Probably best bet would be to try out Sundara and see if I'll like the planar sound.
Click to expand...
Sundaras will have a bit more treble, but nothing that equalization can't fix. Will you be running these on a PC by any chance? If so, you can use Equalizer APO to recess the upper treble range. Sundaras are amazing for the price, and in fact have similar performance to the LCD 2C like you mentioned, besides differences in trebble. The bass on the Sundara's are great, and better than the HE-400i, although not as pronounced to the HE-400S (if my memory serves me right). If you have Amazon, I'd say go for the Sundara's. You'll definitely be more than impressed, and you'll have a whole month to demo them before returning (if you aren't pleased).
 
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Maiden Voyage

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
DonJuanSchlong said:
My buddy was just deciding between the bose and Sony headsets, and now that this is out, I think this might be a better purchase. Hopefully he's still within his return period.
Click to expand...
I could never really stand the muddy bass on Sony’s headphones. I’m generally not much of a bass guy so muddy bass is a huge nope from me.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
Maiden Voyage said:
I could never really stand the muddy bass on Sony’s headphones. I’m generally not much of a bass guy so muddy bass is a huge nope from me.
Click to expand...
On the other hand, I'm a huge basshead. 3k watts on mids, 1k on highs, and 12k on bass. But there's nothing like a flat frequency (or close to it). I'll take no bass over muddy bass. It's gotta be tight, articulate, etc, for me to enjoy it. Sony does have a bit of a v-curve, even within their higher end cans. Their studio stuff is a different story on the other hand.

But that's one thing i love about sound. It's much different from our visuals. My green might be the equivalent to your red, but we both understand that color spectrum to be "green". Both of us will feel/hear a 28hz note just the same, as well as a 6.5khz tone. We just may have our preferences as to how it should sound, or what we enjoy better, but it'll be varry much wider than what is accepted as good virtuals/coloration on a TV display.
 
Maiden Voyage

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
Looks like Apple might be getting into higher quality music streaming:
www.macrumors.com

Rumor: Apple to Announce Third-Generation AirPods and HiFi Apple Music Tier in 'Coming Weeks'

Citing sources within the music industry, Hits Double Daily reports that Apple is preparing to launch a new HiFi Apple Music tier in the "coming...
www.macrumors.com www.macrumors.com

manfestival said:
Got my Grado Hemps in. FYI they are Hemps, the Hemp symbol that is typically on the grill was factory removed by request. I figured I would do a little show of some of the collection with the D5200 and MS2i.

20210430_173149.jpg
Click to expand...
Those are so good looking. Which is weird because the normal Grado headphones do nothing for me.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
manfestival said:
Got my Grado Hemps in. FYI they are Hemps, the Hemp symbol that is typically on the grill was factory removed by request. I figured I would do a little show of some of the collection with the D5200 and MS2i.

20210430_173149.jpg
Click to expand...
Those denons look surprisingly comfy and lightweight! I'm used to have like 650 grams on my head, all the time. And Grado's are amazing, especially for the price. So glad this thread exists!
 
manfestival

manfestival

Member
Maiden Voyage said:
Looks like Apple might be getting into higher quality music streaming:
www.macrumors.com

Rumor: Apple to Announce Third-Generation AirPods and HiFi Apple Music Tier in 'Coming Weeks'

Citing sources within the music industry, Hits Double Daily reports that Apple is preparing to launch a new HiFi Apple Music tier in the "coming...
www.macrumors.com www.macrumors.com


Those are so good looking. Which is weird because the normal Grado headphones do nothing for me.
Click to expand...
I think it is the wood/hemp. It is really nice and feels nice too. Also not too heavy but the comfort is well... Grado comfort which is like below average.
DonJuanSchlong said:
Those denons look surprisingly comfy and lightweight! I'm used to have like 650 grams on my head, all the time. And Grado's are amazing, especially for the price. So glad this thread exists!
Click to expand...
Yep they are very comfy and I can wear them all day but they can get hot from time to time. You gotta check out the Hemp. They really do sound fantastic. I was content with my MS2i(the silver ones in the photo) since they were considered the better and more neutral phone from Grado at the time. Then everyone started talking how the Hemp may be their best can... I could not resist for the price point.
 
Korranator

Korranator

Member
Maiden Voyage said:
Tidal is splitting MQA into its own tier in Australia. More countries to come?
darko.audio

Tidal forks MQA | Darko.Audio

The streaming service is soft-launching a CD-quality-*only* subscription tier.
darko.audio darko.audio
Click to expand...
So they want to charge even more money for what they call "high Res". What a ripoff.

I've been demoing Tidal thanks to their free trial, but I'm not really impressed. Their master editions are usually remixed editions and not originals. From my experience, most remixed editions are terrible. It's the loudness war were they turn up the volume and flatline the DR. Or they are just upscale mixes from 16bit FLAC and add 3 to 4db to it. I'm not saying they are all like that, but I have found a lot of content that fits that description.

My personal opinion, is you are better off creating your own personal files from CD or vinyl and streaming them yourself.
 
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T

tsumake

Member
I’m waiting to see how Spotify’s hifi option will pan out. Streaming services are good for discovering music and if Spotify is offering a lossless tier, it may good enough for me. I don’t think it’s worth paying so much for ‘audiophile’ streaming services, at least not at this moment.
 
T

tsumake

Member
Korranator said:
So they want to charge even more money for what they call "high Res". What a ripoff.

I've been demoing Tidal thanks to their free trial, but I'm not really impressed. Their master editions are usually remixed editions and not originals. From my experience, most remixed editions are terrible. It's the loudness war were they turn up the volume and flatline the DR. Or they are just upscale mixes from 16bit FLAC and add 3 to 4db to it. I'm not saying they are all like that, but I have found a lot of content that fits that description.

My personal opinion, is you are better off creating your own personal files from CD or vinyl and streaming them yourself.
Click to expand...

You’d think Tidal would be sensitive to dynamic compression.
 
SF Kosmo

SF Kosmo

Al Jazeera Special Reporter
I'm not really an audiophile (in fact I have mild tinnitus from years of too many concerts) but I did recently upgrade my living room sound system to a half decent 5.1 Vizio system (an easy one with a soundbar and wireless speakers and satellite) and I've been thinking about doing the same for my PC set up, which is in another room.

Thing is, it seems like this is sort of complicated on PC and there aren't a lot of affordable out of the box 5.1 solutions on PC. Anyone recommend anything?
 
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Maiden Voyage

Maiden Voyage

Gold™ Member
tsumake said:
I’m waiting to see how Spotify’s hifi option will pan out. Streaming services are good for discovering music and if Spotify is offering a lossless tier, it may good enough for me. I don’t think it’s worth paying so much for ‘audiophile’ streaming services, at least not at this moment.
Click to expand...
I’m hoping the CD quality on Apple Music rumor comes to fruition.
 
T

tsumake

Member
SF Kosmo said:
I'm not really an audiophile (in fact I have mild tinnitus from years of too many concerts) but I did recently upgrade my living room sound system to a half decent 5.1 Vizio system (an easy one with a soundbar and wireless speakers and satellite) and I've been thinking about doing the same for my PC set up, which is in another room.

Thing is, it seems like this is sort of complicated on PC and there aren't a lot of affordable out of the box 5.1 solutions on PC. Anyone recommend anything?
Click to expand...

You may be able to use the same Vizio setup for your PC if it has TOSLINK (optical) out. If not, you can get a usb dac (like a Soundblaster x3) to get optical out.
 
SF Kosmo

SF Kosmo

Al Jazeera Special Reporter
tsumake said:
You may be able to use the same Vizio setup for your PC if it has TOSLINK (optical) out. If not, you can get a usb dac (like a Soundblaster x3) to get optical out.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, I could but they're in different rooms and I don't think a soundbar makes as much sense for my desk.
 
manfestival

manfestival

Member
DonJuanSchlong said:
Amazon music HD is available for 3 months free right now (possibly for only prime members?).
Click to expand...
I signed up for the 3 month free trial like 2-3 weeks ago. Super nice but yeah... the service leaves a lot to be desired and I have found that the ultra hd isn't always the best option... oddly. So far my experience has been positive overall but I do have a few gripes. Spotify really does take the cake but their sound quality is just not there.
 
DonJuanSchlong

DonJuanSchlong

Banned
manfestival said:
I signed up for the 3 month free trial like 2-3 weeks ago. Super nice but yeah... the service leaves a lot to be desired and I have found that the ultra hd isn't always the best option... oddly. So far my experience has been positive overall but I do have a few gripes. Spotify really does take the cake but their sound quality is just not there.
Click to expand...
Agreed 100%. One of my biggest gripes is that you can't click on the artist name throughout the UI. Only in one specific area unlike YouTube music, and I'm pretty sure Spotify and others.
 
Korranator

Korranator

Member
tsumake said:
Click to expand...




I think Hans missed the point of what Golden Sound's video was about. He wasn't arguing what sounded better, his point what was that MQA is misleading it's consumers and making false claims. Namely the format is not lossless, nor are they bit perfect, and many times the so called masters are sometimes just upscaled 16bit/flac.



l8Tq8Kb.png


nXxuIhZ.png
 
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T

tsumake

Member
Korranator said:
I think Hans missed the point of what Golden Voice's video was about. He wasn't arguing what sounded better, his point what was that MQA is misleading it's consumers and making false claims. Namely the format is not lossless, nor are they bit perfect, and many times the so called masters are sometimes just upscaled 16bit/flac.



l8Tq8Kb.png


nXxuIhZ.png
Click to expand...

Golden Sound argues that Tidal’s labeling of its songs are misleading, implying that the fault lies in the MQA format. Hans argues that the MQA format is good and somewhat implies the fault lies in Tidal’s portrayal of its library.
 
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