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[texasairhead101]

From Twitter

Justin McElroy
Also, if @VoxGames breaks 6K before midnight, I'll strongarm the staff into doing a podcast leading up to the launch.

 

[Divvy]

It would be nice if they could design the website less choppy and memory intensive as the Verge site, as good as it looks, it doesn't run great.

 

[Tempy]

* Avoid doing Top Ten lists.
* Reviews - Avoid numerical scoring. Be as informative as possible on all aspects. I like reviews being descriptive; explaining how mechanics work and if there are potential issues. I do not care for "emotional" reviews because I use reviews to judge whether or not I should buy or not - not to read about a reviewer trying to be funny, gushing, or raging.
* Avoid being sensationalist and/or hyperbolic.
* Podcasts aggravate me to no end. People think they're funny while they're clearly not. Anything interesting which needs to be discussed is better off done in written form, where the participants have time to think and form their thoughts in an orderly fashion.
* Some investigative reporting might be nice, rather than just regurgitating news gained elsewhere.

In general I prefer something more like gamasutra.com, and less like someone's livejournal/blogspot.

 

[wonderkins]

Couple things I hope happen:

1. Have a better policy towards the free swag endemic to this hobby. Crescente seemed to revel in the stuff, which colored any opinion he had. They could at least approach it like Kuchera does at Ars and be upfront. Also, not so, "Yay, free stuff. YAY!" Seeing Justin's video, though... Yeah, not hopeful. Irony or not, it's not conducive to audience trust.

2. Don't spam posts like The Verge does. Not every PR blast requires a post. Not every Apple rumor deserves analysis relative to the portable space. MS/Sony/Nintendo/Developers are not your friends. Don't attempt to be theirs. Cordial; not buddies.

3. Video reviews. Necessary. The single best thing The Verge does. Fewer hipster tropes and preciousness, though, would be appreciated.

And Arthur, I generally think you're attitude stinks, your approach to criticism too sensitive, and your impartiality suspect. But, I also think you're a strong writer and that you are a good addition to this nascent website. Either way, typing words in response to critics is lazy. How about an honest self-appraisal in light of the pointed criticisms and a modicum of self-tuning in response. Do the hard work instead of the easy back-and-forth. Really, in your case, it's overdue.

EDIT: And everything Tempy posted above me, esp. concerning numerical scores. Eschew that toxic bs.

 

[ScOULaris]

It would be nice if they could design the website less choppy and memory intensive as the Verge site, as good as it looks, it doesn't run great.

Yeah. If this new games site takes after the design principles of The Verge, count me out. The Verge is laid out like a memory intensive quilt of mish-mashed headlines that requires far too much scrolling around to get to what you want.

 

[hamchan]

chris grant - Former Joystiq
Justin McElroy - Former Joystiq
Brian Crecente - Former Kotaku
Russ Pitts - Former The Escapist
Chris Plante - Former freelance (the daily)
Russ Frushtick - Fomer MTV Multiplayer blog
Arthur Gies - Former Joystiq
Griffin McElroy - Former Joystiq

I only know McElroy, Crecente and Gies and I'm not a fan of any of their work...

 

[aegies]

Couple things I hope happen:

1. Have a better policy towards the free swag endemic to this hobby. Crescente seemed to revel in the stuff, which colored any opinion he had. They could at least approach it like Kuchera does at Ars and be upfront. Also, not so, "Yay, free stuff. YAY!" Seeing Justin's video, though... Yeah, not hopeful. Irony or not, it's not conducive to audience trust.

2. Don't spam posts like The Verge does. Not every PR blast requires a post. Not every Apple rumor deserves analysis relative to the portable space. MS/Sony/Nintendo/Developers are not your friends. Don't attempt to be theirs. Cordial; not buddies.

3. Video reviews. Necessary. The single best thing The Verge does. Fewer hipster tropes and preciousness, though, would be appreciated.

And Arthur, I generally think you're attitude stinks, your approach to criticism too sensitive, and your impartiality suspect. But, I also think you're a strong writer and that you are a good addition to this nascent website. Either way, typing words in response to critics is lazy. How about an honest self-appraisal in light of the pointed criticisms and a modicum of self-tuning in response. Do the hard work instead of the easy back-and-forth. Really, in your case, it's overdue.

EDIT: And everything Tempy posted above me, esp. concerning numerical scores. Eschew that toxic bs.

You just made a lot of subjective criticisms of me with zero supporting statements. There's no impartiality. My value judgments are based on my personal opinions, which are based on my life experiences. My only requirements are fairness and due diligence.

And numeric scores aren't the problem. The problem is text that comes after a score has been decided, and/or scores that don't match the text. I don't think either of those things are going to be an issue.

 

[Edgeward]

Yeah. If this new games site takes after the design principles of The Verge, count me out. The Verge is laid out like a memory intensive quilt of mish-mashed headlines that requires far too much scrolling around to get to what you want.

I don't find that to be a problem for me but the layout is more catered to a tablet too much than a desktop for me to actually look at it without making my eyes hurt a bit.

 

[Pinko Marx]

I'd like to see some more investigative journalism in the gaming community. Some real behind the scenes type shit. Theres definitely not enough of that going on. Seems like everything is pre-approved by the developer and/or publisher of a game. I want some real down and dirty, nitty gritty. Find out why Bethesda knowingly released a broken PS3 game, talk to Rock* about its GTA3 review controversy. Really get in there.

 

[Tempy]

On the other hand - if you can find some genuinely funny writers - I'd love a gaming version of The Onion.

 

[wonderkins]

You just made a lot of subjective criticisms of me with zero supporting statements. There's no impartiality. My value judgments are based on my personal opinions, which are based on my life experiences. My only requirements are fairness and due diligence.

And numeric scores aren't the problem. The problem is text that comes after a score has been decided, and/or scores that don't match the text. I don't think either of those things are going to be an issue.

blah, blah, blah. Your responses are as rote as they are tired when it comes to the artificiality of your personality. You can keep responding to everyone here, defender or critic. But until committing to some honest self-reflection, you'll keep spinning on the merry-go-round. No amount of verbiage, SAT vocab, or "post-modern" arguments of subjective/objective individual reality will save you from your conspicuous shortcomings. Welcome to the drawbacks of broadcasting broadly your personality: negative criticism. 'ta.

 

[BoobPhysics101]

blah, blah, blah. Your responses are as rote as they are tired when it comes to the artificiality of your personality. You can keep responding to everyone here, defender or critic. But until committing to some honest self-reflection, you'll keep spinning on the merry-go-round. No amount of verbiage, SAT vocab, or "post-modern" arguments of subjective/objective individual reality will save you from your conspicuous shortcomings. Welcome to the drawbacks of broadcasting broadly your personality: negative criticism. 'ta.

Ouch. Harsh but true.

 

[Yagharek]

I only know McElroy, Crecente and Gies and I'm not a fan of any of their work...

Yeah, same here. I just see the same old names and expect the same old rubbish from this new site.

 

[wastedyears]

Find out why Bethesda knowingly released a broken PS3 game.

Because they wanted it on store shelves for the holiday shopping season.

 

[aegies]

blah, blah, blah. Your responses are as rote as they are tired when it comes to the artificiality of your personality. You can keep responding to everyone here, defender or critic. But until committing to some honest self-reflection, you'll keep spinning on the merry-go-round. No amount of verbiage, SAT vocab, or "post-modern" arguments of subjective/objective individual reality will save you from your conspicuous shortcomings. Welcome to the drawbacks of broadcasting broadly your personality: negative criticism. 'ta.

Here's something less SAT: You keep bitching without giving examples. "I don't like your attitude" doesn't tell me what you don't like about it. I'm not responding to everyone here. I'm responding to you. Feel free to PM me if you'd rather.

I'm not sure which merry-go-round I'm spinning on, other than giving people here an opportunity to be heard.

 

[Pinko Marx]

Because they wanted it on store shelves for the holiday shopping season.

well okay but you know what I mean.

 

[Fantomex]

Here's something less SAT: You keep bitching without giving examples. "I don't like your attitude" doesn't tell me what you don't like about it. I'm not responding to everyone here. I'm responding to you. Feel free to PM me if you'd rather.

I'm not sure which merry-go-round I'm spinning on, other than giving people here an opportunity to be heard.

I have a feeling you will be receiving a ton of examples from Gaf very soon

 

[Azar]

As someone who likes to read and write long-form feature articles on gaming sites, I hope the absurd amount of money Vox Media is pouring into its expansion will lead to that kind of content. There's been some of it on The Verge, but not as much as I expected.

1UP has done its best at that and produced some really damn good content, freelance and in-house, with features and cover stories. But they don't have the budget to do as much of that as this site potentially could.

 

[newjeruse]

From Twitter

Justin McElroy
Also, if @VoxGames breaks 6K before midnight, I'll strongarm the staff into doing a podcast leading up to the launch.

We're already starting with shit like this? More of the same.

 

[GillianSeed79]

Writing in public under your own name opens you up to scrutiny. I accept that. I would more often like to read criticisms of the work I do that go beyond "fuck that guy, he's an asshole." I've tried to act in good faith as a member of the press and a member of this community where I can. It just gets a little old reading complete strangers call me a piece of shit all the time, and worse, looking for an excuse to do it. There are people here that seem to think more about how much of a piece of shit I am than other people put into hobbies.

Hate me GAF, but I sympathize with the dude. I'm just curious, I know who Crecente is and I used to frequent Joystiq a few years ago, but what did “Arthur” do to piss off so many people? Was it that Nier review or something?

Like, I kind of wish sometimes everyone had a comment section where they worked where the general public could remind you every day you are an asshole that is a waste of oxygen. I get this all the time. The gist I got from this thread was them asking how they could make their site more appealing.

As someone who is reminded every day that you are a piece of shit that would have been better still born I kind of agree that at some point you just say fuck it. Crticism is fine, but when it gets to the point where you are hated just because of your name seems ridiculous.

FFS there was at least one person who posted that he hoped Brad from Giant Bomb would be fired for arguing why he felt Skyrim was GOTY. Are you fucking kidding me? You think that dude is going to post here after that shit?

 

[Edgeward]

Hate me GAF, but I sympathize with the dude. I'm just curious, I know who Crecente is and I used to frequent Joystiq a few years ago, but what did “Arthur” do to piss off so many people? Was it that Nier review or something?

That was Justin McElroy

 

[Gowans]

Arthur is by far my favourite Non GB gaming writer. He cuts through the shit and says it as it is, corrects people when they are wrong and knows what he is talking about. That may cause him to rub some people the wrong way but he just gets more respect from me.

I'll be going to the site just to read his stuff, if it's anything like the verge I'll be sure it will be excellent!

 

[Terrordactyl]

Hate me GAF, but I sympathize with the dude. I'm just curious, I know who Crecente is and I used to frequent Joystiq a few years ago, but what did “Arthur” do to piss off so many people? Was it that Nier review or something?

Like, I kind of wish sometimes everyone had a comment section where they worked where the general public could remind you every day you are an asshole that is a waste of oxygen. I get this all the time. The gist I got from this thread was them asking how they could make their site more appealing.

As someone who is reminded every day that you are a piece of shit that would have been better still born I kind of agree that at some point you just say fuck it. Crticism is fine, but when it gets to the point where you are hated just because of your name seems ridiculous.

FFS there was at least one person who posted that he hoped Brad from Giant Bomb would be fired for arguing why he felt Skyrim was GOTY. Are you fucking kidding me? You think that dude is going to post here after that shit?

Well said, I really don't understand hating people for their opinions or their websites models, the dudes are trying to make a living while doing what they love, so fucking sue them. I mean, take Kotaku for example, I know Gawkers policy is hits hits hits (isn't everyone? hell even gaf), they compete between their blogs IIRC, thats the way the person funding the whole operation wants it ran, how is that the fault of crecente? Perhaps thats why he is leaving Kotaku among other reasons.

I don't want to come off too white knight-ish but Crecente is a legitimate journalist having worked for press outside of blogs and the misinformation coming from some of these posts like "crecente revels in swag" are completely unfounded, I believe he even posted in this thread that he holds an annual auction and gets rid of the swag that way for childs play, which he makes sure is well known on the site.

Anyways I agree with this guy I quoted, and you journos catching flak don't take it to heart you wouldn't be doing a very good job if you weren't being scrutinized, but like Arthur is saying there is a line between scrutiny and just being plain malicious and hateful towards someone you don't even know based on their opinion or if you think their work is sensastionalistic. Protip: look the other way if it bothers you that much.

 

[Fantomex]

Dude a journalist is someone who does exhaustive research. Did they research Skyrim for PS3? Oh that's right "We reviewed the 360 Version" Fuck research! Stop calling these dudes journalists.

 

[FStop7]

Hate me GAF, but I sympathize with the dude. I'm just curious, I know who Crecente is and I used to frequent Joystiq a few years ago, but what did “Arthur” do to piss off so many people? Was it that Nier review or something?

Justin McElroy did the much hated Nier review.

Arthur's unapologetically skewered a couple of sacred cows so a certain sect on here foams at the mouth at any moment his name is invoked. There's a touch of the green-eyed monster involved, too.

 

[scitek]

I feel like I'm one of a few people here that actually wants to be a part of the gaming press professionally. Many times I've posted my reviews here, and they're usually heavily complimented, and sometimes said to be better than that of the big sites, and when I say, "well, my goal is to get a job with one of those sites, actually," it's met with, "why would you want to do that?" Because I need to make a living? Working for free kinda sucks.

Honestly, though, at times I see these guys getting attacked for their opinions, and flat-out hated by so many people, and it makes me wonder if I'd want to willingly put myself through that, because it's really inevitable. I mean, I'm thick-skinned, I used to weigh 325 lbs., I've put up with my share of assholes, but still, it sometimes makes me grateful no one cares who I am. :\

 

[conman]

Here's something less SAT: You keep bitching without giving examples. "I don't like your attitude" doesn't tell me what you don't like about it. I'm not responding to everyone here. I'm responding to you. Feel free to PM me if you'd rather.

I'm not sure which merry-go-round I'm spinning on, other than giving people here an opportunity to be heard.

Classy.

It's exactly this sort of entitled, defensive, pissed off, adolescent attitude among gaming "journos" that rubs many folks the wrong way. Great way to impress potential readers. I'll check out the new site because I respect Chris and the McElroy Bros, but you sure aren't making it easy.

 

[Terrordactyl]

Dude a journalist is someone who does exhaustive research. Did they research Skyrim for PS3? Oh that's right "We reviewed the 360 Version" Fuck research! Stop calling these dudes journalists.

Whats the distinction? Sure Kotaku is a blog, by definition they would be bloggers, but news consumption has changed so I think the term journalist is a rather loose one.

At time of review for skyrim IIRC OPM hadn't even received a PS3 review copy, perhaps the PS3 one wasn't available at time of review publishing, what are they going to do, hold a review for one of the biggest fall titles because they weren't granted a PS3 copy? Regardless what do you want them to do, everyone and their mom has reported on how shitty the PS3 version is, what else can be done? Ask for official comment? I'm sure many have tried.

Anyways, I would also like to point out I called one of them a journalist, because he is/was. But way to take the most mundane and pointless arguments out of my post.

 

[johnsmith]

One of the founders of Vox Media is Markos Moulitsas of Daily Kos. Interesting.

 

[Aaron]

Dude a journalist is someone who does exhaustive research. Did they research Skyrim for PS3? Oh that's right "We reviewed the 360 Version" Fuck research! Stop calling these dudes journalists.

People keep saying this, and then don't hold any other group of journalists to the same high standard. Check out the people who write professionally, not just about movies or other entertainment, but politics and other subjects. The vast majority are in the same class as people who write about videogames. The actual investigative journalists are very few and far between.

Also, fuck playing a 100+ hour game on all three platforms, and get a review out in a reasonable time frame. You need to pull some Dr. Who shit to make that happen.

 

[Rickenslacker]

I'm not sure where the Arthur hate comes from, but my only experience with his stuff is from the RebelFM podcast which I stopped listening to because of everyone other than Arthur, and people were hating on him while I was still listening to it. He's a fine dude in my book.

 

[Prosper]

Sweet, so another IGN/Kotaku clone is popping up.

 

[firehawk12]

I'm not sure where the Arthur hate comes from, but my only experience with his stuff is from the RebelFM podcast which I stopped listening to because of everyone other than Arthur, and people were hating on him while I was still listening to it. He's a fine dude in my book.

I know he's reading this, but I'll just respond to this since it relates directly to RebelFM. The major reason why I stopped listening to it is because Arthur has to be right and have the last word. Every time. I'm okay with people having different opinions, but the way he sounded on those podcasts - admittedly this was a year ago - was just so insufferably stubborn that it turned me off completely. I know I'm not the only one who shares this opinion, since it came up on that "What podcasts have you stopped listening to" thread from ages ago. (It doesn't help that everyone else on the show would just give up in order to end the painful argument).

I think he's better when he doesn't run the show - he was fine on the few times he's appeared on the (now dead?) Joystiq podcast - but that's because he couldn't just yell his way to victory on a point.

 

[Lo_Fi]

Don't really see the need for another gaming news site. Plenty of them already, and Kotaku + Gaf just about covers everything.

 

[IrishNinja]

Classy.

It's exactly this sort of entitled, defensive, pissed off, adolescent attitude among gaming "journos" that rubs many folks the wrong way. Great way to impress potential readers. I'll check out the new site because I respect Chris and the McElroy Bros, but you sure aren't making it easy.

i'm actually not seeing that from that post, though - dude is asking for specifics, and offers another venue to provide them. i get the sentiment here, but where are you reading it from that post?

also, did anyone ever ask crecente @ the dante's inferno EA promotional stunt? i recall a video of him burning what i thought was obviously a prop, unsure if dude was serious about it at the time. not a big deal, just curious.

 

[Coolwhip]

Dude a journalist is someone who does exhaustive research. Did they research Skyrim for PS3? Oh that's right "We reviewed the 360 Version" Fuck research! Stop calling these dudes journalists.

Come on 'dude'. Reporting about videogames is hardly journalism. So what do you expect?

 

[Codeblue]

People keep saying this, and then don't hold any other group of journalists to the same high standard. Check out the people who write professionally, not just about movies or other entertainment, but politics and other subjects. The vast majority are in the same class as people who write about videogames. The actual investigative journalists are very few and far between.

Also, fuck playing a 100+ hour game on all three platforms, and get a review out in a reasonable time frame. You need to pull some Dr. Who shit to make that happen.

The issue was known to be in previous Bethesda games. Maybe someone could have "investigated" and asked Bethesda if they were still releasing broken games even after the engine overhaul. This way PS3 owners know to avoid the game and reviewers don't have to spend 300 hours playing a game.

 

[elektrixx]

This is an all-star team as far as I'm concerned. I hope this site is great.

Original video content please!

 

[catotheyounger]

Arthur is by far my favourite Non GB gaming writer. He cuts through the shit and says it as it is, corrects people when they are wrong and knows what he is talking about. That may cause him to rub some people the wrong way but he just gets more respect from me.

I'll be going to the site just to read his stuff, if it's anything like the verge I'll be sure it will be excellent!

Couldn't agree more. I feel his writing and transparency about his methodology has been informed by listening to some of the greats on podcasts - namely Jeff Green and Shawn Elliott. I place value in his ability to use his art background to help inform his opinion on games, his Deus Ex HR review especially. Games writing isn't, nor should it, be a personality contest. Reading a site or a review isn't like voting for prom king or queen. Its about the text.

 

[Shaneus]

No Remo... *nods head*

Seeing the timing of this and Remo's (and to a lesser extent, Gaynors... but he's less journalist-y) has me baffled why neither of them are mentioned. If they're working on some kind of other Traveling Wilburys-esque gaming news site, then the battle is on.

 

[oipic]

Looking at the current staff, it seems like there is none who's interested in PC gaming so i'm assuming PC coverage will be as pathetic as it is with joystiq and kotaku. Former joystiq guys had zero interest from what i could gather from podcasts, kotaku dude doesn't care based on kotaku's coverage and Arthur LOVES (to troll)PC gaming. Sadface.

Very LTTP here, but yeah, this. I know the project is barely up and running in relatively terms, but this is my immediate, if unsubstantiated, concern as well.

I'm a fan of what Josh and co are up to over at The Verge, though, and they're very community-minded and open to feedback and input, which bodes well for this project, too. I'll definitely be keeping an eye out for tweets etc from this mob prior to launch, despite the rather negative group-think going on here. Good luck to all.

 

[angrybus]

* Podcasts aggravate me to no end. People think they're funny while they're clearly not.

That has to be the most antagonist and introverted thing I've ever read on this forum. Man, you sound like some lonely Grinch-type figure..

 

[Utako]

It would be nice if they could design the website less choppy and memory intensive as the Verge site, as good as it looks, it doesn't run great.

I don't think The Verge was intended to be viewed on a TI-83.

 

[Seraphinianus]

That has to be the most antagonist and introverted thing I've ever read on this forum. Man, you sound like some lonely Grinch-type figure..

I've read much worse, but yeah "they think they're funny" is like the calling card of the insecure dude. Sometimes stuff is patronizing in how it tries to be funny, but people just sitting around talking on podcasts? no. They put podcasts out just because people demand to hear them talking with each other...

 

[stewy]

My recommendation is to get a copy editor. I hate seeing the masses of typos, awkward language, and general mistakes on all the game blogs.

This cannot be stressed enough. Outside of the ridiculous fluff we get on sites from Kotaku due to the post quota they apparently need to fill, this is my biggest beef with gaming blogs. Take some pride in your work! Or, at the very least, hire someone to make it seem like you're doing so.

 

[RedNumberFive]

Come on 'dude'. Reporting about videogames is hardly journalism. So what do you expect?

Using the term "reporting" is even a stretch. By those standards if I were to copy and paste press releases onto a blog I'd be a reporter too. These guys get paid reasonably well and receive free trips and copious amounts of free swag to tow the company line. They would never risk that relationship by asking any hard hitting questions.

 

[JonathanEx]

Using the term "reporting" is even a stretch. By those standards if I were to copy and paste press releases onto a blog I'd be a reporter too. These guys get paid reasonably well and receive free trips and copious amounts of free swag to tow the company line. They would never risk that relationship by asking any hard hitting questions.

Hopefully then the Vox Gaming site takes its cues from The Verge, with an open ethics policy which states they'll accept no swag or free trips, only loaners of things they'll review. I suppose there'll be differences between how tech/gaming industries treat the press, and with some companies *coughrockstar* forcing you to review on paid events it'd be interesting to see if it could work.

 

[LiK]

Here's something less SAT: You keep bitching without giving examples. "I don't like your attitude" doesn't tell me what you don't like about it. I'm not responding to everyone here. I'm responding to you. Feel free to PM me if you'd rather.

I'm not sure which merry-go-round I'm spinning on, other than giving people here an opportunity to be heard.

Cuz they love to hate and rile people up. They don't post specifics or reasons, they just post their hatred for all gaming blogs in general and since you guys worked at those sites which had questionable articles from all sorts of people, they group you all up as the same individual who wrote it.

Funny that they hate x gaming blog even tho GAF has posted some great stories from them as the source. But why acknowledge the positive when it's so easy to to spout off the negatives instead? It's so much cooler to hate.

 

[RedNumberFive]

Hopefully then the Vox Gaming site takes its cues from The Verge, with an open ethics policy which states they'll accept no swag or free trips, only loaners of things they'll review. I suppose there'll be differences between how tech/gaming industries treat the press, and with some companies *coughrockstar* forcing you to review on paid events it'd be interesting to see if it could work.

Well that's good news! I'd love for this to be true.

 

[Deadly Cyclone]

Man, the anti-game journalism folk are out in full force here.

Yeah, you don't all have to like these guys, nor their work, but this is a fresh start. A new site with no ball and chain from Gawker or the likes. Let's at least see what these guys can do with a clean slate before we get our pitchforks. Christ, Gaf being Gaf for sure here.