Support NeoGAF

[Revolutionary]

Finally did a Vault Raid as a Shadow. We got up to the 4th floor when we were invaded by Immortals. At first I thought they were just NPCs because they had generic class names, but the way they played quickly proved that they were not. They nearly wiped us, but in the end it was just one Wizard vs me, a Necromancer, so I simply kept out of range while my minions wittled her down, and we came away with the win. Pretty fun turn of events, but I'm not sure what the point was lol. We got a bunch of 'essentia' but I don't even know how to use it. I must have slept through that part of the tutorial lmao

 

[amigastar]

Just uninstalled the game, tried it for a few minutes.
I just hope Diablo 4 will be free of this pay to win/progress nonsense.
I'm really loosing or lost my faith in Blizzard actually.

 

[manfestival]

Sure. I was specifically talking about the Immortals vs Shadows system that opens up to you later in the game once you hit level 43. It is highly centered around PvP to be able to get to the highest levels within this specific system. The Immortals are effectively considered to be the 300 strongest players on the server for that week. The Shadows are basically everyone else. Every week you're doing daily and weekly quests but ultimately to be able to challenge an Immortal and basically take over and become an Immortal, it's done via PvP elimination first between the Shadows, then Immortals, then the highest Immortal on the server. Needless to say, that is highly gear dependent and at least I've heard people say that PvP is where the pay to win really shows it's ugly face.

Edit: This video goes into good detail about the Immortals vs Shadows system.

I am level 42 in the game and just playing this casually... if pvp is a necessary part of the grind to 60 then.. big oof. I guess I am about to hit the fall off point for the game then. Normally the bickering for p2w in most games is there but not a big deal but in pvp that is the real issue. Then if pvp is intrinsically involved in the progress and there is p2w in this. Yeah, okay I can see the biggest issue of all. Most of the outcries of the p2w just seemed to fall on pve but barely anyone touched on that pvp system here.

 

[RiccochetJ]

I am level 42 in the game and just playing this casually... if pvp is a necessary part of the grind to 60 then.. big oof. I guess I am about to hit the fall off point for the game then. Normally the bickering for p2w in most games is there but not a big deal but in pvp that is the real issue. Then if pvp is intrinsically involved in the progress and there is p2w in this. Yeah, okay I can see the biggest issue of all. Most of the outcries of the p2w just seemed to fall on pve but barely anyone touched on that pvp system here.

It's not part of getting to 60. It's just another system you can take part in for rewards and loot. I haven't pvp'd once and I'm paragon level 5 now. So it basically breaks down to being that you can be an Immortal, a Shadow, or just a standard Adventurer and just continue on your way.
Being a Shadow means that you have access to some other daily quests that drop loot etc. It's only if you want to be at the top and become an Immortal is when pvp comes into play.

 

[Tygeezy]

The game is a lot of fun if you have less than two hours a day to dedicate to it. I understand the complaints if you want to hardcore play this game for 6+ hours a day.

 

[strange headache]

50 crests cost a $100 for a 0.36% at a 5 star gem. You need to open 50 crests 1314 times to have a 99% chance at ONE 5 star gem.

The scaling in this game is horrific too:

• Above level 40 enemies scale faster than your character, meaning that the more you level the weaker you become.
• So it takes longer and longer to finish a rift if you don't rely on shop items to counteract the monster level scaling.

 

[Tygeezy]

50 crests cost a $100 for a 0.36% at a 5 star gem. You need to open 50 crests 1314 times to have a 99% chance at ONE 5 star gem.

The scaling in this game is horrific too:

• Above level 40 enemies scale faster than your character, meaning that the more you level the weaker you become.
• So it takes longer and longer to finish a rift if you don't rely on shop items to counteract the monster level scaling.

There are a lot of free 2 play players that are 60 + into the paragon levels. I don't think anybody here is arguing that there isn't an advantage to whaling. Again, if you resign yourself to the fact that you won't be a top high end player (although currently wudijo is free 2 player and the highest rank pvp player on his server) then you can have a great time. You have to no life this game regardless of pay status to be a top 1% player and most people including myself don't have that kind of time to dedicate to ANY game.

 

[SirKicksalot]

Don't forget to turn charms into skill stones and sell those on the market for platinum. If you get two class skills on the same stone you're going to make a nice profit. Yet another avenue to obtain legendary gems or crests.

 

[Low Moral Fibre]

If you have good impulse control good on you and I hope you are enjoying the game.

If you have poor impulse control (and don't have tons of money) please watch this before getting absolutely raped.

 

[Tygeezy]

Wudijo is still number 1 on his server despite being a free player. You have to no life this game if you want to be an elite player regardless of pay status.

 

[Mattdaddy]

Is anyone playing with controller on PC? Is it good or does it suck?

 

[whyman]

I am level 42 in the game and just playing this casually... if pvp is a necessary part of the grind to 60 then.. big oof. I guess I am about to hit the fall off point for the game then. Normally the bickering for p2w in most games is there but not a big deal but in pvp that is the real issue. Then if pvp is intrinsically involved in the progress and there is p2w in this. Yeah, okay I can see the biggest issue of all. Most of the outcries of the p2w just seemed to fall on pve but barely anyone touched on that pvp system here.

Again the amount the haters straight up lie about this game is insane. I’m psragon level 12 and tried pvp once… You will be fine without it. Only group dungeons is a thing from Hell 1 difficulty and on but it’s easy to find groups and as someone who likes to play solo it works fine.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Again the amount the haters straight up lie about this game is insane. I’m psragon level 12 and tried pvp once… You will be fine without it. Only group dungeons is a thing from Hell 1 difficulty and on but it’s easy to find groups and as someone who likes to play solo it works fine.

I would suggest you actually watch these videos, especially Josh Strife Hayes and take them to heart.

 

[whyman]

I would suggest you actually watch these videos, especially Josh Strife Hayes and take them to heart.

I got 16 min in and then he lost me. “Not too much fun that they can enjoy it completely without paying”

I’ve said from the start this game is not for everyone. But if you are not tempted to pay and you like the game, it’s a great game and you don’t have to pay to enjoy it completely. (Unless by completely you mean being the best at everything, then you should not play this game, like I’ve said from the start)

Still I agree that the micro transactions sucks. But what I can’t take, that have pissed me off so much in this debate is the lies. I’m ok with legit criticism but when people say things like “You can not progress without paying” “The game ends at 60 if you don’t pay” “you can’t upgrade items without paying” they have clearly not even tried the game and lose all credibility. It’s simply not true.

Do I think anything will change even if every pc/console player in the world complains about this game? No, because it’s a mobile game and the mobile game market is already lost. When they try to pull this shit with a PC or Console first game I’ll be right there with you. Crying out to no one.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I got 16 min in and then he lost me. “Not too much fun that they can enjoy it completely without paying”

I’ve said from the start this game is not for everyone. But if you are not tempted to pay and you like the game, it’s a great game and you don’t have to pay to enjoy it completely. (Unless by completely you mean being the best at everything, then you should not play this game, like I’ve said from the start)

Still I agree that the micro transactions sucks. But what I can’t take, that have pissed me off so much in this debate is the lies. I’m ok with legit criticism but when people say things like “You can not progress without paying” “The game ends at 60 if you don’t pay” “you can’t upgrade items without paying” they have clearly not even tried the game and lose all credibility. It’s simply not true.

Do I think anything will change even if every pc/console player in the world complains about this game? No, because it’s a mobile game and the mobile game market is already lost. When they try to pull this shit with a PC or Console first game I’ll be right there with you. Crying out to no one.

Mate, he literally states *multiple* times that if you are having fun then that is *GOOD*. No one wants to stop you having fun. We want the gaming industry to treat you better. It isn’t a difficult thing to comprehend.

Also nothing stated was lies. Its there in the game, blatant for all to see. The “lies” are the constant dismissal of the copious amounts of evidence, data, and obvious design choices made.

 

[RiccochetJ]

Is anyone playing with controller on PC? Is it good or does it suck?

I like it and actually prefer playing with a controller right now. But there's an issue and you need to turn on the option to uncap the framerate or else the input lag makes it unplayable.

For some reason, I find the m/kb implementation not up to snuff at the moment, but people are figuring out workarounds such as adjusting cursor size and color.

 

[whyman]

Mate, he literally states *multiple* times that if you are having fun then that is *GOOD*. No one wants to stop you having fun. We want the gaming industry to treat you better. It isn’t a difficult thing to comprehend.

Also nothing stated was lies. Its there in the game, blatant for all to see. The “lies” are the constant dismissal of the copious amounts of evidence, data, and obvious design choices made.

No I didn’t say his specific video was lies, well other then the “impossible to enjoy completely” thing that is highly subjective. The lies I was talking about are spread on this forum and this thread by users trying to gather support for their cause. Instead of use legit points like you and the guy in the video they resort to blatant lies that you can’t progress without paying. It’s sad and it makes the side that is against these practices look desperate instead of right.

I was having more fun with the game before I had to think about how bad the micro transactions are. I just ignored them. Better get back to the game…

 

[tylrdiablos]

Do Activision-Blizzard release financial/profits/earnings reports on occasion?
As much as I hate this predatory F2P gatcha shit... I really want to see how much its raked in.

I wonder how fucked Diablo IV is.

 

[RiccochetJ]

World events are hilarious. I wonder how hot people's phones got for this because my graphics card fan kicked into high gear.

 

[Orbital2060]

Sure. I was specifically talking about the Immortals vs Shadows system that opens up to you later in the game once you hit level 43. It is highly centered around PvP to be able to get to the highest levels within this specific system. The Immortals are effectively considered to be the 300 strongest players on the server for that week. The Shadows are basically everyone else. Every week you're doing daily and weekly quests but ultimately to be able to challenge an Immortal and basically take over and become an Immortal, it's done via PvP elimination first between the Shadows, then Immortals, then the highest Immortal on the server. Needless to say, that is highly gear dependent and at least I've heard people say that PvP is where the pay to win really shows it's ugly face.

Edit: This video goes into good detail about the Immortals vs Shadows system.

Thanks for explaining, and great video on shadows

Im not really that into pvp, but it sounds interesting the way the system works. So I joined the shadows and made some progress in the court. I think Im good with that, and not bother with the immortal side. Between this and the quest with the Einfrinn tree Ive been pretty impressed with the ideas and the writing in the game.

Regarding legendary gems, I found a guide on Eurogamer that explained pretty well how to go about acquiring some.

Diablo Immortal Legendary Gems list, how to get and upgrade Legendary Gems explained

Everything you need to know about Legendary Gems in Diablo Immortal, including how to get Legendary gems, upgrade them, and a list of all Legendary Gems.

www.eurogamer.net

Ive run a bunch of elder rifts with x3 rare crests, and gotten enough runes to craft a couple of gems already. Only 1- and 2- star gems so far. I bought one Eye of the Berserker from the market for ~1100 platinum gained from dailies. 1-star gems sit around 1k plat, 2-star gems at around 5-7k plat, and 5-star gems seem to go for anywhere between 30-60k plat on my server (The Unspoken).

Im just gonna focus on getting the 6x3 gem setups which are detailed in the build panel. And not worry about upgrading just yet. Gems and gear/weapons for all three builds. Looks like gear and weapon is randomised in zones and dungeons so just have to keep playing.

 

[RiccochetJ]

Thanks for explaining, and great video on shadows

Im not really that into pvp, but it sounds interesting the way the system works. So I joined the shadows and made some progress in the court. I think Im good with that, and not bother with the immortal side. Between this and the quest with the Einfrinn tree Ive been pretty impressed with the ideas and the writing in the game.

Regarding legendary gems, I found a guide on Eurogamer that explained pretty well how to go about acquiring some.

Diablo Immortal Legendary Gems list, how to get and upgrade Legendary Gems explained

Everything you need to know about Legendary Gems in Diablo Immortal, including how to get Legendary gems, upgrade them, and a list of all Legendary Gems.

www.eurogamer.net

Ive run a bunch of elder rifts with x3 rare crests, and gotten enough runes to craft a couple of gems already. Only 1- and 2- star gems so far. I bought one Eye of the Berserker from the market for ~1100 platinum gained from dailies. 1-star gems sit around 1k plat, 2-star gems at around 5-7k plat, and 5-star gems seem to go for anywhere between 30-60k plat on my server (The Unspoken).

Im just gonna focus on getting the 6x3 gem setups which are detailed in the build panel. And not worry about upgrading just yet. Gems and gear/weapons for all three builds. Looks like gear and weapon is randomised in zones and dungeons so just have to keep playing.

That's a good article! There was a blowup yesterday where some youtubers were freaking out about how f2p players can't sell their gems. That's not true. Per the article, here's their screenshot.

The "unbound" means that you can sell it on the marketplace if you're so inclined. It's also indicated by the scale you see in the upper left hand corner. Now the chance of rolling a 5 star gem with 5 stars is stupidly low at 0.0045%, but it's unbelievably rare for whales too. Just less rare and as indicated by the dude who spent 4k and didn't get one yet, lot of money. I've seen a lot of people on Youtube who've spent money have their higher tier gems being 5 star w/ 3 stars.

I got lucky last night with my sole legendary crest from the free battle pass and got a 5 star gem w/ 2 stars filled. Next week I'll have enough fading embers to buy enough FA runes to roll on a random 1-5 legendary and we'll see what happens! But like you too, I'm focusing on trying to set up the builds they recommend as well. I also think I'm always going to try and be a bit below the server's paragon level so you get that bonus xp. Currently I'm at around 150%.

But yea, I wouldn't worry about the high tier gems. If anything it just allows the whales to see content sooner and unfortunately just destroy in pvp, but like you I'm not really even bothering with that area yet. Gear will eventually open up w/ your paragon level where the gear will give you enough combat rating to tackle the next hell levels and raids. But from my estimates, you get a chance at a 5 star legendary gem 4 times a month as a free to play player. One crest from the free battle pass, one from the hilt vendor which sells a legendary crest for 1600 marks once a month and then you can get enough embers to buy enough FA runes to roll on the above random legendary twice a month. If you buy the base battle pass for $5 you get two extra legendary crests to try your luck.

Regardless, I'm surprised at how much I'm enjoying this game.

 

[strange headache]

Josh Strife Hayes is the GOAT.
Must watch before you download this money trap.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Josh Strife Hayes is the GOAT.
Must watch before you download this money trap.

Yep, and he even had a supplemental video explaining the bullshit about the Legendary Crests, meanwhile folks in here are trying to dismiss it and pretend like it isn’t a blatant scam.

 

[strange headache]

Yep, and he even had a supplemental video explaining the bullshit about the Legendary Crests, meanwhile folks in here are trying to dismiss it and pretend like it isn’t a blatant scam.

Josh Strife Hayes produces well researched videos and explains Diablo's monetization quite well.
There is also plenty of other information available on the insidious monetization. The people in this thread who are still defending this crap are living in denial.

The joke is on them though since non-paying players only exist in this game to stroke the egos of the whales.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Josh Strife Hayes produces well researched videos and explains Diablo's monetization quite well.
There is also plenty of other information available on the insidious monetization. The people in this thread who are still defending this crap are living in denial.

The joke is on them though since non-paying players only exist in this game to stroke the egos of the whales.

Yup.

Meanwhile I will go back to playing *good* Diablo games like Diablo 2 remaster on my Nintendo Switch. Or Diablo 3 on my Steam Deck. Or Diablo 1 on my second jail broken switch.

 

[Tygeezy]

Yep, and he even had a supplemental video explaining the bullshit about the Legendary Crests, meanwhile folks in here are trying to dismiss it and pretend like it isn’t a blatant scam.

I don’t think a single person has dismissed it. Everybody that is playing understands how it works and realizes it’s almost impossible to be a top player without spending.

That doesn’t mean you can’t enjoy the game casually not paying anything.

 

[Dr. Claus]

I don’t think a single person has dismissed it. Everybody that is playing understands how it works and realizes it’s almost impossible to be a top player without spending.

That doesn’t mean you can’t enjoy the game casually not paying anything.

RicochetJ literally tries to dismiss it while using a disingenuous strawman argument that ignores the reality of what those YouTubers were discussing.

And I am all for people enjoying the game casually. I don’t want or expect you to stop having fun. I just want companies to treat their customers better and with more respect. Especially one that is as important as blizzard.

 

[Subterranean]

I was having fun with this but when I hit the Shadows stuff with the piss poor onboarding and seeing the obscene amount of F2P MMO mechanics I am a bit over it. I do tend to get this way when I hit end game for games like this because the min/max grind doesn't appeal to me.

 

[Generic]

The joke is on them though since non-paying players only exist in this game to stroke the egos of the whales.

Or maybe they just like the game.

 

[strange headache]

Or maybe they just like the game.

Gamblers also like to gamble, drinkers like to drink, smokers like to smoke... doesn't mean that it is good for them.

 

[Tygeezy]

Gamblers also like to gamble, drinkers like to drink, smokers like to smoke... doesn't mean that it is good for them.

He’s talking about non paying players. Non paying players by definition aren’t gambling.

 

[prinz_valium]

could finally log back in after 2 days

 

[Foilz]

The constant crying from podcasters and people about the P2w element is seriously too much. Yes boosts and such do suck but if you can't afford them then simply ignore them. You are under leveled or under powered then play more. Everyone bitched at $70 games, then omg $10 dlc then omg battle passes. Wtf these people need to make money, especially if the game is free. If they released DI for $10 on mobile it would have like 100 players instead of the millions. Get good or go home i bought the $5 battlepass

 

[strange headache]

He’s talking about non paying players. Non paying players by definition aren’t gambling.

The point is that non-paying customers play this because they are addicted to playing whatever new game is doing the rounds, instead of opting for something that doesn't try to fleece them.
Non-paying players only exist as cannon fodder for the paying ones. Just say no, play something that respects you.

The constant crying from podcasters and people about the P2w element is seriously too much. Yes boosts and such do suck but if you can't afford them then simply ignore them. You are under leveled or under powered then play more. Everyone bitched at $70 games, then omg $10 dlc then omg battle passes. Wtf these people need to make money, especially if the game is free. If they released DI for $10 on mobile it would have like 100 players instead of the millions. Get good or go home i bought the $5 battlepass

If it sucks, don't support it. It's really simple.
Between giving the game away for free and predatory skinner boxes, there exist multiple ways for healthy monetization.

 

[Romulus]

Surprised the visuals are this good on a phone but rarely play mobile. I've not had any frame drops even when the entire screen is filled with enemies. I have an A42 samsung, which is bare bones.

 

[Dr. Claus]

The constant crying from podcasters and people about the P2w element is seriously too much. Yes boosts and such do suck but if you can't afford them then simply ignore them. You are under leveled or under powered then play more. Everyone bitched at $70 games, then omg $10 dlc then omg battle passes. Wtf these people need to make money, especially if the game is free. If they released DI for $10 on mobile it would have like 100 players instead of the millions. Get good or go home i bought the $5 battlepass

The reality is, they would have made more than their development cost back if it was a full priced game that treated players with respect and was, most importantly, FUN.

There are also numerous free to play games that have MTX that don’t treat their players like shit with predatory design.

 

[SirKicksalot]

This game really opens up once you hit level 60 and move to Hell difficulty. Every area has a bunch of long side quests.
Then there's the Shadows vs Immortals mechanic. In addition to the challenges and raids it opens, for a Diablo game the contracts are hilariously complex, multi-stage quests.

All I expected was Diablo 3 endgame with MMO raids, but Immortal is way bigger than that.

 

[Miyazaki’s Slave]

Fun is subjective and as a Diablo fan who enjoys grind and loot loops this game is F U N (of course....in my opinion).
I am on 6 servers now, have multiple level 60 characters (2 technically counts as multiple), and am having a blast playing with friends.

I am sure the dailies will eventually become boring once I work through all of them, but the content feels fresh everyday and I look forward to jumping in and running some dungeons with a bud each night.

What I like the MOST: my friends with kids or other "grown up responsibilities" don't need a console or a pc to play the game. They can use the phone/tablet that gathers dust after they finish their wordle and weaver puzzles everyday.

 

[Hari Seldon]

Not sure what I think of this game. I don’t give a fuck about the MTX because I am an adult with full control over my purchase impulses. Taking that out, the game design is in ways better than D3 with the amount of end game stuff. Not that D3 is some kind of great game, so it should be better and it is. But in other ways it is a huge step back. Loot is meaningless super quick into the game, might as well not even drop and instead just give the mats. And the zones (and I guess dungeons?) not being procedurally generated is pretty bad.

Not sure how long I’ll stick with this. Seems like a 9/10 mobile game but a 4/10 pc game. If mobile gaming in general wasn’t a giant pile of shit I would totally ignore this, but as it is it is a solid pooping game.

 

[newtypepilot]

please, keep using that delusional rhetoric that you don't have to spend money

 

[Generic]

The point is that non-paying customers play this because they are addicted to playing whatever new game is doing the rounds, instead of opting for something that doesn't try to fleece them.
Non-paying players only exist as cannon fodder for the paying ones. Just say no, play something that respects you.

Why would they stop playing something they like?

 

[PuppetMaster]

I am level 42 in the game and just playing this casually... if pvp is a necessary part of the grind to 60 then.. big oof. I guess I am about to hit the fall off point for the game then. Normally the bickering for p2w in most games is there but not a big deal but in pvp that is the real issue. Then if pvp is intrinsically involved in the progress and there is p2w in this. Yeah, okay I can see the biggest issue of all. Most of the outcries of the p2w just seemed to fall on pve but barely anyone touched on that pvp system here.

The "grind" to 60 is pretty fast. I don't think it took me more than 6 hrs. There is no PvP required.

After 60 you keep leveling but they call it prestige lvls instead.

I have not put any money in. And still enjoying it so far. My highest char is prestige 10.

I did the quest to join the shadows, but ended up selecting No in the end. I haven't even done any PvP yet. But the shadows/immortals thing does sound interesting.

 

[Ogbert]

On the positive side, I get the impression that D4 is going to be completely free of this nonsense.

I think even Blizzard realise they can't screw the pooch on D4.

 

[FunkMiller]

Josh Strife Hayes is the GOAT.
Must watch before you download this money trap.

Yeah. I just watched this video with mounting horror at the insidious, rapacious greed on display. The whole game is fucking disgusting, and designed to psychologically target people inclined to overspend on thinly veiled gambling games.

 

[MiguelItUp]

On the positive side, I get the impression that D4 is going to be completely free of this nonsense.

I think even Blizzard realise they can't screw the pooch on D4.

Of course D4 will be completely free of it. It's not a F2P mobile game, and it's not co-developed by NetEase.

Oh yeah, most definitely. They're well aware of the expectations of everything. They can't afford to under deliver.

 

[Orbital2060]

Our server got a new Immortal yesterday, after one of the Shadow clans managed to oust the prior one. Ive only done a few contracts and some pvp because Ive been busy with the main quest and rifts but I like the whole shadow vs immortal system. And how theres a communal, working class spirit to the shadow faction and the immortals being these upper-class gits that need to be taken down.

 

[SirKicksalot]

Our server got a new Immortal yesterday, after one of the Shadow clans managed to oust the prior one. Ive only done a few contracts and some pvp because Ive been busy with the main quest and rifts but I like the whole shadow vs immortal system. And how theres a communal, working class spirit to the shadow faction and the immortals being these upper-class gits that need to be taken down.

Same here. The final Shadow quests were cute.
I wonder how many people are on a server. There can be up to 500 Immortals but what's the total population?

 

[Orbital2060]

Same here. The final Shadow quests were cute.
I wonder how many people are on a server. There can be up to 500 Immortals but what's the total population?

Yeah, I dont know how many there can be. There were 400+ Shadows signed up for the lottery here today but I dont know how many players a server can hold. Some may also not bother with the immortal system at all.

 

[Dr. Claus]

 

[12Goblins]

played until level 45ish.. I really wanted to like it so I could have a game to play on my phone, but it's really just not that good. everything is high quality and well made but the gameplay is super repetitive, pretty much doing the same shit over and over and you can do it with your eyes closed and never die.. why make it so fucking easy? and there's nothing really addicting or something to look forward to in order to l want to keep playing