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[VolticArchangel]

Did Sony waste time/money on it's own AI upscaler?

I haven't played on a pro so don't have an experience with it or pssr.

 

[//DEVIL//]

Of course not. its still miles better than the shit FSR is. and it can only improve over time since PSSR is hardware-based and not software like FSR is.

in theory it can at one point reach a very high-quality upscaler with time and updates. during the PS5 pro generation and PS6. how is this a bad thing ?

for what its, its better than what DLSS was when it was released and its better than FSR right now ( cant compare with FSR4 yet )

 

[Mister Wolf]

Does the Pro have the hardware to utilize FSR4?

 

[viveks86]

FSR 4 isn’t out yet. It hasn’t even been properly previewed except for an unmanned booth at CES. PSSR is out and has been in the devs hands for ages. The PS5 pro may as well be shelved as a project if they depended on AMD for their hitherto unproven tech.

And that’s assuming FSR 4 even works on PS5 pro’s version of RDNA.

 

[K' Dash]

Nvidia said it had what a gfx server farm or supercomputer training on dlss for 6 years. Doesn't sound cheap.

It is not, but clearly they used a number of (already created) models for their upscaling technique, so that would make it “easier” to make.

The problem here is to find data to feed the tools and create a model, that’s why it took Nvidia 6 years, they were pioneering.

Anyway your guess is as good as mine.

 

[awwr999999]

For me abandoning the Cell processor was a mistake. It is such a great technology and innovation that even medical field used the technology. Even banned to be exported to China due to its technology might use in military. Even some developers loved it like Capcom, etc, Sony just made a mistake on not providing enough tools and knowledge base library. Cell could have been big this days and more advance, and it could have been a perfect complement to ML AI. I don't want Sony to make the same mistake of abandoning there own technology because of pressure from out side forces, even if its a good piece of tech. Ps5 pro PSSR is already performing very well at a fast pace, and developers are now getting use to it. And for $699 that is already cheap for an AI upscaling capable technology and stutter free.

PS3 had already abandoned the PS2's proprietary CPU and GPU and the move to a Nvidia GPU doomed PS games to look just like PC games.
PS2's Graphics Synthesizer GPU uses a proprietary architecture designed only for gaming while Nvidia's GPUs are designed for video editing and a wide range of other things.

AI 'upscaling' is using system resources to stretch images to fit on 4k displays at the expense of added input latency and added visual noise.
Objectively speaking, turning off PSSR and using a display that matches the native rendering resolution of the PS5 would provide a superior image with superior performance.

 

[Robb]

No, I think it’s clever to not be dependent on others solutions. Especially for something like this that I’d assume will only become bigger and more commonplace over time.

I don’t think it’s unlikely at all that Nintendo, for example, will ditch Nvidia hardware a gen or two down the line due to it being too expensive relative to other offers. And then suddenly no more DLSS on Nintendo platforms (assuming they’ll use it on Switch 2) and they’d have to move to some other, likely worse, solution.

 

[Cakeboxer]

 

[killatopak]

I'll be thanking them once PS6 gets released.

As long as it's not proprietary to any of the tech companies they're subject to, they aren't beholden to them should they need to switch it up.

 

[winjer]

Should have just developed one together. Way too many on the market. TAA, TSR, FSR3, FSR4, IGTI (probably won't be used any more), DLSS, XeSS, and whatever solution GG uses for Forbidden West on the Pro.

That is what they did with FSR4 and PSSR. But then, each adapted the model for the PC and the Pro.

 

[Donald mac Ronald]

Why does that even matter? Has no bearing on the question. Sad attempt at trying to be edgy.

For those saying maybe Sony doesn't want to pay a licence fee.. it's an upscaler that's built into the AMD hardware. There wouldn't be a fee to use it. They are already paying for AMD hardware .

 

[keefged4]

It's about time the consoles had their own solution, so no, its not a waste.

 

[Felessan]

So why develop one when AMD are going to do it for you and it's their graphics hardware.

Because Sony can do it better
If anything it's Sony develop one for AMD than vice versa. It's common in their collaboration, Sony provide insights and technical specification what they want from metal, AMD do it and then integrate solutions in their own designs.
I expect that FSR4 will be largely based of PSSR, at least on metal side.

 

[Shmunter]

Amd likely leveraging of PSSR.

 

[Astray]

No it definitely wasn't.

Having your own upscaler means that you get to continue to have a choice between various hardware vendors and you don't get locked in by their own ML solution.

Sony could move to say, Intel or Nvidia for the PS7 and not really lose much AI progress by ditching AMD. This is crucial to maintain negotiation strength.

 

[PharaoTutAnchAmun]

Chinese AI was made for 1/80th of Concorde!

The Chinese AI is not made for games development, its only made for chatbots, you only had to made a quick Google search and you would know it

 

[BlackTron]

They're the same thing. Sony just put it in a product before AMD.

 

[UnrealEck]

I don't think it's a waste totally. But they are essentially beaten by other methods. But it's to be expected when that's one of the competitor's strong suits.
They did get the experience first hand of developing these things themselves which is bound to be valuable.

 

[TintoConCasera]

Nah they don't. Their waste money department is too busy with the gaas stuff.

 

[ShaiKhulud1989]

Even VR wasn't a waste of money because they've sold sensors, IR tracking and even Move sensors to other companies in droves. PSSR is more of a closed tech, but I imagine it will scale one way or another to other departments on a later date. The OPs notion is just silly.

 

[DeepEnigma]

No. They’ve been in the AI image processing on the consumer level since 2013 or so with their TVs and BR players. Just a natural evolution for them considering they’re world leaders in imaging sensors technology on the digital camera front.

 

[mdkirby]

If I had to guess, they’ll also be putting it in their tvs

 

[GymWolf]

Nah, they are using pro owners as betatesters for ps6.

This is gonna pay dividends later.

 

[Hudo]

Not really wasting money when you have a division that does research on these topics: https://ai.sony/publications/

 

[bbeach123]

Compared to what the fck they doing nowaday its actually the best money they spent .

 

[xrnzaaas]

Too early to say. It definitely had a rough start and it's another thing working against the incentive of paying a lot of money to upgrade to Pro model.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Why pay to license something when you can make your own?

It’s open source.

 

[FeralEcho]

So what you're saying is there's a 100% probability that the answer is either yes or no. I agree. Of course there's only a 50% chance it being true.

Spoiler

 

[Bonfires Down]

It’s possible. It could be the new Mantle if anyone remembers that.

 

[KaiserBecks]

I don’t think so, right now was the best time to start and implement the technology in order to learn and improve for the next generation. People forget that DLSS was utterly useless when it came out and look where it’s now.

 

[simpatico]

CRAAAAWWWWLING IN MY SCREEN
THESE PIXELS WONT SIT STIIILL
UEEEE IS HOW I FAAALLLLLL
ONLY NATIVE RES IS REAAALL

(dedicated to PC gaming too )

 

[vkbest]

And that’s assuming FSR 4 even works on PS5 pro’s version of RDNA.

FSR 4 is an inference model, will run on any hardware have the capability to run the model fast enough if they adapt to run it. The new AMD card is not much more capable than PS5 Pro solution.

 

[Parazels]

Sony will be choosing between their native technology and AMDs, if necessary.

 

[StereoVsn]

The Chinese AI is not made for games development, its only made for chatbots, you only had to made a quick Google search and you would know it

??

a) It was a joke.
b) I have been playing with Deepseek for about a week already so well aware of its capabilities.
c) Its actually very good comparatively speaking at coding. Similar results (maybe a tad worse) vs much more expensive CharGPT 4o or Sonnet 3.5.

 

[CrustyBritches]

Pro launched last year, and we still don’t have FSR4. There’s also no confirmation that they are the same implementation.

 

[Roman Empire]

It is still too early to say it. I do feel they released their upscaler a little too raw but it has potential. The question we should be asking is if Sony will invest on it long-term or abandon it after this or the next generation. Proprietary software is not a bad at all, but Sony's track record for this type of stuff isn't the best either.

 

[Zacfoldor]

Dude, they will need an upscaler for PS6, and in order to make that good they need iteration. Getting one out with the pro is vital and will significantly improve the iteration of PSSR in PS6.

I don't even read this thread but this is so obvious that if you have other opinions I don't know what to tell you.

Some of you answered yes? Really!?

 

[Horseganador]

Sony is doing what it should do, collaborating with AMD to create its own AI technology and not relying entirely on an external third party at a key point.

 

[viveks86]

FSR 4 is an inference model, will run on any hardware have the capability to run the model fast enough if they adapt to run it. The new AMD card is not much more capable than PS5 Pro solution.

Is there any material on this out yet?