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[Bogroll]

Expecting good RT performance from this acient AMD platform is just silly... the fact that they've got anything going at all is really surprising to me

I don't really notice RT until I turned it off in Doom Eternal, so much better when it's on, also I remember when I went to walk across the street in Spiderman I saw a truck in the shop window even though I wasn't looking at the truck I stopped crossing the road as I would in real life. Even though tis crude on these consoles it can be a nice addition.

 

[Bogroll]

So, as of this point and until now, Digital Foundry should have been doing 1:1 comparisons between GT7 (2022) and FM7 (2017), as those are the latest entries in their respective franchises?

Doesn't that sound absurd - even though both games are from the same generation?

Here, we're talking about comparing two games from two different generations.

I don't see anything wrong with comparing GT7 PS4/Pro with FM7 XB1/XBX

 

[Heisenberg007]

I don't see anything wrong with comparing GT7 PS4/Pro with FM7 XB1/XBX

They both belong to the same generation, but there is no comparison (and rightly so). The gap in years doesn't warrant a 1:1 comparison. Digital Foundry didn't do one either - even though, as you said, it wouldn't be wrong to do so.

It'd be equally odd if Digital Foundry decides to compare Halo Infinite with Concord when it releases, even though both have current-gen versions. Just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Wingnut]

no VR is kind of a fail to me

Everybody wants VR but nobody buys VR

 

[Ozriel]

GT7 does look great in several areas, but it's the principle. Two games from different generations should not be compared.

Two games released 1.5 years apart should not be compared? Especially when both were built with the current gen consoles in mind?

So, as of this point and until now, Digital Foundry should have been doing 1:1 comparisons between GT7 (2022) and FM7 (2017), as those are the latest entries in their respective franchises?

FM7 has been delisted and was already widely compared with GT Sport when it was up. It wouldn't have made sense to then pivot to comparing with GT7.

 

[Elysium44]

So, as of this point and until now, Digital Foundry should have been doing 1:1 comparisons between GT7 (2022) and FM7 (2017), as those are the latest entries in their respective franchises?

Doesn't that sound absurd - even though both games are from the same generation?

Here, we're talking about comparing two games from two different generations.

Devil's Advocate, when GT 7 came out, FM 7 was pretty old. Also GT 7 has a PS5 enhanced version. I think GT 7 will come out looking very good overall, in terms of graphics and physics. It is very lacking in single player though, and the multiplayer also could be a lot better imo. Polyphony are pretty stuck in their ways, a bit like Bethesda come to think of it (except their games do look modern and run flawlessly). I would like to see Forza do well and push Polyphony to make GT 8 a lot better. GT 7 still uses the 'chase the rabbit' AI which is dreadful for example. And that café menu career mode is really bad. I have the game on PS4 and have only played it a little bit, it's so boring.

 

[Bogroll]

They both belong to the same generation, but there is no comparison (and rightly so). The gap in years doesn't warrant a 1:1 comparison. Digital Foundry didn't do one either - even though, as you said, it wouldn't be wrong to do so.

It'd be equally odd if Digital Foundry decides to compare Halo Infinite with Concord when it releases, even though both have current-gen versions. Just doesn't make sense to me.

Still got to be compared as they're similar signature games on each console. Does it make it completely fair. No. Is it going to make GT7 a ugly game absolutely not. But we can't wait around for GT8 for a comparison. Plus some of those old car models on FM look wank but on the other hand better have those cars in than not.

 

[Turk1993]

There are things that GT7 still does better to me, like the material shaders. They have all unique material shaders and textures for each car which from what i understand is not the case with FM2023. FM2023 will have lots of new shaders with adjustments on each car but not like GT7 which is car by car based. GT7 is still a good looking game and the cockpit view is still one of the best. The HDR is also phenomenal which i hope FM2023 also nails it. And the headlight and taillight illumination is far more realistic than any other game.

 

[SlimySnake]

There are things that GT7 still does better to me, like the material shaders. They have all unique material shaders and textures for each car which from what i understand is not the case with FM2023. FM2023 will have lots of new shaders with adjustments on each car but not like GT7 which is car by car based. GT7 is still a good looking game and the cockpit view is still one of the best. The HDR is also phenomenal which i hope FM2023 also nails it. And the headlight and taillight illumination is far more realistic than any other game.

im not seeing it. Forza looks better in every way. Whats the point of materials if there is bad GI bounce off of cars and fake reflections?

Lighting, atmospheric effects, sense of speed, and trackside detail are all better here and by a long shot. And this without RTGI at launch.

 

[Turk1993]

im not seeing it. Forza looks better in every way. Whats the point of materials if there is bad GI bounce off of cars and fake reflections?

What i mean is its not better or worse, they are just accurate because they capture it from each individual car. THere are gonna be cars that can look identical or better but most models in GT7 in the cockpit will have more accurate material shaders.

Lighting, atmospheric effects, sense of speed, and trackside detail are all better here and by a long shot. And this without RTGI at launch.

With this i agree, its just a step up in those areas where you notice the difference between a current gen and cross gen game.

 

[IntentionalPun]

They both belong to the same generation, but there is no comparison (and rightly so). The gap in years doesn't warrant a 1:1 comparison. Digital Foundry didn't do one either - even though, as you said, it wouldn't be wrong to do so.

It'd be equally odd if Digital Foundry decides to compare Halo Infinite with Concord when it releases, even though both have current-gen versions. Just doesn't make sense to me.

The trick is to not get butthurt over a comparison.

GT7 is 2.5 1.5 years older and had a last-gen version, I'm sure that won't go unmentioned in the video. It's an interesting comparison either way.

GT7 is phenomenal looking also.

 

[adamsapple]

So John wants to compare a current-gen exclusive game with a last-gen game that was released 18 months ago?

Here, we're talking about comparing two games from two different generations.

Here, we're talking about comparing two games from two different generations.

Why do you keep saying this ?

You have a valid point about the games being 18 months apart, but GT7 was announced and marketed as a PS5 exclusive game almost the entire duration of its development with a PS4 version announced just a few months before its release and as a response to the console shortages.

If DF compares GT7 with FM, they will compare the native PS5 GT7, not an enhanced-patch from PS4, like FM7 was back from XBO to One X.

 

[Ozriel]

The trick is to not get butthurt over a comparison.

GT7 is 2.5 years older and had a last-gen version, I'm sure that won't go unmentioned in the video. It's an interesting comparison either way.

GT7 is phenomenal looking also.

We’re certainly not 2.5 years away from March 2022

 

[IntentionalPun]

We’re certainly not 2.5 years away from March 2022

Oh shit lol, was thinking it was 2021.

So like 1.5 years. Even stupider to be all weird about a comparison.

 

[SlimySnake]

Why do you keep saying this ?

You have a valid point about the games being 18 months apart, but GT7 was announced and marketed as a PS5 exclusive game almost the entire duration of its development with a PS4 version announced just a few months before its release and as a response to the console shortages.

If DF compares GT7 with FM, they will compare the native PS5 GT7, not an enhanced-patch from PS4, like FM7 was back from XBO to One X.

Maybe Sony shouldn’t have shackled themselves to last Gen consoles to chase some extra cash while screwing over everyone who paid $70 for a next Gen game on a $550 console.

This is a game that came out almost 2 years into the console life cycle. Sony have no one but themselves to blame for any comparisons that will show them in a poor light. Say what you will about Phil Spencer but he gave this team 6 years and no last Gen mandate. Hope John trashes not PD but Jim Ryan and German Hurst for holding back pd engineers.

 

[adamsapple]

Maybe Sony shouldn’t have shackled themselves to last Gen consoles to chase some extra cash while screwing over everyone who paid $70 for a next Gen game on a $550 console.

This is a game that came out almost 2 years into the console life cycle. Sony have no one but themselves to blame for any comparisons that will show them in a poor light. Say what you will about Phil Spencer but he gave this team 6 years and no last Gen mandate. Hope John trashes not PD but Jim Ryan and German Hurst for holding back pd engineers.

I think GT7 looks phenomenal and in some areas, the attention to car detail namely, it will probably trump FM for most "non-premium" cars. I don't think there's anything to trash in it at all. Just thought it a bit odd that it's being called a last-gen game when it was primarily a current-gen game.

 

[Danknugz]

Everybody wants VR but nobody buys VR

they did it for flight simulator so the precedent is set at least

 

[LastBattle]

Weird I had no issue understanding her perfect English.

Reminds me of this

 

[transformer]

People really complaining about comparing GT to Forza? Wasn’t Forza originally made to be the MS alternative to GT? When have they not been compared? I honestly love the comparisons. I think they have made each others games better due to this. I bet we don’t have a livery editor in GT if it weren’t for Forza. And I bet we don’t have race regulations and tyre compounds in the upcoming Forza if it weren’t for GT sport. We all are winners in this.

 

[tmlDan]

im not seeing it. Forza looks better in every way. Whats the point of materials if there is bad GI bounce off of cars and fake reflections?

Lighting, atmospheric effects, sense of speed, and trackside detail are all better here and by a long shot. And this without RTGI at launch.

but car detail is worse, the Forza cars look like toys too plastic-ey for some reason....otherwise you're right

 

[Hoddi]

- No longer relying on MSAA on console, moved onto TAA.

Goodbye

 

[Heisenberg007]

Why do you keep saying this ?

You have a valid point about the games being 18 months apart, but GT7 was announced and marketed as a PS5 exclusive game almost the entire duration of its development with a PS4 version announced just a few months before its release and as a response to the console shortages.

If DF compares GT7 with FM, they will compare the native PS5 GT7, not an enhanced-patch from PS4, like FM7 was back from XBO to One X.

That was Sony being deceptive with their marketing. It's not like they only decided to start developing the PS4 version in the last 6 months or so.

At its core, it is a last-gen game - just like all other cross-gen games.

 

[adamsapple]

That was Sony being deceptive with their marketing. It's not like they only decided to start developing the PS4 version in the last 6 months or so.

At its core, it is a last-gen game - just like all other cross-gen games.

Reportedly, the decision to make it cross-gen was late into development, unlike Horizon and Ragnarok which were always planned cross-gen.

Forget business sense, Sony’s cross-gen U-turn is disappointing for PS5’s potential | VGC

Sony’s PS4 announcements mean we’ll likely have to wait for Mark Cerny’s SSD future…

www.videogameschronicle.com

Gran Turismo 7, after all, was outright advertised as a PS5 exclusive in December, although to be fair to Sony, I understand the decision to release a PS4 version was made only fairly recently. For Horizon Forbidden West and God of War, however, these games were always intended to release as cross-gen titles, I was told, but Sony did not mention the last-gen console during the announcement of either title.

Andy Robinson usually has a pretty good track record so I do believe the above.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I was told, but Sony did not mention the last-gen console during the announcement of either title.

 

[Senua]

PC footage when

 

[Team Andromeda]

The XBox bashing here is pathetic. Turn 10 delivered on their promise for Raytracing at 60. The game looks incredible, but even more impressive for me was the sound effects in the game, which sounded so good

 

[DenchDeckard]

Why has my fanatec stuff not turned up yet!

Looks amazing.

 

[IllegalLemon]

And what about RT outside mirrors? Or will only be in mirrors?

I interpreted that as reflections only being on car bodywork, side view mirrors and puddles on the road(probably).

 

[pasterpl]

First time I am seeing a damage control month before actual video. Hopefully these users are being paid for their efforts. /s

 

[Barakov]

Looks like FM7
.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Think I'll just go performance mode tbh. I'll try them both out but performance for when I'm on xbox. Maxed out on pc

 

[adamsapple]

 

[ZehDon]

Think I'll just go performance mode tbh. I'll try them both out but performance for when I'm on xbox. Maxed out on pc

It'll be a toss-up between performance and performance RT for me. I'll happily trade resolution for a good RT implementation, but 60FPS is the bare minimum I'm prepared to accept for a sim racer.

 

[DenchDeckard]

It'll be a toss-up between performance and performance RT for me. I'll happily trade resolution for a good RT implementation, but 60FPS is the bare minimum I'm prepared to accept for a sim racer.

Yup. If the resolution doesn't look too muddy in performance rt I'm all over that.

 

[adamsapple]

It'll be a toss-up between performance and performance RT for me. I'll happily trade resolution for a good RT implementation, but 60FPS is the bare minimum I'm prepared to accept for a sim racer.

Performance RT for me as well.

But also wonder if they'll add a 120hz mode down the line.

 

[GloveSlap]

I hope so. Trees and vegetation are the one thing still holding back pretty much all modern racing games.

 

[Negotiator101]

Called it best environments yet in a track racer.

 

[Negotiator101]

I hope so. Trees and vegetation are the one thing still holding back pretty much all modern racing games.

All 3D in Forza Motorsport no 2D bullshit this time.

 

[Porticus]

All 3D in Forza Motorsport no 2D bullshit this time.

Of course those are the important things in a racing game, not the simulation, lighting, gameplay or the card shading, those wonderful 3d trees.

 

[Elysium44]

I remember the 2D trees in FM7 got a load of criticism but when I played it, you just don't notice unless you go looking for something to complain about, or you pause it and pixel peep.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Is FM2023 the first Xbox game with proformance options on console?
If so, kudos.

 

[adamsapple]

Is FM2023 the first Xbox game with proformance options on console?
If so, kudos.

Not sure what you mean by performance options, do you mean the choice of 30/60 etc ? No, Forza Horizon 5 also had a 30 FPS Quality and 60 FPS Performance mode. No RT on console for that one though.

 

[Sethbacca]

Serious question for someone like me who owns FH5 on a PC with an RTX card, what is the difference?




The game looks fantastic by default but with RT on I literally can't tell the difference on my machine and nor can people in the comments to that comparison.

What's really weird is the left video (RT Off) has higher FPS but somehow the video looks less fluid than the one with RT on and lower fps. Might be something to do with how it was captured but it really threw me off. Honestly though, they're so similar that there appears to be no reason to turn on RT.

 

[Elysium44]

What's really weird is the left video (RT Off) has higher FPS but somehow the video looks less fluid than the one with RT on and lower fps. Might be something to do with how it was captured but it really threw me off. Honestly though, they're so similar that there appears to be no reason to turn on RT.

It will be due to the capture method, each runs flawlessly on my modest PC without dropped frames (the benchmark even counts those). As was pointed out to me afterwards, everything is literally identical except with RT on, your own car reflects parts of itself back onto itself (like mirrors / spoiler) which obviously will be unnoticeable most/all of the time unless you go looking for it.

 

[Panajev2001a]

with a PS4 version announced just a few months before its release and as a response to the console shortages.

Are you being disingenuous and trying to say that somehow Polyphony made a PS4 version at the last minute in a few months? …

 

[adamsapple]

Are you being disingenuous and trying to say that somehow Polyphony made a PS4 version at the last minute in a few months? …

I don't know if they built it in-house or off-shored it, but the decision to make a PS4 version was later into development, after the game was already announced and being made as a PS5 only game.

Gran Turismo 7, after all, was outright advertised as a PS5 exclusive in December, although to be fair to Sony, I understand the decision to release a PS4 version was made only fairly recently.

Forget business sense, Sony’s cross-gen U-turn is disappointing for PS5’s potential | VGC

Sony’s PS4 announcements mean we’ll likely have to wait for Mark Cerny’s SSD future…

www.videogameschronicle.com

 

[Heisenberg007]

I don't know if they built it in-house or off-shored it, but the decision to make a PS4 version was later into development, after the game was already announced and being made as a PS5 only game.

Forget business sense, Sony’s cross-gen U-turn is disappointing for PS5’s potential | VGC

Sony’s PS4 announcements mean we’ll likely have to wait for Mark Cerny’s SSD future…

www.videogameschronicle.com

FYI - that is just his understanding. This is not official info.

 

[adamsapple]

FYI - that is just his understanding. This is not official info.

Well of course, Polyphony hasn't commented on this one way or the other, and I don't expect them to ever do that either.

But we know for a fact that the game was announced and revealed as a PS5 exclusive with a PS4 version announced much after the fact.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Well of course, Polyphony hasn't commented on this one way or the other, and I don't expect them to ever do that either.

But we know for a fact that the game was announced and revealed as a PS5 exclusive with a PS4 version announced much after the fact.

Yeah, but that's similar to God of War Ragnarok, Horizon Forbidden West, and Miles Morales.

We all got bamboozled by Jim Ryan's beautiful eyes.

 

[adamsapple]

Yeah, but that's similar to God of War Ragnarok, Horizon Forbidden West, and Miles Morales.

We all got bamboozled by Jim Ryan's beautiful eyes.