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[proandrad]

Jedi Survivor's quite broken too it seems:



There are some games struggling with either PSSR or/and the lack of a RT denoiser with the pro patches, Black Ops 6 is the latest example, but Hogwarts, SH2, AW2, Jedi Survivors, Outlaws or Fifa are struggling one way or another.



Considering how rough it looks in some games i'd bet there will be some hotfix from Sony soon? or at least they'll allow users to go back to FSR in case it takes time to get fixed.

All the games suffering from this issue are 3rd party games and Sony 1st party titles don't seem to have the issue. My only guess it they are all using an older version of PSSR and the Sony titles are using the the most up to date version. This was my main concern with leaving it up to the developers to patch in PSSR themselves, most will be a version behind. We constantly see this issue with FSR on PC with ver. 2.1, 3, and 3.1.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Jedi Survivor's quite broken too it seems:



There are some games struggling with either PSSR or/and the lack of a RT denoiser with the pro patches, Black Ops 6 is the latest example, but Hogwarts, SH2, AW2, Jedi Survivors, Outlaws or Fifa are struggling one way or another.



Considering how rough it looks in some games i'd bet there will be some hotfix from Sony soon? or at least they'll allow users to go back to FSR in case it takes time to get fixed.

All the games that are pushing graphics harder expose PSSR flaws.

 

[Desprado123]

It is my personal point of view that it amazes me that actually PS5 Pro has more than 60% more TFLOPS compare to PS5 ,however, sony own claims are opposite and they say up to 45% and
now 3rd party games are not beyond 30% to 35% max improvement so is this bottleneck of API, hardware or new graphic engines does not utilize TFLOPS efficiently?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

It is my personal point of view that it amazes me that actually PS5 Pro has more than 60% more TFLOPS compare to PS5 ,however, sony own claims are opposite and they say up to 45% and
now 3rd party games are not beyond 30% to 35% max improvement so is this bottleneck of API, hardware or new graphic engines does not utilize TFLOPS efficiently?

Lack of optimization, and the fact that TFlops don't scale linearly with performance. If that were the case, XSX would be significantly more powerful than PS5 and it is weaker most of the time.

What's more astounding is in that games that DO take advantage of the PS5 pro properly, you're getting a 100% or greater boost in performance for only 60% more Raster, thanks to the ML AI upscaling PSSR

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

All the games that are pushing graphics harder expose PSSR flaws.

No, the games that don't use an optimal resolution do what everyone knows is a flaw of AI upscaling in general. They aren't pushing graphics harder, they are not the best example of "graphics" on the system to begin with.

 

[Mister Wolf]

No, the games that don't use an optimal resolution do what everyone knows is a flaw of AI upscaling in general. They aren't pushing graphics harder, they are not the best example of "graphics" on the system to begin with.

James, we pretending like Jedi Survivor, Silent Hill 2, and Alan Wake 2 aren't graphical showcases for videogames.

 

[Kangx]

Yeah as it is right now it looks worse than on base console.

But finally i see that its a pssr issue so i have high hopes.

I want to play this game soo bad it hurts.
Ita been a while since i got hooked on a game and i shelved it for the pro and now i have to still wait till its fixed.


Its a mistery why some games look much better with pssr and some way worse.

Hmm. Just watch call of duty, there is also issue with image quality too. I doubt these devs would not see these issue when play testing.

The logically conclusion just like SH2, the image quality issue is so glaring that i doubt they would use PSSR instead of any other upscalers because sony does not mandate mandatory use of PSSR.

in conclusion, this is likely an unforseen issue rather than a particular issue with PSSR. Software update on the pro might have break some games.

Here the video. You can clearly see there is a substantial in clarity and graphic improvement from the pro. Too bad. The white dot and the shimmering is really bad.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

James, we pretending like Jedi Survivor, Silent Hill 2, and Alan Wake 2 aren't graphically showcases for videogames.

They are fine looking games in general, they're not the best looking games on the system at all. There's flaws with them on the base console that have been known for ages.

 

[kevboard]

James, we pretending like Jedi Survivor, Silent Hill 2, and Alan Wake 2 aren't graphically showcases for videogames.

they are on PC on max settings... WAY less so on console, to the point where I would argue they all look like shit in many aspects on console.

 

[Mister Wolf]

They are fine looking games in general, they're not the best looking games on the system at all. There's flaws with them on the base console that have been known for ages.

There is flaws with them on the base consoles because the base consoles are weak and the game designers aren't catering to them by choice. Same for Cyberpunk, Black Myth, and Star Wars Outlaws. You get what you pay for.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

There is flaws with them on the base consoles because the base consoles are weak and the game designers aren't catering to them by choice. Same for Cyberpunk, Black Myth, and Star Wars Outlaws. You get what you pay for.

No, the base consoles are not weak.

Sony's exclusive games are the best visuals on the system and run perfectly fine on the base consoles. That's because they are well optimized.

To no surprise, they are also the best showcase of the visuals on the PS5 Pro.

 

[Desprado123]

By seeing replies of some post it seems that Conclusion is that 90% of developer will only deliver 30% max performance of Pro in comparison to PS5 and call it a day.

 

[Kangx]

All the games that are pushing graphics harder expose PSSR flaws.

Call of duty with the video I just posted dispell this notion. I think it is a system wide issue that affects quite a bit number of games.

Edit: although I think Alan wake 2 kinda fit your premise. PSSR is not that good at upscale from low resolution, but the image quality issue for alot of games right now are not due to pushing hardware hard rather it is a system wide issue which is unknown right now.

 

[Mister Wolf]

No, the base consoles are not weak.

Sony's exclusive games are the best visuals on the system and run perfectly fine on the base consoles. That's because they are well optimized.

To no surprise, they are also the best showcase of the visuals on the PS5 Pro.

Both of these games run on the PS5. Only one of them was designed to cater to the weak hardware of the PS5. If you can't see the big difference between these two games in visual tech then I don't know what else to tell you.

 

[Desprado123]

Can anyone do comparison of DLSS Performance vs PS5/Pro dynamic 4K. I am unable to find comparison this one.

 

[SlimySnake]

The Silent Hill 2 and Jedi Survivor PSSR implementations make me wonder if PSSR needs to be trained more on ray tracing. Same thing is happening with AW2's RT mode denoising. It's really bad. It's not that bad on PCs even at much lower resolutions. I played Cyberpunk path tracing at 720p internal resolution upscaled to 1440p and it didnt have this ghosting. Now the ray reconstruction's beta did have this level of atrocious ghosting on anything ray tracing. I am seeing the same thing here.

The tech is clearly not ready and i am not surprised that GG skipped it. Out of all the sony exclusives, its the one game that pushes foliage and level of detail hard. It's also the game that was completely fucking broken at launch because the once reliable checkerboarding completely broke when faced with a massive leap in foliage and level of detail. I always wondered why Days Gone and Ghost of Tsushima that ran at 1800cb 30 fps looked fine but HFW ran at the same resolution at 60 fps and looked completely broken. Well, it's likely that even checkerboarding wasnt good enough and had to be redesigned by GG to feed it more data.

It took them 4-5 months to create a brand new algorithm to fix that performance mode. PSSR could need some more retooling because while it does seem to work well with last gen games, it seems to be struggling with next gen games with realtime ray tracing.

99% of sony's studios dont use ray tracing so if Sony trained its model on first party games then they only had Spiderman 2 and ratchet as their RT games and even they only use rt reflections. no RTGI or RT Shadows in any of the sony first party games.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Both of these games run on the PS5. Only one of them was designed to cater to the weak hardware of the PS5. If you can't see the big difference between these two games in visual tech then I don't know what else to tell you.

Nope.

Horizon looks better on my PS5 Pro.

That footage you posted has some pretty awful artifacting all over the image.

Which is doubly more impressive since HFW is still cross gen.

 

[bundylove]

The Silent Hill 2 and Jedi Survivor PSSR implementations make me wonder if PSSR needs to be trained more on ray tracing. Same thing is happening with AW2's RT mode denoising. It's really bad. It's not that bad on PCs even at much lower resolutions. I played Cyberpunk path tracing at 720p internal resolution upscaled to 1440p and it didnt have this ghosting. Now the ray reconstruction's beta did have this level of atrocious ghosting on anything ray tracing. I am seeing the same thing here.

The tech is clearly not ready and i am not surprised that GG skipped it. Out of all the sony exclusives, its the one game that pushes foliage and level of detail hard. It's also the game that was completely fucking broken at launch because the once reliable checkerboarding completely broke when faced with a massive leap in foliage and level of detail. I always wondered why Days Gone and Ghost of Tsushima that ran at 1800cb 30 fps looked fine but HFW ran at the same resolution at 60 fps and looked completely broken. Well, it's likely that even checkerboarding wasnt good enough and had to be redesigned by GG to feed it more data.

It took them 4-5 months to create a brand new algorithm to fix that performance mode. PSSR could need some more retooling because while it does seem to work well with last gen games, it seems to be struggling with next gen games with realtime ray tracing.

99% of sony's studios dont use ray tracing so if Sony trained its model on first party games then they only had Spiderman 2 and ratchet as their RT games and even they only use rt reflections. no RTGI or RT Shadows in any of the sony first party games.

May i ask how do you train pssr? How does ML work? Is it learning by us playing more and sending some data back to the devs or is it per game?

Seems ridiculous we have to wait months to a year to have these games run with better IQ. At the very least i want the base modes back to bypass this crap till then

 

[SlimySnake]

There is flaws with them on the base consoles because the base consoles are weak and the game designers aren't catering to them by choice. Same for Cyberpunk, Black Myth, and Star Wars Outlaws. You get what you pay for.

they are weak for 60 fps. Compared to PS4 and PS3, they are extremely powerful consoles with a myriad of features like RT, mesh shaders, and ssds that should all result in some stunning looking games, but devs just continue to give in to the hate mob who want 60 fps and then complain about shitty fucking image quality. You just cant have both. Devs need to grow some balls and tell gamers to stfu and buy a pc if they want 60 fps at good image quality.

Avatar looks fine in the 30 fps mode and its arguably the most advanced game on consoles to date. It runs at 1296p-1800p internally in its 30 fps mode before being reconstructed via FSR3. thats 58%-75% scaling. Way better than even 4k fsr quality on PC. The problem is that the CPU isnt good enough to do ray tracing at higher framerates and they had to settle for 720p internally which ruins the image quality and makes people think horizon which runs its 60 fps mode at 1296p internally look better in comparison. A 3x boost in pixels will undoubtedly look better while all that detail avatar is pushing is hidden by shitting reconstruction artifacts.

I think Black Myth, Silent Hill 2 and other UE5 games are CPU bound as well. They are built on UE5.0 and UE5.1 respectively and epic has improved both gpu and cpu usage by a ton in UE5.4. So future games should run much better on consoles. At least in the 60 fps modes.

 

[SlimySnake]

May i ask how do you train pssr? How does ML work? Is it learning by us playing more and sending some data back to the devs or is it per game?

Seems ridiculous we have to wait months to a year to have these games run with better IQ. At the very least i want the base modes back to bypass this crap till then

nvidia had some clips on youtube about this. yes, it comes down to having all kinds of different games being played on their AI servers over and over again, and eventually the AI trains itself and gets better.

DLSS is still getting better and better. On PC, we had to manually change the dlss version to get rid of ghosting on leaves in silent hill 2 because the game shipped with an older version of dlss. even avatar had this ghosting issue on crows and other flying objects so its been a thing for a while. death stranding was the first time i personally noticed it and that game came out in 2020. took 4 years for nvidia to fix it. so even dlss is continuously improving.

now the problem is that it took DLSS 6 years and PSSR has had maybe a few months or maybe a year of training? devs can also manually adjust and improve the algorithm. much like gg did with the checkerboarding tech. So i guess the answer is both. you can feed it data and it will also learn on its own. Maybe the can improve the algorithm by learning from Nvidia and AMD's mistakes.

For now, devs should not be using anything other than 4k pssr quality which uses 1440p internal resolution. Demon Souls, TLOU1, and TLOU2 use it and its fine. Some minor flickering in TLOU1 but its rare. Nothing distracting like spiderman 2 which uses 1080p to reconstruct to 4k or alan wake 2 which uses 1296p. though AW2's issues are mostly due to ray tracing not being handled properly so 1296p should be fine with PSSR. Nothing offensive like we are seeing in silent hill2 and jedi survivor.

Anything below 1080p should be banned until Sony can train it a bit more.

 

[Fortuneelsewhere]

This console is so disappointing.. weak and so badly designed.. nothing more than a test bed for PSSR using loyal customers as beta testers preparing for PS6..

No point in blame Remedy when the fault is clearly on Sony side.. branding this console as premium when it barely can make any palpable upgrade on games is like a bad taste joke..

I use to love Sony but more and more I’m feeling they lost their way and touch with their core audience..

 

[bundylove]

nvidia had some clips on youtube about this. yes, it comes down to having all kinds of different games being played on their AI servers over and over again, and eventually the AI trains itself and gets better.

DLSS is still getting better and better. On PC, we had to manually change the dlss version to get rid of ghosting on leaves in silent hill 2 because the game shipped with an older version of dlss. even avatar had this ghosting issue on crows and other flying objects so its been a thing for a while. death stranding was the first time i personally noticed it and that game came out in 2020. took 4 years for nvidia to fix it. so even dlss is continuously improving.

now the problem is that it took DLSS 6 years and PSSR has had maybe a few months or maybe a year of training? devs can also manually adjust and improve the algorithm. much like gg did with the checkerboarding tech. So i guess the answer is both. you can feed it data and it will also learn on its own. Maybe the can improve the algorithm by learning from Nvidia and AMD's mistakes.

For now, devs should not be using anything other than 4k pssr quality which uses 1440p internal resolution. Demon Souls, TLOU1, and TLOU2 use it and its fine. Some minor flickering in TLOU1 but its rare. Nothing distracting like spiderman 2 which uses 1080p to reconstruct to 4k or alan wake 2 which uses 1296p. though AW2's issues are mostly due to ray tracing not being handled properly so 1296p should be fine with PSSR. Nothing offensive like we are seeing in silent hill2 and jedi survivor.

Anything below 1080p should be banned until Sony can train it a bit more.

Oh boy are we ever screwed with the pro.

I think sony has to make a public apperance and address this.

In the console space , with an enclosed system, we have no option to tinker around to find solutions like on pc.

I hope that all new releases moving forward will show better results by training pssr for that specific game .

Very dissapointed .

 

[AW_CL]

This console is so disappointing.. weak and so badly designed.. nothing more than a test bed for PSSR using loyal customers as beta testers preparing for PS6..

No point in blame Remedy when the fault is clearly on Sony side.. branding this console as premium when it barely can make any palpable upgrade on games is like a bad taste joke..

I use to love Sony but more and more I’m feeling they lost their way and touch with their core audience..

I am very disappointed with the Pro. There are hardly any differences compared to the standard PS5 in terms of performance or innovations. Instead, the fans are even louder, making the experience less enjoyable. Asking for $700 for this junk is just criminal, it’s not worth more than $400. Cerny also doesn’t seem to be the genius that many people consider him to be.

 

[SlimySnake]

All the games suffering from this issue are 3rd party games and Sony 1st party titles don't seem to have the issue. My only guess it they are all using an older version of PSSR and the Sony titles are using the the most up to date version. This was my main concern with leaving it up to the developers to patch in PSSR themselves, most will be a version behind. We constantly see this issue with FSR on PC with ver. 2.1, 3, and 3.1.

Sony's first party titles are reconstructing is from a much higher resolution. tlou1, tlou2, demon souls are all reconstructing from 1440p. results are much better. Star wars outlaws, silent hill 2, alan wake 2 all have one thing in common, they are all upscaling from 864p in their performance modes. jedi was upscaling from 1080p but it was dynamic resolution so its likely also reconstructing from a sub 1080p resolution.

the only sony first party game thats using pssr at a low resolution is spiderman 2 and you can see it kind of shimmer as soon as you start flying. it's also a very simply looking game in comparison to these other games pushing way more geometry and level of detail. Thats another thing not talked about enough when it comes to sony titles. almost all of them are cross gen and feature last gen level of detail and geometry. Not to mention lacing volumetric and ray traced effects that can fuck with reconstruction techniques.

the only sony game that can compare with these games is horizon fw and its not using PSSR. That speaks volumes. notice how Lords of the Fallen devs and the F1 devs also skipped adding PSSR. they said their upscaling techniques were good enough. Nah, i bet they switched to it and saw the same issues we are seeing plague AW2, Outlaws, SH2 and Jedi Survivor. Especially since both Lords of the fallen and F1 rely heavily on ray tracing.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

I am very disappointed with the Pro. There are hardly any differences compared to the standard PS5 in terms of performance or innovations. Instead, the fans are even louder, making the experience less enjoyable. Asking for $700 for this junk is just criminal, it’s not worth more than $400.

So much false with all of this

 

[bundylove]

I am very disappointed with the Pro. There are hardly any differences compared to the standard PS5 in terms of performance or innovations. Instead, the fans are even louder, making the experience less enjoyable. Asking for $700 for this junk is just criminal, it’s not worth more than $400.

The honest thing to do would be this.

Since we are guinea pigs , i would expect some insentive from sony . Like more free games or price reduction for the pro version of the game.

If i am testing your games for you to implement the collected data and results for your future games and console , than i want to be treated as a tester so pay me somehow.

But of course that will never happen.

 

[proandrad]

Sony's first party titles are reconstructing is from a much higher resolution. tlou1, tlou2, demon souls are all reconstructing from 1440p. results are much better. Star wars outlaws, silent hill 2, alan wake 2 all have one thing in common, they are all upscaling from 864p in their performance modes. jedi was upscaling from 1080p but it was dynamic resolution so its likely also reconstructing from a sub 1080p resolution.

What about Black Ops 6, Howgarts, and Fifa are those also upscaling from a much lower resolution?

 

[sendit]

Both of these games run on the PS5. Only one of them was designed to cater to the weak hardware of the PS5. If you can't see the big difference between these two games in visual tech then I don't know what else to tell you.

The base tech of Horizon FW is the PS4. A better comparison would be Burning Shores DLC. However, even that is still anchored by PS4 hardware.

 

[teokrazia]

Both of these games run on the PS5. Only one of them was designed to cater to the weak hardware of the PS5. If you can't see the big difference between these two games in visual tech then I don't know what else to tell you.

Forbidden West is a gorgeous showcase of packing a scene with granular details.
But the light model is old gen ass flat.
And it shows all the time.

How fanboys can still talk about it as a heavy lifter is beyond me.

 

[SlimySnake]

Oh boy are we ever screwed with the pro.

I think sony has to make a public apperance and address this.

In the console space , with an enclosed system, we have no option to tinker around to find solutions like on pc.

I hope that all new releases moving forward will show better results by training pssr for that specific game .

Very dissapointed .

yeah, i didnt even think of that. even if sony improves their solution. devs will have to patch in the latest pssr version.

I am very disappointed with the Pro. There are hardly any differences compared to the standard PS5 in terms of performance or innovations. Instead, the fans are even louder, making the experience less enjoyable. Asking for $700 for this junk is just criminal, it’s not worth more than $400.

innovations are there, performance isnt. PSSR is a big deal but the implementation is half assed. The RT hardware improvements are also great and sound great on paper, but because they didnt bother scaling performance with CUs, or CPUs or vram bandwidth, they ended up literally throwing away all of that extra 2-4x improvements in rt performance.

I was really excited to see how star wars outlaws would perform on this new rt hardware because on pc, disabling DXR costs 30% in performance. it relies heavily on rt cores and performance. they shouldve been able to double the pixel count at the minimum but its literally the same.

so the innovations they did make were held back by performance concessions they made on the gpu, cpu and vram side. concessions they didnt have to make given that the console costs an insane $700. i understood the concessions on the $399 pro compared to say the $500 x1x which didnt skimp on the vram size, vram bandwidth and tlfops. but this fucking thing is literally 2x more expensive. unacceptable.

 

[SlimySnake]

What about Black Ops 6, Howgarts, and Fifa are those also upscaling from a much lower resolution?

last gen games. dlss 1, sonys checkerboarding worked well on last gen games too. less triangles, fewer geometry, no ray tracing = far fewer things for the upscaler to resolve.

 

[SlimySnake]

Forbidden West is a gorgeous showcase of packing a scene with granular details.
But the light model is old gen ass flat.
And it shows all the time.

How fanboys can still talk about it as a heavy lifter is beyond me.

its the fact that its running at 3x the resolution of most of these games in performance modes. hell, now its running at 4x the resolution. the image simply looks sharper, resolves way better on a 4k screen, and gives the impression of a better looking game. you have to sit down and look at the level of detail, lighting model, geometry and textures to see the difference but you cant see any of that on games being upscaled at a terribly low resolution like 720p with half of the next gen settings paired back.

75% of ps5 users play games on 60 fps. its no surprise that remedy increased the performance settings to match fidelity mode thinking all of their hard work was going to waste. only problem is that at 864p using a brand new upscaler, its simply not enough and those details are lost anyway.

p.s and this might just be placebo, but horizon forbidden west must have gotten an upgrade on the pro because it looks way better than i remember. at least in fidelity mode, they are still turning down some settings in performance mode.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

James Sawyer Ford vs the world

Don't you mean another PS5 Pro thread ruined by the usual PCMR rhetoric.

So Pro vs PCMR again.

 

[Kangx]

I think I found evidence of the issue on the pro. Watch the video On the ps5, From 1:00 to 1:40. On the pro, From 1:30 to 2:10.

Please tell me you notice the difference? This is modern warfare III i believe. The ps5 has image crawling issue, but the pro is significantly worst. Also there are shimmering/alias on the pillar at 1:36 on the pro and there is none on the ps5 at 1:04.

This had to be a system issue.

Can someone cut these footages from the timeliness I listed and line them up. This would be great.

I am going to post this on the enhanced thread too.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Forbidden West is a gorgeous showcase of packing a scene with granular details.
But the light model is old gen ass flat.
And it shows all the time.

How fanboys can still talk about it as a heavy lifter is beyond me.

Even with regards to granular detail I no longer consider it impressive. Not when games like Alan Wake 2 and Avatar exist. Horizon was designed around PS5 and it shows on all levels. It's easy to discern this when looking at Forbidden West maxed out on PC and comparing it to all those other games Maxed.

 

[Salty Pickle]

Even with regards to granular detail I no longer consider it impressive. Not when games like Alan Wake 2 and Avatar exist. Horizon was designed around PS5 and it shows on all levels. It's easy to discern this when looking at Forbidden West maxed out on PC and comparing it to all those other games Maxed.

So everybody needs to have a $ 3000 PC then? Get real.

 

[Kenneth Haight]

It took them until June to fix the problem. The game came out in February.

News - Horizon Forbidden West gets a free major update - out now

New update out now for Horizon 2 New game plus, ultra hard, visual & performance mode changes, and more. They’re also gonna add a 40 Hz mode for PS5 & VRR support later. New Game+ Ultra Hard difficulty mode when selecting the difficulty for New Game or New Game Plus Reset Skills...

www.neogaf.com

Also, this isn't even answering my question

For you?

Mine was fine

 

[SKYF@ll]

Even with regards to granular detail I no longer consider it impressive. Not when games like Alan Wake 2 and Avatar exist. Horizon was designed around PS5 and it shows on all levels. It's easy to discern this when looking at Forbidden West maxed out on PC and comparing it to all those other games Maxed.

When creating a game, designing it based on the PS5 (XSX) and RTX3060 will benefit 90% of gamers.
Developers should achieve at least 1080p/60fps on the PS5.
Enhancements for high-end PCs will add RT and many effects to the base PS5, and the game will run well if the resolution is increased according to the performance of each.
The game is not a tech demo. It is essential that many gamers can play it comfortably.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Both of these games run on the PS5. Only one of them was designed to cater to the weak hardware of the PS5. If you can't see the big difference between these two games in visual tech then I don't know what else to tell you.

Your use of the phrase "cater to the weak hardware" betrays you. You either lack a fundamental grasp of what it actually means to develop games for any platform, or you don't and are instead biased, a troll, or both.

The Silent Hill 2 and Jedi Survivor PSSR implementations make me wonder if PSSR needs to be trained more on ray tracing. Same thing is happening with AW2's RT mode denoising. It's really bad. It's not that bad on PCs even at much lower resolutions. I played Cyberpunk path tracing at 720p internal resolution upscaled to 1440p and it didnt have this ghosting. Now the ray reconstruction's beta did have this level of atrocious ghosting on anything ray tracing. I am seeing the same thing here.

The tech is clearly not ready and i am not surprised that GG skipped it. Out of all the sony exclusives, its the one game that pushes foliage and level of detail hard. It's also the game that was completely fucking broken at launch because the once reliable checkerboarding completely broke when faced with a massive leap in foliage and level of detail. I always wondered why Days Gone and Ghost of Tsushima that ran at 1800cb 30 fps looked fine but HFW ran at the same resolution at 60 fps and looked completely broken. Well, it's likely that even checkerboarding wasnt good enough and had to be redesigned by GG to feed it more data.

It took them 4-5 months to create a brand new algorithm to fix that performance mode. PSSR could need some more retooling because while it does seem to work well with last gen games, it seems to be struggling with next gen games with realtime ray tracing.

I think people are reading too much into this. PSSR, like any AI-based reconstruction tech, just needs time to cook. A good way to look at it is that whatever we are getting now from PSSR is better than whatever version of it devs had access to 12 months ago.

It's like people forget what or how DLSS was when it launched.

99% of sony's studios dont use ray tracing so if Sony trained its model on first party games then they only had Spiderman 2 and ratchet as their RT games and even they only use rt reflections. no RTGI or RT Shadows in any of the sony first party games.

As for RT... I feel the issue is one of denoising. And that's not something I believe PSSR would necessarily be trained to fix yet...as you have surmised. If anything, I think PSSR is exaggerating the RT noise right now.

 

[Senua]

Don't you mean another PS5 Pro thread ruined by the usual PCMR rhetoric.

So Pro vs PCMR again.

It's a PS5 pro Vs PC comparison video. Save your crying for other threads, little flower.

Forbidden West is a gorgeous showcase of packing a scene with granular details.
But the light model is old gen ass flat.
And it shows all the time.

How fanboys can still talk about it as a heavy lifter is beyond me.

Because they're desperate.

 

[Mister Wolf]

It's a PS5 pro Vs PC comparison video. Save your crying for other threads, little flower.


Because they're desperate.

Yeah they prop up these exclusives. Same exclusive get ported to PC and we max out the settings and see they aren't anything special. Baked lighting and all kinds of other performance cost cutting measures designed to cater to weaker hardware. Does Spiderman 2 even have dynamic time of day and/or dynamic weather?

 

[DenchDeckard]

I've just watched this on my 65 inch oled and what a shit show this is.

I'm no developer so I don't know. It looks like they need to scale everything back to the ps5s quality mode, cut the raytracing as the system clearly can't handle the quality of raytracing required to hit a high end pcs quality and then run it at 60fps with a higher base resolution.

So, cut everything back to ps5 quality, reducing the higher settings on shadows and foliage density and increase base res and then deliver that at 60fps perhaps?

I'd rather play the ps5 or xbox series x version if I had to play this on console.

Not good at all. Props to DF for highlighting this.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

It's a PS5 pro Vs PC comparison video. Save your crying for other threads, little flower.


Because they're desperate.

I see above and beyond extra's

Who desperate and why?

 

[Bojji]

All the games suffering from this issue are 3rd party games and Sony 1st party titles don't seem to have the issue. My only guess it they are all using an older version of PSSR and the Sony titles are using the the most up to date version. This was my main concern with leaving it up to the developers to patch in PSSR themselves, most will be a version behind. We constantly see this issue with FSR on PC with ver. 2.1, 3, and 3.1.

DD2 have issues with RTGI, AW2 have issues with denoiser in RT mode. Many games have issues with specular highlights (COD).

Where is my appology for saying silent hill 2 had pro patch and was broken and the game looked bad cuz of that huh?
Telling me i need an oled tv to have a better image quality and what other nonsense lol
Anyways at least we know the issue .
But will this be fixed?
Ia this on hardware level or sofrware level?
Why is pssr so broken?

When someone criticizes Sony products here in some way - this person is the issue, or non OLED tv sucks ass etc.

Looks like PSSR sucks with RTGI and Lumen at this point, clearly can't resolve image correctly with heavy RT.

All the games that are pushing graphics harder expose PSSR flaws.

At this point, it looks like it. PSSR needs major updates.

 

[Darsxx82]

Lack of optimization, and the fact that TFlops don't scale linearly with performance. If that were the case, XSX would be significantly more powerful than PS5 and it is weaker most of the time.

Not only is it false, but if you really wanted to be faithful to reality (within the extreme equality of results) it can be the opposite, especially in the most demanding games.

Then, the most curious and funny thing is the nerve to reduce the performance situation of PS5Pro to the simple fact of the lack of adequate optimization (which may be very true) but then they deny the performance situation of some games on XSX vs PS5 to the reason of the lack of optimization when, especially XSX, is being the console to which the least time of optimization is dedicated of all the current ones (even less than XSS), PS5 being de base/priority plataform in most of the time and yet it responds frankly well.

The typical hypocrisy and double standard

 

[SKYF@ll]

DD2 have issues with RTGI

What kind of problem is it? Please tell me the source or details.

 

[Bojji]

What kind of problem is it? Please tell me the source or details.

Timestamped.

 

[SKYF@ll]

Timestamped.

Thank you.
The issues that were present in the PS5 version have been exacerbated in the PS5 Pro version.
I hope this will be improved as soon as possible.

 

[Luipadre]

So SH2 is actually patched lol? I didnt see any image quality difference at all other than the broken reflections everywhere. I wonder if these devs even QA their games or they just said it looks good and patched it anyway? SH2 got 0 benefits from this patch, its actually looks much worse. Im glad i finished it, otherwise i would be really mad and 0 communication from Bloober since Pro release.

 

[Quezacolt]

So SH2 is actually patched lol?

No, there's still no Pro patch for SH2. The patch that came out becore the Pro release was to fix some bugs, nothing more. But whatever they did there, makes the game look worse on the pro.
I still have to test it, but saw some people say that the 1.0 disc version looks normal, compared to the broken version we have now.