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London riots spreading through UK

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SmokyDave

Member
Great King Bowser said:
A well thought out post from mecha_infantry there. Can't say I disagree with any of it growing up as an urban youth myself.
Mecha has his head screwed on so well I sometimes wonder how he looks left or right.

Don't agree with all of the post but it's an excellent post, no doubt.


Meus Renaissance said:
Watching upper class man who went to grammar or private schools, live in lovely neighbourhoods, gathering to discuss the underclass youth problem in the country is kind of pathetic.
I think it's an excellent indicator of how disconnected and fragmented our society has become.

I also think that the number of people in the country that have faith in the government could be counted on the fingers of one hand.
 

Kentpaul

When keepin it real goes wrong. Very, very wrong.
33-Hit-Combo said:
Wtf? Look at the university fees right now. Would fees be upheld in your vision? Or will the rich study and the poor fight?

They could come up to Scotland and get some free Uni
 
Meus Renaissance said:
Watching upper class man who went to grammar or private schools, live in lovely neighbourhoods, gathering to discuss the underclass youth problem in the country is kind of pathetic.

Grammar School =/= upper class.

Just better than the thickos at the comps.
 

Michan

Member
zomgbbqftw said:
What about vocational jobs? Should we continue to import labour from eastern Europe or actually make sure there is something for these guys to do? University isn't the be all and end all.
There's nothing wrong with waiting a couple more years to start working. You work until you reach your mid-60s as it is.

There's a shortage of jobs, and there is always unemployment. Encouraging more people to learn would reduce unemployment and lead to a more educated and socially responsible society.
 
Meus Renaissance said:
Watching upper class man who went to grammar or private schools, live in lovely neighbourhoods, gathering to discuss the underclass youth problem in the country is kind of pathetic. They'll just use this as another platform to blame each other - where most of their anger will come from.

Grammar schools are anything but upper class, I went to one!
 

Dabanton

Member
Meus Renaissance said:
Watching upper class man who went to grammar or private schools, live in lovely neighbourhoods, gathering to discuss the underclass youth problem in the country is kind of pathetic. They'll just use this as another platform to blame each other - where most of their anger will come from.

Was about to write the same thing.
 
DiscoJer said:
The riots are in England, which is one of the biggest, most generous welfare states in the world. They were using Blackberries to coordinate things. They weren't stealing TVs for food...

Personally, I don't think there is a solution. I think it's just that Western culture has been hating itself for close to a 100 years now and it's gotten to a point where it's completely nihilistic. Compare it to those of the Turks and Kurds and other immigrants - their youths stood in front of stores protecting it from these rioters.

They still have pride in their own culture, and thus themselves. But Westerners have been taught hate themselves and their culture. And those that don't are called racists or xenophobes or such (as if it's not okay to like both your culture and others)...or simply even just "Vigilantes"

Anyway, here is one of the most public of the arrested



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...-grammar-school-girl-in-court-over-riots.html

Doesn't seem like she was stealing TVs for food.

I love this delusion.

It isn't. £17 billion goes unclaimed amusingly.

£50 a week is really generous for someone who is unemployed and under 21?

Gas and electric is cheap these days though, so they'll have enough to get by.
 

Michan

Member
33-Hit-Combo said:
Wtf? Look at the university fees right now. Would fees be upheld in your vision? Or will the rich study and the poor fight?
Fees aren't terrible – especially compared to the U.S. (where many more people attend university), and there are many scholarships and bursaries out there. Not to mention, student loans are stupidly flexible, with most requiring a rather comfy salary before needing to be paid back.

The schools are there. The funding is there. You don't have to aim for Oxbridge; there are lots of cheaper options which still yield great results.

Plus, joining the army doesn't necessarily mean fighting. An awful lot of the time is spent on training and discipline. Also, there are many, many careers in the army with on-the-job learning outside of just "soldier."
 
zomgbbqftw said:
Grammar schools are anything but upper class, I went to one!

Then you're obviously a tea sipping, banker, with a house named Manor, and a son name Albert, Oxbridge graduate, fox hunter Tory

Just looking for things to contrast with state schools where metal detectors are not uncommon
 
Michan said:
This is how I think the education system should work:

Compulsory until 20. At 16, you either enter into higher education (college/university), or you're auto-drafted into the army.


I have a better idea, extend the football league tenfold and make all youths professional footballers.
 

SteveWD40

Member
I cant stress enough, in Manchester at least I don't expect much close to Tuesday night again, heres why (again):

The majority of the "rioters" were opportunist looters, not hardened gangs, they made the numbers so vast the Police were overwhelmed, they assumed they would be left to get on with it like London last weekend.

The GMP didn't even need rubber bullets, they beat many of them into whipped butter and hundreds of them now have records / jail-time.

The casual looters that made it so hard for the Police to take it on will think twice (like they always have till now) that the Police are not going to take any shit.

The gang members might try it on but they will be met with over 2000 police, watching their social media co-ordination armed with rubber bullets and batons, they won't have the numbers to hide in.

I hope so at least, the attitude in Manchester is "fuck these cunts" now.
 

Nolan.

Member
If someone is intent on committing a crime will they just remove their 'face mask' if asked nicely? particularly if they aren't apprehended already
 
Kentpaul said:
People forget when you are born in the UK you have won the lottery of life, our poor can afford smartphones, expensive clothing ect, you need to just scale our poor to our society (our middle class owning 3,4 cars per house hold for example)


Poor in spirit.
 

Flynn77

Member
SmokyDave said:
There is no telling how many lives were saved yesterday by the cool head of Tariq Jahan.
Absolutely, the man is an inspiration. To call for peace after what happened was such an amazing thing to do. He probably halted a full scale riot last night, we were dangerously close to the edge in Brum, and you get the feeling he pretty much diffused the entire thing.
 

Kentpaul

When keepin it real goes wrong. Very, very wrong.
They should thank the rain for law and order, not the police.

These people are so disconnected from society it hurts to watch.
 
33-Hit-Combo said:
Wtf? Look at the university fees right now. Would fees be upheld in your vision? Or will the rich study and the poor fight?


People view the poor as tools to be used.

The Peasants always revolt, you wouldn't want history repeating itself would you now.
 

SteveWD40

Member
Kentpaul said:
They should thank the rain for law and order, not the police.

These people are so disconnected from society it hurts to watch.

Not in Manchester, the weather helped but so did GMP's response.

To be fair mate, your predictions of law crumbling and the BBC being raided, you are either trolling or seriously deluded / mentally unstable.
 

SmokyDave

Member
Flynn77 said:
Absolutely, the man is an inspiration. To call for peace after what happened was such an amazing thing to do. He probably halted a full scale riot last night, we were dangerously close to the edge in Brum, and you get the feeling he pretty much diffused the entire thing.
Absolutely. When this is over, someone needs to pin a medal on that mans chest. He deserves recognition.
 

jufonuk

not tag worthy
SiriusTexra said:
Just the timing of it, it's too perfect.

This is probably just a coerced training drill for police to get them prepared for the real riots that are about to occur once the economy accidentally all over the floor.

I'm not buying some anarchists are pissed at some random fuck being dead. No way. Police have been known to pretend to be anarchists. That's fact.
These are the same anti riot cops who get thrills with batoning random women in crowds, now their favorite punching bags, scumfuck junkies are running around and they're NOT doing anything?

Are they waiting for the public to demand full on martial law or something? What's the game here? Is it just to demonize protesting in the future? Seeing the governmental policy reaction to this should be interesting.

Create a problem and everyone will beg for a solution. More guns, more rights taken away, please protect us, more searches, everyone's a potential criminal. It's like watching how 1984 happens. People end up wanting their own suffocation, it's hilarious.

The real problem here, is that the police aren't doing anything, and now people are demanding ACTUAL BULLETS for these "rioters". Somethings fucking off. Did Dr Who recently feature a rioter stepping on a bunny rabbit or something.

what the fuck, you have gone of the reservation here
 

jufonuk

not tag worthy
The Incarnation said:
I have a better idea, extend the football league tenfold and make all youths professional footballers.

yes so they can earn more money in a month than most of us will earn in ten.. that will solve everything so will will have nouveau riche Chav's and Rudeboys awesome!!

Michael Carroll

none on the respect to people and all the money they want to indulge them selves, then the working class people who went uni, worked out of school to try and catch a break can watch the cuts affect them while people who dont care about anythign get the keys to the lives us normal people can only day dream about on the bus home...

I am not talking about the youths that are playing footy and prospecting, etc maybe I missread it as give al lthe youths out there automatic pro footballers lifestyles.. (i am not into football so I guess premiere players earn a ton, while lower leagues not so much, but I hope I am getting my gist across)
 

SmokyDave

Member
Nolan. said:
Just hand over power to Ed mr cameron
Are you insane?

Kentpaul said:
Ban players from outside the UK, for more homegrown success.
Then re-instate all the playing fields and see if we can generate some local pride?

Nah, makes far too much sense and it would cost the Football clubs and their foreign owners lots of pennies.
 

jufonuk

not tag worthy
Meus Renaissance said:
Anyone suffering riot damage can seek compensation under Riot Damages Act, even if uninsured - government

great some chancers setting fire to there houses/properties to claim money, no wait that would be fun when it backfires on them...
 
When the prime minister, David Cameron, said on Wednesday the riots had brought out "some of the best of Britain", he could not have known how fitting that description would be of events on a petrol station forecourt in the suburb of Birmingham 12 hours later. Spilling out in the road beside the Jet garage, where three Asian men were killed the previous night, around 300 Muslim and Sikh men gathered to debate how they should respond to the tragedy. There were no politicians in sight – no official community spokespeople or religious leaders. These were local men, struggling to know how to manage their grief and anger.

Candles marked the spot where Haroon Jahan, 21, and brothers Shazad Ali, 30 and Abdul Musavir, 31, had been killed in the early hours of Wednesday. The three were part of a group of around 80 guarding the petrol station, on Dudley Road in Winson Green, when they were victims of a hit-and-run. A murder inquiry has been launched, and a 32-year-old man is being questioned. After prayers and a silent vigil, men took turns to express their views. There had been fears that the meeting, held after last prayer of the day – Isha'a – would be a flashpoint, sparking a further round of rioting and looting.

It was clear from snatches of conversation that there were some in the crowd – a minority – who wanted to reap revenge on the black community, whom they held responsible for the deaths. They did not prevail. It is hard to explain how the men gathered in the dark reached the conclusion they did. There was no leader; the forum was open for people to speak and disagree. The consensus among most – after half an hour – was that a planned march should not take place, in part because it would be disrespectful to the families of those who died. Not everyone agreed – and it was impossible to know whether dissenters would break away later in the night and, in breach of the general will, seek retaliation. However community relations in Birmingham play out in the days and weeks to come, the meeting at Dudley Road will serve as evidence of a determination among many not to allow the violence to spiral.

Standing on the wall of the forecourt, one Sikh man, Harpreet Singh, 28, began by imploring others not to take to the streets. He said they had gathered to pay their respects to the deceased and prove they were united. He announced the families of the dead men did not want them to march on the city centre, as had previously been planned. "We need to tell the media we will not tolerate the tyranny, but we will not react either. We are capable, but we will not do it," he said. Singh concluded there were two possible outcomes – either they would protest, and the media would label them "extremists", or they would act "nobly" and be perceived as a community united. He added: "You decide. I will stand with you all the way. I speak to you on behalf of all the Sikhs who were guarding the gurdwaras and mosques yesterday." Some in the crowd, both Muslim and Sikhs, agreed. Others did not, insisting they had come to protest.

"I say peacefully march man," one man shouted. Another said: "Okay, I'm here to do a march, you get me? Let's do a march – but keep it peaceful," said one man, in his 20s. "Yeah, but it won't stay peaceful," interjected someone else. "I know my brothers, it won't stay peaceful." Another voice from the crowd added: "Whoever makes trouble, man, we are going to have to deal with them ourselves. No matter who you are, no matter which area you're from, you are going to get beaten by our elders." There were some chants of "march, march, march". There was another shout of "not today, not today," followed by "who wants a peaceful march - hands up?". A sizeable number of hands were raised. Many, it seemed, had come expecting a demonstration.

An hour before the debate started, the atmosphere had been highly charged, as groups gathered for silent prayers for the dead men. The crowd consisted mostly of young men, many of whom had hoods pulled over their heads. A small number – five or six - had scarves concealing most of their faces. There were older men too, and some community elders. Police kept a low profile at the edge of the gathering. A few held their hats under their arms as prayers were said. Speaking before the debate about whether to protest began, Shaheen Kayani, 46, a cab driver from nearby Hodge Hill, said the Muslim community was pulling together to prevent trouble. "Everybody says to their sons: please don't start another riot. People don't want trouble any more. I just say we want peace, peace, peace." Some of the younger contingent sniggered as he spoke. They were the same teenagers quietly shaking their heads later, listening on from the fringe of the meeting as the tide of opinion turned against street protest.

Some of them urged a reaction. "They've killed them for free, bro," said one man. Others made racist comments about the looters and suspected murderer. But when a man pointed his finger in the air, shouting: "We are going to protest to let them now how we feel", he was shouted down. The crowd had been building, and was halting the traffic. Police gathered nearer to shepherd people off the road. There appeared to be agreement that any protest should take place on Friday, after prayers. One man who had initially been agitating to take to the streets announced he had had changed his stance.

"I've changed my mind, bro. The way I see, the brothers we can't control." Smaller discussions broke out in the crowd. After more debate, one man stepped forward and shouted with a force that lifted his voice above the murmurs. "Make sure you're not marching in the name of the three brothers that died. Because if you're gonna march ... in their name, and you're rioting, it is a disgrace."

There were grunts of approval. A number of people said they would go home. A handful of the masked youths walked away. Those who remained heard stood in near silence, heads bowed as they listened to Sikh and Muslim prayers.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/11/uk-riots-birmingham-muslim-sikhs?CMP=twt_gu​
 

Chinner

Banned
The Incarnation said:
You nuts, that guy has eyes like the Goa'uld off Stargate.. Give me the fucking creeps.
EjTb1.jpg
 

daviyoung

Banned
Nolan. said:
We've already done the fire bit :p plus who doesn't want to see more of Ed in his dad's suit

Out of the fire, into the centre of the sun...

I know more about politics than which politician's eyes look funny and what suits they wear.
 

Nolan.

Member
Why is Cameron flip flopping some of these rioters aren't going to turn around anywhere

daviyoung said:
Out of the fire, into the centre of the sun...

I know more about politics than which politician's eyes look funny and what suits they wear.

Good for you sweetie
 

nib95

Banned
Meus Renaissance said:
When the prime minister, David Cameron, said on Wednesday the riots had brought out "some of the best of Britain", he could not have known how fitting that description would be of events on a petrol station forecourt in the suburb of Birmingham 12 hours later. Spilling out in the road beside the Jet garage, where three Asian men were killed the previous night, around 300 Muslim and Sikh men gathered to debate how they should respond to the tragedy. There were no politicians in sight – no official community spokespeople or religious leaders. These were local men, struggling to know how to manage their grief and anger.

Candles marked the spot where Haroon Jahan, 21, and brothers Shazad Ali, 30 and Abdul Musavir, 31, had been killed in the early hours of Wednesday. The three were part of a group of around 80 guarding the petrol station, on Dudley Road in Winson Green, when they were victims of a hit-and-run. A murder inquiry has been launched, and a 32-year-old man is being questioned. After prayers and a silent vigil, men took turns to express their views. There had been fears that the meeting, held after last prayer of the day – Isha'a – would be a flashpoint, sparking a further round of rioting and looting.

It was clear from snatches of conversation that there were some in the crowd – a minority – who wanted to reap revenge on the black community, whom they held responsible for the deaths. They did not prevail. It is hard to explain how the men gathered in the dark reached the conclusion they did. There was no leader; the forum was open for people to speak and disagree. The consensus among most – after half an hour – was that a planned march should not take place, in part because it would be disrespectful to the families of those who died. Not everyone agreed – and it was impossible to know whether dissenters would break away later in the night and, in breach of the general will, seek retaliation. However community relations in Birmingham play out in the days and weeks to come, the meeting at Dudley Road will serve as evidence of a determination among many not to allow the violence to spiral.

Standing on the wall of the forecourt, one Sikh man, Harpreet Singh, 28, began by imploring others not to take to the streets. He said they had gathered to pay their respects to the deceased and prove they were united. He announced the families of the dead men did not want them to march on the city centre, as had previously been planned. "We need to tell the media we will not tolerate the tyranny, but we will not react either. We are capable, but we will not do it," he said. Singh concluded there were two possible outcomes – either they would protest, and the media would label them "extremists", or they would act "nobly" and be perceived as a community united. He added: "You decide. I will stand with you all the way. I speak to you on behalf of all the Sikhs who were guarding the gurdwaras and mosques yesterday." Some in the crowd, both Muslim and Sikhs, agreed. Others did not, insisting they had come to protest.

"I say peacefully march man," one man shouted. Another said: "Okay, I'm here to do a march, you get me? Let's do a march – but keep it peaceful," said one man, in his 20s. "Yeah, but it won't stay peaceful," interjected someone else. "I know my brothers, it won't stay peaceful." Another voice from the crowd added: "Whoever makes trouble, man, we are going to have to deal with them ourselves. No matter who you are, no matter which area you're from, you are going to get beaten by our elders." There were some chants of "march, march, march". There was another shout of "not today, not today," followed by "who wants a peaceful march - hands up?". A sizeable number of hands were raised. Many, it seemed, had come expecting a demonstration.

An hour before the debate started, the atmosphere had been highly charged, as groups gathered for silent prayers for the dead men. The crowd consisted mostly of young men, many of whom had hoods pulled over their heads. A small number – five or six - had scarves concealing most of their faces. There were older men too, and some community elders. Police kept a low profile at the edge of the gathering. A few held their hats under their arms as prayers were said. Speaking before the debate about whether to protest began, Shaheen Kayani, 46, a cab driver from nearby Hodge Hill, said the Muslim community was pulling together to prevent trouble. "Everybody says to their sons: please don't start another riot. People don't want trouble any more. I just say we want peace, peace, peace." Some of the younger contingent sniggered as he spoke. They were the same teenagers quietly shaking their heads later, listening on from the fringe of the meeting as the tide of opinion turned against street protest.

Some of them urged a reaction. "They've killed them for free, bro," said one man. Others made racist comments about the looters and suspected murderer. But when a man pointed his finger in the air, shouting: "We are going to protest to let them now how we feel", he was shouted down. The crowd had been building, and was halting the traffic. Police gathered nearer to shepherd people off the road. There appeared to be agreement that any protest should take place on Friday, after prayers. One man who had initially been agitating to take to the streets announced he had had changed his stance.

"I've changed my mind, bro. The way I see, the brothers we can't control." Smaller discussions broke out in the crowd. After more debate, one man stepped forward and shouted with a force that lifted his voice above the murmurs. "Make sure you're not marching in the name of the three brothers that died. Because if you're gonna march ... in their name, and you're rioting, it is a disgrace."

There were grunts of approval. A number of people said they would go home. A handful of the masked youths walked away. Those who remained heard stood in near silence, heads bowed as they listened to Sikh and Muslim prayers.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/11/uk-riots-birmingham-muslim-sikhs?CMP=twt_gu

Respect to the Muslim and Sikh brothers. I have massive respect for them. With those numbers and the three deaths, they could have easily reacted and hit the street with vengeance. Glad they stood above it.
 

Osiris

I permanently banned my 6 year old daughter from using the PS4 for mistakenly sending grief reports as it's too hard to watch or talk to her
We need more Section 60 authorisations, they worked in Leicester last night and should have been authorised from the beginning.

The policing should have been proactive at the outset, rather than reactive, especially as their reaction times were worse than a stoner on valium.

Raise the school leaving age to 18, make young offender centres something to be feared rather than laughed at and stop the courts treating young offenders like special snowflakes.
 

Prine

Banned
Yes much respect to that community. And id like to counter the comment about "3 for free". The entire nation is on their side, justice will prevail, through established means. No innocent should have to endure any wrath, and those that are responsible will be brought to justice.
 

Facism

Member
Twinduct said:
prfSW.png


So ...... honestly hope this is just a joke.

Has anyone reported this filth, irregardless of whether it's a joke or not? Her twitter paints her as a massive bellend with no morality.

[edit]nm linked and reported to a policeman friend in Kingston.
 
I was listening to LBC radio over the course of these days and I think the radio hosts made a good point that people shouldn't blame crime behaviour for boredom. In the past people had less to do but didn't resort to these type of things, it is inexcusable. There are obviously problems with society that cause people to be this way, but not entirely alone. Parents yield a lot responsibility in shaping the morals and attitudes of their kids in the first years.
 
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