Support NeoGAF

[wipeout364]

Its going to be all old school now. Like in the early nineties with all those player numbers and city names. Seriously though this is shitty. I wish people would boycott EA football for a couple of years, though no one will. HAving exclusive rights is bad for everyone except EA. I really hope this is not the start of a trend with hockey and basketball next.

 

[Guileless]

You have to assume that EA offered the NFL more than it expected to get from EA, VC, 989, Midway, and Microsoft combined for the next 5 years. You could also assume that the NFL charged an exclusivity premium because the deal is worth a lot more to EA since it's exclusive. I don't know anything about professional sports licensing, but it's got to be just a massive number.

I want an extended Wall Street Journal piece that reveals how this happened, why it happened, and most importantly the price that made it happen.

 

[DarienA]

Ouch... and ouch.... and... OUCH.... let the EA hate swell!

The loss of the license will hurt, but like soccer games I'm not sure what real damage it's going to do.

Like most folks I say good move by EA... and f*cked up move by EA.

 

[Mama Smurf]

As has been said, there have been many, many...sigh..."soccer" games over the years without a license. And I don't think having a license has EVER been a sign of quality in the genre.

Of course, I'm assuming you guys care about the gameplay here, but maybe it's the names attahced which mean more to you.

 

[Lazy8s]

Despite being priced lower at retail, 2K5 was paying full rates to the National Football League for its license and selling a comparable number of units to Madden. EA must easily be paying a lot more than twice what they were for this deal.

 

[AniHawk]

As has been said, there have been many, many...sigh..."soccer" games over the years without a license. And I don't think having a license has EVER been a sign of quality in the genre.

Of course, I'm assuming you guys care about the gameplay here, but maybe it's the names attahced which mean more to you.

Think it comes down to a sales thing. Sega/VC/Take-Two can't use ESPN NFL 2KX anymore. They were doing very well with the move to $20 and it most likely made them a nice profit. Sega's already hurtin'. Been hurtin' for years. It's not like they turn out crap sports titles, and once it finally got popular and things were looking up, a lot of that got taken away.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Wow, looks like EA got scared of the Take-Two/Sega/VC combo on their asses this year eating some of 'their' pie. WTF?

 

[Drek]

This is rather obnoxious. Guess I'm done buying EA's games. Hell, I like Madden more than VC's ESPN series and I'm still not cool with this shit.

I never pirate games but EA makes me wish I did, only theirs though.

 

[kaching]

Exclusivity does not benefit the NFL brand in any way -- the existence of multiple official NFL licensors did not restrict each other's access to NFL property. This move simply limits the NFL brand's exposure since the NFL 2K titles had expanded the market with their sales and reached a new price demographic.

Disingenuous answer, Lazy. You didn't answer the question you quoted.

Established competitors aren't suddenly disallowed from even competing in book or movie license markets since those licenses weren't being granted to multiple parties in the first place.

Since when does a license granted promise a free ride into perpetuity? This new approach could have just as serious repercussions for EA 5 yrs down the road (or sooner if the NFL put smart escape clauses in) if the NFL and Players Association choose not to renew with them.

EDIT: Meanwhile, nobody is stopping anyone from making quality football products, sans license.

 

[keiichi]

This is a great PR stunt.

EA has been in the news lately for over working employees on their products, well, now we can rest easy knowing that the Madden Dev. Team will have plenty of time working on other projects since the code for Madden 2005-2010 is already complete.

yay!

 

[Mama Smurf]

Think it comes down to a sales thing. Sega/VC/Take-Two can't use ESPN NFL 2KX anymore. They were doing very well with the move to $20 and it most likely made them a nice profit. Sega's already hurtin'. Been hurtin' for years. It's not like they turn out crap sports titles, and once it finally got popular and things were looking up, a lot of that got taken away.

What VC need to do now is work really, REALLY hard on making an awesome football game. That'll probably require not releasing a game next year, take at least a couple of years to really work on it until they know they're way ahead of Madden in gameplay terms. Then release the title, without a license sure, but with all very similar names and an editor built in so if you really want to, you can have all the right names in there.

That's all I can see for them. They need to show that their game is best, even if Madden has the license. It's what Konami did for years.

And if that doesn't work...time to stop making football games. Try and outbid EA in 5 years time.

 

[cvxfreak]

Now I'm glad I don't buy EA games.

 

[Katana_Strikes]

This is a very sad day indeed.

 

[PhatSaqs]

ESPN Pro Football 2K6 does have a nice ring to it

 

[dskillzhtown]

Ouch... and ouch.... and... OUCH.... let the EA hate swell!

The loss of the license will hurt, but like soccer games I'm not sure what real damage it's going to do.

Like most folks I say good move by EA... and f*cked up move by EA.

IAWTP, so much hate from many people who don't care about sports games anyway. I think it is a great move by EA. I mean, it is a brilliant move. Especially if they have formed a REAL partnership with the NFL. Meaning Madden kiosks at the Pro Bowl, Madden intros at games, Madden clips on every NFL show, etc.

For the NFL, is the move really that bad? In their eyes, they are getting a crapload of money from EA and I believe that they consider Madden the truly superior NFL videogame. From their involvement with Madden Bowl and the Madden series being in the Hall of Fame you can tell who is their favorite.

EA did this with NASCAR as well. A couple of good series were lost in that. EA did lose the F1 license a couple of years ago.

 

[Dilbert]

First of all, fuck EA. And I don't even play sports games.

Second, what does it mean that BOTH the NFLPA and EA denied that this story was true...before it turned out that the story was, in fact, true? Can corporations just say whatever the hell they want now? I really wish someone would call them on the carpet and bitch at them for blatantly lying.

Both Electronic Arts and the NFL Players Association have moved to deny reports that they are working towards a major exclusive deal for player rights licensing, with the Sports Business Journal retracting its original story.

"The story published in Sports Business Journal includes some serious errors related to agreements between EA and its partners," Electronic Arts spokesman Glen O'Connell told gi.biz. "The financials reported in the story are incorrect by an order of magnitude and the NFL Players Association has contacted the publisher to request a correction."

The NFL Players Association has also separately denied the reports, which suggested that EA would enter into a four-year exclusive licensing deal with Players, Inc (NFLPA's licensing arm) costing some $250 million per year.

Does this mean that they will allow the financial terms of the deal to be examined? They forced a retraction because of an "order of magnitude" mistake in the price...and I find it VERY hard to believe that an exclusive license would be granted for $25M/year.

 

[DarienA]

BTW a few folks here seem to be thinking this deal took place BECAUSE of sales this year.... but wasn't this rumored to be in talks like a YEAR ago at least? I vaguely remember hearing something a bit back....

 

[puck1337]

Dear EA,

Suck a dick.

p.s. Please do not buy my wife.

 

[DopeyFish]

Yes it was rumored.

It sorta sucks I gotta wait 5 1/2 years for a good football game tho :/

 

[sonycowboy]

You have to assume that EA offered the NFL more than it expected to get from EA, VC, 989, Midway, and Microsoft combined for the next 5 years. You could also assume that the NFL charged an exclusivity premium because the deal is worth a lot more to EA since it's exclusive. I don't know anything about professional sports licensing, but it's got to be just a massive number.

I want an extended Wall Street Journal piece that reveals how this happened, why it happened, and most importantly the price that made it happen.

Given that EA has had at least a 70% market share every single year since 1999, including this one, when you add those other guys numbers together, it doesn't add up to much.

I'm sure the number is big given that it's over 5 years, but many of you are carried away with assuming it's a monstrous number.

When I made the thread about how Take-Two could possibly be making money on their title @ $20, people said volume :lol

$20 retail

of which
$5 is the margin for retailers
$3 is manufacturing
$3 is royalty (on a $20 game)
------------------------------------
leaving $9 to be distributed among:

NFL
NFL Player Association
Terrell Owens as coverboy
Take-Two
Sega
VC

Because of Take-Two, EA was losing $20 profit off of each title sold @$29.99 (after the first two and a half million sold at full price).

If EA just doubled what they were giving the NFL & Players association, that would be a number no other publisher could touch.

 

[Guileless]

sonycowboy, are you saying that the licensing fees that publishers pay to the NFL and the NFLPA is based on the number of units sold rather than a flat fee?

 

[AstroLad]

Looks like I'm on an all-Winning Eleven sports diet now.

I can't even begin to fathom what new depths of staleness EA will discover with this regime in place.

 

[Miguel]

EA's schedule for next year

July 1st: Madden 2006: Training Camp
August 1st: Madden 2006: Preaseason
Sept 10th: Madden 2006: Week 1
Sept 17th: Madden 2006: Week 2
Sept 24th: Madden 2006: Week 3
Oct 1st: Madden 2006: Week 4
Oct 8th: Madden 2006: Week 5
Oct 15th: Madden 2006: Week 6
Oct 22nd: Madden 2006: Week 7
Oct 29th: Madden 2006: Week 8
Nov 5th: Madden 2006: Week 9
Nov 12th: Madden 2006: Week 10
Nov 17th: Madden 2006: Week 11 (TURDUCKEN EDITION)
Nov 19th: Madden 2006: Week 11
Nov 26th: Madden 2006: Week 12
Dec 3rd: Madden 2006: Week 13
Dec 10th: Madden 2006: Week 14
Dec 17th: Madden 2006: Week 15
Dec 24th: Madden 2006: Week 16
Dec 31st: Madden 2006: Week 17
Jan 7th: Madden 2006: AFC Wild Card Round
Jan 7th: Madden 2006: NFC Wild Card Round
Jan 14th: Madden 2006: AFC Divisional Round
Jan 14th: Madden 2006: NFC Divisional Round
Jan 21st: Madden 2006: AFC Championship Round
Jan 21st: Madden 2006: NFC Championship Round
Feb 4th: Madden 2006: Superbowl XL (AFC EDITION)
Feb 4th: Madden 2006: Superbowl XL (NFC EDITION)

 

[Musashi Wins!]

eh...in football I like EA's game better. But this is pretty sickening. I've done my share to defend them in plenty of hate threads in the beginning of the year and such but...they really are a repulsive sort of game company

 

[Willco]

EA SIGNS AN ALL-NEW PARTNERSHIP WITH JESUS, GOD TO HOLD EXCLUSIVE RIGHTS TO HEAVEN

Mon Dec 13, 2004 07:36 PM ET
LOS ANGELES, Dec 13 (Reuters) - Just hours after signing a record setting deal with the NFL and Player's Inc., video game publisher Electronic Arts Inc. also announced that it had negotiated separate deals with Jesus and God for the sole rights to heaven. The five-year exclusivity deal with Jesus allows EA to maintain control of admittance into the pearly gates, while the ten-year contract with God gives EA majority shareholder status of heaven.

"We've faced a lot of heavy competition in the video game industry this year," said EA chief executive Larry Probst, "But this deal allows us to penetrate a market of billions of Christians, especially those in the 'Red States', and their faith-installed subscription base."

The licensing agreement is an exclusive for not only heaven, but most of space, which includes the highly lucrative Mars, and may be a potential goldmine for EA.

"If there is indeed life on Mars," said Probst, "We know they will want copies of Madden."

 

[GhaleonEB]

EA's schedule for next year

July 1st: Madden 2006: Training Camp
August 1st: Madden 2006: Preaseason
Sept 10th: Madden 2006: Week 1
Sept 17th: Madden 2006: Week 2
Sept 24th: Madden 2006: Week 3
Oct 1st: Madden 2006: Week 4
Oct 8th: Madden 2006: Week 5
Oct 15th: Madden 2006: Week 6
Oct 22nd: Madden 2006: Week 7
Oct 29th: Madden 2006: Week 8
Nov 5th: Madden 2006: Week 9
Nov 12th: Madden 2006: Week 10
Nov 17th: Madden 2006: Week 11 (TURDUCKEN EDITION)
Nov 19th: Madden 2006: Week 11
Nov 26th: Madden 2006: Week 12
Dec 3rd: Madden 2006: Week 13
Dec 10th: Madden 2006: Week 14
Dec 17th: Madden 2006: Week 15
Dec 24th: Madden 2006: Week 16
Dec 31st: Madden 2006: Week 17
Jan 7th: Madden 2006: AFC Wild Card Round
Jan 7th: Madden 2006: NFC Wild Card Round
Jan 14th: Madden 2006: AFC Divisional Round
Jan 14th: Madden 2006: NFC Divisional Round
Jan 21st: Madden 2006: AFC Championship Round
Jan 21st: Madden 2006: NFC Championship Round
Feb 4th: Madden 2006: Superbowl XL (AFC EDITION)
Feb 4th: Madden 2006: Superbowl XL (NFC EDITION)

And all the content will be exaclty the same as the year before, but with new player stats.

Seriously, I'm expecting to see news of massive layoffs at EA: "Sorry guys, no need to innovate or update anything but stats - no competition = no effort needed."

Fuck us all.

 

[Lazy8s]

kaching:

Disingenuous answer, Lazy. You didn't answer the question you quoted.

It answers the question exactly: there is no benefit to the NFL brand from this. Gaining exclusive license does not allow EA to do anything more with an NFL game than could've been done before, and it only limits the brand's market penetration.

Since when does a license granted promise a free ride into perpetuity? This new approach could have just as serious repercussions for EA 5 yrs down the road (or sooner if the NFL put smart escape clauses in) if the NFL and Players Association chooses not to renew with them.

This has nothing to do with the difference between a market that gets closed off to participants who were already established and a market that wasn't open to multiple participants in the first place, the issue you contested. An established competitor like SEGA Visual Concepts is especially hurt by this kind of anti-competitive practice because they'd already invested in some fixed development and publishing infrastructure specifically for NFL games which now goes to waste.

Meanwhile, nobody is stopping anyone from making quality football products, sans license.

There isn't a major market for football games, just NFL games.

 

[Bishman]

EA: Hey Sony, we are in development of a new Bond title, mind helping us with the development cost?
Sony: We don't care about your Bond series, look at Goldeneye: Rogue Agent's sales. Terrible sales, we aren't giving you nothing!
EA: Alright Sony, I guess you don't want Madden.
Sony:

 

[sonycowboy]

Wow, looks like EA got scared of the Take-Two/Sega/VC combo on their asses this year eating some of 'their' pie. WTF?

I can't say I'm surprised at the responses, but Take-Two/Sega have no one to blame but themselves. They're the ones who said, "damn the profits" and did a slash and burn to football on VG's bottom line. EA was perfectly happy letting Take-Two have it's little piece of the pie and to let the games compete fairly at retail (albiet with all the cards in EA's favor, including marketing). As I've already said, they MADE EA do this.

EA will make more money with this arrangement than if they left it as it is this year.

 

[GhaleonEB]

And what happens to Sega's five-year deal with ESPN? Talk about a sunk cost.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Take-Two said the Sega NFL game was not a "material contributor" to its profits, but nonetheless it condemned the exclusive NFL/EA deal.

"We believe that the decisions of the National Football League and Players Inc. to grant an exclusive license for video games do a tremendous disservice to the consumers and sports fans, whose funds ultimately support the NFL, by limiting their choices, curbing creativity and almost certainly leading to higher game prices," Take-Two said in a statement.

.

 

[Jimmy Carter]

Well, appears I'm on a full-out NFL/EA hate excursion now. Not going to buy any EA games, or even watch the NFL until this is rectified.

This has to, on some legal level, be illegal. And if not, something needs to be done about it. This is simply wrong.

 

[Chi-Town]

According to Gamespot's article http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/12/13/news_6114977.html
the NFL came up with the idea of an exclusive license and shopped it around to at least 5 different companies including EA.

 

[cja]

Milk

EA chief executive Larry Probst told Reuters the company plans to use the license for new game franchises outside of "Madden" and the "NFL Street" brand.

"You can imagine that there will be additional products in different genres than the pure simulation game and the arcade genre," Probst said.

Latest Reuters update with comments from the NFL PA and Take Two

 

[sonycowboy]

detail

EA's current roster of NFL games includes the top-selling Madden franchise and the extreme football NFL Street franchise. Given that EA currently has no "manager games" per se, there is clear writing on the wall that the publisher will announce a new sports management lineup of products, though it refused to comment on when.

A source close to the negotiations said it was at a spring, 2004, off-site meeting attended by top NFL officials that the league determined it would take the league license exclusive. GameSpot was told the league put the license up for bid and that EA was among as many as five software publishers competing for it. An EA spokesperson said today, "Obviously, exclusives are more expensive. We are most certainly paying a premium."

In a statement, Larry Probst, Chairman and CEO of Electronic Arts said, "We are excited about the opportunity to further enhance our relationship with the NFL and PLAYERS INC. The five-year agreements will usher NFL fans through the console technology transition with new ideas and innovative game play experiences."

The deal is obviously bad news for EA's competitors, particularly ESPN Videogames, Sega, and Take-Two who stole a respectable chunk of EA's Madden football market with their NFL 2K series and it's budget price tag this year of $19.99.

Arguably, the deal will impact consumers negatively as well. With less choice, theories of competition no longer apply. Some industry insiders speculate the exclusive deal was embraced by the NFL after it saw Take-Two lower the price of its 2K5 product earlier this year. No licensor likes to see a price war being fought with its brand value at stake. At the same time, exclusive licenses in the sports world are more the norm than non-exclusive licenses. The NFL's apparel license is a Reebok exclusive, as is its beverage license with Gatorade.

This afternoon, Take-Two issued the following statement: “While sports games in general are an important part of Take-Two's product diversification strategy, the licensed NFL game we distributed on behalf of Sega this year was not a material contributor to our profitability to date, nor was it expected to be a meaningful contributor in the upcoming year. We remain committed to continued diversification of our product portfolio, including sports.

"We believe that the decisions of the National Football League and PLAYERS INC to grant an exclusive license for videogames do a tremendous disservice to the consumers and sports fans whose funds ultimately support the NFL, by limiting their choices, curbing creativity and almost certainly leading to higher game prices.”

"I really respect them, but the consumer really loses," one analyst told GameSpot. "EA is both evil and really smart." :lol

As for such a deal affecting quality of future football products, EA's vice president of corporate communications Jeff Brown told GameSpot, "The onus is on EA to keep making a better game each year…that's the hurdle you have to clear every year."

 

[Incognito]

Ouch... and ouch.... and... OUCH.... let the EA hate swell!

The loss of the license will hurt, but like soccer games I'm not sure what real damage it's going to do.

Like most folks I say good move by EA... and f*cked up move by EA.

You're comparing Madden and VC to SOCCER GAMES? :lol :lol :lol

Whatever makes you EA drones sleep easier at night...

 

[AstroLad]

Darien-

Well soccer is a totally different beast (not even counting the sales difference). First of all, Winning Eleven blows out FIFA gameplay-wise by more of a margin than has ever existed in football in the minds of 99% of the soccer fans who have played both, so people are more likely to overlook the lack of a license. Secondly, in soccer national teams are a big part of the game, and that's all correct in WE, so that's a huge part of the "realistic" feel that doesn't even pertain to the license. No national teams in football. Also, Konami contracts w/ individual leagues, so though they don't have everything, it's good enough and the editor is such that you can recreate basically anything you want. At this point, there's basically no way in hell anyone would try to compete w/ Madden w/o a license and success would be impossible unless someone made a game that just absolutely annihilated Madden, which would cost tons to develop and the risk of loss (no license, EA mindshare) wouldn't make that worthwhile.

 

[jobber]

this shit sucks. 5 years, i've picked 2K over Madden. I got Madden with my GC in 02 and it was soooooo boring after playing 2K. I hope EA goes down like Enron.

 

[DSN2K]

Sega better Sue for the good the gaming industry.

 

[Willco]

Sega better Sue for the good the gaming industry.

They'd only lose more money.

 

[belgurdo]

Helloooo, return to $70 "upgrades" due to lack of competition once again

 

[Chi-Town]

As much flak as EA is taking I can only wonder how bad it would be if one of the other 5 companies snagged the NFL rights, in particular Microsoft or Sony(I'm sure they were 2 of the 5). I bet they might've even entertained the idea briefly. But pissing off EA and ,more importantly, rival system's owners who you hope to sell your next generation systems to in the near future probably made the deal a lot less attractive.

 

[jetjevons]

IAWTP, so much hate from many people who don't care about sports games anyway. I think it is a great move by EA. I mean, it is a brilliant move. Especially if they have formed a REAL partnership with the NFL. Meaning Madden kiosks at the Pro Bowl, Madden intros at games, Madden clips on every NFL show, etc.

For the NFL, is the move really that bad? In their eyes, they are getting a crapload of money from EA and I believe that they consider Madden the truly superior NFL videogame. From their involvement with Madden Bowl and the Madden series being in the Hall of Fame you can tell who is their favorite.

EA did this with NASCAR as well. A couple of good series were lost in that. EA did lose the F1 license a couple of years ago.

This is terrible news for Football fans. EA no longer needs to innovate. For example we know that EA had features complete for NFU2 that they DELIBERATELY CUT because they felt they already had enough for a sequel and why not save that feature for 3. We can now expect innovation in the Madden series to slow to a crawl. With no competition they can rest on their laurels.

Also I heard the amount was around a billion dollars.

 

[firex]

holy shit this pisses me off and i don't even buy football games, i just watch the real games. now i'm never buying one until this deal ends.

 

[JayFro]

I'm done with EA games. Now they can continue with yearly roster updates and shitty graphics but they won't be getting my $$$.

 

[AirBrian]

First of all, fuck EA. And I don't even play sports games.

Second, what does it mean that BOTH the NFLPA and EA denied that this story was true...before it turned out that the story was, in fact, true? Can corporations just say whatever the hell they want now? I really wish someone would call them on the carpet and bitch at them for blatantly lying.

Does this mean that they will allow the financial terms of the deal to be examined? They forced a retraction because of an "order of magnitude" mistake in the price...and I find it VERY hard to believe that an exclusive license would be granted for $25M/year.

Both Electronic Arts and the NFL Players Association have moved to deny reports that they are working towards a major exclusive deal for player rights licensing, with the Sports Business Journal retracting its original story.

"The story published in Sports Business Journal includes some serious errors related to agreements between EA and its partners," Electronic Arts spokesman Glen O'Connell told gi.biz. "The financials reported in the story are incorrect by an order of magnitude and the NFL Players Association has contacted the publisher to request a correction."

The NFL Players Association has also separately denied the reports, which suggested that EA would enter into a four-year exclusive licensing deal with Players, Inc (NFLPA's licensing arm) costing some $250 million per year.

Well technically, they were accurate to deny the rumored 4-year deal. They just left out the part that a 5-year deal was in the works. :lol :-(

 

[Dilbert]

Well technically, they were accurate to deny the rumored 4-year deal. They just left out the part that a 5-year deal was in the works. :lol :-(

Well, the "order of magnitude" comment is one thing...but Players Inc. also said in another story that I read that nothing other than the "normal licensing deals were in the works."

I'm being entirely serious -- if companies can get in trouble for insider trading, why shouldn't they get in trouble for bad-faith public denials of a story which turns out to be substantially true as reported?

 

[john tv]

I guess I'll be boycotting EA games from now on. I only bought one in the last couple of years anyway (Burnout 3), but next time I'll just pass. This isn't the way to promote and grow an industry, this is how you kill it. Idiots.

 

[DarienA]

<can't wait for the next big EA release to watch the grumbling.....>

I'm curious... since the NFL came up with the idea and shopped it around according to the gamespot article will you whiners also be boycotting the NFL?

BTW If I'm an EA drone... then I certainly enjoy watching a few of you squirm.... dance for me b*tches.

 

[AirBrian]

Well, the "order of magnitude" comment is one thing...but Players Inc. also said in another story that I read that nothing other than the "normal licensing deals were in the works."

I'm being entirely serious -- if companies can get in trouble for insider trading, why shouldn't they get in trouble for bad-faith public denials of a story which turns out to be substantially true as reported?

Yeah, I know what you are saying. I guess the only thing I can think of is that if for some reason the deal fell through, that could negatively impact the stock. It's still wrong though.