demigod
Member
You poor child.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PS5 will outsell Xbox Series consoles 2-to-1 this year, Ampere Analysis forecasts
- Thread starter IbizaPocholo
- Start date
- Opinion Business Analysis
MikeM
Member
Is there a link to this data source?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Don't know, but this was a reality back in 2016.
Black Ops 3 had an 85% PlayStation 4 attach rate in the US in Q1
I’ve always wondered how beneficial those co-marketing deals between game publishers and platforms holders can be. It seems like the Call of Duty one with PlayStation is working out just fine.
www.criticalhit.net
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
I've said it in the past, but while the specific case of them buying Zenimax was fine (they were about to lose funding, needed someone to buy them), and even ABK in isolation is "fine" (they want to sell, MS is a buyer willing to purchase)...it's the combination of these actions and what they could enable if just left to go about freely which can be a negative to gamers and the market, IMO.
My main issues are that for Microsoft, it's a LOT of studios/IP/talent to take onboard when they historically have had issues managing just a small collection of internal teams. We have seen very little of content from Zenimax teams produced fully under the ownership, funding & guidance of Microsoft to tell whether or not it makes for better games from those teams as a net benefit being owned by a platform holder, and yet they are rushing into buying an even larger publisher before we the gamers/customers have seen any genuine fruit bore out of the Zenimax deal (or a lot of the 2018 purchases like Ninja Theory, Compulsion, inXile, Double Fine (excusing Psychonauts 2) etc.). Microsoft don't have an infinite budget for funding games, so there's a risk gamers may miss out on certain IP not coming back because MS are now the sole funder of development, vs. before each of those teams/pubs could have gotten funding from independent investors, banks, even crowdfunding etc. It might also lead to some creatives at studios feeling like they aren't being paid enough attention to with getting required resources, guidance etc. so there's a risk of talent exodus too, the more internal teams you keep piling up & bringing in.
For gamers, if they'd been accustomed to an IP being multiplat for a long time, and now they can't play new installments on the ecosystem they're already invested in, they lose in a sense because they have to spend money to get access to that IP going forward (I'm not saying this is a bad thing in isolation but, when compounded with other factors, it can potentially be pretty bad). Their favorite once-3P teams might no longer be able to make certain games, leading to decreased output from them or content not to their liking (we've seen this with Rare for example). For the market as a whole, it consolidates more labor under a single entity (since some of these publishers also have support studios within them that previously may have been lent out to studios of other 3P publishers, but that may not happen as much anymore if a platform holder buys them). MS's specific pattern and timing with acquisitions may also trigger other big tech companies to go after other big publishers and, if they're challenged by regulators, sue them while pointing to MS's getting approval for ABK (and Zenimax) as proof that they, too, should be allowed to buy any number of publisher to be able to "compete".
Of course there's an easy way to say it's bad for customers: they have to pay more for a product they want. But, that's the reality with inflation, so if that's the only way you can say it's bad for customers, that can be used against every other product ever made.
I was talking home consoles and while, yes, the Wii outsold PS3, it also had a very severe drop in sales the way most consoles have never exhibited. Its success also did nothing for the Wii U, whereas PS3's rebound directly contributed to the PS4's successful start.
Let's not jump the gun and call Game Pass a "resounding" success. If it were, it would not have begun stagnation on the new consoles just two years into the console generation cycle. If it were, we'd actually get at least Game Pass annual revenue figures directly from Microsoft, or at least what percentage of Xbox annual revenue is contributed to by Game Pass.
You seem to have missed the point of Sony's PS+ revamp. It wasn't so much to increase sub count (where, yes, it lost about 1.9 million), but increase revenue, which it DID do. Quite a lot, in fact. Something that Game Pass can't have claimed it accomplished in 2022, both in terms of revenue increase or sub growth. So aside from some issues with the PS+ Platinum tier which Sony should do better with, I'd say the revamp had its intended effect.
I'm focusing on revenue/profit instead of MAU because truth be told, all console models factor in MAU to some extent. It's just that Sony & Nintendo are understanding enough that it isn't the only (or most important) factor so as to obfuscate their console numbers the way Microsoft does. And if Game Pass growth has been strongly tied to sales of Xbox consoles, why would console sales not be a factor to projecting Game Pass growth?
Then find a better source.
And who's fault is that? Sony's for waiting until they ceased PS3 production before reporting final PS3 numbers, or Microsoft for abruptly ending number reporting for all consoles in 2015 due to slagging XBO sales? All I said was at the end of the day, PS3 outsold 360. Not by some massive amount, certainly not in the US & UK markets. But the common figures put out there by both companies show PS3 as ever-so-slightly ahead WW.
At the end of the day though, it really doesn't matter too much because whether PS3 outsold 360 in units or not, it absolutely outdid the 360 in the end years with a focus on hardcore and core-orientated exclusive games, while the 360 veered off into casual territory with the Kinect. This trajectory for both systems was a subtle signal for what paths their successors ended up pursuing, and for PS the payoff was more or less immediate.
It doesn't just apply to PS5, but the truth of the matter is, Sony have invested in multiple global markets for generations whereas Microsoft have not. Therefore the PlayStation brand in a lot of these places is a lot more popular, and what benefits Xbox would get in these markets in terms of sales is relatively small by comparison.
It will take multiple years and generations of MS prioritizing more global markets to build up the sort of mindshare with their brand that Sony has been doing with a lot of these global markets since the mid-1990s'.
Like I said, I just want to cut past the corporate BS that have come from the Xbox division the past few years. It's a culmination of things, going back to last generation, and various broken promises, combined with some of the things I see supposed game media doing that often comes off as propaganda, and I dislike that.
This company told us for many years that sales no longer mattered for them, until they were outselling their direct competitor in NPD for a few months. Then suddenly sales mattered again. They want to dictate when people should pay attention to sales, and the terms for them are obvious: sales should only matter when Xbox is outselling PlayStation. If it isn't, then suddenly sales no longer matter. Well sorry Aaron, Phil, Satya & the rest of Microsoft, but that's not how this works. Sales have always mattered. They aren't the only metric of importance, of course, but they matter enough to discuss them, and not just when Microsoft says it's okay to talk numbers.
So that's why I do it, and hopefully that was understandable. I respect that you and I probably see differently on this topic, it is what it is. Sometimes you'll actually find me agreeing with certain things Microsoft/Xbox are doing, but personally I feel like those moments have become less and less since prior to the launch of the new consoles. We'll see if they can ever make enough sensible moves (and preferably, a lot of that means having better transparency, more consistent messaging & transparency, and working with what they've got vs. buying up stuff when they're still struggling with what they currently have, in most cases) in the future that get me singing a different tune.
You simply can't get 151 million for PS4 & PS5 at end of 2021 unless you're including later PS3 and PS Vita hardware numbers. Or even PSVR (which shouldn't be the case, because that is a peripheral).
The numbers MS provided to the CMA of Sony's install base with that report were either misleading, or also included 360 numbers on Microsoft's end.
yurinka
I know you've pointed out that Statista's figure might be based on VGChartz and, well, VGChartz are pretty bad, but I think it would be fair to then round down those 360 numbers by 900K. You're still left with 3 million out of that 63.7 million figure being 360s, a minimum 50 million XBO, that leaves 10.7 million for Series S & X as of end of 2021 (sold-through).Not really demanding anything. MS have made it a habit to provide that type of info in blog posts and statements, so what's wrong with expecting that to continue. It's like with Sony setting expectations for a Showcase every year, then they skipped doing one in 2022.
Pointing that out isn't "demanding" anything, it's just showing that a certain expectation or pattern was not met, was broken. As for Sony software sales, well yes it's a bit curious about that. If they don't provide some outright numbers for GT7, HFW, TLOU Part 1 Remake in particular in their next fiscal report, I think that might signal something they have to take into consideration going forward.
We have some indication where those games are in select regions; HFW for example was the #8 best-selling game in NA for 2022, not counting bundles. So if we ever got numbers for, say, the #7 and #9 best-selling games of 2022 for NPD, then we'd know where HFW numbers landed for that region, that year. But alongside sales, revenue generated from each game also matters a lot, perhaps even more so, so again I think we'll see what's up there in the next fiscal report.
If I didn't care about Xbox, I wouldn't be talking about it. Truth is, there are things about the brand I like, but there are things I CLEARLY don't like about it, either, and 90% of those have to do with PR, messaging, and how they chase optics above everything else, including real results. Or their hypocrisy, downplaying of certain things while supporting even more niche stuff, enabling certain toxicity in console discussion online with fans and media, quite a lot of the things they've said & done in trying to acquire ABK, the fact they do some of the same exclusivity deals with 3P that Sony does and yet it's only Sony who get called out for it as if it's a bad thing, so on and so forth.
I want the brand to do better but there are way too many enablers who simply make up BS about PS & Sony to artificially make it look like MS & Xbox are doing better than they actually are in growing and strengthening their brand.
Well sure, 30 million/2 = 15 million, not 16/17/18 million. Personally I never said they were 2:1, just that there is a likely range for total Series sold as of end-year 2022 and it's probably not as much as some diehards want to imagine it being, if you look at all the data.
Never mind,
SenjutsuSage
already explained it.What he didn't tell you is I'm gonna win
Exactly. 16 million (or, IF you're willing to make some concessions with certain data, upwards 19 million or so) sold-through for Xbox Series as of end-year 2022 is nothing to sneeze it. It's not bad, even if there's a likelihood they're tracking a bit behind XBO, and they only have better things to look forward to this year with system sales.
I just dislike that now sales matter again for some people when, not even a year ago, sales discussion was their kryptonite. But leave it to MS to spark this again; a lot of the same people who suddenly care about sales once more seem to take issue with the fact some of us aren't seeing any realistic way they're within spitting distance to PS5 global sales, or aren't at 20 million or more. Just because we look at more than vague PR statements from a platform holder who still refuses to provide direct numbers to either retailers or end customers.
That's really what's irritating some people, I feel. That the gap is probably larger than they want to accept. But it's all just about probabilities, that's it.
I only looked deeper into something YOU brought back up, the data MS provided to the CMA. I questioned the changes in methodology between the Xbox numbers in that data and the PS numbers.
Why were PS units counted as 151 million at end of 2021, unless PS3 and PS Vita units were also included (since they continued manufacture post-2013)? And did MS apply similar to their Xbox numbers in that same report by including 360 units sold? Or did they use a completely different methodology for their own numbers?
Because if so, then they just misled the CMA with worthless numbers because the two sets being compared, have different methods applied to produce the numbers listed. That's...NOT a good thing. Which is why I assume MS did include 360 numbers in that figure, which is why I've brought it up.
Those are your choices. Pick one.
Amazing, now you're trying to throw "sold (on paper)" into this. So, what? You doubt PS5 actually sold 2 million in Japan now? Are you taking the "on paper" talk from 2020 that was about console performance, and just using the term now for sales figures that companies can be sued for if they lied about?
That is hilarious.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
I've said it in the past, but while the specific case of them buying Zenimax was fine (they were about to lose funding, needed someone to buy them), and even ABK in isolation is "fine" (they want to sell, MS is a buyer willing to purchase)...it's the combination of these actions and what they could enable if just left to go about freely which can be a negative to gamers and the market, IMO.
My main issues are that for Microsoft, it's a LOT of studios/IP/talent to take onboard when they historically have had issues managing just a small collection of internal teams. We have seen very little of content from Zenimax teams produced fully under the ownership, funding & guidance of Microsoft to tell whether or not it makes for better games from those teams as a net benefit being owned by a platform holder, and yet they are rushing into buying an even larger publisher before we the gamers/customers have seen any genuine fruit bore out of the Zenimax deal (or a lot of the 2018 purchases like Ninja Theory, Compulsion, inXile, Double Fine (excusing Psychonauts 2) etc.). Microsoft don't have an infinite budget for funding games, so there's a risk gamers may miss out on certain IP not coming back because MS are now the sole funder of development, vs. before each of those teams/pubs could have gotten funding from independent investors, banks, even crowdfunding etc. It might also lead to some creatives at studios feeling like they aren't being paid enough attention to with getting required resources, guidance etc. so there's a risk of talent exodus too, the more internal teams you keep piling up & bringing in.
For gamers, if they'd been accustomed to an IP being multiplat for a long time, and now they can't play new installments on the ecosystem they're already invested in, they lose in a sense because they have to spend money to get access to that IP going forward (I'm not saying this is a bad thing in isolation but, when compounded with other factors, it can potentially be pretty bad). Their favorite once-3P teams might no longer be able to make certain games, leading to decreased output from them or content not to their liking (we've seen this with Rare for example). For the market as a whole, it consolidates more labor under a single entity (since some of these publishers also have support studios within them that previously may have been lent out to studios of other 3P publishers, but that may not happen as much anymore if a platform holder buys them). MS's specific pattern and timing with acquisitions may also trigger other big tech companies to go after other big publishers and, if they're challenged by regulators, sue them while pointing to MS's getting approval for ABK (and Zenimax) as proof that they, too, should be allowed to buy any number of publisher to be able to "compete".
Of course there's an easy way to say it's bad for customers: they have to pay more for a product they want. But, that's the reality with inflation, so if that's the only way you can say it's bad for customers, that can be used against every other product ever made.
I was talking home consoles and while, yes, the Wii outsold PS3, it also had a very severe drop in sales the way most consoles have never exhibited. Its success also did nothing for the Wii U, whereas PS3's rebound directly contributed to the PS4's successful start.
Let's not jump the gun and call Game Pass a "resounding" success. If it were, it would not have begun stagnation on the new consoles just two years into the console generation cycle. If it were, we'd actually get at least Game Pass annual revenue figures directly from Microsoft, or at least what percentage of Xbox annual revenue is contributed to by Game Pass.
You seem to have missed the point of Sony's PS+ revamp. It wasn't so much to increase sub count (where, yes, it lost about 1.9 million), but increase revenue, which it DID do. Quite a lot, in fact. Something that Game Pass can't have claimed it accomplished in 2022, both in terms of revenue increase or sub growth. So aside from some issues with the PS+ Platinum tier which Sony should do better with, I'd say the revamp had its intended effect.
I'm focusing on revenue/profit instead of MAU because truth be told, all console models factor in MAU to some extent. It's just that Sony & Nintendo are understanding enough that it isn't the only (or most important) factor so as to obfuscate their console numbers the way Microsoft does. And if Game Pass growth has been strongly tied to sales of Xbox consoles, why would console sales not be a factor to projecting Game Pass growth?
Then find a better source.
And who's fault is that? Sony's for waiting until they ceased PS3 production before reporting final PS3 numbers, or Microsoft for abruptly ending number reporting for all consoles in 2015 due to slagging XBO sales? All I said was at the end of the day, PS3 outsold 360. Not by some massive amount, certainly not in the US & UK markets. But the common figures put out there by both companies show PS3 as ever-so-slightly ahead WW.
At the end of the day though, it really doesn't matter too much because whether PS3 outsold 360 in units or not, it absolutely outdid the 360 in the end years with a focus on hardcore and core-orientated exclusive games, while the 360 veered off into casual territory with the Kinect. This trajectory for both systems was a subtle signal for what paths their successors ended up pursuing, and for PS the payoff was more or less immediate.
It doesn't just apply to PS5, but the truth of the matter is, Sony have invested in multiple global markets for generations whereas Microsoft have not. Therefore the PlayStation brand in a lot of these places is a lot more popular, and what benefits Xbox would get in these markets in terms of sales is relatively small by comparison.
It will take multiple years and generations of MS prioritizing more global markets to build up the sort of mindshare with their brand that Sony has been doing with a lot of these global markets since the mid-1990s'.
Like I said, I just want to cut past the corporate BS that have come from the Xbox division the past few years. It's a culmination of things, going back to last generation, and various broken promises, combined with some of the things I see supposed game media doing that often comes off as propaganda, and I dislike that.
This company told us for many years that sales no longer mattered for them, until they were outselling their direct competitor in NPD for a few months. Then suddenly sales mattered again. They want to dictate when people should pay attention to sales, and the terms for them are obvious: sales should only matter when Xbox is outselling PlayStation. If it isn't, then suddenly sales no longer matter. Well sorry Aaron, Phil, Satya & the rest of Microsoft, but that's not how this works. Sales have always mattered. They aren't the only metric of importance, of course, but they matter enough to discuss them, and not just when Microsoft says it's okay to talk numbers.
So that's why I do it, and hopefully that was understandable. I respect that you and I probably see differently on this topic, it is what it is. Sometimes you'll actually find me agreeing with certain things Microsoft/Xbox are doing, but personally I feel like those moments have become less and less since prior to the launch of the new consoles. We'll see if they can ever make enough sensible moves (and preferably, a lot of that means having better transparency, more consistent messaging & transparency, and working with what they've got vs. buying up stuff when they're still struggling with what they currently have, in most cases) in the future that get me singing a different tune.
You simply can't get 151 million for PS4 & PS5 at end of 2021 unless you're including later PS3 and PS Vita hardware numbers. Or even PSVR (which shouldn't be the case, because that is a peripheral).
The numbers MS provided to the CMA of Sony's install base with that report were either misleading, or also included 360 numbers on Microsoft's end.
Not really demanding anything. MS have made it a habit to provide that type of info in blog posts and statements, so what's wrong with expecting that to continue. It's like with Sony setting expectations for a Showcase every year, then they skipped doing one in 2022.
Pointing that out isn't "demanding" anything, it's just showing that a certain expectation or pattern was not met, was broken. As for Sony software sales, well yes it's a bit curious about that. If they don't provide some outright numbers for GT7, HFW, TLOU Part 1 Remake in particular in their next fiscal report, I think that might signal something they have to take into consideration going forward.
We have some indication where those games are in select regions; HFW for example was the #8 best-selling game in NA for 2022, not counting bundles. So if we ever got numbers for, say, the #7 and #9 best-selling games of 2022 for NPD, then we'd know where HFW numbers landed for that region, that year. But alongside sales, revenue generated from each game also matters a lot, perhaps even more so, so again I think we'll see what's up there in the next fiscal report.
If I didn't care about Xbox, I wouldn't be talking about it. Truth is, there are things about the brand I like, but there are things I CLEARLY don't like about it, either, and 90% of those have to do with PR, messaging, and how they chase optics above everything else, including real results. Or their hypocrisy, downplaying of certain things while supporting even more niche stuff, enabling certain toxicity in console discussion online with fans and media, quite a lot of the things they've said & done in trying to acquire ABK, the fact they do some of the same exclusivity deals with 3P that Sony does and yet it's only Sony who get called out for it as if it's a bad thing, so on and so forth.
I want the brand to do better but there are way too many enablers who simply make up BS about PS & Sony to artificially make it look like MS & Xbox are doing better than they actually are in growing and strengthening their brand.
Well sure, 30 million/2 = 15 million, not 16/17/18 million. Personally I never said they were 2:1, just that there is a likely range for total Series sold as of end-year 2022 and it's probably not as much as some diehards want to imagine it being, if you look at all the data.
Never mind,
What he didn't tell you is I'm gonna win
Exactly. 16 million (or, IF you're willing to make some concessions with certain data, upwards 19 million or so) sold-through for Xbox Series as of end-year 2022 is nothing to sneeze it. It's not bad, even if there's a likelihood they're tracking a bit behind XBO, and they only have better things to look forward to this year with system sales.
I just dislike that now sales matter again for some people when, not even a year ago, sales discussion was their kryptonite. But leave it to MS to spark this again; a lot of the same people who suddenly care about sales once more seem to take issue with the fact some of us aren't seeing any realistic way they're within spitting distance to PS5 global sales, or aren't at 20 million or more. Just because we look at more than vague PR statements from a platform holder who still refuses to provide direct numbers to either retailers or end customers.
That's really what's irritating some people, I feel. That the gap is probably larger than they want to accept. But it's all just about probabilities, that's it.
I only looked deeper into something YOU brought back up, the data MS provided to the CMA. I questioned the changes in methodology between the Xbox numbers in that data and the PS numbers.
Why were PS units counted as 151 million at end of 2021, unless PS3 and PS Vita units were also included (since they continued manufacture post-2013)? And did MS apply similar to their Xbox numbers in that same report by including 360 units sold? Or did they use a completely different methodology for their own numbers?
Because if so, then they just misled the CMA with worthless numbers because the two sets being compared, have different methods applied to produce the numbers listed. That's...NOT a good thing. Which is why I assume MS did include 360 numbers in that figure, which is why I've brought it up.
Those are your choices. Pick one.
Amazing, now you're trying to throw "sold (on paper)" into this. So, what? You doubt PS5 actually sold 2 million in Japan now? Are you taking the "on paper" talk from 2020 that was about console performance, and just using the term now for sales figures that companies can be sued for if they lied about?
That is hilarious.
You really typed all this to push sales figures that nobody believes? Was this worth it?
As for the China stuff, I’m merely citing the article YOU shared. The Japanese install base on paper is approx 2 million (from retail sales)…but in reality quite a decent portion of these were exported to China to make up part of the 1.5 million units you cite.
Why did I need to explain something so basic, that’s already captured in the article you dropped?
Last edited:
Ash Sparrow
Banned
Will see when we get official numbers, probs later this month!
MikeM
Member
Thanks. Seems to be UK only tho
Cheezewizz
Banned
There's a lot I agree with here, and only time will tell how capable they are in managing these new additions.
Sure there may be games that don't come PS, and require PS only users to buy additional hardware in order to play them. But from MS's standpoint they've done all they can to make it so that everyone can play their games. Had Sony allowed Gamepass on PS consoles, then their users would be able to play them there as well. But Sony apparently deferred, and at the end of the day, it's their console, so they decide what goes on it. Furthermore, while 3P games not being on a console isn't optimal for consumers, Sony is the one that has been heavy handed with locking up 3rd party exclusives. They've gone so far as to let every dev/publisher know that they're more than willing to pay for exclusivity. This has all been covered previously here on Gaf. The last thing I want to do is to come off as white knighting for MS, but it's really hard not to come off that way. Because when compared to Sony the last few years, MS has absolutely been significantly more consumer friendly.
Well no, it hasn't actually. While MS has stated that they may increase prices in the future if inflation continues to rise, neither they nor Nintendo have as of today raised their prices. Sony as we know did so almost 6 months ago. Excusing Sony's anticonsumer behavior by pretending that everyone else is doing it when they most certainly aren't doesn't really work.
Sure, but that's not the point. Let's keep the goalposts where they are shall we?
Jumping the gun seems awful irrelevant compared to claiming Gamepass "has begun stagnation". Sure GP subs leveled some on console, but it doesn't take a genius to predict as much looking at what MS released over the last year. As far as revenue and percentage goes, we indeed have those figures. According to MS's report to CADE, Gamepass console revenue was at $3 billion, which accounted for 18% of Xbox revenue for 2021.
I can't imagine Sony revamped it's sub service offerings with the intent that it would lose subscribers. Of course if you have proof that their sole purpose was to simply increase revenue while losing subscribers, I'd be happy to admit that I'm wrong. While I personally don't see a whole lot of pro consumerism in fleecing more money out of less customers, it doesn't appear as though Sony made all that much more going from $679 to $794 yoy.
First of all. Let's not pretend that Sony and Nintendo are more business savvy than Microsoft here. Of course while Nintendo largely operates in the gaming market, Sony does not. As such, to suggest that Sony "understands" these things while Microsoft doesn't is just a bit farther than I'm willing to go. Microsoft doesn't report it's console sales numbers because they changed the way the report all their sales data back in 2015. If they were simply "obfuscating" their console numbers for console wars sake, then we'd see them releasing hardware and sales from their other divisions, but alas we do not. Many other tech companies make their reports the same way. If it were an issue for their stockholders, then I'm sure they'd have said as much by now. Of course it's unfortunate for us here on Gaf to not have those numbers, but to think MS has went so far as to hide their hardware sales numbers while also pouring in billions of dollars into a division that's doing as poorly as you suggest is quite the conspiracy theory.
That was my entire point. There isn't one. We can speculate based on the data and trends that we have leading up to when they stopped reporting their numbers, but that's all we can do. Statistica isn't a source for how many 360's sold overall because their figure is simply where MS basically stopped reporting. We know MS produced and sold more 360's, but for whatever reason, you prefer to believe that they just disappeared into the ether. Never to be sold at all.
It's nobody's fault. It just is the way it is. Microsoft changed the way they reported across all their divisions, but yet again here you are pretending they did it only for Xbox to stick one to people like you on gaming forums. And waiting until they ceased PS3 production? Sony didn't announce that it had shipped 87 million until April of 2019. When MS's last 360 announcement was in June of 2014. Yes, I know that you said the PS3 outsold the 360. The problem is that you gave specific reasons for why that was the case, when that's almost certainly not the reality. MS stopped reporting those figures, and so that's the last official figures that not only we, but everyone has. Nobody cares if places like Statistica lists only the last figures reported because ultimately it doesn't matter. It only becomes a problem when you latch onto those figures, take them at face value, and then give all sorts of reasons and conjecture for why.
If you say so. The 360 was the highest selling console worldwide for both 2011 and 2012. The PS3 took the top spot for 2013, followed by the PS4 in 2014. So your claim that PS3 dominated in the "end years" should be corrected to simply "year".
This is simply false is what it is. The real fact of the matter is that they all have invested in global markets. They may not all invest in them the same, but they do where they believe they will see returns for doing so. If your premise was anywhere close to being accurate, then Xbox wouldn't enjoy a roughly 60% marketshare lead in Mexico compared to Playstation's paltry 29%. If Playstation's brand is so much more popular in these places then why is it roughly the same in Brazil where Xbox out performs Playstation with a 62% to 37% marketshare split?
If you don't like MS or Xbox that's perfectly fine, and to be honest... You don't even need to explain your reason for doing so. But there's no need to try and justify your preference for Sony or dislike for MS by making all these arguments. They're rather weak arguments honestly, and will only succeed in hurting your credibility.
Well to be fair. It's their console, and as much you detest it, that being the case, they do get to choose when their sales are discussed, at least accurately anyway. As a metric, their sales are only as important as they deem them to be. Unfortunately you don't get to dictate that. You're free to claim that they're lying, but it ultimately doesn't matter.
yurinka
Member
AAA games now take a lot of years to be made. Games like Ghostwire Tokyo, Redfall or Starfield have been made mostly outside MS.
Mid or big AAA games released now take from 4 to 6 years (and in many cases more), and since every generation they need more time very likely this generation they'll take longer maybe 5 to 8 years being the new standard.
Plus when acquired, many of their teams were busy with other projects. That means that pretty likely we won't see any AAA Zenimax game started inside MS being released this generation. And not because of MS management issues (which seem to exist), but because meaty games need time to be made. The MS ones don't take longer than the other ones to be made, simply happened that MS needed to announce games they didn't have even in production because they didn't have any other announcements to make and wanted to hype their fans with something.
This, combined with having a big majority of these fans on the rival console and most of them not wanting to migrate is the main reason of why MS will keep releasing all -or most of- these big multiplatform IPs on the rival consoles, as did with Minecraft.
If they buy a big IP it's because they want the huge amount of money it makes. And if the big majority of that money is made in other platforms, to make it exclusive would mean to don't earn that huge chunk of money for almost nothing, a handful new million users won't compensate it.
I think MS did learn with the mistakes they had with Rare and Kinect. I don't see them reapeating this. But I can see MS turning any big IP into a GaaS with an aggressive take on microtransactions, season passes, battle passes etc. trying to compensate having them day one on GP. Which if done wrong may be a big issue.
Yep. Also, we have to remember that Wii only sold 14.23M consoles more than PS3, even if Sony did fuck it up with a ton of things at the PS3 launch. And that these Wii sales were only around a 37% of the around 275M home consoles sold that generation.
MS said the regulators that Sony outsold them every single generation so yes, PS3 oldsold 360.
They were counting there the Sony consoles for the two currently active generations: PS4, PS Vita and PS5. And they compared them to the MS consoles of the these two currently active generations: the XBO and Series families.
We know for a fact that they had sold until then:
117.1M PS4
17M PS5
This is 134.1M, so there's 16.9M remaining. Some sources -there are a couple in its wikipedia page- estimate PS Vita sales at around 15 or 16M.
In this case MS mentioned consoles sold, but in other cases when explaining to the regulators the difference between PS and them compared only PS4 vs XBO, or compared other metrics as were market share (revenue, percent of the total market) or MAU.
In any comparison, Sony were 2:1 or above.
Nah, all the numbers they provide to regulators are correct. Regulators can also ask to other sources like Sony, Nintendo or the companies who track the market sales to verify them.
Substitute Xbox series and PS5 and it may be relatively correct this generation.From the same folks who brought you this
