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[FunkMiller]

Okay, so this game sucks, even after almost a year of delay and six years of development. It's a disaster, to be sure, but what is really damning is that MS leadership put this game in the forefront of their marketing, to the point where Nadella mentioned it in his conference call with investors LAST WEEK! Now, I know Nadella isn't out there playing these games. My only conclusion here is that Xbox leadership really thought this was a prime Xbox title and had no idea about the state of the game, which is incredibly, incredibly worrying for the future of Xbox.

I don't believe for one rosy red second that they didn't know this game was coming in hot, and stinking of garbage. But this is the games industry in 2023, when they can put games in this state out anyway, because people are still dumb enough to pre-order, or buy out of some misplaced loyalty to a brand. They think they can just shovel out broken shit and fix it with patches, and that'll keep the sheep happy. Sadly, a lot of the time, they're right.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Redfall, Scorn, State of Decay, Crackdown 3, Crossfire X, Sea of Thieves.

These are what I can remember having a pretty big buzz or marketing push and then just became mid/downright awful.

At least Sea of Thieves that first few nights playing with friends was stupid funny and I laughed my ass off trying to figure shit out with them though it got boring fast

With this game I was bored trying to get out of the Firestation

 

[DeepEnigma]

Some folks swear this game was already in development long before the acquisition or any prospect of it being on game pass.

I don't see the correlation of a rental service being the problem if this was always how the game was designed.

And they delayed raced to put out this broken unfinished bug riddled content starved mess because the service has been conditioned to be in perpetual "early access mode." Game Patch as a Service™

You don't need to defend everything. The results are speaking for themselves, where these games would have just either been delayed since they relied on sales, or sent out to die and studios closed down.

 

[Nydius]

You spent 7.5 billion + operating costs with no return. You have to get SOME content out of that.

This made me ponder something:

Which $7bn Microsoft acquisition was worse, Zenimax/Bethesda or NOKIA? At least NOKIA put out a few decent flagship Windows Phones. So far the only decent thing the Zenimax acquisition has gotten Microsoft has been Hi-Fi Rush and an old game library for Game Pass fodder.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Redfall, Scorn, State of Decay, Crackdown 3, Crossfire X, Sea of Thieves.

These are what I can remember having a pretty big buzz or marketing push and then just became mid/downright awful.

The list may be bigger than this but I don't really tend to get too wrapped up in MS exclusives anymore as they generally let me down.

Sea of Thieves although not my cup of tea was very popular for MS and the studio mostly because certain big streamers kept playing it.

 

[adamsapple]

And they delayed raced to put out this broken unfinished bug riddled content starved mess because the service has been conditioned to be in perpetual "early access mode." Game Patch as a Service™

You don't need to defend everything. The results are speaking for themselves, where these games would have just either been delayed since they relied on sales, or sent out to die and studios closed down.

I don't know how you see this as a defense lol.

I've been critical about the game being in this state even *AFTER* a full calendar year delay. Don't forget, this was a Summer '22 game and if it wasn't for a first party cushion and MS being so lax with their project, Bethesda would have pushed it out in an even worse state last year. A lot of users are saying "They should have delayed it more", but they already did. At a point it's just a matter of pushing it out and get it over with so the team is free for something else.

This games apparent issues go far beyond the need for it to be on any specific service *or* console.

 

[manfestival]

Redfall, Scorn, State of Decay, Crackdown 3, Crossfire X, Sea of Thieves.

These are what I can remember having a pretty big buzz or marketing push and then just became mid/downright awful.

The list may be bigger than this but I don't really tend to get too wrapped up in MS exclusives anymore as they generally let me down.

I suppose I should've been more clear. I am looking for the correlative association being made by this post that GP is the clear determining factor for the downfall in the quality of games from microsoft. Crackdown 3 and Sea of Thieves were started far before we knew of whatever impact there could be from GP. Was Scorn always planned as a GP title? Maybe I have always associated microsoft with mid or even bad games and that is why I can't see the association that others are drawing.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I don't know how you see this as a defense lol.

I've been critical about the game being in this state even *AFTER* a full calendar year delay. Don't forget, this was a Summer '22 game and if it wasn't for a first party cushion and MS being so lax with their project, Bethesda would have pushed it out in an even worse state last year.

This games apparent issues go far beyond the need for it to be on any specific service *or* console.

The service affords them not having to actually delay the game until it was in a much better state. You have goofy bastards repeating like parrots, "well hurr durr it's free on game pass."

If they had to rely on sales, this shit would have been long delayed. It's what a lot of us said would happen, and the handwaving to it to boot.

 

[Topher]

Some folks swear this game was already in development long before the acquisition or any prospect of it being on game pass.

I don't see the correlation of a rental service being the problem if this was always how the game was designed.

"This isn't early access, but it sure feels like it."

'Redfall' review: Good enough for Game Pass

 

[diffusionx]

I don't believe for one rosy red second that they didn't know this game was coming in hot, and stinking of garbage. But this is the games industry in 2023, when they can put games in this state out anyway, because people are still dumb enough to pre-order, or buy out of some misplaced loyalty to a brand.

Yea, I would agree normally, except that MS has continually pushed this game as a big title in their lineup. The Nadella quote was: "And I've never been more excited about our pipeline of games, including the fourth quarter launches of Minecraft Legends and Redfall." I have to think this was the opinion of Xbox leadership at the time, and he passed that onto investors, unless they are lying/obfuscating to the CEO. Neither sign is a good one for the future of Xbox.

Microsoft CEO: I've Never Been More Excited About Xbox's Pipeline Of Games

"Great content remains the flywheel behind our growth"

www.purexbox.com

 

[DeepEnigma]

It bears repeating Ybarra told me when they got the email Jimmie was taking over Playstation Mike and Phil cracked open a bottle of scotch (I think it was scotch) and had a drink in celebration saying Jimmie would run PS into the ground

The same Phil who greenlit the first Halo video that gave us Craig and thought that shit looked good

And now this

The same Ybarra that was with Blizzard's downfall from what was once a storied grace?

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Five years. FIVE YEARS!

(Sorry if posted already for some reason)

 

[SmokedMeat]

Yep, PC version's a unoptimized mess.

 

[missiles]

this is a good one

Looks like someone discovered an unfinished 360 game and released it to the internet.

This game has looked questionable all along but I didn't expect 4/10 bad. A complete waste of everyone's time and damaging to the studio, the Xbox brand and the confidence of their customers. Very poor all round.

 

[The Cockatrice]

Five years. FIVE YEARS!

(Sorry if posted already for some reason)

Did she also sleep during development?

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Sea of Thieves although not my cup of tea was very popular for MS and the studio mostly because certain big streamers kept playing it.

And it was a good game.

 

[Slothbeing1209]

 

[Thirty7ven]

Yea, I would agree normally, except that MS has continually pushed this game as a big title in their lineup. The Nadella quote was: "And I've never been more excited about our pipeline of games, including the fourth quarter launches of Minecraft Legends and Redfall." I have to think this was the opinion of Xbox leadership at the time, and he passed that onto investors, unless they are lying/obfuscating to the CEO. Neither sign is a good one for the future of Xbox.

http://[URL]https://www.purexbox.co...en-more-excited-about-xboxs-pipeline-of-games

[/URL]

Make no mistake, Xbox management thought they had a winner here until very very recently.

 

[HTK]

I'm surprised people go out and buy some of these games. This game just on the first trailer and gameplay videos looked uninspiring garbage. Fact that people developed this for 5 years is just wow. I could be saving people so much money.

 

[SkylineRKR]

This game has always looked bad, and I like Arkane a lot. Deathloop was fun though I eventually gave up after too much repetition. This game looks way worse.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Done

 

[RGB'D]

MS happened

I think it's more that Zenimax was hard up for money and Arkanes games never sold all that well so there was a focused push (Fallout 76, Redfall) for GAAS to help the books. If anything MS funding helped to eliminate micro-transactions. I could blame MS for forcing this game out in this state, but also if there isn't any potential in it, just let it release and die and get Arkane back to shit they're amazing at.

 

[Dick Jones]

I hate being this petty but this has to be astroturfing at this point, it's the only way it makes sense :









Again, why ?

 

[fart town usa]

Looks like someone discovered an unfinished 360 game and released it to the internet.

This game has looked questionable all along but I didn't expect 4/10 bad. A complete waste of everyone's time and damaging to the studio, the Xbox brand and the confidence of their customers. Very poor all round.

XBOX just keeps embarrassing themselves.

Not even a hater in the slightest but this shit is unacceptable and I can definitely appreciate mid-tier games. I still defend Alone in the Dark: Inferno and Devil's Third, lol.

 

[reksveks]

This made me ponder something:

Which $7bn Microsoft acquisition was worse, Zenimax/Bethesda or NOKIA? At least NOKIA put out a few decent flagship Windows Phones. So far the only decent thing the Zenimax acquisition has gotten Microsoft has been Hi-Fi Rush and an old game library for Game Pass fodder.

Bit early to decide this, Bethesda hasn't released any of the big IP's yet and might not for a while.

 

[demigod]

I have said it here before Xbox sends gifts in the form of game pass cards and SSDs to people like this to put Xbox in a favorable light

And yes I have the receipts and have shared them with mods here

He said he bought like 4 seagate nvme cards at $200 each, lol.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

XBOX just keeps embarrassing themselves.

Not even a hater in the slightest but this shit is unacceptable and I can definitely appreciate mid-tier games. I still defend Alone in the Dark: Inferno and Devil's Third, lol.

Devils Third multiplayer was fun dude

 

[dorkimoe]

Tried to warn y'all. You guys built this game up so much.

 

[demigod]

Are we expecting a Tweet from Arkane/Phil Spencer/Zenimax that, "We are noticing the feedback. And we promise to improve our game quality in the future." etc., like they sometimes do?

Or are we expecting them to brush it under the rug and not add to the negativity surrounding the brand by publicly acknowledging the issues/failure of Redfall?

What would be the better option for Microsoft right now to protect their PR and brand value perception?

Phil has gone into hiding ever since the CMA blocked the deal.

Speaking of hiding, we got a couple of users on here as well, coincidence?!?

 

[Raoul_Duke]

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

He said he bought like 4 seagate nvme cards at $200 each, lol.

Bought

 

[RGB'D]

I mean honestly. I wanted this game to be good because I love Arkane, but taking that out of it, from the moment the game was revealed it's seemed a bit shit. I think I was just relying on Arkane not missing, and unfortunately rhey proved they can. I hope that they learn some big lessons from Deathloop and Redfall and get back to the bangers now that quality will be more important than financials. Xbox needs quality games, their revenue is fine.

 

[DeepEnigma]

 

[Musilla]

Phil Spencer admits Microsoft shipped games "too early"

"For any game, but definitely for our games Starfield and Redfall - which are our first big Xbox games with ZeniMax coming into the team - I just wanted to make sure those teams felt they had all the support they could get from Xbox, and to maybe feel some of the benefit of being part of a larger organisation that has other revenue streams and other helpful things going on," Spencer continued.

"In the end, I believe the quality of the games will be better and customers will find the experience to be more interesting, which will hopefully feel like the right decision in hindsight," he added."One of the things I have learned is that you want teams to feel like they own their dates. They deliver better when they feel like they own their own destiny with their games, so you wait for the real signal from the creative and production teams."

 

[Gudji]

But Redfall is better than HFW.

Spoiler

No, no it isn't.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I don't get it, why not just cancel the game and save face?

Scalebound died for this and Crackdown 3

 

[Represent.]

4/10 from Gamespot lmao.

I LOVE to see big game sites actually use the full review scale and not just 7 as the lowest.

Game is trash? 4/10

 

[Heisenberg007]

For a second, I thought it was a new tweet by Phil addressing Redfall's launch.

I keep thinking about it, but I don't have an answer.

Whether it'd be a good idea or bad idea to address these concerns and publicly acknowledge them? Will it help repair their PR (because they show they care) or will it damage it further (because they said the same thing after Halo Infinite?)

 

[Zheph]

For a second, I thought it was a new tweet by Phil addressing Redfall's launch.

I keep thinking about it, but I don't have an answer.

Whether it'd be a good idea or bad idea to address these concerns and publicly acknowledge them? Will it help repair their PR (because they show they care) or will it damage it further (because they said the same thing after Halo Infinite?)

I think I would keep it quiet and just deliver the updates relatively soon, you just post the patchnotes and move on to next patch
let's see

 

[reksveks]

I think I would keep it quiet and just deliver the updates relatively soon, you just post the patchnotes and move on to next patch
let's see

That would be my plan.

 

[Zheph]

That would be my plan.

it sucks tho I saw there is already a big patch for Jedi Survivor devs worked their life during the weekend...

 

[Heisenberg007]

I think I would keep it quiet and just deliver the updates relatively soon, you just post the patchnotes and move on to next patch
let's see

That would be my plan.

But can it also not backfire?

As in you promised a great product, sold it a premium $70 price, knowing it was clearly buggy and awful, intentionally kept hidden the Series X and S videos, and didn't let reviewers share their reviews of the game right until launch. And then you didn't even acknowledge the poor result and apologize to your fans?

I can see that also may be a possibility. I think it's between a rock and a hard place situation, but I'd also probably lean towards staying quiet.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Didn't they review bomb a big Xbox title recently, though? I forgot which one. Maybe one of the Forza Horizon games?

 

[Camreezie]

Redfall, Scorn, State of Decay, Crackdown 3, Crossfire X, Sea of Thieves.

These are what I can remember having a pretty big buzz or marketing push and then just became mid/downright awful.

The list may be bigger than this but I don't really tend to get too wrapped up in MS exclusives anymore as they generally let me down.

Recore and Halo 5 too

 

[Zheph]

But can it also not backfire?

As in you promised a great product, sold it a premium $70 price, knowing it was clearly buggy and awful, intentionally kept hidden the Series X and S videos, and didn't let reviewers share their reviews of the game right until launch. And then you didn't even acknowledge the poor result and apologize to your fans?

I can see that also may be a possibility. I think it's between a rock and a hard place situation, but I'd also probably lean towards staying quiet.

regardless of the what they decide to do there will be damage so I would try to not stir the pot too much

 

[Elog]

I feel sorry for the Xbox fans. MS is seemingly not able to change the bad culture they are having. That is bad for gaming in general. I want Nintendo and PS to feel pressure.

This was supposed to be a 'Xbox is back as a good first party publisher' moment. Between Halo and this they are rapidly using up the positive marketing goodwill they have been building up in conjunction with the start of this generation. You need to deliver the goods - and they are not doing that.

 

[Honey Bunny]

XBOX just keeps embarrassing themselves.

Not even a hater in the slightest but this shit is unacceptable and I can definitely appreciate mid-tier games. I still defend Alone in the Dark: Inferno and Devil's Third, lol.

I would like to see you defend Alone in the Dark Inferno.

 

[bender]

Worst part is that the meme potential isn't even that good. Forspoken at least brought us some gems.

 

[Buggy Loop]

But Greedfall is a good game?

At launch?

It had comical glitches and game breaking bugs.

Spoiler

But good by Bethesda standards

Still i agree, that's the least problematic game in the list and apparently found some commercial success.

 

[mejin]