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[Team Andromeda]

All depends how they depart, if there's bad blood it's more "fun" for us as readers.
There was a recent departure from Bethesda, was nothing "Holy shit! The end is coming!" (from me, at least lol).

Sometimes people get burnt out, or they get another better offer somewhere else, or they just want to try something different, it's not a big deal.

If staff leave Xbox it is because they can't manage studios and Xbox is leaving the industry. If staff leave SONY its staff always leave companies

 

[Bartski]

 

[ungalo]

Stig Asmussen was with Sony Santa Monica for 11 years before he left the studio.

The studio's next game was God of War 2018.

Stig went on to direct a major game franchise, meaning he has the rare experience to say he's headlined not one but two major game franchises in his career.

The reporting on the comings and goings of personnel is often used to create FUD. In some cases, it can be really bad and in other cases, it's just part of the process. People get new opportunities, especially if they're good at their jobs.

If you're a Game Director, you might be offered a job as a studio head. It's like saying the walls a falling because an offensive coordinator left for a head coaching job. And sometimes you leave for another offensive coordinator job because it makes more sense for your career.

I feel like Neogaf is too immature (general lack of life experience) to understand a lot of these things.

Tell me, who replaced Stig Asmussen ?

No one is saying the next game will be bad for sure, you know what you lost but not what you'll get, that's as simple as that. Competent game directors certainly are not easy to find, if it's someone from the studio that's going to step up, it can turn out well or not.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I thought Jim Ryan's retirement was him looking to enjoy life. Until Sony started letting other executives go and doing layoffs in studios. Then it was clear he was being retired.

Do you ever wonder how ancient religions are born?

Shama kissed Shubu.

"I thought it was OK at first, but then we got that storm, and 3 weeks later there was an earthquake. Earth God is mad that Shama kissed Shubu. We must kill Shama and forbid any similar kisses from occurring in the future! It is clear Earth God wills it!"

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Tell me, who replaced Stig Asmussen ?

No one is saying the next game will be bad for sure, you know what you lost but not what you'll get, that's as simple as that. Competent game directors certainly are not easy to find, if it's someone from the studio that's going to step up, it can turn out well or not.

Cory replaced Stig and he replaced David Jaffe to direct God of War 2 before that he was a lead animator.

People get too caught up in names and faces.

Directing games isn't easy, a track record of success is certainly better than no track record, but you shouldn't dismiss people based just on the unknown. It's better to adjudicate based on results, rather than spread FUD.

Gaming is changing and one of the easiest ways to make a lot of money is to leave a studio and start your own or join a start-up. It's also extremely risky. But there are a multitude of reasons to leave. Not everyone is going to be a lifer.

 

[BennyBlanco]

80 people and how long did it take to develop?

Let's say it took 4 years.

80 people in Finland. Let's assume they had 65 people year 1, 70 people year 2, 75 people year 3, and 80 people year 4 with an average salary of 65K dollars.

That would be about 18.8 million dollars. Let's round that up to 20 million dollars. Let's add an extra 5 million for advertising and publishing and porting to PC.

That's 25 million dollars.

Let's say the game sold at an average of 50 dollars and we know it sold 560K copies by July 2021.

That would have been 8 million dollars in less than a year. The game would almost certainly have broken even, even without the PC release, not to mention the gap filled on PS+.

There is a reason why Sony bought Housemarque AFTER Returnal launched. One the game was almost certainly a success (not an unmitigated failure) and they probably see the promise in potential in the studio to reach another level like they've done with many of their other studios.

You were just telling me the other day that Persona 4 selling 1 million on Steam wasn’t a success. What do you suppose the budget was for that versus this?

 

[SlimySnake]

Fuck Herman.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

80 people and how long did it take to develop?

Let's say it took 4 years.

80 people in Finland. Let's assume they had 65 people year 1, 70 people year 2, 75 people year 3, and 80 people year 4 with an average salary of 65K dollars.

That would be about 18.8 million dollars. Let's round that up to 20 million dollars. Let's add an extra 5 million for advertising and publishing and porting to PC.

That's 25 million dollars.

Let's say the game sold at an average of 50 dollars and we know it sold 560K copies by July 2021.

That would have been 8 million dollars in less than a year. The game would almost certainly have broken even, even without the PC release, not to mention the gap filled on PS+.

There is a reason why Sony bought Housemarque AFTER Returnal launched. One the game was almost certainly a success (not an unmitigated failure) and they probably see the promise in potential in the studio to reach another level like they've done with many of their other studios.

The only area we agree on is PlayStation liking the studios talent (plus asking price) and believing they can "fix the boyfriend".

 

[Mibu no ookami]

You were just telling me the other day that Persona 4 selling 1 million on Steam wasn’t a success. What do you suppose the budget was for that versus this?

When did I say Persona 4 selling 1 million on steam wasn't a success?

 

[reinking]

Another one gone? If this was XBox Studios people would be typing this is the end

I guess because its SONY, we'll hear how its commonplace for staff to leave studios

Did you not read the posts? LOL. So much concern already.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

The only area we agree on is PlayStation liking the studios talent (plus asking price) and believing they can "fix the boyfriend".

Or you could state how financially it was a disaster... it likely wasn't.

 

[bender]

They proclaimed arcade dead long before Sony bought them out. While I think Returnal's rogue mechanics are kind of bad, I doubt he is leaving because of the direction Sony is taking the studio which at first glance looks like integrating Housemarque's core strengths into more fleshed out concepts.

1) Dead Nation
2) Nex Machina

For me.

I don't love Housemarque games outside of Nex Machina, but Dead Nation is the only game of theirs that I'd consider bad.

 

[BennyBlanco]

When did I say Persona 4 selling 1 million on steam wasn't a success?

News - Business - SEGA Targets 5 Million Sales in Debut Year for Next Numbered Persona Title

Sega has published the company’s quarterly investor Q&A for the Q2 financial results for the fiscal year ending in March 2024 (which is July, August and September 2023). The respondents were Sega Sammy’s Haruki Atami (Representative Director, President and Group CEO) and Koichi Fukasawa...

www.neogaf.com

News - Business - SEGA Targets 5 Million Sales in Debut Year for Next Numbered Persona Title

Sega has published the company’s quarterly investor Q&A for the Q2 financial results for the fiscal year ending in March 2024 (which is July, August and September 2023). The respondents were Sega Sammy’s Haruki Atami (Representative Director, President and Group CEO) and Koichi Fukasawa...

www.neogaf.com

You said the numbers were misleading and you weren’t sure it was a success, despite the CEO of Sega saying it far exceeded their expectations in the article you were quoting. Seems a bit logically inconsistent to question the success of 1M units sold on a cheap port of a ps2 game vs a big budget new IP selling 560k units, no?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Or you could state how financially it was a disaster... it likely wasn't.

I have no interest in doing Scott Steiner math.

 

[BlackTron]

560k copies 3 months after launch is an unmitigated disaster.

It also flopped on Steam.

Returnal Appears To Be One Of The Worst Performing PlayStation PC Ports So Far

Wild Hearts managed to attract much more players than Returnal during its launch week.

www.thegamer.com

But didn't Returnal come out early in PS5's life as an exclusive when it was still really hard to get a system? Isn't it unfair to judge only the first 3 months for this game? How well did it do in the end?

I think a late port of a single player PS game is a tough sell on Steam for $60

 

[Fake]

Sony is losing a bunch of talend people...

 

[Team Andromeda]

Did you not read the posts? LOL. So much concern already.

Did you read my post? SONY pulling out of the console game?

 

[Mibu no ookami]

News - Business - SEGA Targets 5 Million Sales in Debut Year for Next Numbered Persona Title

Sega has published the company’s quarterly investor Q&A for the Q2 financial results for the fiscal year ending in March 2024 (which is July, August and September 2023). The respondents were Sega Sammy’s Haruki Atami (Representative Director, President and Group CEO) and Koichi Fukasawa...

www.neogaf.com

News - Business - SEGA Targets 5 Million Sales in Debut Year for Next Numbered Persona Title

Sega has published the company’s quarterly investor Q&A for the Q2 financial results for the fiscal year ending in March 2024 (which is July, August and September 2023). The respondents were Sega Sammy’s Haruki Atami (Representative Director, President and Group CEO) and Koichi Fukasawa...

www.neogaf.com

You said the numbers were misleading and you weren’t sure it was a success, despite the CEO of Sega saying it far exceeded their expectations in the article you were quoting. Seems a bit logically inconsistent to question the success of 1M units sold on a cheap port of a ps2 game vs a big budget new IP selling 560k units, no?

I said that the 1 million unit number was a bit misleading.

For reference Persona 4 launched at 20 dollars and Returnal (which was certainly not big budget) launched at 60 dollars on Steam and 70 on PS5. The lowest Returnal has been priced on Steam is 40 dollars. There may be a day when the game sells a million copies on PC when it drops to like 5 dollars, but I wouldn't call it a success on Steam based on that.

Persona is also a much larger franchise than Returnal and at 20 dollars I would have expected more than a million units of Persona on PC.

And note, I'm not calling Returnal a success either. I just don't think it was likely to be an unmitigated disaster. Hopefully you understand that's an not a binary choice between the two.

 

[Clear]

The way people are reading into this is so weird; do you guys believe that working at the same place forever is what successful, talented people dream of?

Its work, not marriage!

 

[Esppiral]

Another one gone? If this was XBox Studios people would be typing this is the end

I guess because its SONY, we'll hear how its commonplace for staff to leave studios

I was thinking exactly the same,lol

 

[Embearded]

People come and go all the time and it doesn't always mean something.
Sometimes you just feel like it's time for a change.

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

Can't say I'm a big fan of HouseMarque despite being a huge enthusiast of PlayStation. Returnal did nothing for me. I kept hoping for a Dead Nation 2 and they did kind of hint at that but....

 

[SaucyJack]

Did you only read the second sentence of my comment? Or are you just looking for a reason to be upset?

I thought Jim Ryan's retirement was him looking to enjoy life. Until Sony started letting other executives go and doing layoffs in studios. Then it was clear he was being retired.

Odd response. What makes you think I'm upset?

You made a fairly stupid statement and I highlighted it. The first line of your comment doesn't really provide any context that mitigates the point you made in the second line.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

But didn't Returnal come out early in PS5's life as an exclusive when it was still really hard to get a system? Isn't it unfair to judge only the first 3 months for this game? How well did it do in the end?

I think a late port of a single player PS game is a tough sell on Steam for $60

I just look at what games are successful in the modern era and Returnal would never get the greenlight from me.

I guess you could argue it was going after the Dark Souls audience but even then, making a 45 year old Meghan Rapino as your protagonist just seemed dumb.

The only way it makes sense is if Sony had a long term plan for the studio and Returnal was an exercise/building block to get the studio in the kind of shape required to succeed today. That feels a little tin foil hatty to me.

 

[StueyDuck]

Another one gone? If this was XBox Studios people would be typing this is the end

I guess because its SONY, we'll hear how its commonplace for staff to leave studios

Have you not read a single comment in the thread so far.

The doom squad is out in full force.

 

[StueyDuck]

Stig Asmussen was with Sony Santa Monica for 11 years before he left the studio.

The studio's next game was God of War 2018.

Stig went on to direct a major game franchise, meaning he has the rare experience to say he's headlined not one but two major game franchises in his career.

The reporting on the comings and goings of personnel is often used to create FUD. In some cases, it can be really bad and in other cases, it's just part of the process. People get new opportunities, especially if they're good at their jobs.

If you're a Game Director, you might be offered a job as a studio head. It's like saying the walls a falling because an offensive coordinator left for a head coaching job. And sometimes you leave for another offensive coordinator job because it makes more sense for your career.

I feel like Neogaf is too immature (general lack of life experience) to understand a lot of these things.

It's not immaturity of understanding... its usually immaturity of tribalism and console warring.

I understand when people see a pattern and get worried. But literally one person leaving a company they've worked at for 14 years is not all that insane. In fact remaining for 14 years is probably the insane part to be honest.

 

[tommib]

The way people are reading into this is so weird; do you guys believe that working at the same place forever is what successful, talented people dream of?

Its work, not marriage!

I’m sure From is very happy with how their wedding is going with Miyazaki. Krueger built Housemarque to be one of the most interesting and fresh devs out there. This is the darkest day for PlayStation. Krueger was showing us you could still gamble high production values and leftield non-mainstream ideas.

PlayStation seems to be getting rid off of anything that is not a Marvel super-hero or part of their AAAA cinematic adventures. You can’t let a guy like this just go. His big career moment was just getting its engine warmed up. Fucked up.

 

[xrnzaaas]

Wouldn't be surprised if he ended up founding / joining a new studio and making smaller arcade games again. Returnal was bigger and different from Housemarque's previous work and it's likely they'll keep heading in that direction (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, don't get me wrong).

 

[FeralEcho]

Get ready for Housemarque gaas.Jim Ryan's legacy.

 

[SaucyJack]

It's not immaturity of understanding... its usually immaturity of tribalism and console warring.

I understand when people see a pattern and get worried. But literally one person leaving a company they've worked at for 14 years is not all that insane. In fact remaining for 14 years is probably the insane part to be honest.

I think that people are seeing a pattern that's not there at the moment.

Studio layoffs are happening across the whole industry, and this is not just within gaming times are hard and companies across the whole economy are trimming headcounts. I don't see anything exceptional going on at SIE/PlayStation Studios in this regard.

Jim Ryan retiring and a couple of other seniorish people moving on is not a pattern. There may be some internal politics at play ..... but this is situation normal within any large company.

 

[The artful mincer]

I just look at what games are successful in the modern era and Returnal would never get the greenlight from me.

I guess you could argue it was going after the Dark Souls audience but even then, making a 45 year old Meghan Rapino as your protagonist just seemed dumb.

The only way it makes sense is if Sony had a long term plan for the studio and Returnal was an exercise/building block to get the studio in the kind of shape required to succeed today. That feels a little tin foil hatty to me.

Right but souls took a while to become a success. I'am pretty sure Returnal is tracking ahead of Demon Souls lauched aligned.

I'am not saying Returnal 2 or whatever will be the next major hit but breakout hits are breakout hits because nobody sees them coming.

 

[The artful mincer]

A lot of jumping to conclusions in this thread.

I think putting success or failure on 1 individual at companies with hundreds or even thousands of devs seems misguided.

As long as the core team carries the same mindset I'm sure they will be fine.

At the end of the day past sucess or failure doesn't predict future success or failure. Todd Howard directed Skyrim and Starfield I'am just saying...

 

[NonPhixion]

I’m sure From is very happy with how their wedding is going with Miyazaki. Krueger built Housemarque to be one of the most interesting and fresh devs out there. This is the darkest day for PlayStation. Krueger was showing us you could still gamble high production values and leftield non-mainstream ideas.

PlayStation seems to be getting rid off of anything that is not a Marvel super-hero or part of their AAAA cinematic adventures. You can’t let a guy like this just go. His big career moment was just getting its engine warmed up. Fucked up.

Very “on the spectrum” type response. Well done.

 

[CamHostage]

Are we sure this is bad news? Maybe he wanted to do something else. Probably made bank when Sony bought the company and has the funds to enjoy life.

It's not good news for Housemarque. Harry Kreuger was an important part of the company in its re-ascent period (he didn't work on Super Stardust, but he was in good position in the continuing rise after and led Nex Machina and Returnal,) and he has experience in arcade-style games which is a rare commodity in big-name games these days.

But sure, we don't know how ultimately the situation will work out. Housemarque has other people, and he may go on to found his own indie studio which might also make great stuff. (Maybe even he will make some of the stuff that Housemarque can't really focus on since it has gone AAA-scale after supporting PSN etc with smaller titles for years before.) So it could be win-win; it could be a downturn for Housemarque; it might not end up mattering visibly to gamers at all, and Housemarque will just make the next thing and Kreuger will go off to do his own thing in whatever industry he pursues and the world keeps spinning...

 

[ElCasual]

Housemarque next game will be GaaS, confirmed

 

[Salty Popsicle]

Damn. Returnal and Nex Machina are Housemarque’s best games by a lot.

Guessing he didn’t wanna do whatever Sony envisioned for Housemarque next and will go make sick arcade style games at a new studio.

If the studio was mandated by Sony to come up with a GAAS-style experience as their next game (speculation), I 100% understand why he wouldn't want to stick around for that.

 

[Salty Popsicle]

The way people are reading into this is so weird; do you guys believe that working at the same place forever is what successful, talented people dream of?

Its work, not marriage!

If you're creating games that you're passionate about and are surrounded by co-workers who share in that same passion and creativity, then I can definitely see someone sticking around until retirement comes knocking. People like Todd Howard and Ed Boon come to mind.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

The game had some great ideas, but ultimately missed the marque. Should have had a better protag and story.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Sucks to lose anyone from Housemarque. I wonder if Sony’s pushing for them to go GaaS with their next release?

 

[ZoukGalaxy]

Good gaming news are becoming a rare breed.

.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Can't say I'm a big fan of HouseMarque despite being a huge enthusiast of PlayStation. Returnal did nothing for me. I kept hoping for a Dead Nation 2 and they did kind of hint at that but....

Returnal is the only game of theirs I genuinely enjoyed and wasn't just a straight up arcade game.

If this departure is an indication of things to come, that could be a good sign IF he was holding back their games from being more than just straight up arcade games.

They need to be Sony's Metroid developers. Awesome shooting mechanics and level design with some AAA sprinkled Sony magic

 

[[Sigma]]

What the hell is going on over there at PlayStation Hermen?

 

[Danjin44]

I just look at what games are successful in the modern era and Returnal would never get the greenlight from me.

Then good thing you are not in charge, if you were all you greenlight is GaaS and live service crap.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

What the hell is going on over there at PlayStation Hermen?

Look at their recent financials and Spider-Man 2.

You're welcome.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Cory replaced Stig and he replaced David Jaffe to direct God of War 2 before that he was a lead animator.

People get too caught up in names and faces.

Directing games isn't easy, a track record of success is certainly better than no track record, but you shouldn't dismiss people based just on the unknown. It's better to adjudicate based on results, rather than spread FUD.

Gaming is changing and one of the easiest ways to make a lot of money is to leave a studio and start your own or join a start-up. It's also extremely risky. But there are a multitude of reasons to leave. Not everyone is going to be a lifer.

Todd Papy replaced Stig.

Cory replaced Todd.

Eric replaced Cory.

 

[[Sigma]]

Look at their recent financials and Spider-Man 2.

You're welcome.

 

[skit_data]

Gregory Louden will be the new Creative Director at Housemarque



Edit: He was narrative and cinematic director at Returnal. Seems he has been involved with Prometheus, Gravity, Quantum Break and Control among others going by his linkedin.

https://fi.linkedin.com/in/greglouden

Not a bad resume.

 

[Jigsaah]

Returnal is so good. Good luck to this man, thanks for the good times.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

Best of luck to him. Returnal is my GOAT, but I have faith in Housemarque.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Todd Papy replaced Stig.

Cory replaced Todd.

Eric replaced Cory.

Stig still worked at Santa Monica when God of War Ascension came out.

My point is that Stig was let go because his own game that he was directing at Santa Monica was canceled.