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[SlimySnake]

Buying Bungie had nothing to do with layoffs at ND and closures at London studio

bungie has a headcount of around 1,200 people even after layoffs.


Those are 1,200 devs Sony took on their payroll. They laid off 900 devs today from far better studios like insomniac, ND and GG. This has everything to do with buying bungie.

 

[skit_data]

No to sound like a bit of an asshole but

Yeah, that's been evident since quite aa while back.

 

[Unknown?]

It was but not as stupid as buying Activision.

 

[nush]

gotta "love" Jim Ryan

sacking 900 people on his way out the door

 

[Lunarorbit]

At the time it seemed like a great move. According to the destiny community they have done a really bad job since Sony bought them (people were meh on lightfall) and I'll never forgive them for canceling last of us online.

Destiny higher ups seem disconnected. You think helldivers is making a strong showing? Imagine factions with tlou2 action.

Where's helldivers micro transactions? Wasn't this the big hang up with factions, that it wouldn't make enough money. I don't believe Neil when he says naughty dog would have to support the game for.years. That's what support studios are for. Visual art studios and blueprint have been helping for years.

Complete bullshit. Fuck bungie

 

[Jose92]

Let's circle back after after Final Shape and Marathon comes out. Sony would be laying off people even if they hadn't acquired Bugie.

Buying Bungie had nothing to do with layoffs at ND and closures at London studio

Buying Bungie Added a lot of overhead to SIE, Believe it or not Bungie employs 1,100 people.

It's irrelevant if Final Shape or Marathon prove to be success, the immediate and mid term effects of the acquisitions are in play currently.

 

[Fabieter]

Bungie had a proven record to have bad management even in the halo days. They basically had trouble with every game they made. Bungie was the worst decision for them.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

bungie has a headcount of around 1,200 people even after layoffs.


Those are 1,200 devs Sony took on their payroll. They laid off 900 devs today from far better studios like insomniac, ND and GG. This has everything to do with buying bungie.

No it doesn’t. These were not decisions on cash flow, but on areas of the business that they feel aren’t efficiently productive or strategic long term. Bungie already had those cuts

Studio London wasn’t making shit and never has. That studio guy closed because it’s garbage

ND hasn’t released anything in years and had a major title canned.

SSM had layoffs after their own failed new IP and ended up restructuring into making GoW2018

This is routine culling because the overall business environment isn’t good. Its not positive news, but Bungie had little to do with any of it

 

[SplunkyMunkey]

I agree Bungie was a mistake to buy with that money they could of brought a good few studios which embracer now owns that also had talented developers and has multiple ips under there belt. But nope sony wastes millions on bungie and brought studios that hasn't even made one ip. They had enough money to probably own atleast Rockstar atleast they can have games that generate alot of income

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Imagine spending $6 billion to acquire a company, only for them to miss their revenue target by 45%, then you see this:

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I would love to see the logic that is being used to say that consolidating video game developers/publishers is "innovation".

The way people are interacting with games is changing. Companies who fail to adapt are being absorbed or killed. Companies who are adapting well are growing.

This is just the death of the arcades pt II.

 

[SlimySnake]

No it doesn’t. These were not decisions on cash flow, but on areas of the business that they feel aren’t efficiently productive or strategic long term. Bungie already had those cuts

Studio London wasn’t making shit and never has. That studio guy closed because it’s garbage

ND hasn’t released anything in years and had a major title canned.

SSM had layoffs after their own failed new IP and ended up restructuring into making GoW2018

This is routine culling because the overall business environment isn’t good. Its not positive news, but Bungie had little to do with any of it

And what did Insomniac do to earn those layoffs? oh right, they had the fastest selling game in Sony playstation's history. Their first 90 metacritic game. And released 3 games in the first 3 years of this gen.

Just read Jimbo's report. This is because of the economy and their dips in profit which were a direct result of them paying off the bungie sale. Now they have added 1,200 devs to their payroll and had to cut elsewhere. It sucks that it came from legendary sony studios like GG, ND and insomniac instead of gaas dumpster fire that is the current Bungie studio.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

And what did Insomniac do to earn those layoffs?

Sounds like they just over hired, we don’t know how severely impacted insomniac is

 

[HeWhoWalks]

And what did Insomniac do to earn those layoffs? oh right, they had the fastest selling game in Sony playstation's history. Their first 90 metacritic game. And released 3 games in the first 3 years of this gen.

Just read Jimbo's report. This is because of the economy and their dips in profit which were a direct result of them paying off the bungie sale. Now they have added 1,200 devs to their payroll and had to cut elsewhere. It sucks that it came from legendary sony studios like GG, ND and insomniac instead of gaas dumpster fire that is the current Bungie studio.

Yeah, most likely.

Not the worst situation, but once the dust settles, I imagine less buyouts such as this. More like they’re used to doing.

 

[IFireflyl]

The way people are interacting with games is changing.

Not really, but this also has nothing to do with consolidation being innovation.

Companies who fail to adapt are being absorbed or killed.

That isn't innovation. What do you think innovation means?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

 

[JohnnyFootball]

It was a pretty foolish acquisition by Sony. Microsoft's makes more sense in that ActiBlizz comes with a huge back library and i.p.'s that have a ton of future potential. Bungie came with Destiny 2 and Marathon, both series that are well past their primes.

Bethesda is proof to me that Microsoft has NO CLUE how to leverage their IPs. They should have had an up and coming studio working on Fallout 3/New Vegas remasters, bringing back older ID ips like Quake. These didn't need to be big AAA games, smaller in scope AA games with an old school feel. Microsoft had TONS of potential to leverage these new IPs, but squandered them. Indiana Jones is the next game coming from Bethesda and that is from a studio who has been 5+ years of putting out anything good.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

Buying Bungie without Halo is like Microsoft thinking they could get DK with Rareware.

Without their biggest game that made them famous in the first place and the talent that made them what did they buy in the end?

Conker would have been a truly awesome franchise...but Microsoft gonna Microsoft.

 

[NickFire]

As of right now it looks like buying Bungie was a mistake to me as well. Somehow, they seem to have become less competent in terms of output since they were acquired. Entirely possible they are being pulled too thin trying to help out with other games. But in today's day and age my guess would be there is too little accountability and too much distraction.

Can't agree investing in GAAS is a huge mistake though. If they stop making as many single player games because of it I would agree. As of now they still seem to be releasing at least one massive SP game each year to go with everything else.

 

[STARSBarry]

Time for Facebook....uh, I mean...."Meta" to change their name again?

They should change it to EX, I'm sure that won't cause any confusion.

 

[twilo99]

Sure they can. Embracer bought a shit-ton of studios with a back library and they have a fraction of Sony's worth. Being able to buy a back library doesn't mean it is a good idea though.

The kind of library ABK had to offer is what I meant, which is what was mentioned in the post I responded to

 

[Sanepar]

Bungie is a totally crap Studio. They had the excuse of Activision for a long time but they are exposed and show that the real crap is Bungie.

The most dumb aquisition, totally dispair by MS moves. With the money they could have bought Capcom.

 

[Del_X]

Bungie itself has been a mistake since about 2014 or so.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Agree. It's their one whiff in terms of bigger acquisitions.

 

[Mephisto40]

You can almost guarantee Bungie are helping make Helldivers 3 right now

As much as I got bored for Destiny, there is a reason they are still making DLC for it, it's because it is a very popular game still, they would have stopped supporting it years ago if it wasnt

I get the feeling Sony knew Activision was eventually going to get bought out by Microsoft, they needed a big FPS producer on board just in case they lost call of duty completely, so the buy out made sense

 

[Klayzer]

Agree. It's their one whiff in terms of bigger acquisitions.

Disagree. To early to call it a whiff. They haven't released anything under Sony yet.

 

[Heisenberg007]

From the initial Due Diligence to the Binding Offer it can be done in two months under the right circonstances, specially if Bungie was looking to sell

Sony had confirmed that they started talking to Bungie for an acquisition in May 2020, 4 months before Microsoft announced Zenimax's acquisition.

It was not a reactionary move at all. Sony had plans for live-service games, and that's why they wanted Bungie.

 

[Hudo]

I don't think buying Bungie was a mistake. But I think them not interfering with Bungie's management is a mistake. That studio needs someone from outside to get them back on track.

 

[Hero_Select]

Sure they can. Embracer bought a shit-ton of studios with a back library and they have a fraction of Sony's worth. Being able to buy a back library doesn't mean it is a good idea though.

Yeah? How's that going for Embracer?

 

[Audiophile]

Wherever you stand on the layoffs or bungie, the optics are difficult to traverse when you purchase a studio for $4B and take on 1200 employees, then can 900 employees elsewhere to save roughly a couple hundred mil.

 

[Hero_Select]

Imagine spending $6 billion to acquire a company, only for them to miss their revenue target by 45%, then you see this:

my god I can't believe they actually posted that to millions of people, that's.. embarrassing. And I love that it has a community note attached to it xD

 

[Klayzer]

I don't think buying Bungie was a mistake. But I think them not interfering with Bungie's management is a mistake. That studio needs someone from outside to get them back on track.

Bingo. If anything, Sony should have never agreed to Bungie's terms for the buyout. Its evident, they need new leadership.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Cost of bungie acquisition has been a cost driver in their gaming division P/L since 2022. That’s one factor why profit margins have been cut in half.

In turn to boost profit % back up they are gutting studios, cancelling games and laying off people.

BUT despite a profit margin cut in half the overall dollar profits are still solid since top line gaming revenue keeps going up. So it’s not as bad as it looks if you focus on the absolute dollar profit.

 

[Mortisfacio]

Out of all of this, I find these threads amusing seeing some people in particular that were vocal in the ABK layoff threads about how Microsoft was the "Big-bad" now sit here and defend Sony for doing the same thing.

 

[Syphon Filter]

Smartest decision they made since entering the games business.

It was a dumb move tbh, Bungie isnt the same Bungie that people know and love since the vast majority left..

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

It was a dumb move tbh, Bungie isnt the same Bungie that people know and love since the vast majority left..

Gamers are incapable of not being a slave to the moment. The current gamer Bungie valuation is akin to NFL fans calling certain rookies busts the day after the draft.

Bungie was purchased to help guide PlayStation through the next 10+ years. Ruling on Bungie before Marathon even hits is absurd.

 

[tmlDan]

I assume people will push this narrative until they release a banger , when they do you will all shut up?

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Imagine spending $6 billion to acquire a company, only for them to miss their revenue target by 45%, then you see this:

These types of dumb things are being done by most companies.

 

[Salty Popsicle]

Buying Bungie had nothing to do with layoffs at ND and closures at London studio

Absolutely true. The layoffs today are 100% due to Sony's mismanagement, not Bungie's.

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

Came in to basically say this.

Almost never see a single corporate takeover that turns out good for all stakeholders.

Yeah me too. And to be honest, when Microsoft started their spree originally, I was quite supportive because I thought they were going to build a first party line up to start building incredible franchises. But that evolved, with a lot of other consolidation into a bigger part an ongoing problem.

I agree with OP that acquiring Bungie was a mistake and effectively a knee jerk reaction to the Bethesda acquisition. But he whole thing is just bullshit. Bungie have helped get TLoU online cancelled and they can't even sort their own shit out. Failing to meet deliverables, having their own lay offs and failing to make the profits they forecast. Looking at the future of Destiny, it's not looking very good at the minute.

 

[Astray]

It worked pretty well for Sony and Insomniac, because that was the traditional way Sony did things.

That was a 1-in-10000000 takeover tho.

Studio that is hyper familiar with the publisher and worked with them for over 2 decades.

 

[NickFire]

Wherever you stand on the layoffs or bungie, the optics are difficult to traverse when you purchase a studio for $4B and take on 1200 employees, then can 900 employees elsewhere to save roughly a couple hundred mil.

I agree with you in principal. But hasn't it been a couple years since they bought them? And aren't they also cancelling live service games that other studios were working on?

 

[Audiophile]

I agree with you in principal. But hasn't it been a couple years since they bought them? And aren't they also cancelling live service games that other studios were working on?

Fair point, I just googled the acquisition. I genuinely thought it was last year. I'm losin' time...

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Not really, but this also has nothing to do with consolidation being innovation.



That isn't innovation. What do you think innovation means?

Whenever an industry goes through massive change, there are always people who don't see said change. Generally those are the people who get left behind.

Layoffs + restructuring is just the snake shedding it's old useless skin in favor of something more beneficial to the organism.

 

[M1chl]

I'm really enjoying the Lego Builders VR game on the Quest 3. It seems nobody else on Neogaf is playing it though.

Wait, what?

brb buying the game

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

Consolidation in the gaming industry is damn near always a mistake. That's my opinion.

Finally nice to see that folks here on Gaff get it!

 

[PSlayer]

Yes sony bagholded hard by buying Bungie. No only the studio is a mess from a managing point but destiny is dead and they don't even own Halo anymore.

This is the corporate equivalent of buying a crypto shitcoin at the peak value and then get dumped.

 

[justiceiro]

"Assets: how do they work?" could be a more appropriate thread title.

Companies don't fire people just because they run out of cash, or buy studios just to spite theirs rivals.

They closed the UK studio because it's a UK studio. No valuable track record and a expensive pay slip.

Buying companies has more to do with moving money around to avoid paying taxes than expecting it to pay for itself without liquidation.

Just because a game company stopped catering to you, doesn't means it's the reason for its failures.

 

[Topher]

Yeah? How's that going for Embracer?

Which is why I added that part about not always being a good idea.

 

[Fishels]

Where did y

In light of Sony's recent decision to terminate 900 employees from their SIE arm, coupled with statements made by several Sony executives regarding the imperative of streamlining operations for enhanced profitability, it is evident that the company's emphasis on Games as a Service (GaaS) has had discernible implications for PlayStation studios, notably in terms of their output or perceived deficiency thereof.

The cancellation of "Last of Us Last Stand" after years in development serves as a poignant illustration of the direction PlayStation studios appear to be heading, which could be construed as a precarious trajectory.

While "Hell Divers 2" has proven successful and is a commendable game deserving of its achievements, the acquisition of Bungie may not have directly influenced the outcome of "Hell Divers 2."

Sony's move to acquire Bungie can be interpreted as a reactionary measure driven by concerns of potential acquisition by another entity, particularly in light of Microsoft's acquisitions, thus avoiding a perceived monopoly. Although Bungie has a track record of producing exceptional games, the substantial investment in their acquisition could have been alternatively allocated to foster organic growth within Sony's existing studios, facilitating the development of innovative and experimental titles.

this is my opinion.

where did you get that title the last stand from?