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[mckmas8808]

If 60% of the market are GAAS gamers (and rising) why wouldn't you devote 60+% of your resource towards them?

Because most GAAS games don't work! Sony shouldn't be following trends. They should be creating them! You don't see Nintendo chasing like this. Sony doesn't need to either. Stop thinking Sony has to do what other failing companies are doing.

That 40% is still larger investment then they've ever put into SP games. They've got a huge development budget going on at present.

Yes, but it's only larger because the cost per SP game is more. They aren't making "MORE" sp games than before. Which is fine, except they released a new platform hardware called PSVR2 this year. Except we have zero clue if they have any 1st party resources making games for it now.

 

[StealthGoblin]

Because most GAAS games don't work! Sony shouldn't be following trends. They should be creating them! You don't see Nintendo chasing like this. Sony doesn't need to either. Stop thinking Sony has to do what other failing companies are doing.



Yes, but it's only larger because the cost per SP game is more. They aren't making "MORE" sp games than before. Which is fine, except they released a new platform hardware called PSVR2 this year. Except we have zero clue if they have any 1st party resources making games for it now.

They are. xDev are putting in the work.

I can't speak for PSVR2.

 

[mckmas8808]

Man we really do be in a bubble uh?

No we aren't. Some people just don't understand nuance. Us Gaffers that don't love GAAS understand that it exists and Sony needs to do it and get it right. It's the execution that we are afraid of. Factions shouldn't be this hard for ND to do. Especially considering they made an amazing multiplayer in TLOU already!!!!

Did Factions really need to be a full-blown standalone GAAS game? Rockstar has added GAAS parts to two SP games. Both RDR2 and GTA5 have don't GREAT with focusing on SP, while offering Live-Service parts for longevity. Why can't Sony build out some of the games the same way.

TLOU3 could have had Factions added to it. Why did it have to be a standalone game?

They are. xDev are putting in the work.

This Jim Ryan needs to SHOW us the work. And stop being the worst marketing Playstation head of all time!

 

[FF:Enhanced_Reality]

I think most people on here are well aware that successful GAAS games generate an absolute ton of money. I am at least.

I’m uninterested in 98% of them though so who cares. I’d rather have them make games I want to play.

I agree.

That being said if Sony were being smart about this, they'd get a team of FPS specialists and put them in one of their successful studios, then get them to develop MAG in a similar way to Call of Duty. Get it on as many platforms as you can and push it, push it, push it till you get it where it needs to be.

Helps offset potentially losing Call of Duty one day if you can push for the better shooter.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Because most GAAS games don't work! Sony shouldn't be following trends. They should be creating them! You don't see Nintendo chasing like this. Sony doesn't need to either. Stop thinking Sony has to do what other failing companies are doing.

Embark Studios just created a new hit (The Finals). If a small team like Embark can figure out the formula for successful Live Service, why don't you think PlayStation will?

Also, lets be real. PlayStation has been languishing in terms of "creating new trends" for a while. They've beaten their AAA formula into the ground and have been almost entirely reliant on big IP to float.

The bold design risk taking that y'all claim to want to see will happen in their Live Service initiative, where IP doesn't matter. See Fairgames, Concord, Marathon and the lack of a number on the end of those titles.

 

[mckmas8808]

Embark Studios just created a new hit (The Finals). If a small team like Embark can figure out the formula for successful Live Service, why don't you think PlayStation will?

Also, lets be real. PlayStation has been languishing in terms of "creating new trends" for a while. They've beaten their AAA formula into the ground and have been almost entirely reliant on big IP to float.

The bold design risk taking that y'all claim to want to see will happen in their Live Service initiative, where IP doesn't matter. See Fairgames, Concord, Marathon and the lack of a number on the end of those titles.

I think Sony can find the formula. Just not enough times to make the 60% Live Services vs. 40% SP game split to make sense. And I care more about consistency and fun, more than pure risk-taking. I couldn't care less if things are risky, if they aren't fun or good.

That's where PSVR2 plays a role also. The fact that GT7 is fully playable in VR is AWESOME! I love that. But that game came out in early 2022. What do they have for us PSVR2 players for 2024?

 

[SportsFan581]

Out of that $27B sales and $1.9B profit, how much of that is split between hardware and software? Hardware is typically a breakeven business. Also, the financials will include all the R&D of PS6 too. Strip all that out and the remaining sales and profits are probably pretty good. The way e-stores work too is they sell a game for $70 and they keep 30%. Or an MTX for $10, they keep $3. So profit margin wise, all the cuts they get from third party is limited to 30% margin.

So a company focused on lots of hardware, R&D and 30% cuts will never have as much profit % as a successful purely software company who sell their software for huge margins right off the bat.

This, people forget that stores like Steam and the console stores are including the 70% collected for developers in the revenue figures. You'd never see nvidia level profit percentages from them, like you said.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I think Sony can find the formula. Just not enough times to make the 60% Live Services vs. 40% SP game split to make sense. And I care more about consistency and fun, more than pure risk-taking. I couldn't care less if things are risky, if they aren't fun or good.

That's where PSVR2 plays a role also. The fact that GT7 is fully playable in VR is AWESOME! I love that. But that game came out in early 2022. What do they have for us PSVR2 players for 2024?

If the discussion is "I like single player so PlayStation should make more single player games" then you're nothing more than a stud farmer (horses) complaining about the automobile industry post Ford Model T. Think of all the arguments for horses at that time and against automobiles. "Cars are ugly and unreliable! They're slow! Cars will never match the beauty of the majestic horse!" Then, in a few short years...

Just as the future of locomotion was automobiles and not horses, the future of gaming is multiplayer, not single player.

PlayStation has succeeded for its entire history, because it knew what trends to jump from, and what trends to jump to. Keeping their focus on single player as multiplayer studios rise to dominance is a fools strategy.

Let's face it, over the next 5 years as the market shifts even more towards multiplayer, that 60:40 split will need to shift more towards multiplayer.

Btw, you can still buy and ride horses today. If you love single player, you'll be able to find games you like.

 

[64bitmodels]

Embark Studios just created a new hit (The Finals).

it isnt even fucking out yet

 

[SportsFan581]

Let's face it, over the next 5 years as the market shifts even more towards multiplayer, that 60:40 split will need to shift more towards multiplayer.

Let's all just hope it doesn't get too much worse. LOL

There is nothing wrong with multiplayer games, but people like games with objectives they can move through and stories they can progress. I'd certainly hope we don't lose those all together for more of the same PvP games.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

it isnt even fucking out yet

It's a hit. Trust me.

 

[64bitmodels]

It's a hit. Trust me.

we'll see when it fully releases epic employee

 

[Kaleinc]

Only takes 100 000 whales to spend $10 000 a year to make a billion
Where will you find an idiot to pay as much for a single player title?
(Except star citizen)

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

people like games with objectives they can move through and stories they can progress.

You're going to see multiplayer do better and better at specifically this.

 

[mckmas8808]

If the discussion is "I like single player so PlayStation should make more single player games" then you're nothing more than a stud farmer (horses) complaining about the automobile industry post Ford Model T. Think of all the arguments for horses at that time and against automobiles. "Cars are ugly and unreliable! They're slow! Cars will never match the beauty of the majestic horse!" Then, in a few short years...

Just as the future of locomotion was automobiles and not horses, the future of gaming is multiplayer, not single player.

PlayStation has succeeded for its entire history, because it knew what trends to jump from, and what trends to jump to. Keeping their focus on single player as multiplayer studios rise to dominance is a fools strategy.

Let's face it, over the next 5 years as the market shifts even more towards multiplayer, that 60:40 split will need to shift more towards multiplayer.

Btw, you can still buy and ride horses today. If you love single player, you'll be able to find games you like.

How is it that you are missing the point so bad? I'll list it out in points.


- GAAS as a means to make games and money is good. Nothing wrong with it.
- Acquiring smaller dev teams to make games like Concord and FairGames makes sense. It's smart.
- Sony has some of the best SP game developers on Planet Earth.
- The 60-40% split today where most is going toward GAAS is TERRIBLE!!!!
- Asking your SP devs to make multiplayer Live Service games is the WORST IDEA OF ALL TIMES!


Plus you people said Single Player games were dying literally 10 years ago and you all were wrong! Remember this?...........

EA: Single-player games are 'finished'​

By Mark_Raby
published December 10, 2010
Games must now have online connectivity, or offline multiplayer

Games publishing giant EAapparently believesthat single-player, offline games are dead. With online play becoming more prevalent and every mediumgoing more and more 'social,'the publisher no longer wants to focus on one-person experiences. EA Games chief Frank Gibeau confirmed the move in a recent interview withDevelop, saying thatall of the company's studio heads are on the same page. "They're very comfortable moving the discussion towards how we make connected gameplay – be it co-operative or multiplayer or online services – as opposed to fire-and-forget, packaged goods only, single-player, 25-hours – and you're out. I think that model is finished."

EA: Single-player games are 'finished'

Games must now have online connectivity, or offline multiplayer

www.gamesradar.com

Or this..............

EA Says People Don't Really Enjoy Linear Games As Much Today​

"You gotta cut the bridge when you realise you can't make a lot of money on something."

By Eddie Makuch on November 29, 2017 at 3:18PM PST



When Electronic Arts closed down Visceral Games and announced that the studio's in-development Star Wars game was changing directions significantly, some wondered if this had to do with the game's more linear, single-player nature. Given the huge success of multiplayer games like Destiny and PUBG that use the games-as-a-service model, was EA re-tooling Visceral's Star Wars game to respond to this industry trend? EA CEO Andrew Wilson said it wasn't necessarily, but now EA CFO Blake Jorgensen has acknowledged that linear games are fading in popularity in the current market.
"As we kept reviewing the game, it continued to look like a much more linear game [which] people don't like as much today as they did five years ago or 10 years ago," Jorgensen said during the Credit Suisse Technology, Media & Telecom Conference this week (via DualShockers)

EA Says People Don't Really Enjoy Linear Games As Much Today

The new Star Wars game from Visceral was going to be more linear-focused until EA changed it significantly.

www.gamespot.com

Or this................

Yes, AAA Single-Player Games Are Dying, And That's Fine​

Dave Thier
Former Contributor
I'm here to help you understand video games.

Oct 18, 2017,12:14pm EDT
But it's part of a longer story that's been gripping the industry for years now, whether we're talking about loot boxes or MMOs. That single-player games of the sort we all know and love, with their characters, narratives and limited run-times, are on their way out. Games-as-service, which can be monetized at rates significantly higher than $60 a customer for years, are what big publishers are after these days. One of the big reasons that EA didn't want to pursue this game was because an Uncharted-style game just didn't fit this focus.


This particular angle triggers the usual laments. That the industry is changing, that we're losing a core part of the things we love, that "insert legendary game here" would never been made in today's publishing landscape. There seems to be an undercurrent to all of this that single-player, narrative games are somehow morally superior to games-as-service, and that the thing that is replacing them is a hollow stand-in for something better. It's a point of view I can sympathize with, if not get on board with. All games are different, and we see greatness in all different sorts of models. Yes, the era in which a particular style of big-budget AAA game reigned supreme is coming to a close, and may already be behind us. Games like Deus Ex: Mankind Divided, Prey and Dishonored 2 all under-performed in a market where PlayerUnknown's Battleground's and Overwatch have flourished. Change is hard, and we're staring at change right now.

Yes, AAA Single-Player Games Are Dying, And That's Fine

EA's shutting down of Visceral Games and the likely death of its single-player, linear Star Wars game further signals the death of a particular kind of big-budget, AAA single-player game. It's sad, but it happens.

www.forbes.com

THEY WERE ALL WRONG!!!

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

- The 60-40% split today where most is going toward GAAS is TERRIBLE!!!!
- Asking your SP devs to make multiplayer Live Service games is the WORST IDEA OF ALL TIMES!

They're not doing this.

They're hiring people with multiplayer experience to make these games.

The 60:40 split shows a PlayStation that understands most of the market is multiplayer centric gamers.

Plus you people said Single Player games were dying literally 10 years ago and you all were wrong! Remember this?...........

EA: Single-player games are 'finished'

Games must now have online connectivity, or offline multiplayer

www.gamesradar.com

Or this..............

EA Says People Don't Really Enjoy Linear Games As Much Today

The new Star Wars game from Visceral was going to be more linear-focused until EA changed it significantly.

www.gamespot.com

Or this................

Yes, AAA Single-Player Games Are Dying, And That's Fine

EA's shutting down of Visceral Games and the likely death of its single-player, linear Star Wars game further signals the death of a particular kind of big-budget, AAA single-player game. It's sad, but it happens.

www.forbes.com

THEY WERE ALL WRONG!!!

In the time those headlines were written...Live Service grown significantly. Single player has plateaued in terms of hitting its ceiling while the cost of creating single player games has risen dramatically. That cost is only increasing too.

Single player isn't dead. It's just shrinking in terms of market percentage.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I play my share of GAAS. Hey, COD and Diablo are GAAS. I like them. I never pay an extra dime buying mtx (never have for Diablo and the last COD mtx I bought were Xbox 360 map packs for MW3 in 2011). I just play the standard modes vanilla style.

Comes down to what kind of games are made and how money grubbing grindy they are. Some are, some arent.

 

[mckmas8808]

In the time those headlines were written...Live Service grown significantly. Single player has plateaued in terms of hitting its ceiling while the cost of creating single player games has risen dramatically. That cost is only increasing too.

Single player isn't dead. It's just shrinking in terms of market percentage.

Have you ever wondered why no publisher or developer ever talks about the cost of Live Service games? Funny how we have no clue how much a game like Apex Legends or OverWatch cost to make and to keep updating.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Have you ever wondered why no publisher or developer ever talks about the cost of Live Service games? Funny how we have no clue how much a game like Apex Legends or OverWatch cost to make and to keep updating.

That's a non issue.

Developers + publishers look at the player metrics and devote the appropriate number of resources to these games every year. The risk comes from the initial development.

PlayStation changed their entire strategy in 2018 as a result of the BR explosion. I think they know the numbers.

 

[Guilty_AI]

we'll see when it fully releases epic employee

pretty sure he's Tim Sweeney's son

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

1. Nintendo doesn't take a loss on anything they sell like Sony. Hardware is at a profit, games never go on sale, games in general are lower budget due to not having as high production values, etc. That's not to mention that Nintendo lives and dies by their first party, i'm pretty sure most of their profit comes from first party sales which don't have a cut that needs to be given to the publisher, they just get 100% of the cash. Sony lives by third party with some sprinkled in first party.

2. Nintendo multiplayer games already implement a few GaaS aspects... Mario Kart 8 is a 9 year old game getting new updates and content. Splatoon is just straight up GaaS. Smash has paid DLC characters, and for a time had constantly added content. Those are 3 of their most popular franchises, we just don't call them GaaS because it's Nintendo and they get a pass over for pretty much everything they do.

That's traditional dlc with paid games, and just keeping supported content up for those games. I don't know about Splatoon 3, but 1 & 2 don't have things like paid battle passes, just paid SP dlc content.

If Sony starts having paid games with things like battle passes and gacha gambling mechanics, it'll be a fucking disaster waiting to happen.

 

[SportsFan581]

I play my share of GAAS. Hey, COD and Diablo are GAAS. I like them. I never pay an extra dime buying mtx (never have for Diablo and the last COD mtx I bought were Xbox 360 map packs for MW3 in 2011). I just play the standard modes vanilla style.

Comes down to what kind of games are made and how money grubbing grindy they are. Some are, some arent.

CoD does provide the campaigns too, so you do have the more traditional content with those as well.

 

[mckmas8808]

That's a non issue.

Developers + publishers look at the player metrics and devote the appropriate number of resources to these games every year. The risk comes from the initial development.

PlayStation changed their entire strategy in 2018 as a result of the BR explosion. I think they know the numbers.

There's risk in the continued development too. If they are expecting the game to be hot for 3 years and it falls off in 8 months........that's not good.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

There's risk in the continued development too. If they are expecting the game to be hot for 3 years and it falls off in 8 months........that's not good.

I don't think this is very realistic.

They have engagement analytics that would make the worlds biggest sports leagues jealous. If they're expecting their game to be hot, long term, it's because they have the analytics to suggest it.

 

[Sanepar]

That 40% is still larger investment then they've ever put into SP games. They've got a huge development budget going on at present.

This is not true. Development costs are higher than ever so they are probably developing less sp only games. Sony has only 16 studios that make games counting Bungie. Most of them are small studios 150 or less developers.

 

[StealthGoblin]

This is not true. Development costs are higher than ever so they are probably developing less sp only games. Sony has only 16 studios that make games counting Bungie. Most of them are small studios 150 or less developers.

You are not including xDEV.

We know of many games they are producing. Some include Project Red by PeopleCanFly, Project Bates by Ballistic Moon, Project Carbon by Sumo etc.

 

[T0minator]

You are not including xDEV.

We know of many games they are producing. Some include Project Red by PeopleCanFly, Project Bates by Ballistic Moon, Project Carbon by Sumo etc.

There's so many games in development at PS and with their partners their next showcase should be incredible, I'm just sick of waiting and hearing rumors about PS. Hermen Hulst and the PS team need to start being more open with their fanbase. It's bullshit lol

I get the feeling Concord will be their premier FPS game with the marketing budget that CoD used to get from them. That'll be the real test of PS's GaaS model

 

[StealthGoblin]

There's so many games in development at PS and with their partners their next showcase should be incredible, I'm just sick of waiting and hearing rumors about PS. Hermen Hulst and the PS team need to start being more open with their fanbase. It's bullshit lol

I get the feeling Concord will be their premier FPS game with the marketing budget that CoD used to get from them. That'll be the real test of PS's GaaS model

I'm curious about Concord as I have heard it isn't a standard MP game and has some unique elements. Given its a lot of old Bungie staff then maybe they've found a way to be innovative.

I'd originally thought that Deviation's game would be the biggest one but they just couldn't keep staff and the whole thing bled out over time.

 

[Fake]

So much money in our pockets.

I could give a fuck.

He have fanboys defending ADs and the other fanboys defending GaaS.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Now list the failures.

Sony’s own studios don’t like the GaaS initiative.

That money going into a GaaS push would be better spent on mobile development, where the whales truly are. You could always have a console/PC port of it as well.

 

[T0minator]

I'm curious about Concord as I have heard it isn't a standard MP game and has some unique elements. Given its a lot of old Bungie staff then maybe they've found a way to be innovative.

I'd originally thought that Deviation's game would be the biggest one but they just couldn't keep staff and the whole thing bled out over time.

Concord seems like it may be closer to an Apex type of game more than a Cod or other FPS MP games.

It'll have PVE and colorful character types. Could be like Overwatch too it seems

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Just four months ago, people were saying that GaaS is just a lottery and here Sony has what is likely going to be the next big GaaS game to start that revenue stream discussed here.

As I mentioned earlier, every year or two there is usually a new hit GaaS game on the market.

Has anyone changed their tune?

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

Sony has a very successful GaaS game -Fate Gran Order. Total revenue of more than $7 billion starting 2015.

If they can make a game similar to Genshin Impact with that brand, I think they have a winning formula.

Mihoyo is bigger than all Playstation studios combined.

FGO is Sony's most profitable IP for good reasons. Same reasons why it's under Sony Music instead of PS Studios. PS studios got rid of one of their best characters (Kat) only because it's anime. If FGO was managed by PS Studios it would EOS within a year.

In the Sony Corp there is a clear clash between the western and eastern sides and that translates into failed projects and decisions against what fans want (Days Gone abandonment, no Bloodborne remake, political stuff).

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Just four months ago, people were saying that GaaS is just a lottery and here Sony has what is likely going to be the next big GaaS game to start that revenue stream discussed here.

As I mentioned earlier, every year or two there is usually a new hit GaaS game on the market.

Has anyone changed their tune?

Few will admit to being wrong. They will protect the ego at all costs.

Instead, they'll try to redefine what GAAS is, or they'll attempt to say certain games aren't successful based on an arbitrary CCU number.

It's a tale as old as time.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

As for the OP's list of successful GAAS games, Roblox is unprofitable. I dont think that company has ever made money. but they got stock IPO money to keep them around for years.

As for the other successful big name GAAS, all are either legacy PC games or multiplat. Sony doing PS exclusive GAAS will not come close to any of those games. Even with PC day one access, they still wont unless it's a tried and true Bungie multiplat game like Destiny 3.

The Sony gamer base doesn't seem to give a shit about most attempts by Sony making MP games, and the PC crowd doesnt seem begging for a GAAS game originating from a walled console ecosystem.

If Sony really wants a successful GAAS game, make it day one multiplat on as many platforms as possible. Sounds impossible, but Sony doesn't seem to mind having MLB The Show on Switch and Xbox. So it can be done. Just a matter of how walled garden they want their GAAS to be.

Successful GAAS games eat up a lot of time and money from dedicated gamers. A rock solid multiplat game will eat up Nintendo and Xbox gamers time, Sony makes 70% cuts on sales and in turn weakens the rest of their ecosystem as people focus on Sony GAAS. It's like GTA and COD being 200 gb downloads with all the DLC and modes. Any gamer loving these games just ate up 200 gb (per game) of their SSD meaning it crowds out lots of other games as gamers wont even bother downloading more games if they are hitting the max.

Is Helldivers 2 a legacy PC game? Who ever said these GaaS games would be exclusive? Sounds to me like you writing your own narrative again.

Helldivers certainly wasn't tried and true was it?

Sony gamer base doesn't give a shit about Sony MP games yet this is the number one game on PSN... How do you not come to the thread and say how completely offbase you were? And maybe not try to be so prescriptive in the future...

I think this list is rather disingenuous. You and I both know that when Sony is talking about GaaS they aren't talking about titles like WoW or Minecraft. Most of those games also don't make any where close to the money Sony is chasing after here (if they did, they would've been in your OP).
And of course saturation is a thing. Just look at your list. You included WoW, for example. How many games tried chasing that subscription based MMO model and failed? Most of those games are the only game, or one of just a few, in their genres.
The list ignores all the failed GaaS attempts over the years. Especially recent years. Anthem? Halo Infinite? Redfall (lol)? Gundam Evolution? There are so many more.

They absolutely are talking about a diverse portfolio of GaaS games. The Horizon game isn't good to be a shooter for example.

First bullet in the chamber hit center mass...

To be successful in an industry (such as gaming), you dont have to corner the market in every aspect of it.

Like every company. Stick to what youre good at. Dont focus everything on risky stuff where their track record is bad.

Stick to what you're good at? How did this work out? Risk is how you grow a business and stay in business.

 

[nial]

FGO is Sony's most profitable IP for good reasons. Same reasons why it's under Sony Music instead of PS Studios.

It's because Aniplex (SMEJ's subsidiary) works a lot with Notes Co. (owner of the Fate IP) in several anime/movie projects, and that followed with them producing a mobile gacha title in the series that exploded in popularity in Japan.
SIE actually tried making mobile gacha games in existing (Wild Arms, Arc the Lad) and new IP (Sora tu Umi no Aida), the thing is that most of them flopped.

 

[twilo99]

Warzone number seems low to me.

Counter-Strike puts a smile on my face knowing how it all started..

Fortnite is an absolute monster.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Warzone number seems low to me.

Counter-Strike puts a smile on my face knowing how it all started..

Fortnite is an absolute monster.

That's because steam is not the end all be all. The vast majority of people play CoD off of Steam. The vast majority of PC players are on battle.net

 

[Mibu no ookami]

It's interesting that Concord is going to release this year (supposedly) and that Sony felt that they just had to buy them right away.

Ultimately, we're going to see if that was an overreaction, but I think it's clear that Sony must have really liked what they saw from this and even Fairgame$ for them to say, not only do we want to publish this game, but we want to publish all of your future games.

Not saying these games are going to be more successful than Helldivers, but in their drive to get GaaS hits, they bought a couple studios.

 

[The artful mincer]

People backing GAAS no doubt feeling smug at the moment!

As successful as Helldivers 2 has been it's still just one game and it's still unclear what it will look like in a year or further out from now. Overall I think Sony's GAAS push can only be judged until the PS6s released when all these other games have released.

I think judging them by there own expectations is fair. If they have reliably doubled there first party revenue then it's successful. It doesn't matter if it's coming from 1 game or 12.

Regarding Helldivers 2 I have these questions.

1. How much revenue is it generating from game sales?

It's half price and released on Steam so it's obviously less per unit compared to other First Party games.

2. How much revenue is generated after sales?

If it's not much then it's kinda similar to Sony's other single player titles unless...

3. Has it bumped Ps plus subscriptions?

Finally

4. Is it more like Fortnite or Fall Guys?

If it's Sony's Fortnite then arguably Sony don't need the other games to be successful. If it's like Fall Guys then it's obviously still really successful but it will just be another awesome exclusive in Sony's portfolio. The other GAAS games will have to pick up the slack if players drift away.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

People backing GAAS no doubt feeling smug at the moment!

As successful as Helldivers 2 has been it's still just one game and it's still unclear what it will look like in a year or further out from now. Overall I think Sony's GAAS push can only be judged until the PS6s released when all these other games have released.

The reason for the smugness comes from everyone and their mothers feeling fine about judging the Live Service strategy before a single game was released. Now we get the first one and it's a breakaway success?

Some crow must be served to a certain extent. That said, you are right. One hit doesn't prove the strategy successful.

I think judging them by there own expectations is fair. If they have reliably doubled there first party revenue then it's successful. It doesn't matter if it's coming from 1 game or 12.

Regarding Helldivers 2 I have these questions.

1. How much revenue is it generating from game sales?

It's half price and released on Steam so it's obviously less per unit compared to other First Party games.

2. How much revenue is generated after sales?

If it's not much then it's kinda similar to Sony's other single player titles unless...

3. Has it bumped Ps plus subscriptions?

Finally

4. Is it more like Fortnite or Fall Guys?

If it's Sony's Fortnite then arguably Sony don't need the other games to be successful. If it's like Fall Guys then it's obviously still really successful but it will just be another awesome exclusive in Sony's portfolio. The other GAAS games will have to pick up the slack if players drift away.

Your 4 questions are both valid and somewhat irrelevant.

They're valid because certainly PlayStation and Arrowhead are asking themselves the same questions right now. They're all doing their best to make sure Helldivers 2 performs well in all aforementioned areas.

They're irrelevant because, at the end of the day, it's about ROI. If Helldivers 2 sells 7 million copies in its first 6 months, and they get a little added revenue from the MTX, then it's (likely) a massive W and will inform PlayStation on what to pursue going forward.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Is Helldivers 2 a legacy PC game? Who ever said these GaaS games would be exclusive? Sounds to me like you writing your own narrative again.

Helldivers certainly wasn't tried and true was it?

Sony gamer base doesn't give a shit about Sony MP games yet this is the number one game on PSN... How do you not come to the thread and say how completely offbase you were? And maybe not try to be so prescriptive in the future...



They absolutely are talking about a diverse portfolio of GaaS games. The Horizon game isn't good to be a shooter for example.

First bullet in the chamber hit center mass...



Stick to what you're good at? How did this work out? Risk is how you grow a business and stay in business.

Big man coming back to a thread to reply to a post in October. If H2 failed you wouldnt post at all and you know it.

GAAS is a risky hit and miss type of game. And Sony's track record on MP is lousy going all the way back to PS3 games, which includes Helldivers 1 on PS4 which was barely played by anyone. H2 has done great despite huge server issues. Other Sony GAAS lately havent... Destruction All Stars, cancelled LOU Online, cancelled Deviation game.

One of the execs even said a couple years ago all they need is one of their GAAS among the 10 to cover them all. H2 might be the one. When an exec even has this mindset, he's rolling the dice gambling.

 

[cash_longfellow]

I think the hate is because most people don’t want GAAS, not because of the money it makes. In fact, one could argue the money they make is the hate because it bleeds the player.

 

[Thaimasker]

Big man coming back to a thread to reply to a post in October. If H2 failed you wouldnt post at all and you know it.

GAAS is a risky hit and miss type of game. And Sony's track record on MP is lousy going all the way back to PS3 games, which includes Helldivers 1 on PS4 which was barely played by anyone. H2 has done great despite huge server issues. Other Sony GAAS lately havent... Destruction All Stars, cancelled LOU Online, cancelled Deviation game.

One of the execs even said a couple years ago all they need is one of their GAAS among the 10 to cover them all. H2 might be the one. When an exec even has this mindset, he's rolling the dice gambling.

Thing is ... PlayStation is a huge brand in gaming. If the game is good it'll do good. Destruction all stars was simply a bad game. If most released a straight up bad game would it do great?
It seems to me that they are more strict about getting these games right compared to back then. I wouldn't be surprised if concord would be their second hit GAAS in a single year.

The majority of gamers are playing GAAS and many of them are hungry for new ones. So why not invest in the majority of your audience and only the minority

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Big man coming back to a thread to reply to a post in October. If H2 failed you wouldnt post at all and you know it.

GAAS is a risky hit and miss type of game. And Sony's track record on MP is lousy going all the way back to PS3 games, which includes Helldivers 1 on PS4 which was barely played by anyone. H2 has done great despite huge server issues. Other Sony GAAS lately havent... Destruction All Stars, cancelled LOU Online, cancelled Deviation game.

One of the execs even said a couple years ago all they need is one of their GAAS among the 10 to cover them all. H2 might be the one. When an exec even has this mindset, he's rolling the dice gambling.

I posted this in October because I was right then and I'm right now. Whether Helldivers 2 was a success or not is largely irrelevant. It's the model for success that Sony has built.

What did I write originally, that only one or two of these games need to be hits and Sony knows that the resources they are putting into these games means that they have a better chance than most.

I'm starting to see what kind of post you really are.

Sony's multiplayer games didn't do well on PS3 because checks notes... the PS3 didn't sell well enough and PSN wasn't mature enough compared to Xbox Live at the time. Helldivers 1 on PS4 was not a big budget game. Interesting that you totally ignore GT Sport, which was really Sony's first big major foray into this stuff.

Destruction All Stars was a cheap launch title, you're so disingenuous. Games get cancelled all the time, whether they GaaS or otherwise.

Not only did an exec say that, I said that months ago, but you weren't like, you know you're right and an exec said the same thing, you were shitty and wrong. You're not saying anything new here.

From the OP you didn't read or didn't care to pay attention to

I think Jim Ryan has correctly understood that Sony needs at least one or two major GaaS titles to bolster operating incomes, otherwise, it's going to fall well behind other publishers. I think they were overly ambitious with the numbers they wanted to introduce, but I also think those numbers were inflated by games like MLB The Show.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

People backing GAAS no doubt feeling smug at the moment!

As successful as Helldivers 2 has been it's still just one game and it's still unclear what it will look like in a year or further out from now. Overall I think Sony's GAAS push can only be judged until the PS6s released when all these other games have released.

I think judging them by there own expectations is fair. If they have reliably doubled there first party revenue then it's successful. It doesn't matter if it's coming from 1 game or 12.

Regarding Helldivers 2 I have these questions.

1. How much revenue is it generating from game sales?

It's half price and released on Steam so it's obviously less per unit compared to other First Party games.

2. How much revenue is generated after sales?

If it's not much then it's kinda similar to Sony's other single player titles unless...

3. Has it bumped Ps plus subscriptions?

Finally

4. Is it more like Fortnite or Fall Guys?

If it's Sony's Fortnite then arguably Sony don't need the other games to be successful. If it's like Fall Guys then it's obviously still really successful but it will just be another awesome exclusive in Sony's portfolio. The other GAAS games will have to pick up the slack if players drift away.

I'm smug because once again, I had the business right and many like StreetsofBeige had it wrong. He doesn't like getting called out just a few months ago, but the receipts are right there. The prediction in this thread wasn't Helldivers is going to be a smash hit, it was that Jim Ryan was right to look for revenue in GaaS games, because Sony needs continuous revenue coming throughout the year when they aren't dropping games.

Other publishers were passing Sony by but a Sony that has GaaS success is a really dangerous entity because that revenue is going to keep them in the AAA game space and allow them to take their time with game releases.

As for the roadmap for Helldivers... there are so many things they can do to fairly monetize this game for years to come. First they already have the super citizen sku that is one of the best selling games on Steam, this is 60 dollars. Then they can release armor packs that align with other Sony IP is probably a first. Killzone, Resistance, Destiny and others; they can sell these for 5 dollars a pop. They have mechs coming later. They could do a major crossover with Starship Troopers an IP that Sony Pictures owns, this could be a whole season pass that they could sell for 20 dollars. The amount of crossovers they can do are pretty much endless. They can do a Helldivers movie a kin to Starship Troopers.

Once sales die down for Helldivers, they can cut the price to 20 dollars or even 10 dollars to get the numbers back up and once the game hits PS+ you're going to see an influx of players. Eventually, the game can go F2P, which is where it is going to get/sustain it's massive numbers.

If played right Helldivers 2 could be worth billions for Sony. That's billions with a B!

And this is only the first major release in their strategy. There will likely be some redundancy, but over time, Sony is going to hit with more and more of these games. And people who were so wrong about this strategy (and other things) yet adamant that they were right, should absolutely be called out with the receipts.