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[Jose92]

Watch Dogs Legion is the first PC title supporting DirectX Ray Tracing to arrive on the next-gen consoles - and in this detailed analysis, Alex Battaglia stacks up the console RT implementation against the PC version. Consoles are running on lower-than-PC settings, so what are the differences and what happens when we mod the PC game to run at Series X quality levels? And from *there*, what kind of PC graphics hardware does it take to match and exceed console quality? The results will surprise you.

Watch Dogs: Legion - how does console ray tracing compare to Nvidia RTX?

Hardware accelerated ray tracing is now firmly established in triple-A titles on PC and with the transition to next gen…

www.eurogamer.net

 

[Evilms]

"After all, in the non-RT Gears 5, an RTX 2080 is said to be comparable to Series X, yet here in Watch Dogs: Legion with RT features active, an RTX 2060 Super seems to be more performant. "

 

[M1chl]

DF: Watch Dogs Legion - Xbox Series X/S Ray Tracing vs PC RTX - Features, Quality, Performance + More

Currently watching, not sure how it ended up being.

www.neogaf.com

 

[Thirty7ven]

"After all, in the non-RT Gears 5, an RTX 2080 is said to be comparable to Series X, yet here in Watch Dogs: Legion with RT features active, an RTX 2060 Super seems to be more performant. "

Uh, what the fuck

 

[Neko Mimi Mode]

Uh, what the fuck

Ray Tracing is more performant for Nvidia over AMD.

 

[diffusionx]

Also, PS5 and XSX seem to be running at the same settings.

Uh, what the fuck

Fact is, these consoles are the very first piece of AMD hardware with RT on the market, so we're just learning what it can do.

 

[pokerlife]

Not to hot

 

[Agnostic2020]

"After all, in the non-RT Gears 5, an RTX 2080 is said to be comparable to Series X, yet here in Watch Dogs: Legion with RT features active, an RTX 2060 Super seems to be more performant. "

Damn.Hopefully they get better with time.

Dealer told me its gonna be better than 2080ti for RT ?

I trust dealer a lot

 

[Low Moral Fibre]

So watched it all and seems like a mix of medium and high PC settings for XSX and PS5 but some of the raytracing settings are lower than the lowest settings possible on PC without editing your config files.

Looks like a 2060S at native 4k (no DLSS) and console settings compares favourably with XSX and presumably PS5 although not yet tested.

Raytracing is always going to be difficult on these consoles but I have to admit it does look good on XSX compared to X1X despite the compromises that had to be made.

 

[M1chl]

Damn.Hopefully they get better with time.

Dealer told me its gonna be better than 2080ti for RT ?

I trust dealer a lot

Well you edited it, I am not saying anything about 2080Ti, however I am not sure what type of RT library are we using as of today, because AMD was heavily behind the curve, so it might improved or might not. However in this game, it's clearly shown how RT can improve the quality.

 

[reksveks]

AMD's RDNA2 is behind Turing

 

[01011001]

performance will improve with later games I bet.

back when Battlefield 5 came out it crushed RTX cards, but over time after many patches it started running way better.

launch titles using RT to this extent is surprising enough tbh.

 

[//DEVIL//]

Holyshit I got so bored I couldn't even finish the video. does he post these videos to justify his job at DF ?

hey look that reflection of the building on that puddle of water is low res when i zoom it 400x ... who the #$#$ gives a #$@# #@$#@ #@$@#$ #@$#@ ??????

I love my PC and 2080ti. i love my XSX and my PS5 on the way, but this is god damn too much :/

focus on the things that friggin actually matter. will never notice any of this shit while i am playing at all.

Looks like a 2060S at native 4k

what ? no . its between 2080 and 2080 super

 

[Thirty7ven]

This video just confirmed to me that these zoomed in analysis are worthless.

For Alex all these differences are “obvious” but I never notice them until he stops the game and decides to focus on a bit part.

Must be excruciating to be in his shoes, being such a stickler for diminishing returns.

 

[GaviotaGrande]

performance will improve with later games I bet.

back when Battlefield 5 came out it crushed RTX cards, but over time after many patches it started running way better.

launch titles using RT to this extent is surprising enough tbh.

It's still crushing RTX cards. That's why on Nvidia there's DLSS.

 

[Evilms]

Damn.Hopefully they get better with time.

Dealer told me its gonna be better than 2080ti for RT ?

I trust dealer a lot

4x 2080Ti

 

[Aceofspades]

Don't over-promise then under-deliver Microsoft.

 

[Neko Mimi Mode]

Don't over-promise then under-deliver Microsoft.

When did Microsoft over promise about AMD Ray Tracing performance?

 

[Dampf]

AMD's RDNA2 is behind Turing

Yes, exactly what I expected.

 

[Phrixotrichus]

So the Series X first row of cross gen offerings are already exhibiting lower than PC-low settings, at least for RT, and generally use slightly lower quality assets.......and are nowhere near native 4k (as expected)

Still good for a 500$ box, but "you get what you pay for" obviously still holds true.

This also doesn`t bode well for AMD`s RDNA2 RT performance.......which is probably why they have only shown classic rasterization benchmark numbers so far.

 

[Freeman76]

Does he cover how shit this looks on series X? The buildings, scenery etc are amazing but the surfaces, water, reflections are abysmal. I dont see the point of DF if all they do is review things on the best tech that hardly anyone has. Their AC valhalla video didnt even mention the awful screen tearing because they play it on a top quality tv that most of us plebs dont have the luxury to own.

Its annoying because the crap reflections in WD and tearing in AC need coverage from a respected source, Ubisoft dont listen to their forum goers and maybe they would up their game if someone called them out on this stuff.

 

[diffusionx]

So watched it all and seems like a mix of medium and high PC settings for XSX and PS5 but some of the raytracing settings are lower than the lowest settings possible on PC without editing your config files.

Looks like a 2060S at native 4k (no DLSS) and console settings compares favourably with XSX and presumably PS5 although not yet tested.

Raytracing is always going to be difficult on these consoles but I have to admit it does look good on XSX compared to X1X despite the compromises that had to be made.

4x 2080Ti

Can I get a

SECRET
A
U
C
E

 

[acm2000]

i called 2060 super for current gen consoles on this game and got slammed for it, it will however get better as DX12U ray tracing seems to be far behind nvidias, plus this is a ubisoft game so.... expected?

 

[Zuzu]

If ray racing reduces the performance of the Series X from a 2080 to a 2060 Super then I would prefer them to not use it and instead focus on graphical features that play to the console’s strengths. At least give us the option to turn it off and use traditional lighting techniques so we can get that performance back.

 

[Croatoan]

So watched it all and seems like a mix of medium and high PC settings for XSX and PS5 but some of the raytracing settings are lower than the lowest settings possible on PC without editing your config files.

Looks like a 2060S at native 4k (no DLSS) and console settings compares favourably with XSX and presumably PS5 although not yet tested.

Raytracing is always going to be difficult on these consoles but I have to admit it does look good on XSX compared to X1X despite the compromises that had to be made.

I fucking told yall...lol. I cant believe people thought the PS5/XBSEX would compete with the 2080ti.

 

[Dampf]

i called 2060 super for current gen consoles on this game and got slammed for it, it will however get better as DX12U ray tracing seems to be far behind nvidias, plus this is a ubisoft game so.... expected?

Huh? DX12U is also fully supported on Turing. If there are any huge improvements made with DXR 1.1, the 2060 Super will benefit too.

 

[Stilton Disco]

We've see from Spiderman that you can get some damned good ray tracing out of these machines, so I expect we'll see better results as the generation progresses, and the third party devs get used to the new hardware.

 

[reksveks]

Huh? DX12U is also fully supported on Turing. If there are any huge improvements made with DXR 1.1, the 2060 Super will benefit too.

We did see a decent improvement in Minecraft, right?

 

[Bittermich]

So the Series X first row of cross gen offerings are already exhibiting lower than PC-low settings, at least for RT

What do you mean already? This is because it’s the first row of games. It’s always like that. First waves of console games usually have issues, there are many reasons why it is that way and it has been every gen like that. Performance will get better.

 

[rodrigolfp]

pretendstobeshocked.gif

Actually, I'm shocked. Looks better than I expected.

 

[Phrixotrichus]

What do you mean already? This is because it’s the first row of games. It’s always like that. First waves of console games usually have issues, there are many reasons why it is that way and it has been every gen like that. Performance will get better.

Games get more complex and more demanding over the course of a gen, not less.
All that changes is that devs get better at masking or working around shortcomings. But they are there and they are there to stay.
These boxes are weak compared to a high end PC, which is why they cost less than half of one, and that will continue to be the case. Additionally this is the first gen where AMD offers RT support...and I´m willing to bet that their performance in that field is much worse than Nvidia`s which is why they haven´t released any numbers, yet.

 

[Agnostic2020]

4x 2080Ti

I trust asstal with my life. He is a so called armchair tech analyst, He knows what he is talking about

 

[pokerlife]

We've see from Spiderman that you can get some damned good ray tracing out of these machines, so I expect we'll see better results as the generation progresses, and the third party devs get used to the new hardware.

ya im sure these games were rushed and not fully optimized

 

[Stuart360]

So the Series X first row of cross gen offerings are already exhibiting lower than PC-low settings, at least for RT, and generally use slightly lower quality assets.......and are nowhere near native 4k (as expected)

Still good for a 500$ box, but "you get what you pay for" obviously still holds true.

This also doesn`t bode well for AMD`s RDNA2 RT performance.......which is probably why they have only shown classic rasterization benchmark numbers so far.

I think XSX and PS5 are still way better at launch than XB1 and PS4 were at launch. But yeah, PC will always remain king.

 

[Reindeer]

Remember when GAF was losing their mind when Alex used 2060S (something agreed by other DF members) for RT comparison with PS5? Once again, GAF experts prove that they know little to nothing and are just cry babies that have been proven wrong time and time again when it comes to this next gen stuff. Not matter how many times these people are proven wrong, they keep embarrassing themselves over and over.

 

[Stuart360]

If ray racing reduces the performance of the Series X from a 2080 to a 2060 Super then I would prefer them to not use it and instead focus on graphical features that play to the console’s strengths. At least give us the option to turn it off and use traditional lighting techniques so we can get that performance back.

The ironic thing is that i have a none RTX card, and if you turn reflections onto the highest settings, they look gorgeous in this game, even though its not RT.
Yeah i'd take framerate over RT anyday.

 

[Leyasu]

Thread is off to an amazing start with the usual suspects already shitting it up.

A cross-gen launch title with ray tracing is not going to anything spectacular. We are going to have to wait for 1st party games to shine and for 2nd or 3rd yr 3rd party games.

 

[Phrixotrichus]

I think XSX and PS5 are still way better at launch than XB1 and PS4 were at launch. But yeah, PC will always remain king.

agreed. The X1 and PS4 were at best a hearty "meh" at launch already, hardware wise.

The PS5/XSX are way better in that regard......but unfortunately the performance targets the marketing divisions decided upon eat that right up.
And then there is this abomination ..the XSS.

 

[ACESHIGH]

So an RX 580 8GB should be able to trade blows with a series S at 1080p without RT i presume.

Can't wait to see what a 3050 is able to do vs a ps5

 

[FireFly]

Games get more complex and more demanding over the course of a gen, not less.
All that changes is that devs get better at masking or working around shortcomings. But they are there and they are there to stay.
These boxes are weak compared to a high end PC, which is why they cost less than half of one, and that will continue to be the case. Additionally this is the first gen where AMD offers RT support...and I´m willing to bet that their performance in that field is much worse than Nvidia`s which is why they haven´t released any numbers, yet.

The RT performance of the 6800 XT is rumoured to be 2080 Ti class or slightly better, which roughly matches with the hardware differences.

 

[Stilton Disco]

So an RX 580 8GB should be able to trade blows with a series S at 1080p without RT i presume.

Can't wait to see what a 3050 is able to do vs a ps5

From the two comparisons we've had so far, it looks like the PS5 and XSX deliver about the same real world performance, they just take different routes to get there.

I'd expect a 3060 will deliver similar performance to both, with a 3070 needed if you want your games to look as good as the top console exclusives.

 

[Reindeer]

Another thing this video highlights is how AMD RT solution takes away raster performance, so it's much more performant when RT is off as opposed to when it's on. This is something many insiders have been claiming when it came to AMD solution for RT as RNDA2 doesn't have separate cores for RT, a reason why performance penalty is much higher than on Nvidia GPUs. It makes perfect sense that these consoles are able to perform around 2080 level with RT off and are closer to 2060S with RT on. Maybe with optimisation consoles can do better, but right now DF was spot on when they originally used 2060S to compare RT between next gen consoles and PC.

 

[MadchesterManc]

The ironic thing is that i have a none RTX card, and if you turn reflections onto the highest settings, they look gorgeous in this game, even though its not RT.
Yeah i'd take framerate over RT anyday.

I remember the Hardware Unboxed video pretty much saying the same for Legions, think they even recommended it if you can't use the higher RT settings too due to the way it culls the environment in the reflections. Screen space reflections are generally good and you seem to lose almost no performance when cranking them up these days. Only issue I have with them is when the reflections are on large reflective surfaces. It can be a little jarring on Metro Exodus around the lakes & rivers when the reflections pop in and out.

 

[Rikkori]

Consoles back to pleb status confirmed. Even funnier - in 2 months 3060 launches and that will be above XSX/PS5 further. Consoles basically starting off as equivalent to 3050, PC's low end card.

Now imagine after 2 more gpu launches in 4 years.. Big Oof! I guess when I called them 1440p machines I was being generous, this is going to get rough long term.

Time for Series X Pro and Playstation 5 X.

 

[Dampf]

We did see a decent improvement in Minecraft, right?

Yes, actually the improvement was quite significant!

 

[Monkeygourmet]

And yet again Sony exclusives will be the best looking games in a generation - that’s pretty much 5 on 5

 

[rodrigolfp]

Consoles back to pleb status confirmed. Even funnier - in 2 months 3060 launches and that will be above XSX/PS5 further. Consoles basically starting off as equivalent to 3050, PC's low end card.

Now imagine after 2 more gpu launches in 4 years.. Big Oof! I guess when I called them 1440p machines I was being generous, this is going to get rough long term.

Time for Series X Pro and Playstation 5 X.

In the end doesn´t matter. PS4 was even weaker for the time and sold 110+mi. So PS5 will sell 150+mi.

 

[Leonidas]

Can't wait to see PS5 vs. PC RT comparisons. If XSX performs worse than the previous gen midrange RTX 2060S in RT, where will PS5 land?

 

[Reindeer]

.

 

[Neo_game]

Remember when GAF was losing their mind when Alex used 2060S (something agreed by other DF members) for RT comparison with PS5? Once again, GAF experts prove that they know little to nothing and are just cry babies that have been proven wrong time and time again when it comes to this next gen stuff. Not matter how many times these people are proven wrong, they keep embarrassing themselves over and over.

If both PS5 and SX are doing the same thing he cannot call one superior to other. At one point he was convinced that PS5 was nothing more than overclocked 36 CU, RX 5700. Apart from benchmark, facts I think they will talk good about both and try to be neutral by keeping both parties interested.