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[SlimySnake]

I agree with this, but not just for charges for shootings like this. I think America at least needs a 'come to jesus' meeting with parents and the downright awful job they're doing. How would you ever accomplish that though? I agree that putting personal stakes into it probably would help a bit in this type of situation, but really parents are just failing their kids all around in the past few decades, IMO.

But how do you recruit them into the military then? I think that's the reason we haven't seen any movement on this point either.

I think the parents are too fucking involved. We had everyone bitching about common core math a few years ago. now critical race theory is a big thing parents are bitching about. some parents are terrified about gender pronouns messing with their kids minds (myself included), but for whatever reason we draw the line at things that can actually kill our kids.

as a parent of 7 year old, i can tell you he already keeps things from me. took me a while to find out he has a crush on a girl. took me even longer to find out they were talking about sex already. and this is when they are 7. by the time they are 18, i highly doubt i would know what they are up to on forums, reddit, and whatever dark web website kids like this browse nowadays. i can teach my kids all the right things, but kids are impressionable and at some point, you just cant watch everything they do.

 

[InfiniteCombo]

Horrible news today, while my kid was in grade school. Here where I live, they kicked cops out of schools, because all cops are bad apparently. We could ban all guns tomorrow and they would not go away over night. If you could magically get rid of all guns, you would get rid of shootings, not killing. To be someone who wants to kill children is not going to go away with access to guns removed. If this monster was not able to get a gun, he would not stop there. He would have killed some other way. Sad but true. The instant blaming of guns is a distraction from the real problem. The problem is someone feels that killing school children is even an option. And since we live in a country where people want to kill children, we need to protect them. And wishing guns away and blaming guns and demanding gun control will seriously not fix this problem. In the short term, the easiest solution is armed guards at all schools. Most schools have already made security changes, like a single point of entry. Add an armed guard at that entrance. It will deter, slow down, or simply stop an assailant. Long term is actually doing something about mental illness in this country. We are pretty much making more and more people mentally ill every year, and these things will keep happening because of that. We send billions of dollars to other countries and let our own country go to shit.

I really do wish there was less gun violence, but it is intertwined in our society. Mental illness, hopelessness, gangs, cartels, etc. It is not one thing that is causing this. It is telling that only one thing gets the blame every single time. It is a broken record at this point.

Very good post. Interesting you mention that, since the city I live in is also considering getting rid of cops in schools. Bad idea. No, scratch that... terrible idea.

My thoughts and sympathies go out to the families and to the community of Uvalde in general. Truly horrible stuff.

CNN is reporting 21 total. A truly devastating and sad day. I hope this brings us closer as a nation; to first, rally behind these families suffering such a tragic loss, and then work together to lessen things like this from happening in the future. That's the optimist in me, anyway; the realist in me understands that such unity is (sadly) unlikely to happen in the current climate . I hope to high heavens that I'm proven wrong, though.

 

[SlimySnake]

Horrible news today, while my kid was in grade school. Here where I live, they kicked cops out of schools, because all cops are bad apparently. We could ban all guns tomorrow and they would not go away over night. If you could magically get rid of all guns, you would get rid of shootings, not killing. To be someone who wants to kill children is not going to go away with access to guns removed. If this monster was not able to get a gun, he would not stop there. He would have killed some other way. Sad but true. The instant blaming of guns is a distraction from the real problem. The problem is someone feels that killing school children is even an option. And since we live in a country where people want to kill children, we need to protect them. And wishing guns away and blaming guns and demanding gun control will seriously not fix this problem. In the short term, the easiest solution is armed guards at all schools. Most schools have already made security changes, like a single point of entry. Add an armed guard at that entrance. It will deter, slow down, or simply stop an assailant. Long term is actually doing something about mental illness in this country. We are pretty much making more and more people mentally ill every year, and these things will keep happening because of that. We send billions of dollars to other countries and let our own country go to shit.

I really do wish there was less gun violence, but it is intertwined in our society. Mental illness, hopelessness, gangs, cartels, etc. It is not one thing that is causing this. It is telling that only one thing gets the blame every single time. It is a broken record at this point.

Yes, first thing we need to do is put a fucking barbed wire fence around every school. we cant protect our grocery stores, malls, and parks, but ffs just spend some cash on school safety ffs.

Secondly, this district actually did have cops stationed. I dont know what happened there, but the shooter was intercepted by cops beforehand and he still managed to get inside. they also had social media monitoring, and other preventive measures like mental health counseling so this is actually a poster child case for when you can have all the preventive measures in the world and it still wont solve the problem.

Lastly, my high school in the early 2000s was a fortress. main floor windows were bolted shut. we had to go through metal detectors. cops, not school staff were there to pat us down in case we tripped the detectors. then on every single floor, the exits were manned by cops. they made sure no one fought in the hallway and they made sure no one roamed around after the bell had rung after each period. i remember them giving me a dirty look if i ever took the bathroom pass during class because they discouraged roaming the halls, period.

why we cant have that kind of security at elementary schools 20 years later is beyond me. take those $40 billion from ukraine and invest in some security here in the u.s. thanks.

 

[Toons]

Idk why were talking about cops being there when cops were there today and they were f***in' worthless.

People wanna talk about all the other s***. Talk about the fact this kid was able to get a gun when he should not have been able to get a gun. And if it wasn't his gun, then who ever he got his gun from should not have been able to get one, nd after this should never be able to own one again because he's clearly not treating it like the dangerous weapon it is in the wrong hands.

If I lend some dude my car and he DUIs and kills even one kid, I am SOL. It should be the same here.

 

[12Goblins]

buying 2 ar-15s days after his 18th birthday.

we need to stop this shit

 

[Robot Carnival]

let's be real here. those talking points of "protecting my family from the tyranny of the government" just doesn't make sense any more when you consider those scenarios with the modern day military. if the US government REALLY want to rule by force and the people in the army is willing to go along with it, do you really think a bunch of yaahoos with AR15s can actually form some sort of resistance to that?

as an immigrant who lived in Hong Kong before it's handed back to the CCP in 1997, I've seen some gun violence's there also. but those are all VERY rare incidents and all of them are robbers who smuggled the guns in from other countries. there are crimes sure, but at least in our day to day life, we never had to worry about guns at all. when I moved to the US, I support the 2nd amendment, but I always feel it should have some restrictions to it. as some had already suggested, there should be registrations and record keeping process with gun and magazine purchase. you should also need extended background check when you purchase any firearm and pass a gun safety class that's not just read a few pages and watch a video type of deal. if you have kids at home, you need some sort of safe gun storage that gets check on from time to time. and of course, banning gun purchase for anyone with mental issues. the fact that it's easier to buy a gun than buy a car is always something that puzzles me.

 

[Umbasaborne]

I feel sick to my stomach, and just so terrible for these children who had their future stripped away from them. And the families who lost them. God fucking damnit, this cant keep happening, this cannot keep fucking happening. Why the fuck is nothing being done about this? How many kids do we need to bury before something is done? Fuck this, fuck all of it. The person who did this is a fucking monster and a coward and i hope that if there is a hell, that they are rotting in it. Fuck, i cried like twice today already over this. It just feels so fucking helpless

 

[Kazekage1981]

i also dont fully understand the psychology behind their motive. Saying they have mental health issues, or they are crazy doesn't help much. The question is WHY do they have that? For this incident, I dont fucking understand him killing his grandmother and driving all the way to elementary school just to kill kids. Why pick kids? He hates kids? Did some kid do something to him? Why pick that elementary school?

This is more like a Clarice Starling and Hannibal Lector type of thing. Maybe he did it because his innocence as a child was robbed of him? He did it because he knew they would not be able to defend themselves? What he did was based purely on emotion with an emotional breaking point (unless it was pre planned with a manifesto or something). Its based purely on emotion and feelings. There is nothing logical about this. None of this makes any sense.

 

[12Goblins]

Idk why were talking about cops being there when cops were there today and they were f***in' worthless.

it's funny to me that people expect some min wage goober with a handgun to run in there and save the day vs some armored suicidal lunatic with military grade rifles. give me a break

 

[SlimySnake]

i also dont fully understand the psychology behind their motive. Saying they have mental health issues, or they are crazy doesn't help much. The question is WHY do they have that? For this incident, I dont fucking understand him killing his grandmother and driving all the way to elementary school just to kill kids. Why pick kids? He hates kids? Did some kid do something to him? Why pick that elementary school?

This is more like a Clarice Starling and Hannibal Lector type of thing. Maybe he did it because his innocence as a child was robbed of him? He did it because he knew they would not be able to defend themselves? What he did was based purely on emotion with an emotional breaking point (unless it was pre planned with a manifesto or something). Its based purely on emotion and feelings. There is nothing logical about this. None of this makes any sense.

dont know about him, but the sandy hook shooter had been drawing cartoons of shooting kids in schools since he was 5. some people are just fucked up.

the sandy hook shooter might have been 5 years old in 1998 or 1999 when the columbine shootings happened so he probably saw that on the news when he was five and was transfixed. he was autistic and not a mild one at that. he didnt speak to his mom for months on end and had his bedroom windows blocked by garbage bags. Why his mom felt the need to buy him guns is beyond me, but kids with mental health problems or even OCDness can get an idea in their head and just grow up with it just completely taking over their mind.

school shootings werent exactly a thing before columbine. the murder and crime rates in the 60s to early 90s was very high, but very few school shootings if any. its almost like as soon as the crime rate went down, the school shootings went up because of the media coverage of these mass shootings.

 

[nush]

its almost like as soon as the crime rate went down, the school shootings went up because of the media coverage of these mass shootings.

It plants the idea in peoples head, very common thing for humans (Minus the shooting part).

 

[Dream-Knife]

We've been long overdue for a school shooting likely due to covid. These will get increasingly common as mental illness is on the rise.

 

[Kazekage1981]

most, if not all autistic kids and with learning disabilities are boys

 

[Dream-Knife]

it's funny to me that people expect some min wage goober with a handgun to run in there and save the day vs some armored suicidal lunatic with military grade rifles. give me a break

Police have the same weapons. They lack any serious training due to their budgets. Civilians are better trained than police.

 

[SlimySnake]

it's funny to me that people expect some min wage goober with a handgun to run in there and save the day vs some armored suicidal lunatic with military grade rifles. give me a break

Not just that the cops were there, but also they had other preventive measures as well. Mental health counseling? Check. Cops stationed at schools? Check. Social Media monitoring? Check. And this still happened. So clearly, none of those preventive measures actually prevented this.

In the Parkland high shooting, the cop stationed there never went inside because he was two weeks from retirement. I dont blame him. In the buffalo grocery store shooting, the security guard actually shot the shooter 3 times but hit the bullet proof west instead. The shooter shot then shot him dead and went about his rampage. I dont know if having cops stationed in front of the school will prevent shootings because anyone can just walk to them, take out a concealed weapon and shoot them in the face. Armor only helps.

The buffalo shooting suspect had been flagged by the school system after he took an online assessment and said his life goal was murder and suicide. he was suspended but managed to fool his counselors who let him go. He even wrote that he was surprised they bought his act. So again, the system failed to prevent this.

The only real option is to keep guns from these people, and thats never going to happen in this country.

 

[SlimySnake]

most, if not all autistic kids and with learning disabilities are boys

yeah, but i didnt mean to suggest that autistic kids are more likely to become mass shooters. I was just making a connection with the OCD traits of autism and what could have happened with the sandy hook shooter. I think he might be the only autistic shooter out of all the school shooters in the last two years so there is no link i would think.

I do think that kids going on these murder sprees are likely suffering from some kind of mental health issues and these wall to wall coverage thanks to the 24/7 news cycle likely inspire them in a fucked up way.

P,S it's definitely interesting that almost none of these mass shooters are women. I see women kill their own kids all the time. read a couple of fucked up stories just this month, but i wonder why girls dont go out and do this. studies have shown that girls are more bullied than boys. especially on social media.

maybe we can do a targeted ban on just boys. let teenage girls, adult men and women have all the guns they want. i think the vegas and the orlando club shooters were the only ones who were over 30. most of the shooters, even the virgina tech shooter were under 25. maybe we can agree to ban guns to men under 25. just for a little while to see if that works.

 

[Dream-Knife]

let's be real here. those talking points of "protecting my family from the tyranny of the government" just doesn't make sense any more when you consider those scenarios with the modern day military. if the US government REALLY want to rule by force and the people in the army is willing to go along with it, do you really think a bunch of yaahoos with AR15s can actually form some sort of resistance to that?

as an immigrant who lived in Hong Kong before it's handed back to the CCP in 1997, I've seen some gun violence's there also. but those are all VERY rare incidents and all of them are robbers who smuggled the guns in from other countries. there are crimes sure, but at least in our day to day life, we never had to worry about guns at all. when I moved to the US, I support the 2nd amendment, but I always feel it should have some restrictions to it. as some had already suggested, there should be registrations and record keeping process with gun and magazine purchase. you should also need extended background check when you purchase any firearm and pass a gun safety class that's not just read a few pages and watch a video type of deal. if you have kids at home, you need some sort of safe gun storage that gets check on from time to time. and of course, banning gun purchase for anyone with mental issues. the fact that it's easier to buy a gun than buy a car is always something that puzzles me.

Live free or die. No one thought some yahoo's would overthrow British rule in the colonies.

You can't regulate mental illness. The same party that pushes gun control promotes mental illness.

 

[BigBooper]

let's be real here. those talking points of "protecting my family from the tyranny of the government" just doesn't make sense any more when you consider those scenarios with the modern day military. if the US government REALLY want to rule by force and the people in the army is willing to go along with it, do you really think a bunch of yaahoos with AR15s can actually form some sort of resistance to that?

as an immigrant who lived in Hong Kong before it's handed back to the CCP in 1997, I've seen some gun violence's there also. but those are all VERY rare incidents and all of them are robbers who smuggled the guns in from other countries. there are crimes sure, but at least in our day to day life, we never had to worry about guns at all. when I moved to the US, I support the 2nd amendment, but I always feel it should have some restrictions to it. as some had already suggested, there should be registrations and record keeping process with gun and magazine purchase. you should also need extended background check when you purchase any firearm and pass a gun safety class that's not just read a few pages and watch a video type of deal. if you have kids at home, you need some sort of safe gun storage that gets check on from time to time. and of course, banning gun purchase for anyone with mental issues. the fact that it's easier to buy a gun than buy a car is always something that puzzles me.

It's a buffer. Will some random militia of yahoos survive against any military, let alone the US? Lol no. It makes the cost of oppression higher than 0 though.

 

[Havoc2049]

Idk why were talking about cops being there when cops were there today and they were f***in' worthless.

People wanna talk about all the other s***. Talk about the fact this kid was able to get a gun when he should not have been able to get a gun. And if it wasn't his gun, then who ever he got his gun from should not have been able to get one, nd after this should never be able to own one again because he's clearly not treating it like the dangerous weapon it is in the wrong hands.

If I lend some dude my car and he DUIs and kills even one kid, I am SOL. It should be the same here.

Being a little harse on the police, aren't you? The first person shot at the school was an Uvalde School District Police Officer, so they did try to stop him. I bet most school district police officers are nothing more than security guards with a little more training. It was also a Federal Agent that ended up shooting the suspect, preventing further people from being killed.

 

[InfiniteCombo]

Being a little harse on the police, aren't you? The first person shot at the school was an Uvalde School District Police Officer, so they did try to stop him. I bet most school district police officers are nothing more than security guards with a little more training. It was also a Federal Agent that ended up shooting the suspect, preventing further people from being killed.

Don't know how it works in every town or city in the US, but I do know that major cities often have, in some schools, actual police officers from that city's police department. Not security guards... Police officers.

 

[Dream-Knife]

Don't know how it works in every town or city in the US, but I do know that major cities often have, in some schools, actual police officers from that city's police department. Not security guards... Police officers.

They do. They're cops with barely any training making 40k a year. Schools and mental health rehabs are retirement posts.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

The only thing they want to do is take all the guns away so we are defenseless. Everything else is rhetoric to inch towards that.

Yeah, trust the God damn ministry of truth to fix this...

If you think the kind of guns you buy at the store “protect you from the government” and the government is only respecting your rights because they’re afraid of your guns you are delusional, I’m sorry.

Criminals have the same guns or better and the guv’ment has no trouble killing or imprisoning them.

We need to return to a culture of traditional morality if we want this kind of random violence to end. We live in a culture of death

Nah, what you need to do is to pay civilized levels of taxes so the government can afford to provide better public mental health.

But whatever you fellers are happy looking at people having to open gofundmes and losing all their savings if they fell ill. It’s freedom’s way y’all.

Bah I’m out of this thread… I’ll get banned if I stay.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

yeah, but i didnt mean to suggest that autistic kids are more likely to become mass shooters. I was just making a connection with the OCD traits of autism and what could have happened with the sandy hook shooter. I think he might be the only autistic shooter out of all the school shooters in the last two years so there is no link i would think.

I do think that kids going on these murder sprees are likely suffering from some kind of mental health issues and these wall to wall coverage thanks to the 24/7 news cycle likely inspire them in a fucked up way.

P,S it's definitely interesting that almost none of these mass shooters are women. I see women kill their own kids all the time. read a couple of fucked up stories just this month, but i wonder why girls dont go out and do this. studies have shown that girls are more bullied than boys. especially on social media.

maybe we can do a targeted ban on just boys. let teenage girls, adult men and women have all the guns they want. i think the vegas and the orlando club shooters were the only ones who were over 30. most of the shooters, even the virgina tech shooter were under 25. maybe we can agree to ban guns to men under 25. just for a little while to see if that works.

Guys committing more crime and more heinous crimes has been the trend since probably the first caveman caught doing something stupid to other cave people in their tribe.

There's probably not one area on Earth where women do worse crimes.

I'm no anthropologist, but whether it's a learned trait of being Rambo macho men, wired into our brains to be violent or a good 50/50 of both I dont know, but it's a guy issue. And as you said it skews to younger people. I'd say in that 18-40 range. You dont see too many angry 60 year olds with white hair and pissed at the world for a shitty life and career shooting up stores and schools. I don't think even many of those gone postal fired employee kinds of attacks are from old geezers either.

Im anti gun and have no problem with more gun regulations. As for adjusting minimum age higher that is an option. Problem is the world seems to have a similar kind of policy for things in life that as soon as you become an adult (give or take a few years), it's open season to do whatever you want because government's best way to set some parameters in life is just to do blanket age based policies assuming the second you reach Age XX, you suddenly become a mature chill person at midnight.

 

[Robot Carnival]

Live free or die. No one thought some yahoo's would overthrow British rule in the colonies.

You can't regulate mental illness. The same party that pushes gun control promotes mental illness.

there's a pretty big difference between flintlocks, cannons and horses, to body armor, auto weapons and armored vehicles. all I'm saying is there should be regulations in getting firearms. I'm not going to argue with you on the whole mental illness issue either, since from my point of view, both parties are promoting them one way or another. but if there's a record of someone having mental issues, shouldn't that be a red flag on NOT giving that person a weapon to harm him/herself or someone else?

 

[Dream-Knife]

If you think the kind of guns you buy at the store “protect you from the government” and the government is only respecting your rights because they’re afraid of your guns you are delusional, I’m sorry.

Criminals have the same guns or better and the guv’ment has no trouble killing or imprisoning them.



Nah, what you need to do is to pay civilized levels of taxes so the government can afford to provide better public mental health.

But whatever you fellers are happy looking at people having to open gofundmes and losing all their savings if they fell ill. It’s freedom’s way y’all.

Bah I’m out of this thread… I’ll get banned if I stay.

Hmm. Didn't we lose a war 50 years ago against rice farmers with SKSs and AKMs? Didn't we just lose a 20 year war against dirt farmers with AKMs, SVDs, and technicals?

 

[Dream-Knife]

there's a pretty big difference between flintlocks, cannons and horses, to body armor, auto weapons and armored vehicles. all I'm saying is there should be regulations in getting firearms. I'm not going to argue with you on the whole mental illness issue either, since from my point of view, both parties are promoting them one way or another. but if there's a record of someone having mental issues, shouldn't that be a red flag on NOT giving that person a weapon to harm him/herself or someone else?

There already is regulations in buying firearms.

Mental illness is a baring factor from owning a firearm as stated on the 4473 and the NICS check from every purchased firearm.

 

[Droxcy]

Man I just feel for the families and my god kids that are in middle school-high school.

Kids now a days are on a whole other level, times are different and not changing for the better sadly.

 

[akimbo009]

I think the parents are too fucking involved. We had everyone bitching about common core math a few years ago. now critical race theory is a big thing parents are bitching about. some parents are terrified about gender pronouns messing with their kids minds (myself included), but for whatever reason we draw the line at things that can actually kill our kids.

as a parent of 7 year old, i can tell you he already keeps things from me. took me a while to find out he has a crush on a girl. took me even longer to find out they were talking about sex already. and this is when they are 7. by the time they are 18, i highly doubt i would know what they are up to on forums, reddit, and whatever dark web website kids like this browse nowadays. i can teach my kids all the right things, but kids are impressionable and at some point, you just cant watch everything they do.

As a parent or 4, with some old enough to be in college, get involved with your kid and earn that trust that they are willing to share details now and into the future. Accepting that your 7 year old is talking about sex with another 7 year - and keeping it from you - is how we get into these messes. Don't accept that shit. Don't helicopter, but lead with love - they will come to you and know better.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Man I just feel for the families and my god kids that are in middle school-high school.

Kids now a days are on a whole other level, times are different and not changing for the better sadly.

No doubt.

For those of you out there who are young and lets say 20 years old (give or take), believe it or not back in the 80s and early 90s when I finished grade school and high school there were no cops or security guards on premise at any school I went to, no metal detectors, any parent could walk in or out of the school meeting their kid to pick them up or if they wanted to meet the principal just walk into their office. When I was super young, everyone's mom would just come up to the classroom door and knock when they wanted to pick them up and take them to the dentist.

Now, you hear about this stuff and it's like protocol after protocol like parents cant even see their own kid unless they make an appointment.

Any kid within walking distance walked to school. I think I walked to school in grade 1 or 2 (I know in kindergarten my mom or siblings would wait for me... maybe grade 1 too, but I forget).

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Why you would still apply the law from 200 years ago when you were living alone on a ranch 200 miles from nearby town to a modern society with equipped and organised police force is beyond me.

 

[Insane Metal]

My heart weeps. Why the fuck would anyone do something like this. Jesus Christ.

 

[Locutus]

There already is regulations in buying firearms.

Mental illness is a baring factor from owning a firearm as stated on the 4473 and the NICS check from every purchased firearm.

Yep, everyone here saying we need more regulations doesn’t know anything about buying a gun. It is already illegal to own a gun if you are crazy or a felon. Those laws don’t stop anyone from owning a gun.

Also, banning semi-automatic rifles won’t do much either. A mass shooting like this could honestly happen with a couple of revolvers.

The only legislative action that will stop this type of thing is a broad and strict ban on all firearms. Even then, it would take more than a century for the available supply of guns in the USA to start to wane. It is still pretty easy to find functioning weapons from World War 2 and the guns sold today will last much longer.

 

[Dr.D00p]

Why you would still apply the law from 200 years ago when you were living alone on a ranch 200 miles from nearby town to a modern society with equipped and organised police force is beyond me.

Its all part of the American identity myth.

Right now, The majority of American society accepts a blood price for the cost of having the right to buy military grade weaponry, even if that blood price is paid in children.

Also, when a country as vast as America has one of these shootings, it can all seem very distant to those not involved in the immediate area. How much can someone living 2,000 miles away on the East or West cosat really care? Certainly not enough to consider losing the right to buy weaponry.

 

[Dream-Knife]

Yep, everyone here saying we need more regulations doesn’t know anything about buying a gun. It is already illegal to own a gun if you are crazy or a felon. Those laws don’t stop anyone from owning a gun.

Also, banning semi-automatic rifles won’t do much either. A mass shooting like this could honestly happen with a couple of revolvers.

The only legislative action that will stop this type of thing is a broad and strict ban on all firearms. Even then, it would take more than a century for the available supply of guns in the USA to start to wane. It is still pretty easy to find functioning weapons from World War 2 and the guns sold today will last much longer.

Don't forget the VT shooter who just had a backpack full of 10 rd G19 mags.

 

[Dream-Knife]

Its all part of the American identity myth.

Right now, The majority of American society accepts a blood price for the cost of having the right to buy military grade weaponry, even if that blood price is paid in children.

Also, when a country as vast as America has one of these shootings, it can all seem very distant to those not involved in the immediate area. How much can someone living 2,000 miles away on the East or West cosat really care? Certainly not enough to consider losing the right to buy weaponry.

"Military grade weaponry" is less lethal than a deer rifle if you're talking about an AR-15/M16/M4 family of rifles.

 

[Robot Carnival]

Hmm. Didn't we lose a war 50 years ago against rice farmers with SKSs and AKMs? Didn't we just lose a 20 year war against dirt farmers with AKMs, SVDs, and technicals?

those are both very different situations and different rules of engagement. if the US military is coming for someone in the US, would that person also be using gorilla warfare tactics living in the mountains or forest? or would there be a big chance that they would be coming to that person's home in the suburban area? in any case, if you plan on defending your home, I fully support your gun ownership. just as long as you keep it within your home and the kids can't get to them.

There already is regulations in buying firearms.

Mental illness is a baring factor from owning a firearm as stated on the 4473 and the NICS check from every purchased firearm.

then what do you suggest we should do in order to solve mass shooting in the US?

Why you would still apply the law from 200 years ago when you were living alone on a ranch 200 miles from nearby town to a modern society with equipped and organised police force is beyond me.

I totally agree to the issue with laws getting outdated by modern developments in technology and social structure. but to play the devil's advocate here, a lot of the US are not cities but just large stretch of land where people just happen to be living on them. and some do still live very similar to the way you describe. that's also why I still support 2nd amendment.

 

[Meicyn]

Hmm. Didn't we lose a war 50 years ago against rice farmers with SKSs and AKMs? Didn't we just lose a 20 year war against dirt farmers with AKMs, SVDs, and technicals?

We operated on specific rules of engagement that emphasizes the avoidance of civilian casualties. In your hypothetical situation where the government is willing to mass slaughter its own civilian population and it’s up to a well-regulated militia to stand up to the oppressors, your AR-15 isn’t gonna do shit against an MQ-1.

 

[Dream-Knife]

those are both very different situations and different rules of engagement. if the US military is coming for someone in the US, would that person also be using gorilla warfare tactics living in the mountains or forest? or would there be a big chance that they would be coming to that person's home in the suburban area? in any case, if you plan on defending your home, I fully support your gun ownership. just as long as you keep it within your home and the kids can't get to them.



then what do you suggest we should do in order to solve mass shooting in the US?



I totally agree to the issue with laws getting outdated by modern developments in technology and social structure. but to play the devil's advocate here, a lot of the US are not cities but just large stretch of land where people just happen to be living on them. and some do still live very similar to the way you describe. that's also why I still support 2nd amendment.

So you're saying the ROE would be different? We used tomhawks on boys ages 10-14 who were sentries on compound walls....


There is no solving it. Mental illness is rising. It will only get worse as boys with no hope are isolated.

We operated on specific rules of engagement that emphasizes the avoidance of civilian casualties. In your hypothetical situation where the government is willing to mass slaughter its own civilian population and it’s up to a well-regulated militia to stand up to the oppressors, your AR-15 isn’t gonna do shit against an MQ-1.

Funny, we still lost when Bush and Obama were droning schools, hospitals, etc. US citizens have better equipment than those dirt farmers. It won't be pretty, but my money is on them.

 

[Peggies]

I don't dare opening any news page anymore. Each and every fucking day something disgusting happens, setting new standards in disgustyness. Fuck that shit! I can't take it anymore.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

What's the point in getting mad about this anymore? It's a joke. The gun lobby will still fight you to keep their assault weapons, because...you know...of reasons. Kids dying doesn't seem to matter. There's no political gain to be made fighting to protect kids from gun violence. That's pretty much the harsh reality of the situation. Most decisions in life break down to dollars and cents. When there's money to be made curbing gun violence, that's when you'll see progress on it. Until then, LOLs and prayers, rinse, and repeat.

 

[MastaKiiLA]

I'm sitting next to my five year old daughter reading this thread. I don’t have strong opinions on guns, but FFS it feels like we need to do something regarding security at schools. At least have cops there and limit access points. Something. RIP to the victims and the families.

The thing is, a school shouldn't have to be a fortress. This is a very much American problem, where schools are shooting grounds. There are many war-torn countries where schools are still safe havens. So the issue doesn't seem to be the lack of security, but rather the access to guns. I know that's an unpopular opinion, but decades of ignoring the source of the issue has brought us to this current situation.

It used to be safe to go to school, where you might worry about someone bringing a knife, or a bat, but you weren't worried about getting shot up in school. Then Columbine and Paducah happened in rapid succession, and suddenly all the copy cats came out to play. Fortunately, I was in uni at that point, and there didn't seem to be any copy cats in my age group.

There were calls for gun control immediately after the Paducah shooting, as that was a major red flag. But nothing got done. Columbine resulted in a trench coat ban before any action was considered for guns. Like trench coats were responsible for killing all those kids. SMFH. It's a goddamn joke. Security isn't the issue. Gun control of some kind has to be implemented, or the same shit will just keep on happening. It's been decades now. Lessons need to be learned.

 

[Hoppa]

 

[Urban]

Oh, it’s a problem. But killings from knives in the UK last year?

224.

Gun deaths in America?

45222.

USA is so big that you can’t compare it with one country. Imo you need to compare it with EU as a whole

 

[Vaelka]

Meanwhile on Reeeesetera

Tbh I kinda agree but not for the reason people on Resetera are against it.
I think that naming these shooters and especially giving them '' cool nicknames '' is part of the problem.
These people need to be treated as what they are, losers.
I think that they probably shouldn't be named because a lot of them want the exposure.


It's also kinda strange to me how race is almost always mentioned in all coverage of crime I see in the US, if it's a wanted thing then it's obviously going to be relevant.
But I fail to see why it needs to be mentioned when they've already been caught like '' black/ white shooter ''.
All it ever really does is play into narratives and divide unnecessarily.
If someone has already been caught or killed and it's not meant as a more in detail description then I fail to see why race is relevant at all.

USA is so big that you can’t compare it with one country. Imo you need to compare it with EU as a whole

Wat, Europe has more than double the population of the US ( around 750 mil people ).
The overall point is that you can't do this with a knife.
You might be able to well akltalteayucually and find some insanely rare example, but the fact still remains that it's a lot easier to kill with a gun especially killing a lot of people and it's way harder to stop someone with a gun.
In some cases they also appear to have been wearing body armor which I really fail to see why a civilian should be owning to begin with, and it has made it hard for them to be stopped even by security and police.

Exactly

Whether you want guns or no guns (I’d prefer zero guns)
It’s NEVER happening in the USA. This is not a red or blue issue. Unfortunately America is obsessed with guns. People need to come up with a better solution here or more assholes are going to having shooting sprees every week

This is probably true yeah, I honestly think it's more of a cultural problem than guns themselves but it still makes the presence of guns a problem.
I definitely think that the media is partly responsible too tho for how they handle it, I do think you'd see the numbers go down perhaps even quite drastically if they stopped making them seem '' cool ''.
I also think that the whole '' cool '' aspect of guns is a problem too and parents putting guns in their kids hands and larping as military being so popularized.
I think it drives people to fetishize and fantasize about violence a lot more, the way some people talk about how self-defense comes across like a fetish and like they're actually hoping they'll get into a situation where they can shoot someone it's very bizarre.

 

[Captain Smoker]

USA is so big that you can’t compare it with one country. Imo you need to compare it with EU as a whole

USA Gun murders:
Gun murders, in particular, have climbed sharply in recent years. The 19,384 gun murders that took place in 2020 were the most since at least 1968, exceeding the previous peak of 18,253 recorded by the CDC in 1993.

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

*Edit: Increased to at least 20,726 in 2021 again

Gun Violence in 2021, By the Numbers

The facts and figures that stuck with us.

www.thetrace.org

EU all homicides:
Overall, homicides decreased significantly across the EU, with 6,100 registered cases in 2009 and “only” 4,747 in 2018.

Homicide and suicide rates in the EU are falling - European Data Journalism Network - EDJNet

Over the last ten years, there were significantly fewer homicides in the EU. Suicide rates have also dropped. While the situation in certain northern countries is less rosy, there were considerably fewer violent deaths per 100,000 people in the South.

www.europeandatajournalism.eu

*Edit: Decreased to 3,875 in 2019

Crime statistics - Statistics Explained

ec.europa.eu

 

[Kimahri]

Why you would still apply the law from 200 years ago when you were living alone on a ranch 200 miles from nearby town to a modern society with equipped and organised police force is beyond me.

Same reason you apply the instructiond from a 1700 year old book.

 

[Sybrix]

You can buy a gun at 18 in Texas but you cant buy a beer...... how FUBAR is that.

 

[Vaelka]

USA Gun murders:
Gun murders, in particular, have climbed sharply in recent years. The 19,384 gun murders that took place in 2020 were the most since at least 1968, exceeding the previous peak of 18,253 recorded by the CDC in 1993.

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

More Americans died of gun-related injuries in 2021 than in any other year on record, according to the latest available statistics from the CDC.

www.pewresearch.org

*Edit: Increased to at least 20,726 in 2021 again

Gun Violence in 2021, By the Numbers

The facts and figures that stuck with us.

www.thetrace.org

EU all homicides:
Overall, homicides decreased significantly across the EU, with 6,100 registered cases in 2009 and “only” 4,747 in 2018.

Homicide and suicide rates in the EU are falling - European Data Journalism Network - EDJNet

Over the last ten years, there were significantly fewer homicides in the EU. Suicide rates have also dropped. While the situation in certain northern countries is less rosy, there were considerably fewer violent deaths per 100,000 people in the South.

www.europeandatajournalism.eu

*Edit: Decreased to 3,875 in 2019

Crime statistics - Statistics Explained

ec.europa.eu

Tbh we've had a significant increase in Sweden, but it's purely gang related and gangs killing and shooting each other ( and the use of bombs too ).
I don't think it's comparable at all to civilians going into schools or supermarkets and shooting people tho but I know it's something people love to bring up.
I imagine it'd be way more common tho if it was easier for people to get a hold of guns, criminals here still need to turn to black markets to get them I think it's fair to assume it'd be way worse if they could just go into a wallmart.

 

[anthony2690]

How many more school shootings will America need till they finally pull their finger out and ban guns?

We had ONE school shooting in UK and we banned guns and haven't had a single one since.

Spoiler

& before someone comes at me with their right to bare arms, that was written when everyone was using single shot muskets, what people are not using now.

I'll probably get the usual stupid tag, but I can defend myself with a gun, you wouldn't need to, if no one else had a gun :l

This is genuinely so sad when you think about all the families torn apart and devastated by this, no one should lose a child.

 

[Lord Panda]

How many more school shootings will America need till they finally pull their finger out and ban guns?

We had ONE school shooting in UK and we banned guns and haven't had a single one since.

Spoiler

& before someone comes at me with their right to bare arms, that was written when everyone was using single shot muskets, what people are not using now.

I'll probably get the usual stupid tag, but I can defend myself with a gun, you wouldn't need to, if no one else had a gun :l

This is genuinely so sad when you think about all the families torn apart and devastated by this, no one should lose a child.

We did the same in Australia, after the Port Arthur massacre. Gun crime here is extremely rare, and most often limited to within the underworld elements here as a result.

Here’s a classic video from John Oliver on gun control and Australian gun laws: