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[Dryk]

I hope there is a hung parliament, and I hope they uphold both of those oaths. I want to see the general public have to go to the polls over and over and over until they get it through their heads that compromise to form government is a thing that sometimes happens.

I've become so disheartened with politics over the decades of voting I've been involved in my vote goes to whichever party will deliver a useful NBN in a reasonable time.

Call me shallow or what have you I just don't care to vote for the lesser of evils anymore. Mandatory voting probably skews our process anyhow.

FTTP can't happen now. Malcolm's already irreversibly screwed that pooch, and I'm not going to forgive him for it.

 

[Elaugaufein]

No doubt. Hence why I think it won't happen.

I'm not sure why they'd withdraw confidence when they could just spill Turnbull and put in one more to their liking and then continue on. Unless you're talking about a scenario where Turnbull wins but with enough seats to withstand a spill but given the distribution of his support in losable seats that seems unlikely unless he gets an big (in terms of seats) victory.

I love how the Tele is so scared of the greens.

About time they were a threat.

The Tele has always loathed the Greens , they just haven't been worried about them. Honestly I doubt they are now either its just a convenient way to nail Labor down to not picking up some Green policies or otherwise being "influenced " which also inhibits leftward internal drift.

(There's something hilarious about Coalition/LNP/County Liberal supporters ranting against coalitions though)

 

[Rubixcuba]

So this Greens preference thing has really dominated the past few days hey?

 

[Elaugaufein]

So this Greens preference thing has really dominated the past few days hey?

Yeah. And it's kinda bizarre given open ticket Green votes go 70%+ to Labor overall , let alone in the kind of seats that are Labor vs Greens contests. The only way it'd matter is if Labor was planning to preference the Liberals in those seats and worried about retribution. And judging by the enormous stink they are kicking up they aren't since that'd look hypocritical as all get out.

 

[Yagharek]

Adam Bandt had it right: wiser heads will prevail. If Greens hold the balance in the house of reps, both parties will seek to form govt with their support.

Compromise is key.

That's why Labor under two years of Gillard managed to be devastatingly effective in passing legislation despite the endless dummy spitting by the hard right fucksticks.

Compare that with nearly three years of ineffective government by an LNP majority who couldn't even negotiate with right wing libertarian mixed senators because the Liberal party had forgotten how to say anything but the word no. Albo had it right when he called them the noalition.

Petulant born to rule snobs who need the silver spoon inserted at the other end. Sideways.

 

[Candescence]

As usual, David Pope is a national treasure:

 

[Antiwhippy]

Hah, been getting ads on gaf from labor going "help us stop him" with a picture of Turnbull.

Don't get me wrong, I want to get rid of the liberals if only to get the far right nutters away from power and stop years of ineffectual government, but not necessarily Turnbull, though so far I think his attempt at controlling the liberal party has been incredibly spineless, limp and ineffectual. Felt more like an attack meant for Tony but they shoehorned Turnbull in now that Tony is gone.

 

[darkace]

Adam Bandt had it right: wiser heads will prevail. If Greens hold the balance in the house of reps, both parties will seek to form govt with their support.

Compromise is key.

That's why Labor under two years of Gillard managed to be devastatingly effective in passing legislation despite the endless dummy spitting by the hard right fucksticks.

Compare that with nearly three years of ineffective government by an LNP majority who couldn't even negotiate with right wing libertarian mixed senators because the Liberal party had forgotten how to say anything but the word no. Albo had it right when he called them the noalition.

Petulant born to rule snobs who need the silver spoon inserted at the other end. Sideways.

The LNP and the ALP had wildly different situations. The LNP have to negotiate with eight different senators whose position is 'populist', which meant the government had to negotiate against their default position with every single piece of legislation.

Hence why they could remove the carbon tax but not the carbon tax compensation, even though it no longer served a purpose.

The ALP had a de facto parliamentary majority and only had to negotiate with either the LNP or Bob Day plus the Greens.

 

[Elaugaufein]

The LNP and the ALP had wildly different situations. The LNP have to negotiate with eight different senators whose position is 'populist', which meant the government had to negotiate against their default position with every single piece of legislation.

Hence why they could remove the carbon tax but not the carbon tax compensation, even though it no longer served a purpose.

The ALP had a de facto parliamentary majority and only had to negotiate with either the LNP or Bob Day plus the Greens.

That's not exactly correct, While I'll give you Bandt. Windsor and Oakshot definitely leaned conservative. Without their support it would have been drawn. I'm not sure how to classify Wilkie and the other 2 Crossbenchers never officially supported Gillard to start with.

 

[Spinifex]

As usual, David Pope is a national treasure:

Someone explain this to me, Batman is an electorate, how is it personified by Di Natale?

 

[darkace]

That's not exactly correct, While I'll give you Bandt. Windsor and Oakshot definitely leaned conservative. Without their support it would have been drawn. I'm not sure how to classify Wilkie and the other 2 Crossbenchers never officially supported Gillard to start with.

They leaned conservative, but they were absolutely pragmatists working for the betterment of the nation. They aren't populist tards like half the current Senate.

Although Abbott is still shit at negotiation.

 

[bomma_man]

That's not exactly correct, While I'll give you Bandt. Windsor and Oakshot definitely leaned conservative. Without their support it would have been drawn. I'm not sure how to classify Wilkie and the other 2 Crossbenchers never officially supported Gillard to start with.

Wilkie describes himself as a centrist but he's more like labor left/di natale style nu green.

 

[Candescence]

So Turnbull has been named in the Panama Papers. While the actual substance probably isn't that serious at all, what this will do to the public's perception of Turnbull is another thing entirely if the media push hard on it.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

So Turnbull has been named in the Panama Papers. While the actual substance probably isn't that serious at all, what this will do to the public's perception of Turnbull is another thing entirely if the media push hard on it.

Apparently his company made 'donations' to some Russian politicians. Must be nice.

 

[Yagharek]

The LNP and the ALP had wildly different situations. The LNP have to negotiate with eight different senators whose position is 'populist', which meant the government had to negotiate against their default position with every single piece of legislation.

Hence why they could remove the carbon tax but not the carbon tax compensation, even though it no longer served a purpose.

The ALP had a de facto parliamentary majority and only had to negotiate with either the LNP or Bob Day plus the Greens.

The LNP is also populist. They should be like blood brothers with the senators.

 

[darkace]

The LNP is also populist. They should be like blood brothers with the senators.

It has populist elements, but it isn't populist by a long-shot. Same with the ALP. Any political party that has aspirations to govern has to embrace a populist element to some extent. Gillard and Keating show that at the end of the day even great governance isn't enough.

The LNP are nowhere near the retarded populist nativism of the Republican party or the right-wing in Europe. No populist party would undertake the 2014 budget.

 

[jdstorm]

As an insider I can tell you the war will continue for years yet. Win or lose the election. The liberal party has always housed both the liberal and conservative traditions but they've often been in direct conflict. It's just that Howard was really good at placating the liberal camp and keeping the broad church together.

I don't think that's a reason (in and of itself) not to vote for them though, the same thing happens in the ALP. It's just that it's been more public in the coalition recently. There's been somewhat of a purge of more conservative candidates losing pre-selection, being put down on the ticket, demoted and the rest.

They're throwing a lot of tantrums at the moment and getting the most minor victories while basically being purged. I don't necessarily agree with it but whatever. I would prefer a more open market less interventionist and more liberal government...but the war going on within the party isn't going to be good for it.

If there is that much Disharmony why don't they just split up, or have half start a new party and let the electorate decide

 

[danm999]

Coalition almost stuffed up the repeal of the mining tax negotiating with the country's biggest mining magnate. Says it all really.

 

[Dryk]

I laughed a little too hard at this

If there is that much Disharmony why don't they just split up, or have half start a new party and let the electorate decide

Because the public only like majority rule for some reason

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

FTTP can't happen now. Malcolm's already irreversibly screwed that pooch, and I'm not going to forgive him for it.

And the current NBN hybrid is about to run out of money, again. Another government bailout not listed in the budget for 10s of billions inbound. Total joke.

 

[D.Lo]

I laughed a little too hard at this

That's an old article from last election, and is not the full article, the author goes on to explain.

The Greens have improved since then, less fringe issue nonsense getting the headlines, like injecting rooms, senate inquiries linking Barbie dolls with domestic violence, and that whole breastfeeding in parliament thing when 99% of working women cannot breastfeed while actually in the main workplace. And for an ideologically 'pure' party they sure did flip to pragmatism a few times (eg fuel excise).

 

[Shaneus]

I laughed a little too hard at this

Because the public only like majority rule for some reason

I don't know where that article is from, but it reads almost word for word what Helen Razer wrote for Crikey just today:

There is something wrong with the ABC’s democratic novelty, Vote Compass. There must be, because since its inception, this “Whom should I vote for?” quiz has whacked me in the Greens quadrant every time. This makes me sore, as I am about as likely to ever vote Green as I am to afford a life in a suburb that is full of people who name their daughters after sexually liberated French modernist writers.

 

[Spinifex]

That's an old article from last election, and is not the full article, the author goes on to explain.

The Greens have improved since then, less fringe issue nonsense getting the headlines, like injecting rooms, senate inquiries linking Barbie dolls with domestic violence, and that whole breastfeeding in parliament thing when 99% of working women cannot breastfeed while actually in the main workplace. And for an ideologically 'pure' party they sure did flip to pragmatism a few times (eg fuel excise).

They are absolutely pushing themselves as more pragmatic now, and it couldn't come soon enough if you ask me. Greens of today are reminiscent of Labor under Whitlam and IMO we really need some of that good ol' fashioned New Deal-style progressivism.

 

[darkace]

Di Natale's budget reply was awful. I was seriously considering voting Greens until I read that.

 

[Jintor]

I don't know where that article is from, but it reads almost word for word what Helen Razer wrote for Crikey just today:

it's word for word stupid is what it is

 

[Elaugaufein]

I'm glad we're basing our opinion on safe injection rooms on War in Drugs hysteria rather than on their actual effect.

And because the majority of people can't breastfeed at work has ~nothing to do with whether it's a valid thing to do or should be allowed in Parliament house.

Also you're pretty much using the version the Murdoch ràg presented for the Barbie doll thing , which was, an admittedly hamfisted, support of ñon-gender divided toys.

 

[bobnowhere]

In an attempt to prove he's not an out-of-touch toff hiding income overseas and ensuring equality for all the PM has had lunch at the exclusive Mens only club The Athenaeum in the middle of an election while the press wait patiently outside.

Whoever decided that was a good look should be sacked.

 

[Dynamite Shikoku]

What a cunt

 

[bobnowhere]

Just got robo-polled by Galaxy for the

Spoiler

ACT!

election. Who knew they even polled here? Haven't seen a single poll in 3 1/2 years since the last election. Even pollbludger doesn't bother separating the ACT and the NT, there's just a nebulous territories row.

 

[Dryk]

That's an old article from last election, and is not the full article, the author goes on to explain.

Similar sentiment has been popping up on Twitter lately too. It's hilarious.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

Just got robo-polled by Galaxy for the

Spoiler

ACT!

election. Who knew they even polled here? Haven't seen a single poll in 3 1/2 years since the last election. Even pollbludger doesn't bother separating the ACT and the NT, there's just nebulous territories row.

When is that due? Last one the Liberals spent a bomb on advertising. Don't want to see that again in a hurry.

 

[bobnowhere]

When is that due? Last one the Liberals spent a bomb on advertising. Don't want to see that again in a hurry.

Ahh... first week weekend in October? Should probably know that. Yeah, the Libs spent a heap on a disingenuous campaign about massive tax rises associated with a proposal to remove stamp duty and increase rates to compensate. This time I imagine it will be light rail and not much else. Though with the Coalition federally for the last three years and maybe another 3 I can't see the Libs making any headway territorywise with the massive public service job cuts.

Interestingly with the massive job cuts, hiring freezes and pork barrel moving of departments to Tamworth, Gosford and others, the per capita damage to the ACT is higher than the removal of the car industry will be to SA and Victoria. Haven't heard anything about jobs programs, compensation, massive defence contracts etc... just forgotten.

 

[Fredescu]

I like Razer more than most and I dig her against the grain kinda style, but her bit amounts to "their platform isn't smashing the system so I might as well vote Labor."

 

[Elaugaufein]

I like Razer more than most and I dig her against the grain kinda style, but her bit amounts to "their platform isn't smashing the system so I might as well vote Labor."

People are really bad at understanding Vote compass. Its not saying you must or do vote for X , it says given these things , that the parties have positions on, at this time, you are most similar to X. No one's going to shoot your dog if you consider yourself a Labor voter and vote Labor despite Vote Compass saying Green. Its about alignment of values and positions.

 

[Candescence]

Christ, the Australian isn't letting up their campaign to discredit that one Q&A audience member who made the government look bad just by asking simple questions, it's absolutely sickening.

 

[Muskieratboi]

As usual, David Pope is a national treasure:

The Greens Candidate for Batman is Alex Bhathal. I mean, come ON, It couldn't be more awesome.

 

[darkace]

With the exception of that nut in Grayndler (overthrow capitalism!), the Greens have some seriously decent people running for seats. I can't for the life of me why they ran that candidate for Grayndler though, it'd be an easy win even against Albo sometime in the next decade. They're really just setting it back with the current guy.

 

[bobnowhere]

Christ, the Australian isn't letting up their campaign to discredit that one Q&A audience member who made the government look bad just by asking simple questions, it's absolutely sickening.

Tomorrows Herald Sun, going full Daily Tele.

Way to completely miss the point.

The Greens Candidate for Batman is Alex Bhathal. I mean, come ON, It couldn't be more awesome.

I love Barnaby as The Riddler. Most of what he says already is a complete mystery.

 

[darkace]

What is the point with him? That people don't have gifted lives is hardly something new.

 

[jdstorm]

Because the public only like majority rule for some reason

Surely there are 160 intelligent moderate people in the liberal party who could break off and form a new party in hop of winning an election.
The liberal party itself started as a splinter movement from a previous party. So it's not like there isn't a successful historical precedent.

I'm not sure I really understand your reply

 

[Arksy]

Surely there are 160 intelligent moderate people in the liberal party who could break off and form a new party in hop of winning an election.
The liberal party itself started as a splinter movement from a previous party. So it's not like there isn't a successful historical precedent.

I'm not sure I really understand your reply

The issue is that assuming people like Bernadi and Abetz have no electoral support, which is a false assumption. There is a reasonably sized demographic of people who are conservative socially and fiscally, in the same way that there exists a socially conservative but economically protectionist catholic sector within the ALP. Just because we might not agree with them doesn't mean they don't exist.

At the end of the day, the liberals and the conservatives agree on a fair number of issues, and they need each other to get into office because of the way representative democracy works. No rural constituency is going to vote for anything but a protectionist agrarian candidate. As Howard once said, the philosophy here is that it's better to be 60% idealistic in power as opposed to being 100% idealistic in opposition.

I would personally like nothing more than a party in power which is both small government and free market with mild intervention where needed, with a very liberal social policy based on traditional freedoms and liberties...but unfortunately it doesn't work like that.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

http://www.smh.com.au/comment/malco...a-new-working-underclass-20160512-got916.html

 

[r1chard]

Tomorrows Herald Sun, going full Daily Tele.

The man the ABC presented as a "new national hero"...

I'd love to see the ABC statement that did that.

 

[Shaneus]

I'd love to see the ABC statement that did that.

Oh FFS.

 

[bobnowhere]

And today's big story is:

Bill Shorten's Man Boobs.

At least Turnbull can afford staff to do the running for him.

 

[Dryk]

Surely there are 160 intelligent moderate people in the liberal party who could break off and form a new party in hop of winning an election.
The liberal party itself started as a splinter movement from a previous party. So it's not like there isn't a successful historical precedent.

I'm not sure I really understand your reply

In the current climate splitting the vote and making a hung parliament inevitable would be hugely unpopular. By and large the public want a majority government to just get into power and do things. I hate it but it is what it is.

 

[Aarglefarg]

An Australian security contractor was killed in Australia's embassy in Baghdad, there were reports of shots fired.

The High Court threw out Bob Day's voting change challenge.

There's a People's Forum on Sky News tonight with Turnbull and Shorten. Does anyone know if it will be available to normal people?

 

[shanshan310]

Fixed

 

[bomma_man]

If labor were competent they could quite easily portray this industry push back against negative hearing reform as blatant self interest from giant corporations (which it is), but after the mining tax debacle I have no confidence.

 

[Ozzy Onya A2Z]

In an attempt to prove he's not an out-of-touch toff hiding income overseas and ensuring equality for all the PM has had lunch at the exclusive Mens only club The Athenaeum in the middle of an election while the press wait patiently outside.

Whoever decided that was a good look should be sacked.

Are we talking alumni type gentlemen's club or sexy lingerie waitress with cognac type gentlemen's club? Details are important, the latter I can respect