• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Destiny 2 Reveal Info Summary Thread: Trailers, Videos, Details, Screens, More

TsuWave

Member
I must've missed it, but what's the word on cross-platform multiplayer? How does it work, or are they saving the details for closer to launch?

there won't be cross platform multiplayer as far as i'm aware. weirdly enough this is not the first time i see it mentioned and i'm wondered why people think there will. did i miss something?

I'm hoping for Nightstalker to become better at PvP

nightstalker was already really good at pvp tho. wombo+shadestep+faster movement and tracker+enemy super cancel. thing was a beast
 

Carn82

Member
Thats too bad. I actually liked what they had written out on enemies, factions, etc. Just didn't like having to go to an out-of-band source to see that stuff.

There's no way they'll be able to get that same detail and flavor of those grimoire cards through NPC/cinematic/environmental storytelling.

On a positive note, very glad to read the sprint cooldown has been removed. That always felt crazy out of the place.

there is a 'Lore' menu in the game; but this is all we know:

DAIiwxJUQAA0K1l.jpg


https://twitter.com/MyNameIsByf/status/865292310254190592
 
No cross-save could be for the best - if PC and console updates aren't released at the same time (causing mismatched data), or if the PC version might open up the way for hacked items or cheats that could carry over to consoles.

Just spitballing though. Could be other reasons for it, including them just plain wanting people to double dip.

No doubt cross-saves that would have been a major feature.

there is a 'Lore' menu in the game; but this is all we know:
Weapons and items have always had little lore blurb descriptions - maybe that's what that is for? Or maybe Exotics get their own stories?

Still don't see how they could get the grimoire's level of detail and depth with that button there.
 
Just spitballing though. Could be other reasons for it, including them just plain wanting people to double dip.

That would only be an issue for cross-buy . Cross-save would encourage double-dipping because there are plenty of people (myself and a few friends included) who would buy the game twice if cross-save was a thing.
 
I literally just logged in to D1 to work on my last few grimoires because I figured that would be the only thing moving on with us.

I have to say I'm a little disappointed that the grimore won't carry over. I think it's an excellent idea to put the lore in the game as they are, but I don't see why they couldn't utilize the grimoire once more. It gives players who love collecting extra incentive.
 

zewone

Member
Any news on the last 3 subclasses? Have they been confirmed ? Would be weird if the game only had two sub-classes to begin with

The guy who leaked all the information about the reveal (100% accurate) has stated the returning subclasses:

Hunter:
Gunslinger
Nightstalker

Warlock:
Stormcaller
Voidwalker

Titan:
Striker
Sunbreaker

Those returning subclasses will be reworked.
 
So i had a long conversation with a few people yesterday, some of which work for other industry companies. We were just talking over the reveal and some interesting points were made.

The main topic of discussion was that the Dawnblade subclass for Warlocks in its current iteration looks both broken and unnecessary. Some of the reasons why include:

-Its striking similarity to Sunbreaker. Ability wise, the Dawnblade is functionally a reskinned solar hammer and it's hard to imagine that Sunbreaker, in the likely event that it returns, will see any significant changes to differentiate them. All of the classes in Destiny 1 were unique enough to be different, so this is the first time we have two Supers with very similar mechanics. Furthermore, the Dawnblade projectiles home not unlike the Boltcaster Exotic Sword, which makes it even easier to use than the Sunbreaker.

-However, there lies an additional concern in that the Dawnblade, along with all Warlocks, have a Healing Rift ability. When standing inside it, it appeared to give the player a full overshield and continuously healed the player in the current build. Since all of the Super's now require two Super hits to kill one another, the Dawnblade was able to tank 3 Golden Gun shots from a Gunslinger by using the Healing Rift as an Overshield. This video shows this in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5qXzz_VR4I

-The Dawnblade class has a dive ability that allows them to fastfall, and the Sunsinger's Angel of Light ability that allows them to fire their weapon in the air (with perfect accuracy) while hovering in place.

So these neutral movement abilities combined with the Sunsinger's strong grenades and versatile super are looking to create a subclass that is by all counts hilariously broken in a multiplayer environment. We have obviously not seen the other 6 classes, but I don't see them doing anything to any of them that isn't either redundant or even more broken than Dawnblade, and at that point we'll just switch to that one anyway. We already saw this in Year 1 when the Bladedancer had a roaming Super with health regen, the best evasive mechanic in the game, arguably the best melee attack in the game, and some of the best grenades, which switched utility throughout but otherwise remained in the meta. On paper however, Bladedancer was a lot less alarming than the Dawnblade, and therefore its effects weren't known for a while.

During the discussion we agreed that it's weird for Bungie to homogenize the classes, but include these minor differences between them. It gives the illusion of choice by making them similar to the point that it ought not to matter, but then it does because of the subtle differences that make one simply better rather than different. I don't see any drawbacks to the Dawnblade class at this point.

Furthermore, it seems that we lost a unique mechanic - the Fireborn revive - in favor of another roaming DPS super that is functionally a reskin of an already existing super. Hell, the Sunbreaker even had an overshield mechanic built into its super and now that is woefully redundant to the Healing Rift available to all Warlocks, so it'd be very odd to see that return. I'm not sure why Bungie did this at this point because I haven't seen the other classes to judge their synergy. However, based on what was shown and what footage has portrayed, I find this change both detrimental to the overall design of the class system and the future meta of the Crucible.
 
Well, with teams 1/3 smaller i believe 3 zones would be too much.
Control was my favorite mode. I'm also worried how 4x4 will impact this mode.

I understand their reasoning but i wish they could balance pvp around 6x6.

Agreed. I'm bummed about Control.

I cannot see how it would work with 4 players. It can't.
 

psyfi

Banned
Do we know if any weapons from D1 are returning? I've always assumed so, but I just realized I don't know for sure.
 

zewone

Member
So i had a long conversation with a few people yesterday, some of which work for other industry companies. We were just talking over the reveal and some interesting points were made.

The main topic of discussion was that the Dawnblade subclass for Warlocks in its current iteration looks both broken and unnecessary. Some of the reasons why include:

-Its striking similarity to Sunbreaker. Ability wise, the Dawnblade is functionally a reskinned solar hammer and it's hard to imagine that Sunbreaker, in the likely event that it returns, will see any significant changes to differentiate them. All of the classes in Destiny 1 were unique enough to be different, so this is the first time we have two Supers with very similar mechanics. Furthermore, the Dawnblade projectiles home not unlike the Boltcaster Exotic Sword, which makes it even easier to use than the Sunbreaker.

-However, there lies an additional concern in that the Dawnblade, along with all Warlocks, have a Healing Rift ability. When standing inside it, it appeared to give the player a full overshield and continuously healed the player in the current build. Since all of the Super's now require two Super hits to kill one another, the Dawnblade was able to tank 3 Golden Gun shots from a Gunslinger by using the Healing Rift as an Overshield. This video shows this in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5qXzz_VR4I

-The Dawnblade class has a dive ability that allows them to fastfall, and the Sunsinger's Angel of Light ability that allows them to fire their weapon in the air (with perfect accuracy) while hovering in place.

So these neutral movement abilities combined with the Sunsinger's strong grenades and versatile super are looking to create a subclass that is by all counts hilariously broken in a multiplayer environment. We have obviously not seen the other 6 classes, but I don't see them doing anything to any of them that isn't either redundant or even more broken than Dawnblade, and at that point we'll just switch to that one anyway.

During the discussion we agreed that it's weird for Bungie to homogenize the classes, but include these minor differences between them. It gives the illusion of choice by making them similar to the point that it ought not to matter, but then it does because of the subtle differences that make one similar better rather than different.

Furthermore, it seems that we lost a unique mechanic - the Fireborn revive - in favor of another roaming DPS super that is functional a reskin of an already existing super. I'm not sure why Bungie did this at this point because I haven't seen the other classes to judge their synergy. However, based on what was shown and what footage has portrayed, I find this change both detrimental to the overall design of the class system and the future meta of the Crucible.
Bungie doesn't seem to care about releasing broken subclasses, Sunbreaker and Stormcaller were both comically overpowered at TTK launch.

Sunbreaker is coming back.

They got rid of self-revive and defender bubble because they broke or oversimplified too many encounters and I don't think Bungie wants to design around them any longer.
 
So i had a long conversation with a few people yesterday, some of which work for other industry companies. We were just talking over the reveal and some interesting points were made.

The main topic of discussion was that the Dawnblade subclass for Warlocks in its current iteration looks both broken and unnecessary. Some of the reasons why include:

-Its striking similarity to Sunbreaker. Ability wise, the Dawnblade is functionally a reskinned solar hammer and it's hard to imagine that Sunbreaker, in the likely event that it returns, will see any significant changes to differentiate them. All of the classes in Destiny 1 were unique enough to be different, so this is the first time we have two Supers with very similar mechanics. Furthermore, the Dawnblade projectiles home not unlike the Boltcaster Exotic Sword, which makes it even easier to use than the Sunbreaker.

-However, there lies an additional concern in that the Dawnblade, along with all Warlocks, have a Healing Rift ability. When standing inside it, it appeared to give the player a full overshield and continuously healed the player in the current build. Since all of the Super's now require two Super hits to kill one another, the Dawnblade was able to tank 3 Golden Gun shots from a Gunslinger by using the Healing Rift as an Overshield. This video shows this in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5qXzz_VR4I

-The Dawnblade class has a dive ability that allows them to fastfall, and the Sunsinger's Angel of Light ability that allows them to fire their weapon in the air (with perfect accuracy) while hovering in place.

So these neutral movement abilities combined with the Sunsinger's strong grenades and versatile super are looking to create a subclass that is by all counts hilariously broken in a multiplayer environment. We have obviously not seen the other 6 classes, but I don't see them doing anything to any of them that isn't either redundant or even more broken than Dawnblade, and at that point we'll just switch to that one anyway. We already saw this in Year 1 when the Bladedancer had a roaming Super with health regen, the best evasive mechanic in the game, arguably the best melee attack in the game, and some of the best grenades, which switched utility throughout but otherwise remained in the meta. On paper however, Bladedancer was a lot less alarming than the Dawnblade, and therefore its effects weren't known for a while.

During the discussion we agreed that it's weird for Bungie to homogenize the classes, but include these minor differences between them. It gives the illusion of choice by making them similar to the point that it ought not to matter, but then it does because of the subtle differences that make one simply better rather than different. I don't see any drawbacks to the Dawnblade class at this point.

Furthermore, it seems that we lost a unique mechanic - the Fireborn revive - in favor of another roaming DPS super that is functionally a reskin of an already existing super. Hell, the Sunbreaker even had an overshield mechanic built into its super and now that is woefully redundant to the Healing Rift available to all Warlocks, so it'd be very odd to see that return. I'm not sure why Bungie did this at this point because I haven't seen the other classes to judge their synergy. However, based on what was shown and what footage has portrayed, I find this change both detrimental to the overall design of the class system and the future meta of the Crucible.
Can't say I find anything I disagree with here. The healing buff scares the living daylights out of me.
 

E92 M3

Member
So i had a long conversation with a few people yesterday, some of which work for other industry companies. We were just talking over the reveal and some interesting points were made.

The main topic of discussion was that the Dawnblade subclass for Warlocks in its current iteration looks both broken and unnecessary. Some of the reasons why include:

-Its striking similarity to Sunbreaker. Ability wise, the Dawnblade is functionally a reskinned solar hammer and it's hard to imagine that Sunbreaker, in the likely event that it returns, will see any significant changes to differentiate them. All of the classes in Destiny 1 were unique enough to be different, so this is the first time we have two Supers with very similar mechanics. Furthermore, the Dawnblade projectiles home not unlike the Boltcaster Exotic Sword, which makes it even easier to use than the Sunbreaker.

-However, there lies an additional concern in that the Dawnblade, along with all Warlocks, have a Healing Rift ability. When standing inside it, it appeared to give the player a full overshield and continuously healed the player in the current build. Since all of the Super's now require two Super hits to kill one another, the Dawnblade was able to tank 3 Golden Gun shots from a Gunslinger by using the Healing Rift as an Overshield. This video shows this in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5qXzz_VR4I

-The Dawnblade class has a dive ability that allows them to fastfall, and the Sunsinger's Angel of Light ability that allows them to fire their weapon in the air (with perfect accuracy) while hovering in place.

So these neutral movement abilities combined with the Sunsinger's strong grenades and versatile super are looking to create a subclass that is by all counts hilariously broken in a multiplayer environment. We have obviously not seen the other 6 classes, but I don't see them doing anything to any of them that isn't either redundant or even more broken than Dawnblade, and at that point we'll just switch to that one anyway. We already saw this in Year 1 when the Bladedancer had a roaming Super with health regen, the best evasive mechanic in the game, arguably the best melee attack in the game, and some of the best grenades, which switched utility throughout but otherwise remained in the meta. On paper however, Bladedancer was a lot less alarming than the Dawnblade, and therefore its effects weren't known for a while.

During the discussion we agreed that it's weird for Bungie to homogenize the classes, but include these minor differences between them. It gives the illusion of choice by making them similar to the point that it ought not to matter, but then it does because of the subtle differences that make one simply better rather than different. I don't see any drawbacks to the Dawnblade class at this point.

Furthermore, it seems that we lost a unique mechanic - the Fireborn revive - in favor of another roaming DPS super that is functionally a reskin of an already existing super. Hell, the Sunbreaker even had an overshield mechanic built into its super and now that is woefully redundant to the Healing Rift available to all Warlocks, so it'd be very odd to see that return. I'm not sure why Bungie did this at this point because I haven't seen the other classes to judge their synergy. However, based on what was shown and what footage has portrayed, I find this change both detrimental to the overall design of the class system and the future meta of the Crucible.

Broken = fun. I don't want everything balanced into boredom.
 
So these neutral movement abilities combined with the Sunsinger's strong grenades and versatile super are looking to create a subclass that is by all counts hilariously broken in a multiplayer environment.

I can understand speculation but in every competitive game under the sun there have been people claiming things are going to be broken before playing them only to realize it's borderline impossible to tell something is going to be broken (or vice-versa) before playtesting. Theorycrafting on multiplayer meta balance before release is like trying to make a puzzle with only half the pieces.

Furthermore, it seems that we lost a unique mechanic - the Fireborn revive - in favor of another roaming DPS super that is functionally a reskin of an already existing super.

This is a pretty large issue though. Destiny 1 was fairly lean on interesting and powerful mechanics. Removing them in favor of more "Press button, kill things" is the opposite direction the game should take. Especially if the game is going to focus on 4v4 as a game mode. They should be encouraging team work and strategy, not just making the game another variation of Call of Duty.
 

duhmetree

Member
Warlocks neutralize any skill gap in PvP against other classes.. It's always been Destinys version of easy-mode IMO.
 
They got rid of self-revive and defender bubble because they broke or oversimplified too many encounters and I don't think Bungie wants to design around them any longer.

That. They're definitely not being replaced because Bungie thought they had new ideas that were so much cooler.

I also think that this is part of the reason why a lot of the support aspects are being moved to more basic global abilities. If the subclasses were replaced with new ones also built around a highly support/passive based super and toolkit, I think they would be worried that they would likely wind up being something that broke/simplified encounters in much the same way (or would just be useless)
 

zewone

Member
Twilight,

I'm actually more surprised you didn't comment on how lazy the new Hunter super is. At least the Warlock is biting the TItan's style. With the Hunter you're basically just exchanging daggers for a staff.
 

BLCKATK

Member
Call me crazy, but I have this feeling that Sunbreaker won't return in the same way that it is currently.

I have this fantasy that Sunbreaker is going to become an Iron Lord esque subclass, with a Burning Iron Lord Axe and a huge flaming cape.
 

Sarcasm

Member
They will be different from the first game. There's no character builder. Wouldn't tell you anything even if there was. The classes play different when it comes to abilities (Specials, Supers, grenades, and melee) and a character creator wouldn't showcase that.

Best you can do to figure out what you might like without purchasing the first game would be to look up videos on the classes.

So wait for the new videos? Or can the old ones work. I watched the ones in the OP but yeah.
 
Twilight,

I'm actually more surprised you didn't comment on how lazy the new Hunter super is. At least the Warlock is biting the TItan's style. With the Hunter you're basically just exchanging daggers for a staff.

I can't really comment on that if it plays different. The Super doesn't look much different from the Bladedancer as far as melee combat goes, but maybe the perks are.
 

Kyoufu

Member
All subclasses currently revealed were reworked in some way, so I'm not sure why the assumption is that Sunbreaker will stay the same, Zoba/Twilight Gap. :p

I think Sunbreaker's super will likely be a large, flaming hammer similar to the RoI axes. Titan is supposed to excel in melee according to Bungie so another melee-oriented super is on the cards IMO.

I could be totally off the mark here but I'm pretty confident that the subclass is being reworked. That goes for Nightstalker as well which is currently far too good in PVE to not use.
 

duhmetree

Member
Twilight,

I'm actually more surprised you didn't comment on how lazy the new Hunter super is. At least the Warlock is biting the TItan's style. With the Hunter you're basically just exchanging daggers for a staff.

I'm glad they didn't get rid of bladedancer type subclass..

The staff super looks like it will be more useful in PvE since it looks to cover more ground as well as do a mini-titan slam on the ground.

For PvP, the length/hitbox of the staff might alleviate the problem that plagued bladedancer for nearly 3 years.... the dreaded shortstop...

Wish we could see the perk clusters for Strider as well as Nightstalker.
 

ethomaz

Banned
All subclasses currently revealed were reworked in some way, so I'm not sure why the assumption is that Sunbreaker will stay the same, Zoba/Twilight Gap. :p

I think Sunbreaker's super will likely be a large, flaming hammer similar to the RoI axes. Titan is supposed to excel in melee according to Bungie so another melee-oriented super is on the cards IMO.

I could be totally off the mark here but I'm pretty confident that the subclass is being reworked. That goes for Nightstalker as well which is currently far too good in PVE to not use.
They confirmed Titan will excel in melee instead Warlocks?

That is a big change.
 
N5gVtUb_d.jpg


Speculation on unannounced locations on reddit.

Mercury seems a natural inclusion, even if only for one or two missions. Fighting on a shattered planet feels like a Final Boss situation.
 

RoboPlato

I'd be in the dick
N5gVtUb_d.jpg


Speculation on unannounced locations on reddit.

Mercury seems a natural inclusion, even if only for one or two missions. Fighting on a shattered planet feels like a Final Boss situation.
It looks like Mercury explodes in the trailer, although there could be a mission or two there before that. I would like it if there were more mission specific locations like Phobos from TTK in addition to the four patrol zones.
 

duhmetree

Member
One area should most definitely be Mars... we know High Moon has been working on Mars for a long while... plus there was a Raid on Mars that was cut.. Might be the Warmind/Charlamegne/Rasputin DLC

I'd assume Mercury or Venus for Osiris DLC
 
It looks like Mercury explodes in the trailer, although there could be a mission or two there before that. I would like it if there were more mission specific locations like Phobos from TTK in addition to the four patrol zones.

Tbh it looked like the SUN exploded in the trailer, at least from what I saw. I'm sorta convinced it's a "If you don't stop Gary, this will happen" cinematic.

Unless we're replacing the sun?? We are dealing with space magic I guess.
 
The no cross platform/save thing is mind bogging considering how much they focused on community and how to foster it in the reveal show
 
Top Bottom