BlazingDarkness
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F'DUPTON 3: Back in the Tub with 5.0/5.5/6/7/several Inches of RAM-Flavoured Water
- Thread starter CrunchinJelly
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Spring-Loaded
Member
Wow.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Pissing contests are like that.
All about the length and nothing about the style.
edit: Ducks make about as much sense as monkey's. Hell, they tend to show off more bravado because of their lengthy spear cocks.
Don't take Chinners joke as what he actually thinks is the moral of the story.
SEGAvangelist
Member
He wrote,
"I will say: the RAM situation on launch, will not reflect the RAM situation in two years, and not reflect the RAM situation at the end of the console's life cycle."
Sounds like a moving target. DF probably has the numbers wrong, but it sounds like there's at least a bit of truth about what they published. That was my point. Quit being such a warrior about it.
Same applies for you. In development doesn't mean it's out at launch. Also, yeah we know it's 6GB and that's better than 4.5-5.5, so yay. Why are you both attacking me for asking a legit question earlier?
Pound_lb003
Member
Up to and including Digital Foundry.
And Brian Provinciano chiming in, made the best indication I've heard, as someone who's actually working on the hardware.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Actually, I'll bet if you could write your name clearly with your pee, I'll bet your win that pissing contest.
Especially if you can dot any I's...
BlazingDarkness
Member
Yeah that's how it sounds to me.
Maybe DF has heard from third parties with the RAM at the lower end (4.5-5GB), and then some of the GAF insiders are hearing direct from Sony sources who've earlier access to more RAM (6GB) and Sony intend to balance the 'reserved' RAM as security for OS stuff for the immediate future.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
If you're a monkey they lock you in a cage for six years because you've shown an understanding of the English language that should be out of your reach.
Speaking from experience with simian based pissing contests.
Ironmanxrs2
Banned
What if its true and it is what it is? Does it sting so hard for folks that their system of choice will be on par with the competition. I still think games and services will decide this generation (when hasn't it?..well Dreamcast, which I loved).
MichaelMikado
Banned
I think this is the point Ive been trying to make is that we have no idea how these services affect the PS4 bandwidth. The ability to do 1080P and 60 fps really also has a limitation of bandwidth. If these added services consume a lot of bandwidth then it makes sense why developers would have trouble hitting that target if their is a cap. In the xbox it wouldn't matter because the devs couldn't really use the eSRAM for anything other than the framebuffer.
I doubt Sony will let that information be known especially if its bad because it would negate the whole point of going with GDDR5 in the first place if the services just hog up the available bandwidth.
Moving target?
He's talking about reducing the OS memory footprint since you know, that's what he goes on to talk about.
SEGAvangelist
Member
YAY! Someone who looked past my Day One avatar!!!
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Instead of figs, you gotta shove a key up in your rectum, mang.
Naughty God
Banned
The PS4 is still much more powerful than the Xbox One.
What the fuck is this?
Okay, let's pretend for a moment that remote play uses the full bandwidth of 802.11n at absolute highest speed it can possibly run at. Which it won't. But let's say it does. That's 600 Mb/s. Note that's megabits, not megabytes, so you have to divide by 8 to get megabytes. So that's 75 megabytes per second. There's 1024 megabytes in a gigabyte. The PS4 has 176 gigabytes per second of bandwidth.
So the absolute max bandwidth remote play could be using, assuming it doesn't have a separate bus between the hardware encoder and wifi, is 75 out of 180224 megabytes per second. I suspect if the PS2 had a hardware h.264 encoder and wifi, it could handle remote play without any noticeable slowdown. edit: I guess I should point out that the PS3 does not have a hardware encoder, which is why remote play on it sucks.
Ironmanxrs2
Banned
It is! Until we find out that the PS4 reserves 25% of their ROPs for audio processing and CPU overruns.
Lastgengamer
Member
What's with so many saying pre order canceled/disappointed? lol
Even if it turns out that 2.5 GB is reserved for future use in addition to the OS's 1GB/1.5GB amount. I cannot see how that would seem restrictive for first and probably second year games since overall devs seem fine with what they have been given and like the PS3 OS matured, the PS4 will probably also see a reduction in RAM memory usage and unlike the X1 it has only 1 OS so this is probably an attempt to keep up with features in response to Microsoft by future proofing the RAM available.
Also since this is GDDR5 memory console muti-platform will still have better RAM to work with on PS4 over the competition.
Even if it turns out that 2.5 GB is reserved for future use in addition to the OS's 1GB/1.5GB amount. I cannot see how that would seem restrictive for first and probably second year games since overall devs seem fine with what they have been given and like the PS3 OS matured, the PS4 will probably also see a reduction in RAM memory usage and unlike the X1 it has only 1 OS so this is probably an attempt to keep up with features in response to Microsoft by future proofing the RAM available.
Also since this is GDDR5 memory console muti-platform will still have better RAM to work with on PS4 over the competition.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
They let me have a computer and GAF account at year six though. To see how humans react to talking to highly intelligent golden lion tamarins.
It has been an interesting experiment from what I can tell. I get hit on about as often as the human female posters here.
King Allant
Member
man, now I'm hoping it 4.5 ram just to see more drama
then again the earlier post reaction to the 6 ram would be fun too
Lifesontheline
Banned
I just read through some of this thread, A gpu upclock years down the line? c'mon .... that's totally unrealistic especially with the way these boxes are built. i'm starting to believe leadbetter.
SEGAvangelist
Member
The target being the smallest footprint possible. Just might explain why maybe DF's findings were different than NeoGAF insiders. Maybe different sources like what BlazingDarkness said. People are pretty quick to hate on DF and thuway himself was defending them. There may be truth from both sides in this case and that's mainly what I'm getting at.
I'm sorry if I offend anyone in advance, but isn't it sort of telling we're talking more about the ram in a system than the games itself? I mean seriously, the difference between Xbox One and PS4 graphics will be unnoticeable by most people, especially since they're both capable of 1080p 60 fps, which is all most peoples TVs can do.
Ironmanxrs2
Banned
It seems really dumb. Why would they upclock the GPU years down the road? Why not now? What would be different?
Thunder Monkey
Banned
You'll change your tune when Sony releases a downloadable patch that allows liquid nitrogen cooling.
All that is fine but in the end I doubt that it's bad because as aforementioned, if all the processes except remote play were simultaneously functional (quite possible) it'll still require less than 1GB/s or if the bit rate for HD video+audio recording, in-game chat and in-game music haven't changed overnight.
With regards to remote play, the PS4 can't play another game simultaneously while streaming one to PSV. So it doesn't form a part of that aggregate.
Dafuq is this shit?
SEGAvangelist
Member
Firmware upgrades? I know with video cards at least firmware changes can make overclocking more stable at higher settings.
Actually games are what matter. If the GPU was all that mattered in either console I'd just stick with PC gaming.
Who plays consoles to brag about GPU power?! LOLOL
Good exclusives on both sides is ALL that matters.
I know you're taking over for DrinkyCow but there are people who will take you seriously. :/
Actually games are what matter. If the GPU was all that mattered in either console I'd just stick with PC gaming.
Who plays consoles to brag about GPU power?! LOLOL
Good exclusives on both sides is ALL that matters.
We can't play any of the games yet, so this is what we have to argue about unfortunately
.Nm process or chip size? Later ones might be smaller and run cooler. Or simply have better yields. He said something about how the PSP got an up clock late cycle. I didn't even know this.
BleachAndPepsi
Banned
Well I really like monkeys, FWIW.
And I mean really like. With that big red booty.
Actually games are what matter. If the GPU was all that mattered in either console I'd just stick with PC gaming.
Who plays consoles to brag about GPU power?! LOLOL
Good exclusives on both sides is ALL that matters.
Comparing with PC, yes
A GPU upclock simply isn't happening IMO.
Even then, I'm not inclined to believe leadbetter.
SEGAvangelist
Member
I know you're taking over for DrinkyCow but there are people who will take you seriously. :/
We can't play any of the games yet, so this is what we have to argue about unfortunately
I was waiting for a good reply for that post too. lol
Thunder Monkey
Banned
That's because it was designed for the higher clock, but it badly impacted battery life and heat output. So they downclocked it. Only to unlock it later in life.
I've got a perfectly serviceable grey blue butt under this diaper. But I expect strict payment in figs for services rendered.
Ironmanxrs2
Banned
I was thinking that maybe but why wouldn't you do it prior to release then? Are they afraid it wouldn't be stable? If that's so it wouldn't be any more stable down the road, right? They wouldn't dare risk fragmenting their user base.
Did it not badly affect battery life after the upclock?
LeeFowler.CU
Banned
I'm not trying to rain on the Sony 6GB parade but why would dev kits have any restrictions on the amount of RAM used? Don't they just ship with a basic OS that runs the code and it would be the SDK documentation that would inform the devs how much ram they should optimize for?
BlastProcessing
Member
Tub's a dangerous place these days.
By upclocking later models wouldn't they be screwing over people with PS4 "phats"?
Actually games are what matter. If the GPU was all that mattered in either console I'd just stick with PC gaming.
Who plays consoles to brag about GPU power?! LOLOL
Good exclusives on both sides is ALL that matters.
Well gee thanks captain.
Too bad we're in a specs thread.
I know you're just trying to be stupid, but there isn't a patch needed to cool any component with LN2. You can design a makeshift waterblock, and do it straight out of the box.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I've never had a PSP so I can't really tell you.
Aquamarine
Member
1) Digital Foundry / Eurogamer claimed in an article that 4.5 GB is available for development at launch, with 512 MB / 1 GB as flexible memory
2) Various, unbanned GAF insiders have said "That article is incorrect"
3) Thuway, Famousmortimer, BruceLeeRoy, and Verendus (all unbanned) have all heard "The memory situation on PS4 is ideal and has exceeded expectations in every way." That should mean that games at launch won't be affected by any kind of restrictions in place
4) Thuway stated that some games currently in development are using 6 GB of RAM, but also implied some form of RAM restrictions at launch is not completely out of the equation
5) Kagari (has connections to Square Enix) also agreed with the 6 GB claim
6) VBlank Entertainment (Retro City Rampage) has denied that Sony is reserving 3.5 GB of RAM for the OS
7) NOTHING is confirmed until either Sony states something or launch RAM allocations are revealed in some way
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