LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I think we will get one by around fall of next year.
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[Forbes] Steam Deck Won’t Survive 2025 Without A Significant Upgrade
- Thread starter Topher
- Start date
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
No need to listen to those hacks.
Looks like a mix of old and new. I'm surprised to see Wukong on number 1, wonder if the Steam Deck is that popular in China.
Black Myth Wukong, BG3 (especially BG3), Elden Ring, Hogwarts, Diablo 4 and No Man's Sky are the exact type of games that would heavily benefit from a Steam Deck upgrade/sequel. Cyberpunk, Helldivers 2 and Red Dead 2 further down the list as well.
Not to mention that even in games that can keep 60/50 FPS, the fans go crazy and battery life plummets (Like Doom 2016). I'd at least really like a refresh with a better and more efficient cooling system, to prevent embarassment in public.
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balls of snow
Member
Yeah I actually have no idea who is the bigger fish between the 2.
Comandr
Member
I don't disagree with you on that. I'm rediscovering love for PS1 classics on my steam deck. newpixie's shader is amazing; its shocking how good ps1 games can look with it. SoTN genuinely looks like a remaster. But that's not a marketing point, and it's certainly not how Valve is marketing the system.
They are absolutely capitalizing on the fact that this thing can play brand new AAA games; even if it doesn't do it that well.
"more than enough performance to run the latest AAA games"
And the fact of the matter is- it's not anymore. Maybe that was more true nearly 3 years ago when the Steam Deck first launched, but it's a completely different landscape now. When the Steam Deck came out, DLSS was only 2 years old. FSR had only been out for 8 months. Both on PC and console, games really rely on these technologies now, and the steam deck just wasn't built with the hardware in mind to keep up with that.
So it's not that the Steam Deck isn't going to be a good device in 10 years; it's that it's going to be outclassed by better devices that can do all of that and more. Why buy a bluray player when a DVD player will play the thousands of DVDs you already have? Why get a PS5 when your PS4 is still good? People want the new better thing. I want the new better thing.
Now with the advent of Valve releasing SteamOS for other manufacturers, and other manufacturers just grabbing off the shelf parts to cobble together a handheld with much more powerful components like the 8840U or HX 370 or whatever comes in the future, Steam Deck is about to get beat at its own game unless they release a successor at some point in the near future.
I love the form factor and comfort of the Steam Deck's ergonomics so much I am essentially holding out for a second generation but... if Valve makes me wait too long, I'm going to jump to something newer. I want to play MHWilds in bed at higher than 20fps at 400p. Let me give you money, Valve.
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Minsc
Gold Member
I don't disagree with you on that. I'm rediscovering love for PS1 classics on my steam deck. newpixie's shader is amazing; its shocking how good ps1 games can look with it. SoTN genuinely looks like a remaster. But that's not a marketing point, and it's certainly not how Valve is marketing the system.
They are absolutely capitalizing on the fact that this game can play brand new AAA games; even if it doesn't do it well that well.
"more than enough performance to run the latest AAA games"
And the fact of the matter is- it's not anymore. Maybe that was more true nearly 3 years ago when the Steam Deck first launched, but it's a completely different landscape now. When the Steam Deck came out, DLSS was only 2 years old. FSR had only been out for 8 months. Both on PC and console, games really rely on these technologies now, and the steam deck just wasn't built with the hardware in mind to keep up with that.
So it's not that the Steam Deck isn't going to be a good device in 10 years; it's that it's going to be outclassed by better devices that can do all of that and more. Why buy a bluray player when a DVD player will play the thousands of DVDs you already have? Why get a PS5 when your PS4 is still good? People want the new better thing. I want the new better thing.
Now with the advent of Valve releasing SteamOS for other manufacturers, and other manufacturers just grabbing off the shelf parts to cobble together a handheld with much more powerful components like the 8840U or HX 370 or whatever comes in the future, Steam Deck is about to get beat at its own game unless they release a successor at some point in the near future.
I love the form factor and comfort of the Steam Deck's ergonomics so much I am essentially holding out for a second generation but... if Valve makes me wait too long, I'm going to jump to something newer. I want to play MHWilds in bed at higher than 20fps at 400p. Let me give you money, Valve.
Right, for non-release day stuff, when that ad was released it was pretty accurate. You can still run the bulk of AAA games on it, minus a handful. I mean Valve even put out a FFVII Remake commercial just for the Deck. That's crazy to me.
Your list doesn't say too much, Slay the Spire, Balatro, Stardew are casual and all the other games on it run fine/well obviously or they wouldn't be on a list of top played games in the first place.
With PCs, there's something better every year, that's a given. Whatever you think is better than the Steam Deck, say the Ally, or whatever, next year, something will be better than that. And the year after something better than that other thing. Endlessly. Love it or hate it. I owned the LCD Deck, upgraded to the OLED Deck. I got the Ally X. Next year something better will be out, maybe I'll get that too, probably will. Deck 2 eventually. Ally 2 and 3, and others. There won't be an end to these devices, and Valve isn't going to lose anything having a less iterative release schedule IMO. People will be buying the Deck 2 when it comes out whether it's 2025 or 2026 or 2027. People will still pickup the Deck 1 at $200 or $300 instead of an Ally X at $700 because of obvious reasons - cost. Even if the X drops to $400, the OLED Deck may be $200, and still you have a cost factor. But even besides that, Valve has almost an Apple-like fanbase that will support them.
Just look at how quickly Valve improves Steam OS too, and how quickly Proton updates with improvements, and how quickly communities form and create solutions for Steam Deck issues. The Deck is unarguably, by a long shot, the most active and supported device, and it'll stay that way IMO for quite a while.
NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
I just got my OLED this year and I'm fine with gaming on it. I don't notice any problems with graphics when playing games so for me I'm keeping this handheld for a long time
Whatever issues I have with the graphics I can fix by using a mod or adjusting the graphics setting within the game
Whatever issues I have with the graphics I can fix by using a mod or adjusting the graphics setting within the game
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jshackles
Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
The Steam Deck hardware will always play the games it plays now, at least as good as they play now. So yeah, if you're buying a Steam Deck to just play the latest stuff - it's gonna be a bad experience as time moves on. I tried Visions of Mana on mine, and while it's playable, it often dips down into the 15-20fps range which makes it a less than ideal experience.
But - the other games I've been playing on it for years will continue to play great on it in the years to come.
But - the other games I've been playing on it for years will continue to play great on it in the years to come.
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Codes 208
Member
The battery life is also worth it. My biggest issue with the rog ally was how playing AAA games even on equal footing to the SD still only lasted a fraction of the time. Like comparing a ps5 controller to an xbox controller
But tbf the rog ally definitely had a wider range of games because of linux’s hit or miss compatibility with cheat prevention software
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NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
I was one of the sucker who bought a ROG ALLY. The fact that I can't return it due to opening it up and changing the SDD really pisses me off. Especially when it comes to to the ROG ALLY X announcement. I'm not supporting that. That company can get fucked
So when I got a Steamdeck OLED, it worked out of the box and yes there are still limitations since it is Linux Based but I can see that improving as time goes by
Minsc
Gold Member
Was that a release day thing? Because the current reviews on youtube I see like this or this, or this it all looks great. Definitely over 30fps, mostly over 40fps, so I think a 45fps lock is feasible, if not certainly a 30fps lock.
I know 30fps sucks right? Let's not forgot how everyone played FFXVI and FF7 Rebirth on the PS5 - well, all the people who matter, 30fps Quality mode. So even on the PS5, you still get games that don't run as well as you'd like them too... so that's not really anything unique to the Deck.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
I think that write-up forgets something very important: the Steam Deck is the only PC portable by a platform holder with the biggest market share in PC gaming by far, Valve. With that comes brand name/power that on its own helps sell the Steam Deck in ways the Asus, Lenovo etc. devices simply don't have. Even a theoretical Xbox handheld wouldn't have that benefit because neither Xbox nor Microsoft are seen as "cool" or viable brands in the PC gaming space.
While that shouldn't let Valve rest on their laurels, it does mean that they have a good amount of leeway that other PC handheld makers lack. And like Nintendo, Valve don't need to play the power game; they need to play the Valve game, and focus on what they bring that others can't. That's a seamless integration of hardware with their Steam OS and Steam itself, even if they're opening this up some to 3P OEM manufacturers.
The biggest mistake Valve could make, in fact, is trying to play the power game and chase after competitors instead of being a leader in their space. That same mistake costed SEGA dearly in the early-mid '90s with a disjointed hardware focus, leading to dead-ends like the 32X which distracted them from what should've been their main focus going forward: the Saturn (and even that fell into the same trap since they haphazardly threw more power at it to compete more directly with the PS1).
So yeah, Valve can establish iterations of Steam Deck revisions every 2-3 years with performance upgrades, but they should also make sure that's balanced with QOL, I/O and immersion feature upgrades that are more easily sellable/marketable and relevant. Unless Asus, Lenovo, Acer whoever get up a storefront with even a fraction of Steam's market share, they can put out PC handhelds 50% more powerful but still only barely scratch Steam Deck's selling power, at best.
In fact, at least in the West those other PC handhelds would probably have a better chance in market penetration by being tuned for PC Game Pass, but that'd only be worth it if Microsoft put real investment into PC Game Pass as a launcher and service.
While that shouldn't let Valve rest on their laurels, it does mean that they have a good amount of leeway that other PC handheld makers lack. And like Nintendo, Valve don't need to play the power game; they need to play the Valve game, and focus on what they bring that others can't. That's a seamless integration of hardware with their Steam OS and Steam itself, even if they're opening this up some to 3P OEM manufacturers.
The biggest mistake Valve could make, in fact, is trying to play the power game and chase after competitors instead of being a leader in their space. That same mistake costed SEGA dearly in the early-mid '90s with a disjointed hardware focus, leading to dead-ends like the 32X which distracted them from what should've been their main focus going forward: the Saturn (and even that fell into the same trap since they haphazardly threw more power at it to compete more directly with the PS1).
So yeah, Valve can establish iterations of Steam Deck revisions every 2-3 years with performance upgrades, but they should also make sure that's balanced with QOL, I/O and immersion feature upgrades that are more easily sellable/marketable and relevant. Unless Asus, Lenovo, Acer whoever get up a storefront with even a fraction of Steam's market share, they can put out PC handhelds 50% more powerful but still only barely scratch Steam Deck's selling power, at best.
In fact, at least in the West those other PC handhelds would probably have a better chance in market penetration by being tuned for PC Game Pass, but that'd only be worth it if Microsoft put real investment into PC Game Pass as a launcher and service.
yurinka
Member
Valve doesn't want to lose money selling handhelds. What they want is to engage the hardware makers to make PC handhelds that run Steam, including Microsoft.
Because expanding PC handheld market means growing Steam and having existing Steam users more engaged on Steam.
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Codes 208
Member
If you havent yet, you could use the ssd you bought for the rog ally (assuming it has more storage than your steamdeck’s) since they use the same ssd size
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NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt
Biggest Trails Stan
Im not opening my Steamdeck OLED, when it comes to that I don't have enough experience to properly do that. I also got the 1TB model plus another 1TB MicroSD so should be fine in the future
But thanks for the tip ^^
I'm eventually gonna to get the dock
Josemayuste
Member
I've got to say that while Steam Deck is already underpowered, coming from a Nintendo Switch to have games like Prey, Baldur's Gate 3, Diablo IV, Valheim, DayZ, MGSVTPP, Dishonored on the go .. make it a more than worthy buy, I see myself using my Deck for years, not to mention it's potential for emulation, the great community, and of course, SteamOS, also.. that OLED screen..
I find myself discovering new little gems too: Nightingale, Shadows of doubt, Gloomwood, Selaco.. I think that Valve made a really great job in its first portable iteration.
I find myself discovering new little gems too: Nightingale, Shadows of doubt, Gloomwood, Selaco.. I think that Valve made a really great job in its first portable iteration.
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jshackles
Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
That guy is just playing the opening area, that doesn't have that many enemies on the screen, and you only have one party member doing spells and stuff. Later in the game it slows down pretty considerably with more stuff on the screen and more things happening with 3 party members in battle.
Minsc
Gold Member
That's too bad. The game is still super new though, like less than a month old I think. So there's plenty of time for improvements.
Shame all the video footage, even if you go two hours out with 3 party members on the screen, fighting monsters it still is running 45-50fps. I can't find any bad framerates at all in the beginning of the game. Oh well. It does look fun though, I imagine whenever I get to it in like a year or so it probably won't have any issues at that point!
I just stream AAA games to my OLED Deck at 90 FPS + HDR with Moonlight. Even get the control customization of Steam in -all- games.
That'll never get outdated and will always be up to date for eternity as long as Moonlight/Sunshine are updated and that I upgrade my PC.
Rest runs great on the Deck with old/indies/emulation, which are what I'd want to play on the go anyways.
That'll never get outdated and will always be up to date for eternity as long as Moonlight/Sunshine are updated and that I upgrade my PC.
Rest runs great on the Deck with old/indies/emulation, which are what I'd want to play on the go anyways.
nowhat
Gold Member
Or dare I say... a console? I have an OLED. It's great for what it is, been having a blast replaying New Vegas and such. But it's not for contemporary AAA games, I thought everyone knew this.
Baldur’s Gate 3, Hogwarts Legacy and Elden Ring are in the top 5 most played games on Steamdeck between March 2023 and March 2024, according to Valve.
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
I think that it has an already huge and comprehensive library and still gets a lot of new games that run acceptably on the go (less of them are AAA sure each year, but there still are). Steam Deck OLED breathed some new life with optimisations such as faster RAM (higher memory bandwidth) but yes there needs to be a Steam Deck 2 in a year or so.
I do not think that Z2 Extreme is that chip though. I think that Steam Deck 2 needs a bigger graphical and efficiency jump and they need at least a derivate of that customised for them… maybe if AMD is ready to port the RT and AI improvements they did for PS5 Pro then Valve could have found the right SoC… and then some maybe as they need to wait for another jump before they get a big enough jump for Steam Deck 3.
I trust in Valve and I will always reward them for SteamOS, Proton, and what they achieved with this project so I will wait for them.
I do not think that Z2 Extreme is that chip though. I think that Steam Deck 2 needs a bigger graphical and efficiency jump and they need at least a derivate of that customised for them… maybe if AMD is ready to port the RT and AI improvements they did for PS5 Pro then Valve could have found the right SoC… and then some maybe as they need to wait for another jump before they get a big enough jump for Steam Deck 3.
I trust in Valve and I will always reward them for SteamOS, Proton, and what they achieved with this project so I will wait for them.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I need windows. I enjoyed my steam deck alot but the screen was wack and the rog ally did everything I wanted.
I'm much more excited for a true rog ally 2
I'm much more excited for a true rog ally 2
Fortress of Regrets
Member
I am sad that my Steam Deck is destined to die next year. Unable to play all the wonderful PC games it currently plays 
GoldenEye98
posts news as their odd job
Nvidia and it isn't even close. Valve is worth ~$10B...that's one month of revenue for Nvidia these days.
Minsc
Gold Member
Crazy to see it written out. Valve, Sony, Nintendo, all worth in the billions. nVidia? Trillions. I guess they could just buy all the platform holders out haha. Except MS. They're also trillions.
Sorcerer
Member
I wonder if Valve even cares? They got the ball rolling by introducing the Deck. All the competitors have to make use of Steam. They are even introducing Steam OS for competitors handhelds. Most likely they will release Steam OS for desktops soon, so you can build your own. All the money comes back to Valve regardless. Even the competition is stuck at trying to make a profit on the hardware itself. The competition is really not competition at all, they are making Valve money on an endless basis.
I wonder if they will even bother with another machine? They obviously don't need the money from the hardware itself.
Something tells me this was the plan all along. Start with the Deck, let others embrace the idea, because they need Steam regardless, have it turn into a self-sustaining eco system, drop the hardware on their end, so many machines on the market that do that for them.
I wonder if they will even bother with another machine? They obviously don't need the money from the hardware itself.
Something tells me this was the plan all along. Start with the Deck, let others embrace the idea, because they need Steam regardless, have it turn into a self-sustaining eco system, drop the hardware on their end, so many machines on the market that do that for them.
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AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
Because games run great on the SD. If they didnt it wouldnt be in the top 5. A lot of people are playing ER on the deck purely because they like the portability of it even though they have a PS5 or XsX. Point is, SD is so much more than just relying on the newest game. Switch has been out for 7+ years and I dont see people not buying third party ports if Switch is really the only platform they can play on. Steam deck is probably the best emulation machine out there, can play almost anything at 60fps and high settings from 2015 and below. Can play any mdoern indie game, can play most modern games currently, now its up to you where you draw the line and say, hey this is too low settings for me, I dont want to play my games on it.
Also not all new games are power hungry hogs. Persona 3 remake for example. Games like that will be coming out years to come, they arent only making Spiderman 2 and GOW 2 visual fidelity games in the future. And most people that do buy a deck, its not their only console but a portable addition. Id rather play ANY indie game in my bed or the deck then to stare at a 60" tv and play some metroidovania 16bit pixelart game.
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elbourreau
Member
Dr.D00p
Member
Well unless AMD have a super secret custom APU in development for Valve which will be ready in late 2025, none of the so far announced new chips for next year will fit Valves stated requirements for them to release a SD2.
The Z2 will only be a modest, incremental upgrade over the Z1.
The Strix Halo is too big and too power heavy even in its cut down variants.
Kracken Point has potential on the CPU side for a decent uplift in performance but only has 8CUs on the GPU which is..meh.
Price cuts and storage upgrades should see them through until the silicon stars align in 2026 for SD2, IMO.
The Z2 will only be a modest, incremental upgrade over the Z1.
The Strix Halo is too big and too power heavy even in its cut down variants.
Kracken Point has potential on the CPU side for a decent uplift in performance but only has 8CUs on the GPU which is..meh.
Price cuts and storage upgrades should see them through until the silicon stars align in 2026 for SD2, IMO.
dragonyeuw
Member
When it launched in 2022 the specs weren't enough for most modern AAA without dropping the settings to low. For AA, older AAA going back 5-10 years and Indies it's perfect, then and now. That said, I wanted a bit more ummpph from my portable PC handheld experience so I sold my OG Deck for a Legion Go last month and, asides from dealing with the quirks of W11 in this format, it's a nicer experience ( including running things like PS3 emulation). It runs more demanding games much better and I don't need to worry about proton compatibility running stuff through Steam OS.
MacReady13
Member
Already talking about an upgraded Steam deck when Australia STILL doesn’t have an official release date for this thing!!!
Kumomeme
Member
funny that i see lot of its fans failed to understand this. sometimes some of them blame game's optimization than just acknowledge that Steam Deck is merely an outdated device.
FewRope
Member
This, I'm not expecting to play Space Marine 2 at 60 fps on my Steam Deck
I think it’s a really narrow minded take. I’m playing Core Keeper on mine just fine - basing an entire system against the 0.1% of AAA trash instead of the other thousand games that release each year is a fools errand.
People chasing cutting edge specs need to ask themselves why they’re looking for that in a handheld.
Going all the way back to the GameBoy, sensible middle ground has always won out in the handheld space & valve have done a great job in achieving that and giving us reasonable specs, battery life etc along with access to the entire back library of PC gaming.
You can pick up a steam deck in 30 years. Still play Hades. Still get 120fps docked on a monitor.
People chasing cutting edge specs need to ask themselves why they’re looking for that in a handheld.
Going all the way back to the GameBoy, sensible middle ground has always won out in the handheld space & valve have done a great job in achieving that and giving us reasonable specs, battery life etc along with access to the entire back library of PC gaming.
You can pick up a steam deck in 30 years. Still play Hades. Still get 120fps docked on a monitor.
Cyberpunkd
Member
And next year's...
And the year after that...
PC crowd is used to it - buy what suits you now, regardless it will be outdated in 6-12 months
rm082e
Member
This whole thing feels like Steam Deck is now a victim of it's own success. It did the thing it does so well that PC players are now expecting a handheld that can run recent AAA games at decent frame rates. The Steam Deck never promised that. In the beginning, everyone I saw praising/hyping the Steam Deck was including an asterisk that expectations needed to be in check and it couldn't do that. But over the last couple of years, that's faded away.
What made the Steam Deck neat to begin with was the fairly low price. It didn't have crazy specs, which meant you could get one for roughly a console level price. We saw what other OEMs did when they built more powerful machines - the price was higher. If you want a gaming laptop in the palm of your hand, you're going to pay for it with cost and short battery life.
Personally, I still like my Steam Deck and it's fine for my (very light) usage. I have a big backlog of older games and indies that run great on it, so I probably won't upgrade for a while. When I do eventually upgrade, I want something with a bigger OLED screen and a lot of horsepower. I'm prepared to spend in the $800-$900 range when that time comes, but that will be a different tier of device than the Steam Deck. But there will still be a place for a $400 hand-held PC.
What made the Steam Deck neat to begin with was the fairly low price. It didn't have crazy specs, which meant you could get one for roughly a console level price. We saw what other OEMs did when they built more powerful machines - the price was higher. If you want a gaming laptop in the palm of your hand, you're going to pay for it with cost and short battery life.
Personally, I still like my Steam Deck and it's fine for my (very light) usage. I have a big backlog of older games and indies that run great on it, so I probably won't upgrade for a while. When I do eventually upgrade, I want something with a bigger OLED screen and a lot of horsepower. I'm prepared to spend in the $800-$900 range when that time comes, but that will be a different tier of device than the Steam Deck. But there will still be a place for a $400 hand-held PC.
Cyberpunkd
Member
The problem is not only on hardware side, every other handheld runs Windows, and that is ass. I wonder how Steam OS is working on ROG Ally X?
Also Steamdeck has trackpads, which is a godsend when playing old PC games that only supported mouse and keyboard.
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Esparadrapo
Member
I think a performance race in mobile devices is as stupid as it can get. Nobody into handheld gaming has performance as a number one priority, not even playing the latest games. Nobody that matters at least. I don't understand how some people can be so out of touch with what customers really want.
Also laughable to think that Intel can be a contender because it might be somewhat more performant at 45W or something like that. The real battle is at sub 15W (I'd say ~10W) and everything above that is just debris.
Also laughable to think that Intel can be a contender because it might be somewhat more performant at 45W or something like that. The real battle is at sub 15W (I'd say ~10W) and everything above that is just debris.
DanielG165
Member
My Steam Deck is an old game and last generation game beast. Would it be great if it received more power? Absolutely. For me personally, I would simply want more battery life out of a second version for more graphically intensive games. It’s the perfect complimentary device to my PC already.
ZenTheShogun
Member
Nvidia.
firegamer273
Member
so you are telling me all the steamdecks have bombs attached to them inside and they will explode in 2025?
HogIsland
Member
hesbollah was instructed to discard their nintendo switches ...