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[Bojji]

You mean that chart?

33% and 35% in apples to apples comparisons is a software patch?

One with RT and the second one with RT and frame gen. Zero raster tests so far.

 

[Gaiff]

One with RT and the second one with RT and frame gen. Zero raster tests so far.

It's still an apples to apples test, unless you think for some bizarre reason, regular frame gen on the RTX 50 works a lot better? Far Cry's RT is weak as hell and wouldn't explain that disparity. Either this chart is made up or it isn't.

 

[//DEVIL//]

One with RT and the second one with RT and frame gen. Zero raster tests so far.

Right . But expecting the performance in resta to be lower than the one with RT. Simply because the newer RT core is working with the resta power just to gain this advantage over older RT cores.

If the newer RT cores and resta power can only do that much combined, then resta in theory should be lower . But who knows

 

[Bojji]

It's still an apples to apples test, unless you think for some bizarre reason, regular frame gen on the RTX 50 works a lot better? Far Cry's RT is weak as hell and wouldn't explain that disparity. Either this chart is made up or it isn't.

DLSS3 frame gen has performance hit, you could have 60fps without FG but when FG is enabled it doubles from ~50FPS to 100FPS for example (so base FPS drops). I think there i a chance that this performance hit might be lower on Blackwell? Or not, we don't know but that would skew results for sure.

Right . But expecting the performance in resta to be lower than the one with RT. Simply because the newer RT core is working with the resta power just to gain this advantage over older RT cores.

If the newer RT cores and resta power can only do that much combined, then resta in theory should be lower . But who knows

RT teraflops performance went significantly up (like over 30% between 4070tiS and 5070ti) so it should boost hybrid RT games to some extend. Meanwhile raster TFs are closer.

 

[Gaiff]

DLSS3 frame gen has performance hit, you could have 60fps without FG but when FG is enabled it doubles from ~50FPS to 100FPS for example (so base FPS drops). I think there i a chance that this performance hit might be lower on Blackwell? Or not, we don't know but that would skew results for sure.

The hit would have to be comically higher to balloon up to a 35% advantage. Based on those apples to apples charts at least, the 5080 certainly is faster than the 4080. Not Turing to Ampere levels or even Ampere to Blackwell, but people have been suggesting the gains will be less than 5% and that seems impossible.

I think we’re looking at around a 20% performance advantage in general going from a 4080>5080, not 30-35%. Those games are likely strong performers on Blackwell.

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

You mean that chart?

33% and 35% in apples to apples comparisons is a software patch?

RT is indeed improved on the 5000 series.

Raster performance is unlikely to be much better as per the data.

 

[Gaiff]

RT is indeed improved on the 5000 series.

Raster performance is unlikely to be much better as per the data.

What data? Where is there a raster benchmark with verifiable and credible data? I don’t think it has improved by 50%, but it most certainly isn’t a "software patch".

 

[Schmendrick]

What data? Where is there a raster benchmark with verifiable and credible data? I don’t think it has improved by 50%, but it most certainly isn’t a "software patch".

He's referring to the cu counts. Those have barely increased, so any kind of noteworthy uplift (if any) has to come from the architecture itself.

 

[Bojji]

The hit would have to be comically higher to balloon up to a 35% advantage. Based on those apples to apples charts at least, the 5080 certainly is faster than the 4080. Not Turing to Ampere levels or even Ampere to Blackwell, but people have been suggesting the gains will be less than 5% and that seems impossible.

I think we’re looking at around a 20% performance advantage in general going from a 4080>5080, not 30-35%. Those games are likely strong performers on Blackwell.

Combine it with RT teraflop increase.

We don't have even one pure raster bench from nvidia so no wonder people are not confident about performance jump. Most games still are raster only (plus software lumen UE5 games).

 

[Gaiff]

Combine it with RT teraflop increase.

We don't have even one pure raster bench from nvidia so no wonder people are not confident about performance jump. Most games still are raster only (plus software lumen UE5 games).

That would mean a titanic performance increase in ray tracing. FC6 has a 21% performance penalty when toggling RT on on a 4080. If the 5080 and 4080 are in the same ballpark with RT off, but the 5080 suddenly becomes 25% more performant with RT on, then we’re looking at the biggest gen-on-gen rt performance increase so far.

I doubt though if the numbers of BMW are anything to go by. The 5090 should be wiping the floor with the 4090 by well over 60%, not just 30-40%.

 

[Bojji]

That would mean a titanic performance increase in ray tracing. FC6 has a 21% performance penalty when toggling RT on on a 4080. If the 5080 and 4080 are in the same ballpark with RT off, but the 5080 suddenly becomes 25% more performant with RT on, then we’re looking at the biggest gen-on-gen rt performance increase so far.

I doubt though if the numbers of BMW are anything to go by. The 5090 should be wiping the floor with the 4090 by well over 60%, not just 30-40%.

We know nothing without independent tests. Nvidia focuses on MFG and don't even show BW TF numbers (when they show them for Ada):

 

[Gaiff]

We know nothing without independent tests. Nvidia focuses on MFG and don't even show BW TF numbers (when they show them for Ada):

Yeah, so wait for reviews instead of claiming the 5080 won’t be an improvement over the 4080. It won’t be a big one, but they won’t be equal.

 

[Bojji]

Yeah, so wait for reviews instead of claiming the 5080 won’t be an improvement over the 4080. It won’t be a big one, but they won’t be equal.

Yep, there is no way it won't be. Question is, how much? And where it will land in performance compared to 4090.

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

Yeah, so wait for reviews instead of claiming the 5080 won’t be an improvement over the 4080. It won’t be a big one, but they won’t be equal.

Based on the core count it's going to be a small improvement. And probably why they're releasing 5080 reviews on release date only.

 

[Zathalus]

It's still an apples to apples test, unless you think for some bizarre reason, regular frame gen on the RTX 50 works a lot better? Far Cry's RT is weak as hell and wouldn't explain that disparity. Either this chart is made up or it isn't.

That Plague tale note is odd. FP8 vs FP4. Might be that DLSS runs faster on 5000 series with the new Transformer model due to that. Unless I misunderstood what they meant by flux.

He's referring to the cu counts. Those have barely increased, so any kind of noteworthy uplift (if any) has to come from the architecture itself.

Not only that, memory bandwidth has taken a rather large jump upwards. Games that are heavily memory bound can see a larger than expected boost just due to that.

 

[rofif]

That huge and profitable high end gpu market that AMD and Intel can't survive in? Even if it's just that they make shit cards that can't compete, Nvidia and the AIB vendors sure do leave a lot of money on the table by producing so few of those cards.

Even if the cards only have $400-$500 of hardware in them, you can't just ignore the R&D and marketing costs, your thoughts on owners of those spending more on games and DLC is just pure conjecture.

Every gpu ever released had rnd. It was always a cost

I've been listening to Jeff for 20 years. I'm not going to say he's wrong, but the degree to which he's implying the additional latency impacts his ability to perform in game compared to his skill level relative to competitive fighting game and FPS players seems out of whack. He's always been a bit above average at both of those genres. Not to say he needs to "deal with it" or anything. I just think the latency introduced by FG is one of those things that some people are going to feel and others aren't. The people who don't feel it just aren't sensitive to it and probably aren't playing a lot of competitive multiplayer games.

yeah and he is obviously exaggerating

 

[//DEVIL//]

DLSS3 frame gen has performance hit, you could have 60fps without FG but when FG is enabled it doubles from ~50FPS to 100FPS for example (so base FPS drops). I think there i a chance that this performance hit might be lower on Blackwell? Or not, we don't know but that would skew results for sure.



RT teraflops performance went significantly up (like over 30% between 4070tiS and 5070ti) so it should boost hybrid RT games to some extend. Meanwhile raster TFs are closer.

Exactly . That’s why we don’t have any information about resta performance. But I would assume if it was more than 30%, they would have at least one graph. But nope nothing.

5090 being on the node as 4090, I am really not expecting much of an improvement . But the 5000 series in general are a good future proof cards due to them having the AI hardware necessary for AI improvements in future.

 

[Kilau]

Every gpu ever released had rnd. It was always a cost

I never implied they didn't, I was saying just build cost of a board isn't the actual total cost so counting that margin as profit isn't accurate.

 

[rofif]

I never implied they didn't, I was saying just build cost of a board isn't the actual total cost so counting that margin as profit isn't accurate.

Yeah I understand. Gpu is more than bill of materials

 

[Corporal.Hicks]

We know nothing without independent tests. Nvidia focuses on MFG and don't even show BW TF numbers (when they show them for Ada):

It's possible to calculate flops based on the available data.

RTX5070 - 31TF / RTX4070 - 29TF
RTX5070ti - 44TF / RTX4070ti - 40TF
RTX5080 - 56TF / RTX4080 - 49TF
RTX5090 - 105TF / RTX4090 - 83TF

 

[StereoVsn]

When the actual hardware (based on CUDA/shader counts) has such limited improvement over the predecessor, yes

NVIDIA's own charts show the 5080 is a software patch over the 4080.

5090 is likely to be 25-30% faster, but also a 28.9% increase in total draw power.

I think it depends on the use case. For gaming,, seems about right. For AI workloads I can see much bigger improvements due to 32GB VRAM, 512bit bus and increase in Tensor cores.

 

[marjo]

Remember a few gens ago when the 70 series would often match or exceed the top of the line of the previous gen. Man, I miss those days.

 

[Lethal01]

If you're getting 25-35% more performance for 25-35% more money, what the fuck else is it?

isnt that number only referring to the raster perfomance? thats not really where im focused.

 

[Lethal01]

Clickbait or not, it's difficult to argue with the raw figures.

Overall the 5000 series has been a sideways refresh with a software patch. The 5090 has an increase in performance - with increased power consumption and total price. Rest of the cards? Raster performance is no better than 2 year old GPU.

so in a raytracing heavy game the 5080 would double my performance? seems like a bargain does that test use framegen?

 

[BattleScar]

isnt that number only referring to the raster perfomance? thats not really where im focused.

If you look at their graphs, that is what they're claiming for RT performance improvement.

 

[Corporal.Hicks]

so in a raytracing heavy game the 5080 would double my performance? seems like a bargain does that test use framegen?

Yes, MFG (FGx4) was used on all RTX50 series cards in their benchmarks.

 

[twilo99]

Impressive

 

[Celcius]

Impressive

I want to know what the coil whine is like at 800 fps

 

[Thebonehead]

Impressive

 

[Dusktildawn48]

Alright guys, PSUs confuse the hell out of me. This is what I have:

COMBAT FG 850W ATX 3.1 | SUPER FLOWER

Please contact the distributor in your country for the availability and quotation

www.super-flower.com.tw

For the 5080, will I just use the 12vhp that came with the PSU? I believe it's a 450w cable.

 

[Celcius]

Alright guys, PSUs confuse the hell out of me. This is what I have:

COMBAT FG 850W ATX 3.1 | SUPER FLOWER

Please contact the distributor in your country for the availability and quotation

www.super-flower.com.tw

For the 5080, will I just use the 12vhp that came with the PSU? I believe it's a 450w cable.

Yes that's fine. 12VHPWR and 12v-2x6 are interchangeable

 

[Gubaldo]

Some more sildes leak

15% improvements

 

[FireFly]

"The Blackwell SM doubles the INT32 bandwidth and throughput by giving all shader cores the ability to run either INT32 or FP32, unlike Ada, which supported that only on half the cores. They also made the Tensor Cores accessible from the shaders, by using the new DirectX Cooperative Vectors API."

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 50 Technical Deep Dive

In this article we cover everything NVIDIA revealed about the GeForce RTX 50 Series: the new graphics card models and their pricing, Blackwell architecture, DLSS 4 updates, Neural Rendering, Reflex 2 for faster headshots, improved AI performance and creator-focused tools.

www.techpowerup.com

So that explains the modest bump on per SM basis. No extra compute, but gaming performance should be slightly better.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

 

[asdasdasdbb]

Some more sildes leak

The increase is tiny but at least it appears to be faster in raster across the board at least.

 

[Gubaldo]

there are reports that 5090 is also seeing 15-20% increase over 4090.
Which is hard to believe given the spec difference between these two.
May be scaling issues?


Edit: That source fixed it;s headline , now its stating 30% increase

 

[Gaiff]

Glad to see those nativists losing the resolution war.

 

[Dusktildawn48]

Glad to see those nativists losing the resolution war.

It seems the gap between the 70ti and 80 is pretty close now no?

 

[Bojji]

Glad to see those nativists losing the resolution war.

That 5070 vs 4070 don't make much sense...

 

[Gubaldo]

That 5070 vs 4070 don't make much sense...

its around 15% according to slide.
Maybe a typo on 3d centre's end




With NO framegeneration on
60-65 fps on 5090 at 4K DLSS quality Path tracing.
How much does 4090 Get?

 

[clarky]

its around 15% according to slide.
Maybe a typo on 3d centre's end




With NO framegeneration on
60-65 fps on 5090 at 4K DLSS quality Path tracing.
How much does 4090 Get?

4090 gets around 50fps I think.

 

[Draugoth]

 

[Gaiff]

 

[analog_future]

Am I crazy in thinking these cards might not be THAT hard to get at launch?

• No bitcoin mining craze to deal with
• No COVID related supply chain issues to deal with
• Cards are at really high prices and more and more people are struggling
• General enthusiasm around the reveal has been lukewarm
• Switch 2 announcement may steal some of the thunder

I'm sure the initial batch will still sell out, but I wonder if they'll sell out in an hour or two this time around instead of the first 3 minutes.

 

[Magic Carpet]

Am I crazy in thinking these cards might not be THAT hard to get at launch?

I'm sure I'll have a hard time finding the small fits in my case founders edition.

 

[Kenpachii]

Am I crazy in thinking these cards might not be THAT hard to get at launch?

• No bitcoin mining craze to deal with
• No COVID related supply chain issues to deal with
• Cards are at really high prices and more and more people are struggling
• General enthusiasm around the reveal has been lukewarm
• Switch 2 announcement may steal some of the thunder

I'm sure the initial batch will still sell out, but I wonder if they'll sell out in an hour or two this time around instead of the first 3 minutes.

Yea got the feeling those cards won't sell that fast. The founders edition will be sold out tho.

 

[dave_d]

Am I crazy in thinking these cards might not be THAT hard to get at launch?

• No bitcoin mining craze to deal with
• No COVID related supply chain issues to deal with
• Cards are at really high prices and more and more people are struggling
• General enthusiasm around the reveal has been lukewarm
• Switch 2 announcement may steal some of the thunder

I'm sure the initial batch will still sell out, but I wonder if they'll sell out in an hour or two this time around instead of the first 3 minutes.

Hard to know. I mean wasn't the deal in the 40 series was that you could get them as long as you weren't trying to get the 4090? (They were so plentiful that tech tubbers started claiming that the 4070 was a flop. Of course tech epiphany and Steam GPU survey suggest otherwise.)

 

[StereoVsn]

Glad to see those nativists losing the resolution war.

It will be really interesting true performance differences between 5080 and 5070Ti and 5070Ti and 4080S.

I think that 5070Ti is really looking to be cars to get unless you want to shell out major $$$ for 5090.

 

[Celcius]

Am I crazy in thinking these cards might not be THAT hard to get at launch?

• No bitcoin mining craze to deal with
• No COVID related supply chain issues to deal with
• Cards are at really high prices and more and more people are struggling
• General enthusiasm around the reveal has been lukewarm
• Switch 2 announcement may steal some of the thunder

I'm sure the initial batch will still sell out, but I wonder if they'll sell out in an hour or two this time around instead of the first 3 minutes.

I guarantee you the RTX 5090 will fly off the shelves. The first and only 32gb GeForce card and the best performance money can buy.
You may be right about the rest though.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Some 5080 images for you all.