Support NeoGAF

[StereoVsn]

We all know what happened here. Valhalla came out in 2020 and was a huge hit. This game started development then or was in very early stages. What happened in 2020? What did every single dev on the planet start saying they needed to do in 2020? To ask the question is to answer it.

The problem for Ubishit is that the world has turned over, Star Wars Outlaws (which I will always believe was a Han Solo game that they modified for similar but not identical reasons) was a massive flop, nobody wants this stuff they're selling.


last minute delays, talking about reworking the game and bringing in historians last minute (which is EXPENSIVE), going over everything for historical accuracy reasons, canceling the season pass, canceling early access, cutting the price of the premium edition, this game is a total disaster. They don't want to release the game in EA and people realize that like 38 people are playing it like Concord.

Yeah, Ubi isn’t doing this all of a sudden out of goodness of their hearts.

Pre-order numbers must have completely tanked for them to take such drastic actions. They even shit canned the season pass and we all know how much Ubisoft loves the sweet, sweet MTX.

No Corpo is going to do that unless they have 0 faith in sales. The changes are expensive considering number of people working, additions modifications, outside consultants and so on.

 

[diffusionx]

Hey, HEY, how about you not put words in my mouth. Where in my post did I say it was wrong? Where? Please point out the exact sentence because otherwise you are misquoting me, and my post wasn’t exactly long so that doesn’t come off as an innocent mistake.



-ah yes, as I stated before, the series Assassin’s Creed is well known for its consistent “historical accuracy”

-yes, we’re aware AC has had black playable leads before, but Freedom Cry was 2013 and Liberation was 2012. Yes, there was little to no controversy, but I didn’t need to wonder why, it’s because it’s only since the mid-2010’s do some people see a lead who isn’t male, white (Asians are often exempt too in their eyes), and/or straight and they proceed to grab their thick rulebook to prove the lead isn’t “justified” or “logical” or they’ll just start screaming, “woke!” if the setting is 100% fictional so they have to rely on their comfort food word.

Just because the mindrot that caused people to whine about Chris Redfield being a lead of Resident Evil 5 and the mindrot that caused other people to whine about Yasuke being a lead of Assassin’s Creed Shadows are different flavors doesn’t change the fact they’re both mindrot. It’s fucking video games with zombies, giant monsters, a dude in shades with flash step abilities, lightning-blasting Pope, Medusa, Valhalla as a location, secret organization using time merging alien bullshit, etc. Anyone who looks at all THAT and goes, “uh, well, the white dude shooting black people, even if they’re zombies, seems problematic!” or, “excuse me, but I need absolute proof Yasuke was a samurai!” each sound like they’re coming from someone who is just deep down miserable or some shit.

And to be clear, I’m not being dismissive of the Japanese people who are criticizing the inaccurate depictions of buildings, locations, etc. of their culture and history. That’s a separate thing from Yasuke, and I would hope they would not criticize Yasuke specifically because video games and especially modern media in general are not starved for Japanese leads (or rather Japanese male leads since apparently the female character “doesn’t count” for some) in modern or historical time periods. And lord knows Japan is no stranger to making games with a playable character not native to the primary region in the game (again, look at some of the Resident Evil games). Hell, a development team in Hong Kong is making an upcoming Silent Hill game (Silent Hill f), you know, the series focused on a town called Silent Hill specifically located in the U.S., and apparently setting it in Japan! Should us Americans get outraged about that? I’m American, and get this, I am not outraged. And neither should any sensible person get outraged, whether at Yasuke, at Chris Redfield, at Silent Hill f, etc.

This is the first AC game starring a "real life" person and also the first AC to have a foreigner in the setting. So it is quantitatively different from prior games. I don't know Freedom Cry but Liberation's lead was a black slave woman in New Orleans, which had a lot of black slave people at the time the game was set.

AC Shadows is is literally DEI/woke/"anti-racism" of the sort that momentarily blew up when this game started development. It's the exact same thing that Blizzard did when they put out that DEI scoring system for their characters. Just because "brainrotted" people talk about woke or DEI doesn't mean it isn't a real thing. When Blizzard puts out a new character that checks all the diversity boxes, pointing out that it checks all the diversity boxes after they proudly announced they literally have a diversity scoring system with check boxes doesn't make it hysterical or conspiratorial. It is just what they are doing.

I wish more people would just say it because it is true instead of talking about torii gates or whether Yasuke was actually a samurai (who the fuck cares) or simping for Japanese people and historical accuracy. It's true, we all knwo it's true, we know why they made this game the way they did. We saw it in that trailer that had this guy chopping off Japanese guys' heads and knocking out fish stands to rap music. Ubisoft knew exactly what they were doing, they were proud of it, they didn't see that the culture has changed since then, and now they're running for cover. I guarantee if they started AC Shadows in 2024, it would star a Japanese guy. I also guarantee some in the company discussed the possibility of changing the main character but decided the blowback would be too much internally and externally.

 

[MatrixReloaded101]

We all know what happened here. Valhalla came out in 2020 and was a huge hit. This game started development then or was in very early stages. What happened in 2020? What did every single dev on the planet start saying they needed to do in 2020? To ask the question is to answer it.

The problem for Ubishit is that the world has turned over, Star Wars Outlaws (which I will always believe was a Han Solo game that they modified for similar but not identical reasons) was a massive flop, nobody wants this stuff they're selling.


last minute delays, talking about reworking the game and bringing in historians last minute (which is EXPENSIVE), going over everything for historical accuracy reasons, canceling the season pass, canceling early access, cutting the price of the premium edition, this game is a total disaster. They don't want to release the game in EA and people realize that like 38 people are playing it like Concord.

So every time a game is made that features DEI characters its due to an agenda? You do realize tons of games released with DEI characters before 2020 right?

Also from the feedback I have seen on Star Wars Outlaw, it just wasn't a good game. They are even releasing a patch to change major elements of the game like the stealth sections. But people are going to completely ignore this and just blame DEI.

Same deal with Concord, that game launched at $40 in a sea of big free to play games but this strategy and the quality of the game wasn't questioned and all the blame was on DEI.

I just think DEI bashing is a very dangerous talking point. "We aren't doing good, so it has to be these new DEI people" instead of "we aren't making quality products, good stories and gameplay that is fun."

The quality of AAA games has been tanking for years long before the DEI stuff become popular in 2020 so why is it being used as a scapegoat in recent times?

Start thinking critically

 

[Laptop1991]

Hey, HEY, how about you not put words in my mouth. Where in my post did I say it was wrong? Where? Please point out the exact sentence because otherwise you are misquoting me, and my post wasn’t exactly long so that doesn’t come off as an innocent mistake.



-ah yes, as I stated before, the series Assassin’s Creed is well known for its consistent “historical accuracy”

-yes, we’re aware AC has had black playable leads before, but Freedom Cry was 2013 and Liberation was 2012. Yes, there was little to no controversy, but I didn’t need to wonder why, it’s because it’s only since the mid-2010’s do some people see a lead who isn’t male, white (Asians are often exempt too in their eyes), and/or straight and they proceed to grab their thick rulebook to prove the lead isn’t “justified” or “logical” or they’ll just start screaming, “woke!” if the setting is 100% fictional so they have to rely on their comfort food word.

Just because the mindrot that caused people to whine about Chris Redfield being a lead of Resident Evil 5 and the mindrot that caused other people to whine about Yasuke being a lead of Assassin’s Creed Shadows are different flavors doesn’t change the fact they’re both mindrot. It’s fucking video games with zombies, giant monsters, a dude in shades with flash step abilities, lightning-blasting Pope, Medusa, Valhalla as a location, secret organization using time merging alien bullshit, etc. Anyone who looks at all THAT and goes, “uh, well, the white dude shooting black people, even if they’re zombies, seems problematic!” or, “excuse me, but I need absolute proof Yasuke was a samurai!” each sound like they’re coming from someone who is just deep down miserable or some shit.

And to be clear, I’m not being dismissive of the Japanese people who are criticizing the inaccurate depictions of buildings, locations, etc. of their culture and history. That’s a separate thing from Yasuke, and I would hope they would not criticize Yasuke specifically because video games and especially modern media in general are not starved for Japanese leads (or rather Japanese male leads since apparently the female character “doesn’t count” for some) in modern or historical time periods. And lord knows Japan is no stranger to making games with a playable character not native to the primary region in the game (again, look at some of the Resident Evil games). Hell, a development team in Hong Kong is making an upcoming Silent Hill game (Silent Hill f), you know, the series focused on a town called Silent Hill specifically located in the U.S., and apparently setting it in Japan! Should us Americans get outraged about that? I’m American, and get this, I am not outraged. And neither should any sensible person get outraged, whether at Yasuke, at Chris Redfield, at Silent Hill f, etc.

On my first post i quoted what you said "A) this isn’t even the first AC game to feature a character not native to the region, there was Black Flag" so i pointed out that Edward Kenway is far more relevant to the region than any native because it was set during the Pirates of the Caribbean times and provided historical facts, then i got laughed at by you and the other 2, so you know why

 

[diffusionx]

So every time a game is made that features DEI characters its due to an agenda? You do realize tons of games released with DEI characters before 2020 right?

Also from the feedback I have seen on Star Wars Outlaw, it just wasn't a good game. They are even releasing a patch to change major elements of the game like the stealth sections. But people are going to completely ignore this and just blame DEI.

Same deal with Concord, that game launched at $40 in a sea of big free to play games but this strategy and the quality of the game wasn't questioned and all the blame was on DEI.

I just think DEI bashing is a very dangerous talking point. "We aren't doing good, so it has to be these new DEI people" instead of "we aren't making quality products, good stories and gameplay that is fun."

The quality of AAA games has been tanking for years long before the DEI stuff become popular in 2020 so why is it being used as a scapegoat in recent times?

Start thinking critically

I'm talking about this particular game. It's not a mystery. Stop trying to change the subject or generalize it, it's pretty suspect.

 

[Doom85]

On my first post i quoted what you said "A) this isn’t even the first AC game to feature a character not native to the region, there was Black Flag" so i pointed out that Edward Kenway is far more relevant to the region than any native because it was set during the Pirates of the Caribbean times and provided historical facts, then i got laughed at by you and the other 2, so you know why

That did not excuse what you said. You claimed that I said it was wrong for Black Flag to have a lead not native (and being “relevant” does not make one a native) to the region, which I did not say at all.

Right here:

What a load of nonsense from you as usual, he did state that Black Flag didn't have a local protaganist which he was saying is wrong for some strange reason

Again, point to exactly where I said it was wrong for them to use a non-local protagonist for the game.

 

[jason10mm]

So every time a game is made that features DEI characters its due to an agenda? You do realize tons of games released with DEI characters before 2020 right?

Also from the feedback I have seen on Star Wars Outlaw, it just wasn't a good game. They are even releasing a patch to change major elements of the game like the stealth sections. But people are going to completely ignore this and just blame DEI.

Same deal with Concord, that game launched at $40 in a sea of big free to play games but this strategy and the quality of the game wasn't questioned and all the blame was on DEI.

I just think DEI bashing is a very dangerous talking point. "We aren't doing good, so it has to be these new DEI people" instead of "we aren't making quality products, good stories and gameplay that is fun."

The quality of AAA games has been tanking for years long before the DEI stuff become popular in 2020 so why is it being used as a scapegoat in recent times?

Start thinking critically

I think we can all recognize that sub-par gameplay can be masked with spectacular visuals or an outstanding story. Happens all the time.

Excellent gameplay can overcome weak visuals and certainly many, many games have a dogshit story from the get go.

The difference between "DEI story" and "story with woman and minorities in it" is the authenticity, organic flow, and plausibility of the characters along with the visuals being in sync with audience tastes. Throw a female lead with a potato shaped body, half shaved head, nose ring, and rainbow flag and its pretty clear that the character is a virtue signal avatar FIRST, second, and third, and MAYBE an actual interesting character a distant fourth, regardless of how well the character plays. But make a normal appearing character with an appealing face and physique that fits the characters story and actions and its clear where the game dev priorities are because they put in the leg work to make the character fit within the game world, be an authentic presentation, AND is appealing to the actual audience they expect to pay $$$ for the game (versus the tiny shrieking social media crowd that will NEVER buy the game).

So a mediocre game with DEI elements SHOULD have the DEI stuff lambasted, because if the devs had just listened to their real audience they may have A. made a better game or at least B. made a game more pleasing to look at and some gameplay flaws could be overlooked.

 

[Laptop1991]

That did not excuse what you said. You claimed that I said it was wrong for Black Flag to have a lead not native (and being “relevant” does not make one a native) to the region, which I did not say at all.

Right here:



Again, point to exactly where I said it was wrong for them to use a non-local protagonist for the game.

You made out that it should of been a native and not a British protaganist, that' was one of your point's, so i pointed out it 100 percent was correct to use a British character,

The Pirates of The Caribbean were British, Blackbeard, Charles Vane, Jack Rackham, Black Bart, Mary Read and even Anne Bonny were all British as Ireland was part of Britain back then, they always will be British, play the game and listen to the accents.

Your changing your points and are arguing in bad faith. and anyone that uses the laughing emojy a lot tends to do that when they change their arguments, your still wrong on that point.

 

[Doom85]

This is the first AC game starring a "real life" person and also the first AC to have a foreigner in the setting.

It isn’t the first game to have a foreigner to its setting, bruh, we flat out have been talking about Black Flag!

AC Shadows is is literally DEI/woke/"anti-racism" of the sort that momentarily blew up when this game started development. It's the exact same thing that Blizzard did when they put out that DEI scoring system for their characters. Just because "brainrotted" people talk about woke or DEI doesn't mean it isn't a real thing. When Blizzard puts out a new character that checks all the diversity boxes, pointing out that it checks all the diversity boxes after they proudly announced they literally have a diversity scoring system with check boxes doesn't make it hysterical or conspiratorial. It is just what they are doing.

I wish more people would just say it because it is true instead of talking about torii gates or whether Yasuke was actually a samurai (who the fuck cares) or simping for Japanese people and historical accuracy. It's true, we all knwo it's true, we know why they made this game the way they did. We saw it in that trailer that had this guy chopping off Japanese guys' heads and knocking out fish stands to rap music. Ubisoft knew exactly what they were doing, they were proud of it, they didn't see that the culture has changed since then, and now they're running for cover. I guarantee if they started AC Shadows in 2024, it would star a Japanese guy. I also guarantee some in the company discussed the possibility of changing the main character but decided the blowback would be too much internally and externally.

So basically the typical, “I can criticize all female/non-white/non-straight characters” stance because you dislike people’s personal politics. I do not give a fuck about their personal politics unless they are genuinely harming people or some shit like that. The so-called culture war is fucking idiotic on both ends, but I wouldn’t not buy a game from either side as long as it interested me and they aren’t hurting anybody.

Also, the marketing team is not the development team. I agree that ad was fucking stupid, but you can’t put that on the developers.

 

[Kikorin]

People asked for an AC set in Japan for ages, the only way to make this game flop was to do something beyond idiotic, like to put a black main character instead of a standard Japanese one. If Ubisoft really can make this underperform, it has to be studied.

 

[Doom85]

You made out that it should of been a native and not a British protaganist, that' was one of your point's, so i pointed out it 100 percent was correct to use a British character,

The Pirates of The Caribbean were British, Blackbeard, Charles Vane, Jack Rackham, Black Bart, Mary Read and even Anne Bonny were all British as Ireland was part of Britain back then, they always will be British, play the game and listen to the accents.

Your changing your points and arguing in bad faith. and anyone that uses the laughing emojy a lot tends to do that when they change their arguments, your still wrong on that point.

WHERE?! Use the fucking quote feature and show me on my original post where I said that. Because this is my original post since you are apparently incapable of using a basic forum feature.

A) this isn’t even the first AC game to feature a character not native to the region, there was Black Flag and B) again, Nioh 1, where was the massive outrage with that game? Hell, they even changed his ethnicity in that game (the real William was English, but the Nioh version is Irish).

If there was any indication of a Japanese Viking, that would be fine by me. And again though, it’s a series with lighting-blasting Popes, Medusa, Valhalla as an actual location, time travel, Ilumanti aliens bullshit, this wasn’t your high school history textbook to begin with.

All I said was a FACTUAL STATEMENT that this (Shadows) wasn’t the first AC game to use a non-native. Why in the living fuck would I say Black Flag was wrong in doing it when it’s the fact it did do it that I am using to show why I don’t have an issue with Yasuke, who is also non-native, being a playable lead in Shadows?!

And don’t bring up Nioh, because you conveniently never mentioned it until now and anyone capable of following a person’s argument could tell when I say, “where was the outrage?”, I am not genuinely wanting outrage, I am saying if there is no outrage for Nioh then there should be none for AC Shadows.

I did not change my argument, that was my argument, I am laughing at your posts because you are conveniently avoiding quoting my original post because I suspect deep down you know your statements are full of bullshit to the highest degree.

You think you can just accuse someone of saying something they clearly did not say on a forum of all things, where we can clearly see everyone’s posts, and think you can away with such a ridiculous stunt? Sorry, chief, that’s a swing and a miss on your end.

 

[Laptop1991]

WHERE?! Use the fucking quote feature and show me on my original post where I said that. Because this is my original post since you are apparently incapable of using a basic forum feature.



All I said was a FACTUAL STATEMENT that this (Shadows) wasn’t the first AC game to use a non-native. Why in the living fuck would I say Black Flag was wrong in doing it when it’s the fact it did do it that I am using to show why I don’t have an issue with Yasuke, who is also non-native, being a playable lead in Shadows?!

And don’t bring up Nioh, because you conveniently never mentioned it until now and anyone capable of following a person’s argument could tell when I say, “where was the outrage?”, I am not genuinely wanting outrage, I am saying if there is no outrage for Nioh then there should be none for AC Shadows.

I did not change my argument, that was my argument, I am laughing at your posts because you are conveniently avoiding quoting my original post because I suspect deep down you know your statements are full of bullshit to the highest degree.

You think you can just accuse someone of saying something they clearly did not say on a forum of all things, where we can clearly see everyone’s posts, and think you can away with such a ridiculous stunt? Sorry, chief, that’s a swing and a miss on your end.

I quoted the post and i showed you what you said, i don't care about your DEI opinion, you shouldn't have used it as a one of your points as you are wrong, on that point. story end of!.

Back to the laughing emoj i see lol

 

[Doom85]

I quoted the post and i showed you what you said, i don't care about your DEI opinion, you shouldn't have used it as a one of your points as you are wrong, on that point. story end of!.

Back to the laughing emoj i see lol

Wow, real mature. Falsely claim I said something I clearly never said, I demand proof, you deflect and dig in deeper, I show my original post demanding you to show exactly where the statement was that you claimed I made, and you deflect again by going, “whatever, I don’t care about your DEI opinion, durp dee durp!!!”

Oh yeah, you really don’t care about my opinion, that’s why you’ve been responding to it for five times now.

Remember, folks, when you try to convince yourselves that the anti-woke don’t have people full of nonsense like the woke do, we’ve got this guy as a helpful reminder.

Welcome to the ignore party, clown. And no more laughs for you after that, now you get the, “I just feel sorry for someone like you” emoji.

 

[Laptop1991]

Wow, real mature. Falsely claim I said something I clearly never said, I demand proof, you deflect and dig in deeper, I show my original post demanding you to show exactly where the statement was that you claimed I made, and you deflect again by going, “whatever, I don’t care about your DEI opinion, durp dee durp!!!”

Oh yeah, you really don’t care about my opinion, that’s why you’ve been responding to it for five times now.

Remember, folks, when you try to convince yourselves that the anti-woke don’t have people full of nonsense like the woke do, we’ve got this guy as a helpful reminder.

Welcome to the ignore party, clown. And no more laughs for you after that, now you get the, “I just feel sorry for someone like you” emoji.

Yeah ok mate lol

 

[diffusionx]

It isn’t the first game to have a foreigner to its setting, bruh, we flat out have been talking about Black Flag!

[/QUOTE]

Black Flag is a pirate game, you play as a pirate.

So basically the typical, “I can criticize all female/non-white/non-straight characters” stance because you dislike people’s personal politics. I do not give a fuck about their personal politics unless they are genuinely harming people or some shit like that. The so-called culture war is fucking idiotic on both ends, but I wouldn’t not buy a game from either side as long as it interested me and they aren’t hurting anybody.

Also, the marketing team is not the development team. I agree that ad was fucking stupid, but you can’t put that on the developers.

You're generalizing just like the other guy, I am not criticizing anyone or anything, I am saying what obviously happened with this game and how we ended up in this situation with this game.

Whether or not you think the culture war is idiotic is irrelevant, it's a real thing. Blizzard literally has a DEI scoring system they use when they make characters. Ubisoft literally has a webpage where diversity is "the heart of what they do", including making their "gaming experiences push representation forward." At some point you have to take these people at their word, and assume that what they say has an influence on how they make their games. It's not "anti woke" or "culture war" or whatever to say thhat Ubisoft pushes "representation" in their games, it's just statign a fact based on what they themselves say.

Diversity, Inclusion and Accessibility | Ubisoft

Learn more about how we are putting D&I at the heart of everything we do with a focus on colleagues, content, culture and community.

www.ubisoft.com

King's Diversity Space Tool: A Leap Forward for Inclusion In Gaming

Activision Blizzard has released a blog detailing their Diversity Space Tool: a new system for character design which translates elements of diversity into character attributes to facilitate more diverse character narratives.

www.wowhead.com

 

[Doom85]

I can’t quote you because you messed it up so it messes up when I quote you, so bear with me:

-I meant setting as in the location, that should have been obvious. The setting of Shadows is not samurai or ninja, it’s Japan.

-oh, trust me, I know it’s real (I just think the name is fucking stupid, shows how egotistical most folks invested on either side are to consider this worthy of being called a “war”), that doesn’t make it any less idiotic from both ends as far as I’m concerned. I’m sure certain developers out there let their anti-woke stance influence their decision in making a white male(s) their lead, you’d be naive to believe that’s not the case, but as long as the game isn’t saying anything legit harmful and the developers aren’t legit hurting anyone, I’d be open to playing it if it looks fun and interesting. It would be nice and a whole lot less over-dramatic if everyone could have that approach, and yet, here we are.

The fact is I like almost all the characters in Overwatch to this day. I did not give a shit about the characters for Concord because the art design and such for them was weak as fuck and the gameplay looked rough. I do not care about the making, I care about the finished product. It’s like when Jerry Seinfeld mentioned, “why does the pilot feel the need to tell the whole plane all the routes and ascents and descents he’s making? I’m just looking at my ticket thinking, ‘sir, just get me to the destination, that’s all I’m worried about.’”

 

[ZVWQP-9B8TM-VH9CT]

What a load of nonsense from you as usual,

Don't forget, as he claims, he "doesn't care about this topic and he is objective". It's only a coincidence that he always sticks into these topics lie flies stick to shit.

 

[Doom85]

Don't forget, as he claims, he "doesn't care about this topic and he is objective". It's only a coincidence that he always sticks into these topics lie flies stick to shit.

Bruh, A) kind of creepy you claim to know my behavior since I don’t recall speaking to you once, and B) you’re talking to someone who openly lied for everyone to see about a specific thing I said. You really trying to call me the liar here in this specific conversation? Oh, yeah, that’s not fucking delusional.

If you don’t have anything better in your measly 200 something posts after a year here to say than baselessly attacking people who clearly were in the right in the conversation, maybe don’t say anything at all. Or maybe you can go back to my original post* and find this mystical sentence where I apparently claimed that the Black Flag lead character not being local to the region was wrong, since Laptop1991 constantly claimed I said it yet even when I did the work for him and put my original quote right in front of him and asked him to show me where I said that, he failed to do so and deflected, pretty fucking basic behavior as to be expected.

*it’s right here. Go ahead, DO IT, actually back up your high and mighty attitude, pal.

A) this isn’t even the first AC game to feature a character not native to the region, there was Black Flag and B) again, Nioh 1, where was the massive outrage with that game? Hell, they even changed his ethnicity in that game (the real William was English, but the Nioh version is Irish).

If there was any indication of a Japanese Viking, that would be fine by me. And again though, it’s a series with lighting-blasting Popes, Medusa, Valhalla as an actual location, time travel, Ilumanti aliens bullshit, this wasn’t your high school history textbook to begin with.

Point it out to me. Show me where I said the lead of Black Flag not being local to the region was wrong. Go ahead, hit me with your best shot, since you seem so confident and everything,

You’re not doing yourself any favors siding with someone who flat out lies about what other people say and is so stubborn they won’t admit to lying even when put in a corner. Don’t try your weakass attack on my character by siding with someone who behaves like Laptop1991.

 

[ZVWQP-9B8TM-VH9CT]

Bruh, A) kind of creepy you claim to know my behavior since I don’t recall speaking to you once, and B) you’re talking to someone who openly lied for everyone to see about a specific thing I said. You really trying to call me the liar here in this specific conversation? Oh, yeah, that’s not fucking delusional.

If you don’t have anything better in your measly 200 something posts after a year here to say than baselessly attacking people who clearly were in the right in the conversation, maybe don’t say anything at all. Or maybe you can go back to my original post* and find this mystical sentence where I apparently claimed that the Black Flag lead character not being local to the region was wrong, since Laptop1991 constantly claimed I said it yet even when I did the work for him and put my original quote right in front of him and asked him to show me where I said that, he failed to do so and deflected, pretty fucking basic behavior as to be expected.

*it’s right here. Go ahead, DO IT, actually back up your high and mighty attitude, pal.



Point it out to me. Show me where I said the lead of Black Flag not being local to the region was wrong. Go ahead, hit me with your best shot, since you seem so confident and everything,

You’re not doing yourself any favors siding with someone who flat out lies about what other people say and is so stubborn they won’t admit to lying even when put in a corner. Don’t try your weakass attack on my character by siding with someone who behaves like Laptop1991.

He didn't quote you ffs. I was referring to another user.

 

[Doom85]

He didn't quote you ffs. I was referring to another user.

Hey, fair enough. That was legit my bad. Sorry about that.

See, unlike Laptop, I can admit when I fucked up.

 

[Laptop1991]

Hey, fair enough. That was legit my bad. Sorry about that.

See, unlike Laptop, I can admit when I fucked up.

your still wrong no matter what digs you come out with, i thought you put me on ignore lol

 

[The Mad Draklor]

your still wrong no matter what digs you come out with, i thought you put me on ignore lol

Don't forget, as he claims, he "doesn't care about this topic and he is objective". It's only a coincidence that he always sticks into these topics lie flies stick to shit.

His lack of consistency and well... lack of intelligence is why his posts are unserious and should be treated as such. This isn't the first meltdown he's had. This thread was a fun revisit considering this was way before Star Wars Outlaws flopped and AC Shadows got clowned on some more before it got delayed.

 

[mitch1971]

The full video of that is piss funny.

 

[Doom85]

His lack of consistency and well... lack of intelligence is why his posts are unserious and should be treated as such. This isn't the first meltdown he's had. This thread was a fun revisit considering this was way before Star Wars Outlaws flopped and AC Shadows got clowned on some more before it got delayed.

Again, who was lying in this thread? Laptop made a baseless accusation, and I called them out, and they never proved their accusation even when I did all the fucking work and laid my original quote out before them and told them to point out exactly where I said the thing they were accusing me of saying. YOU are the one who has a lack of intelligence if you just blindly follow those with similar beliefs without taking each case into individual account. The fact you and the others aren’t addressing that and you in particular are trying to bring a completely different thread into this speaks volumes. When called out on bullshit, people like you all deflect and bring up other things without actually addressing the original issue because you all know you have Jack and shit to say and you’re too stubbornly arrogant to admit it.

Anyone who blindly agrees with someone who is clearly making false accusations is the actual clown, so I suggest you wisen the fuck up.

Also, apparently Laptop thinks nothing of you considering he mocks people who use the laughing emoji on posts they don’t agree with, which YOU have done to most of my posts. So way to stand behind someone who is actually mocking you intentionally or not.

 

[EDMIX]

your still wrong no matter what digs you come out with, i thought you put me on ignore lol

lol nah, I don't think you should have been making some of theses claims, just quote what people are saying.

Stop making up imaginary arguments lol

I have nothing against your points, but shit man, read what is being stated as even when you tried to edit some of your post, they still make wild claims about a user saying this or that and its like....we can fucking read the post sir, why make something up that can be quoted? lol

I think you just assumed an argument and went with it tbh. I have nothing against ACIV or Valhalla's characters, in fact they are used as examples to show that clearly they've had titles where a character not native to the setting exist, thats it. To say such weird absolutes like "you said" or this or that is wild lol

" i didn't say there wern't any black pirates, you said i said that."

Its like...sir, where? Who is saying anything remotely like this?

You think you can just accuse someone of saying something they clearly did not say on a forum of all things

I don't even know why one would do something so weird lol I think he just saw the part of the post and just went on triggered auto pilot or some shit lol

I am saying if there is no outrage for Nioh then there should be none for AC Shadows.

I agree, but I feel if you release many games from the past, you'd get a different reaction now vs back then. Even when Laptop states

if they had made Black Flag with a black protag first, it would have been as ridiculous as Shadows and would of got the same response Shadows has.

Its like, i'm not sure. I think at release, as in if this released 2013, I don't know if anyone really would care tbh, I think if released TODAY, yes, you'd get folks merely echoing what is being stated with Shadows, I don't agree with really any of it as, its a video game, its fake, none of those titles is like a non-fiction type thing, but my opinion of saying there should not be outrage, isn't the same as a prediction if someone would be triggered or not lol

I think back then, they could have done that and I don't really buy that anyone would care, I think that is a climate that is more so happening today vs back then.

I mean, Nioh literally fucking has the very character some of you are crying over and I don't see any thread questioning him existing in that game as some wild outrage.

Now if Nioh 1-2 FIRST released 2025, has Yasuke, I think many people would assume its because of some DEI thing or agenda or something like this.

Anyone who blindly agrees with someone who is clearly making false accusations is the actual clown

This.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

Again, who was lying in this thread? Laptop made a baseless accusation, and I called them out, and they never proved their accusation even when I did all the fucking work and laid my original quote out before them and told them to point out exactly where I said the thing they were accusing me of saying. YOU are the one who has a lack of intelligence if you just blindly follow those with similar beliefs without taking each case into individual account. The fact you and the others aren’t addressing that and you in particular are trying to bring a completely different thread into this speaks volumes. When called out on bullshit, people like you all deflect and bring up other things without actually addressing the original issue because you all know you have Jack and shit to say and you’re too stubbornly arrogant to admit it.

Anyone who blindly agrees with someone who is clearly making false accusations is the actual clown, so I suggest you wisen the fuck up.

Also, apparently Laptop thinks nothing of you considering he mocks people who use the laughing emoji on posts they don’t agree with, which YOU have done to most of my posts. So way to stand behind someone who is actually mocking you intentionally or not.

LOL, here's to you having another meltdown.

 

[Doom85]

LOL, here's to you having another meltdown.

LOL, here’s to you and your friends being disingenuous and using nothing but lies and misdirection to protect yourself.
LOL at “meltdown”, oh right, people should just be calm when someone repeatedly lies about what they said and they and two other parrots, I mean people, just squawk, I mean repeat, the nothing arguments they make without actually pointing to my original quote that I have laid out before you multiple times and show me where I made this supposed statement that Laptop accused me of saying.

It’s honestly pathetic. Like, do you clowns know how a trial works for example? If a party is accused of something and then fails to provide evidence supporting said accusation, they can’t just resort to deflection and cheap ass attacks on one’s character to substitute the lack of evidence.

Disprove me about my original statement and Laptop’s accusation. Go on, DO IT. Otherwise, it proves how pathetically scared you two are to actually face a legit argument you can’t win.

 

[Edgelord79]

None of this is a surprise if one has read any history about Japan and their culture.

This really should have been anticipated by their consultants and they should have been warned about pushing the envelope with a traditional culture like Japans. Those is a colossal screw up.

Some cultures have more “flexibility” on how their history and culture is portrayed. Japanese culture is not one of those.

 

[EDMIX]

None of this is a surprise if one has read any history about Japan and their culture.

This really should have been anticipated by their consultants and they should have been warned about pushing the envelope with a traditional culture like Japans. Those is a colossal screw up.

Some cultures have more “flexibility” on how their history and culture is portrayed. Japanese culture is not one of those.

Exactly, they should have looked at Nioh series from japan to see what they can and can't do, its lik.....oh wait.....

I mean, if anything Ubisoft should have looked at how Japan treats the Dynasty Warriors and Samurai Warrior's series

https://www.koeitecmoamerica.com/sw5/character/character26.html

lolz, I kid, but shit, I don't really know if this is as big of a deal as many are wildly exaggerating it to be. I mean, the above design has him with like a tribal type outfit with braids, is this really 100% what he looked like in real life? maybe not, outrage? nahhh this is a fake game.

They are free to interpret this person how they feel just, I don't see why it would matter that Ubisoft is doing it and suddenly now being offended by some shit no one was offended from prior, even the very Japanese that did this in their own works.



Japan is so loose with how they have their history told, they'll take figures from history and have them in Hentai's sir....

Some cultures have more “flexibility” on how their history and culture is portrayed. Japanese culture is not one of those.

.......also Japan lol

Guess which one is Nobunaga lol

Someone can take this deeply and seriously, i don't disregard that as anyone can be offended by something, but the exaggeration of what Japan is offended by is a bit extreme here, what evidence does anyone actually have that as a whole, this is something Japan doesn't alter, charge or play with in vulgar ways? As someone that reads manga and watches lots of Anime, I'd argue Japan if anything is more loose and open to this then most.

 

[Laptop1991]

lol nah, I don't think you should have been making some of theses claims, just quote what people are saying.

Stop making up imaginary arguments lol

I have nothing against your points, but shit man, read what is being stated as even when you tried to edit some of your post, they still make wild claims about a user saying this or that and its like....we can fucking read the post sir, why make something up that can be quoted? lol

I think you just assumed an argument and went with it tbh. I have nothing against ACIV or Valhalla's characters, in fact they are used as examples to show that clearly they've had titles where a character not native to the setting exist, thats it. To say such weird absolutes like "you said" or this or that is wild lol

" i didn't say there wern't any black pirates, you said i said that."

Its like...sir, where? Who is saying anything remotely like this?

I don't even know why one would do something so weird lol I think he just saw the part of the post and just went on triggered auto pilot or some shit lol


I agree, but I feel if you release many games from the past, you'd get a different reaction now vs back then. Even when Laptop states



Its like, i'm not sure. I think at release, as in if this released 2013, I don't know if anyone really would care tbh, I think if released TODAY, yes, you'd get folks merely echoing what is being stated with Shadows, I don't agree with really any of it as, its a video game, its fake, none of those titles is like a non-fiction type thing, but my opinion of saying there should not be outrage, isn't the same as a prediction if someone would be triggered or not lol

I think back then, they could have done that and I don't really buy that anyone would care, I think that is a climate that is more so happening today vs back then.

I mean, Nioh literally fucking has the very character some of you are crying over and I don't see any thread questioning him existing in that game as some wild outrage.

Now if Nioh 1-2 FIRST released 2025, has Yasuke, I think many people would assume its because of some DEI thing or agenda or something like this.

This.

Okay I'll make a point

Who are these indigenous people that he was referring to, the black people brought to Nassau by the British as part of the slave trade that we all know is wrong now!, no they are not.

Nassau and Jamaica etc were British colonies under British rule. It was Britain

Even after the British Pirates and Ship captains broke with Britain in Nassau they were still in charge, they were still British

So who are the foreigners in Nassau, It's the black people brought over from Africa, against their will as slaves, not the British, the British were there long before,

As for any actual indigenous people, if there was any, they weren't black and were wiped out long before the events and time we are talking about, and Nassau isn't that big of an island, so could of just been empty,

So he is still wrong claiming Edward Kenway doesn't belong there and wasn't a local and Black Flag had a foreign protaganist, He was in Britain.

Spain did the same at that time as well.

And your the one who starts laughing at people ED, when you don't agree with opinions or facts lol, and I quoted Doom 95 not you.

Update, there you go same response lol

 

[EDMIX]

Who are these indigenous people that he was referring to,

Thats something you have to take up with him lol I can't speak for him as i'm not sure why you'd ask me tbh.

That doesn't change the point btw that your statement is false.

" i didn't say there wern't any black pirates, you said i said that."

Nothing like this was stated, stick to what we are actually posting man..

And your the one who starts laughing at people ED

lolz and? I'm not making up entire claims of what you are stating or not or something. I'm just replying based on factually what you are saying, I do my best not to assume and only address what you are saying.

Stop this weird making up whole claims or something.

So he is still wrong claiming Edward Kenway doesn't belong there

That sounds like something you can take up with him..

I personally haven no issue with him being there, as someone from a different land going to a different setting isn't some wild concept in gaming, I'm fine with that, I'm fine with AC Valhalla, I'm fine with AC Shadows....

As for any actual indigenous people, if there was any, they weren't black and were wiped out long before

I see...so...lets look this up before posting as you'd think this whole thing with making up claims would have made you more careful on saying such wild absolutes

So, just so you understand, The Taíno people still live in Haiti, want to know how I know?

I'm fucking Haitian..... many in my family are Taíno and a few of my friends from the DR are also Taíno. So we know of this mixture of natives and slaves cause it literally the history of my people.

Regardless, they could had the game about a slave, about a native or about a nomad from a different land, all those things are ok, its a fake game... No where in any of my statements am I arguing against including anyone, lots of different demographics existed during this time and you could have easily had a story where a native is taking back their land from pirates who are invading and needing to take on their ways to defeat them ala beating fire with fire etc

Any of those stories fit, it would be weird to even have a mindset that makes it seem as if ONLY 1 DEMOGRAPHIC could be the main character in that situation. Depends on the story and many different stories could be made up for ACIV and even as a Haitian, I take zero offensive, I love ACIV and never seen it as "OMG WOOOOOW IT MUUUUUUST have a Native" or anything of the sort.


Its their game, their story. I think any demographic we've talked about thus far is fine to be in ACIV as clearly many demographics existed, why should that be limited when you know the islands had many different people?

 

[Laptop1991]

Thats something you have to take up with him lol I can't speak for him as i'm not sure why you'd ask me tbh.

That doesn't change the point btw that your statement is false.

" i didn't say there wern't any black pirates, you said i said that."

Nothing like this was stated, stick to what we are actually posting man..

lolz and? I'm not making up entire claims of what you are stating or not or something. I'm just replying based on factually what you are saying, I do my best not to assume and only address what you are saying.

Stop this weird making up whole claims or something.


That sounds like something you can take up with him..

I personally haven no issue with him being there, as someone from a different land going to a different setting isn't some wild concept in gaming, I'm fine with that, I'm fine with AC Valhalla, I'm fine with AC Shadows....


I see...so...lets look this up before posting as you'd think this whole thing with making up claims would have made you more careful on saying such wild absolutes

So, just so you understand, The Taíno people still live in Haiti, want to know how I know?

I'm fucking Haitian..... many in my family are Taíno and a few of my friends from the DR are also Taíno. So we know of this mixture of natives and slaves cause it literally the history of my people.

Regardless, they could had the game about a slave, about a native or about a nomad from a different land, all those things are ok, its a fake game... No where in any of my statements am I arguing against including anyone, lots of different demographics existed during this time and you could have easily had a story where a native is taking back their land from pirates who are invading and needing to take on their ways to defeat them ala beating fire with fire etc

Any of those stories fit, it would be weird to even have a mindset that makes it seem as if ONLY 1 DEMOGRAPHIC could be the main character in that situation. Depends on the story and many different stories could be made up for ACIV and even as a Haitian, I take zero offensive, I love ACIV and never seen it as "OMG WOOOOOW IT MUUUUUUST have a Native" or anything of the sort.


Its their game, their story. I think any demographic we've talked about thus far is fine to be in ACIV as clearly many demographics existed, why should that be limited when you know the islands had many different people?

Your digressing and cherry picking points

I said there were no native ship captains, i never said there were no black pirates which is still true, and they wern't natives anyway,

so what your Haitian, we are not talking about Haiti, we are talking about Nassau at the time of the golden age of the pirates of the Caribbean, so what i've said is true,

and i did take it up with him and you inserted yourself into the debate with your irrelevant points because they don't fit your viewpoint or agenda,

I'm not backing down about a single thing i've posted, keep laughing!.

 

[The Mad Draklor]

LOL, here’s to you and your friends being disingenuous and using nothing but lies and misdirection to protect yourself.
LOL at “meltdown”, oh right, people should just be calm when someone repeatedly lies about what they said and they and two other parrots, I mean people, just squawk, I mean repeat, the nothing arguments they make without actually pointing to my original quote that I have laid out before you multiple times and show me where I made this supposed statement that Laptop accused me of saying.

It’s honestly pathetic. Like, do you clowns know how a trial works for example? If a party is accused of something and then fails to provide evidence supporting said accusation, they can’t just resort to deflection and cheap ass attacks on one’s character to substitute the lack of evidence.

Disprove me about my original statement and Laptop’s accusation. Go on, DO IT. Otherwise, it proves how pathetically scared you two are to actually face a legit argument you can’t win.

LOL, there you go again continuing with your meltdown. Go ahead, make another wall of text because I didn't bother reading any of them.

 

[EDMIX]

I said there were no native ship captains, i never said there were no black pirates which is still true,

ok, I never made any claim that you stated otherwise. Where did i state this? Soooooo you are greatly either misinterpreting what is being stated or lying or something, but quote the exact thing that was said as I never say anything about you saying anything even remotely like this.

so what your Haitian, we are not talking about Haiti,

This is relevant cause Haiti is still in the Caribbean, it still has native people and a game could have made made using any of that information.

and i did take it up with him and you inserted yourself into the debate

lol i don't care, post what you wish regarding the user you are talking about lol

Anyone is free to comment on here..

I'm not backing down about a single thing i've posted, keep laughing!.

You fight waaaaay too much man. lol

I'm fine with Edward, i'm ok with Valhalla, I'm ok with Shadows...

I don't understand what you are upset over as anything you are saying that supports Edward being in the game isn't being debated by me. I'm ok with all of it, I think you are assuming any response that isn't agreeing with you, is seeking to fight with you or something weird like this.....


So Edward is fine in ACIV, they can do it about a slave, they can do it about a native, I see nothing wrong in all of those options and the fucking game is literally about my people and even I'm open to all of those different takes

Lighten up Laptop lol this is just a game and not every person commenting is seeking to fight you or something

 

[Laptop1991]

His lack of consistency and well... lack of intelligence is why his posts are unserious and should be treated as such. This isn't the first meltdown he's had. This thread was a fun revisit considering this was way before Star Wars Outlaws flopped and AC Shadows got clowned on some more before it got delayed.

I see what you mean, it's identical with both of them lol

 

[EDMIX]

I see what you mean, it's identical with both of them lol

nah, I think you are just triggered cause we are asking for quotes of things you can't provide lol

Stop making up claims to fight man, nothing here is this serious to be making up whole arguing points about multiple users and then getting mad when we are asking to post exact what is being stated.

 

[Laptop1991]

ok, I never made any claim that you stated otherwise. Where did i state this? Soooooo you are greatly either misinterpreting what is being stated or lying or something, but quote the exact thing that was said as I never say anything about you saying anything even remotely like this.



This is relevant cause Haiti is still in the Caribbean, it still has native people and a game could have made made using any of that information.



lol i don't care, post what you wish regarding the user you are talking about lol

Anyone is free to comment on here..



You fight waaaaay too much man. lol

I'm fine with Edward, i'm ok with Valhalla, I'm ok with Shadows...

I don't understand what you are upset over as anything you are saying that supports Edward being in the game isn't being debated by me. I'm ok with all of it, I think you are assuming any response that isn't agreeing with you, is seeking to fight with you or something weird like this.....


So Edward is fine in ACIV, they can do it about a slave, they can do it about a native, I see nothing wrong in all of those options and the fucking game is literally about my people and even I'm open to all of those different takes

Lighten up Laptop lol this is just a game and not every person commenting is seeking to fight you or something

I'm fine mate i don't need to lighten up, no Haiti wasn't under British rule was it, that was Spain then France, not the same thing at all and i merely pointed out to Doom 95, that he was wrong to say Blag Flag had a foreign protaganist, it didn't, and i'm not fighting just sticking to the truth.

You could lighten up yourself lol

 

[Doom85]

LOL, there you go again continuing with your meltdown. Go ahead, make another wall of text because I didn't bother reading any of them.

Got you, you’re a troll, who never had anything of value to say in the first place. Checks out.

 

[Laptop1991]

nah, I think you are just triggered cause we are asking for quotes of things you can't provide lol

Stop making up claims to fight man, nothing here is this serious to be making up whole arguing points about multiple users and then getting mad when we are asking to post exact what is being stated.

You were acting the same in that thread, i've just read it lol

 

[EDMIX]

no Haiti wasn't under British rule was it

ok, i never say it is...

My point is that you could make a game about that.

Thats it.

he was wrong to say Blag Flag had a foreign protaganist,

I mean, technically it is, he is a Welsh person in the Caribbean, I'm not saying anything is wrong with this btw, I love the game, but explaining HOW he got there doesn't mean he is native, it just means you are telling us how he got to this place, that is ok btw, but that doesn't change what Doom is saying.

i'm not fighting just sticking to the truth.

nahh i greatly disagree, you are combative and seem to think any statement made is to debate some other thing... me saying Haiti had native people with slaves is not debating the comment you made about "British Rule"

its telling you a way exist to have ACIV have a story with a native, as Haiti exist, that is all, instead you seem to think almost any comment is some fight to defend or attack or something.

 

[Laptop1991]

ok, i never say it is...

My point is that you could make a game about that.

Thats it.



I mean, technically it is, he is a Welsh person in the Caribbean, I'm not saying anything is wrong with this btw, I love the game, but explaining HOW he got there doesn't mean he is native, it just means you are telling us how he got to this place, that is ok btw, but that doesn't change what Doom is saying.



nahh i greatly disagree, you are combative and seem to think any statement made is to debate some other thing... me saying Haiti had native people with slaves is not debating the comment you made about "British Rule"

its telling you a way exist to have ACIV have a story with a native, as Haiti exist, that is all, instead you seem to think almost any comment is some fight to defend or attack or something.

Agree with your first point as long as it's a good game,

Not with your last 2, Nassau was British for a long time and i've already pointed out the black people came from Africa afterwards by slavery, Kenway is British in Britain, and Wales wasn't separate at the time

I'm defending my views and historical facts that you have an issue with, that's not being combative, no matter what you type i'm not backing down to you on what i've said.

Update, i made you laugh again, your welcome lol

 

[EDMIX]

Kenway is British in Britain, and Wales wasn't separate at the time

...he is still not native to the Caribbean's and that is Doom's point btw

I'm defending my views and historical facts

I mean, how, you are disagreeing that the game is about a person not native to that land as ACIV is not about an indigenous Caribbean person

So yea, its funny to me cause you are trying your best to make that fit, but ACIV's character is not a native to the Caribbean's even slightly

Edward Kenway

Edward James Kenway (1693 – 1735) was a Welsh-born British privateer-turned-pirate and a member of the West Indies and British Brotherhoods of Assassins. He was the father of Haytham Kenway, the founder of the Colonial Rite of the Templar Order, and the grandfather of Ratonhnhaké:ton, a...

assassinscreed.fandom.com

His character apparently is born in what we'd know today as the UK

So..i don't know what to say, I disagree with Doom many times, but on this one, he is correct. I don't even know how one would disagree with him being not native, when the game itself states he is not born in the setting of the game.


So to be fair and to settle this, we can even just say, this is not the first time a AC game had a character, in a setting they were not born in...

Edward was not born in the Caribbean
Evor was not born in England or France etc
Yasuke was not born in Japan

I mean, i feel that is fair and regardless how you see Doom's points or even my points, we are simply stating this is not new to the AC IP to have character in a setting they are not directly from

 

[Laptop1991]

...he is still not native to the Caribbean's and that is Doom's point btw


I mean, how, you are disagreeing that the game is about a person not native to that land as ACIV is not about an indigenous Caribbean person

So yea, its funny to me cause you are trying your best to make that fit, but ACIV's character is not a native to the Caribbean's even slightly

Edward Kenway

Edward James Kenway (1693 – 1735) was a Welsh-born British privateer-turned-pirate and a member of the West Indies and British Brotherhoods of Assassins. He was the father of Haytham Kenway, the founder of the Colonial Rite of the Templar Order, and the grandfather of Ratonhnhaké:ton, a...

assassinscreed.fandom.com

His character apparently is born in what we'd know today as the UK

So..i don't know what to say, I disagree with Doom many times, but on this one, he is correct. I don't even know how one would disagree with him being not native, when the game itself states he is not born in the setting of the game.


So to be fair and to settle this, we can even just say, this is not the first time a AC game had a character, in a setting they were not born in...

Edward was not born in the Caribbean
Evor was not born in England or France etc
Yasuke was not born in Japan

I mean, i feel that is fair and regardless how you see Doom's points or even my points, we are simply stating this is not new to the AC IP to have character in a setting they are not directly from

So what he is a native of Britain, and parts of it were British, and there isn't a one nation Caribbean nation, certainly not back then and doesn't exist now, who's in charge of this all Caribbean nation,

No he is not he is wrong as what you have just said about the Caribbean is wrong. and you 2 agree a lot more than your admitting. and your just agreeing with him to cause an argument which is what you do a lot of the time, agree all you like, it doesn't matter to me.

 

[EDMIX]

So what he is a native of Britain, and parts of it were British, and there isn't a one nation Caribbean nation

yea, i'd say that is wildly stretching that. Put it this way, the game does not take place in a setting he was factually born in.....

Regardless of who ruled what, he still was born in a different location. I'm not debating you on if Britain occupied this place or something

No he is not he is wrong as what you have just said about the Caribbean is wrong

what specifically? like quote where you feel i'm wrong.

and you 2 agree a lot more than your admitting

well...not really lol Doom and I argue over lots of shit, but fuck many people do on here, you'll see me disagreeing with you here and agree with you else where, don't take it so personal as its not like i'm disagreeing with you on some personal level, we merely disagree on this topic bruv


Don't take it that serious as you'll find i rarely do even on the most heated debates lol

and your just agreeing with him to cause an argument

nahhh I don't even agree that Edward shouldn't be the main character, i think he is ok as the main character.

Look, we will agree and disagree on lots of things, but please reframe from making odd claims or stating anyone's intention, that should only be left up to each individual user

So because we debate on this thread or this topic, doesn't mean I'll disagree with you in all ways, in all threads or anything like this, just like Doom and I will disagree on lots of shit, but that is me with lots of users on here.

Its ok to disagree, I would never hold that against you on some personal level

 

[Laptop1991]

yea, i'd say that is wildly stretching that. Put it this way, the game does not take place in a setting he was factually born in.....

Regardless of who ruled what, he still was born in a different location. I'm not debating you on if Britain occupied this place or something


what specifically? like quote where you feel i'm wrong.


well...not really lol Doom and I argue over lots of shit, but fuck many people do on here, you'll see me disagreeing with you here and agree with you else where, don't take it so personal as its not like i'm disagreeing with you on some personal level, we merely disagree on this topic bruv


Don't take it that serious as you'll find i rarely do even on the most heated debates lol



nahhh I don't even agree that Edward shouldn't be the main character, i think he is ok as the main character.

Look, we will agree and disagree on lots of things, but please reframe from making odd claims or stating anyone's intention, that should only be left up to each individual user

So because we debate on this thread or this topic, doesn't mean I'll disagree with you in all ways, in all threads or anything like this, just like Doom and I will disagree on lots of shit, but that is me with lots of users on here.

Its ok to disagree, I would never hold that against you on some personal level

You claimed or implied Kenway is not a native of the Caribbean, so therefore not a local but an outsider, and Jamaica and Nassau were totally British so he is not an outsider, fact, but the Caribbean is made up of various countries and historical influences and isn't just one country, you know fine well what i mean't, the rest of your points are nonsense.

 

[EDMIX]

You claimed or implied Kenway is not a native of the Caribbean, so therefore not a local but an outsider, and Jamaica and Nassau were totally British so he is not an outsider, fact, but the Caribbean is made up of various countries and historical influences and isn't just one country, you know fine well what i mean't, the rest of your points are nonsense.

I mean, this can't be true as the basic definition of this term doesn't mean this.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/native

I'm not claiming he is not born there btw, i'm factually telling you the game tells us he is not born in the setting of the game.

We generally do not use that term based on occupation or military rule etc

As in, I was born in America (well Florida, its a separate thing lol) when I go overseas, I don't tell people I'm native american, that makes no sense and my answer can simply be "Well American is totally American, thus I'm not an outsider, thus I'm native" or anything weird like this.

I'm sorry man, he wasn't born in the setting of the game, this really can't be a point to even be fighting over as factually, he is not born in the place the game takes place in...

So how can be native when he is from what we know today as the UK?

https://assassinscreed.fandom.com/wiki/Edward_Kenway
^ it shows he isn't born in the Caribbean btw.

 

[Laptop1991]

I mean, this can't be true as the basic definition of this term doesn't mean this.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/native

I'm not claiming he is not born there btw, i'm factually telling you the game tells us he is not born in the setting of the game.

We generally do not use that term based on occupation or military rule etc

As in, I was born in America (well Florida, its a separate thing lol) when I go overseas, I don't tell people I'm native american, that makes no sense and my answer can simply be "Well American is totally American, thus I'm not an outsider, thus I'm native" or anything weird like this.

I'm sorry man, he wasn't born in the setting of the game, this really can't be a point to even be fighting over as factually, he is not born in the place the game takes place in...

So how can be native when he is from what we know today as the UK?

https://assassinscreed.fandom.com/wiki/Edward_Kenway
^ it shows he isn't born in the Caribbean btw.

I'm born in England which is part of Britain so i'm both English and British, my Dad was also Irish so i am an automatic Irish Citizen as well, it doesn't matter where you are born if the different land masses are part of one nation that's what you are, and your American then with an automatic passport and citizenship not Haitian, although your family come from there i'm guessing.

 

[EDMIX]

I'm born in England which is part of Britain so i'm both English and British, my Dad was also Irish so i am an automatic Irish Citizen as well, it doesn't matter where you are born if the different land masses are part of one nation

ok, but we are not saying Edward not a citizen of this or that or if he part this or that or something.


He was born in England

He was not born in the Caribbean's and he is not a Caribbean native anymore then I'm a native America and i was literally born in American and i'd never say something odd like this.

So, i'm not debating his citizenship, nationality or if this place was occupied by Britain .

Very plainly, he was born in England, he factually is not a native Caribbean or anything like this.

So the place he is born, is not the setting of the game. No matter how you feel about those terms, who ruled what etc We don't really even use those terms to describe that btw as most people use the term native, like you are from the people that originally are from that place, they are not really talking about nationality, citizenship etc

 

[Laptop1991]

ok, but we are not saying Edward not a citizen of this or that or if he part this or that or something.


He was born in England

He was not born in the Caribbean's and he is not a Caribbean native anymore then I'm a native America and i was literally born in American and i'd never say something odd like this.

So, i'm not debating his citizenship, nationality or if this place was occupied by Britain .

Very plainly, he was born in England, he factually is not a native Caribbean or anything like this.

He was born in Wales not England but is British legally and the nation was called Britain! so in Nassau or Jamaica they were British, and that's back then over 300 years ago there was no such thing as a Caribbean native, that's what you are saying now, because of your personal bias, your ancestors were under Span then France back then aswell also, you can't judge the past by now.

So are you American, you didn't answer.

 

[EDMIX]

He was born in Wales not England but is British legally

Thats ok, he is still not born in the Caribbean.

ACIV's states this so...yea.

Edward Kenway

Edward James Kenway (1693 – 1735) was a Welsh-born British privateer-turned-pirate and a member of the West Indies and British Brotherhoods of Assassins. He was the father of Haytham Kenway, the founder of the Colonial Rite of the Templar Order, and the grandfather of Ratonhnhaké:ton, a...

assassinscreed.fandom.com

Put it like this, he was not born in the setting of the game....