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[CSJ]

Shouldn't matter really and should apply in any direction. You should not have a wall there and today's accident is the reason why. Any emergency and a plane might need a bit of extra room to make a safe landing. I'm sure these people live if that wall wasn't there.

Exactly, runway excursions are the most frequent landing accident and the airfield is built for use of landing and take-off on both sides too, by obvious evidence of having eyes.

Thing is, in a lot of incidents once the plane departs the runway tarmac, it will slow down a lot quicker in soft ground but in this case, there was a giant fucking concrete+steel(?) reinforced earth mound blocking the way (such a fucking idiotic design btw)
I guarantee you it's getting removed and replaced with concrete anchors under the ground with heightened struts.

It had plenty of free room to depart the airfield and slide on, yeah - there may have been casualities on the road with cars.
Also I understand it didn't have it's gear down to dig into the ground either.

Example here https://asn.flightsafety.org/wikibase/346271 it took an additional 830ft to come to a stop after leaving the end of the runway after a belly landing, went right through the localizer antennas because they weren't affixed to what was basically an immovable object.

 

[daffyduck]

…
I guarantee you it's getting removed and replaced with concrete anchors under the ground with heightened struts.
…

That one airport will almost certainly be forced to do so, but how many other Korean airports use a similar structure?

 

[Tams]

That one airport will almost certainly be forced to do so, but how many other Korean airports use a similar structure?

Apparently it was because of typhoons, so the question is, what is the practice in most of East Asia and SE Asia?

I'm only really familiar with Japan, and I can't think of a single airport there that raises their ILS like that.

 

[vpance]

They can put any concrete structure underground to support the antennae. Raising it up to avoid water levels doesn't require a hill either.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

I'm amazed the plane held up until it hit the obstruction. Would have thought the runway would have ripped the bottom apart but it seemed pretty sturdy until the other impact.

They are designed to be able to do that, the fuselage has reinforced plates on the bottom.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

Lots of misinformation on this page. First of all its an older 737, has nothing to do with the current Boeing situation of the MAX fleet. Second, it was primarily a bird strike. While not fatal by itself, can cause issues. I see some people, say they "forgot" to put out their landing gear which I think is a joke. No pilot will forget literally the one thing they do on a daily basis. We dont know yet why, maybe malfunction, maybe too high of a speed for them to open, either way they had sufficient fuel in them which will always cause a fireball. Scrapping against the ground and only one spark and tilt was always goign to end in a disaster. We had one similar a few days ago and half the peiople survived, that wall in Jeju is the biggest puzzle as why in the world are those tiny skinny antennas mounted on such a huge concrete wall when most of the world has them just hanging out of the ground.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

I'm amazed the plane held up until it hit the obstruction. Would have thought the runway would have ripped the bottom apart but it seemed pretty sturdy until the other impact.

Plenty of footage online airplanes landing without landing gear and surviving. Planes are sturdier than people think, same as their wings can literally bend 45* which means pointing upwards in an extreme turbulence and still not break off. Problem here was that wall but also, if one of the engines is off center when landing, as you can see, it will completely hault the whole aircraft and spiral out of control into pieces.

 

[Puscifer]

Boeing is on a roll with me not wanting to fly these days. Dunno, I got over my fear of flying 10 years ago and enjoyed it immensely but I can't deny that flying just doesn't feel right and I can't be the only one right?

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

I will never understand why runways don't have a long stretch AFTER the original runway to account for these sorts of situations. Yes, they're rare, but it's better safe than sorry.

When airports are built they are built for their time and capacity. Runways ARE longer than they should be, there is a clear cut off point until which an aircraft could take-off last minute and until which spot they are allowed to touch down before it becomes too late to stop. When theres a catastrophic emergency, not much you can do about it, you are reacting and making hard decisions in seconds. If they extended it even more, then one day an aircraft would crash past that point and someone will say, well why not extend even further etc. We cant go indefinately and these things cost money and land and operational costs.

 

[AeonGaidenRaiden]

Boeing is on a roll with me not wanting to fly these days. Dunno, I got over my fear of flying 10 years ago and enjoyed it immensely but I can't deny that flying just doesn't feel right and I can't be the only one right?

Dude forget about the media BS and parrot mentality where everyone repeats the same thing without having a clue. Was there issues with the new 737? Absolutely but doesnt mean the whole fleet of all Boeing is now unhinged plus this is a way older 737 which doesnt have anything to do with the current lineup. Trust me, no airline would just stand by and let their aircrafts fall out of the sky. It only took 2 737 Max to crash for Boeing literally to almost go bankrupt. They fucked up but they sure as hell wont allow it to happen again because they know they could just be gone as a company.

Enjoy your flights, planes are safer than any other transportation in the world. It doesnt matter the company, just travel worry free. For reference, if people think this only happens to "Boeing" or that their planes are "metal coffins", feel free to check this link. There are daily accidents of all aircraft types and plenty Airbus too. They just arnt as big to make it on daily news:

Aviation Safety Network > > ASN Aviation Safety Database results

Aviation Safety Network: Aviation Safety Network: Databases containing descriptions of over 11000 airliner write-offs, hijackings and military aircraft accidents.

asn.flightsafety.org

 

[Z O N E]

It's looking like NAVER Maps (Koreas domestic version of Google Maps) has updated their airport images to REMOVE the concrete barrier from BOTH ends of the airport. You can see how the surrounding area still has the same quality to it like the before shot, but the airport has been modified.

Left: Before
Right: Updated (New)

 

[Windle Poons]

Lots of misinformation on this page. First of all its an older 737, has nothing to do with the current Boeing situation of the MAX fleet. Second, it was primarily a bird strike. While not fatal by itself, can cause issues. I see some people, say they "forgot" to put out their landing gear which I think is a joke. No pilot will forget literally the one thing they do on a daily basis. We dont know yet why, maybe malfunction, maybe too high of a speed for them to open, either way they had sufficient fuel in them which will always cause a fireball. Scrapping against the ground and only one spark and tilt was always goign to end in a disaster. We had one similar a few days ago and half the peiople survived, that wall in Jeju is the biggest puzzle as why in the world are those tiny skinny antennas mounted on such a huge concrete wall when most of the world has them just hanging out of the ground.

You beat me to it with your response but wholly agree.

Wasn't a Max so all this 'Boeing need to fuck off' stuff is way out of line.

Need to see what flight data recorder indicates (though did I hear it might be damaged or is that some BS?)

Was on second approach after failed first attempt - nothing from the tower advising pilots that there was no landing gear or flaps - or because of the country, have they been told to keep their mouths shut?

 

[Z O N E]

That mound is a DEATH TRAP. Look at all that concrete inside of it. That first image, the image on the left is how localizers look in most airports, where they're almost flat on the ground.

That mound might as well be a fucking wall cause it fucking was.

 

[Tams]

It's looking like NAVER Maps (Koreas domestic version of Google Maps) has updated their airport images to REMOVE the concrete barrier from BOTH ends of the airport. You can see how the surrounding area still has the same quality to it like the before shot, but the airport has been modified.

Left: Before
Right: Updated (New)

While it wouldn't surprise me guven South Korean culture, the second images are of a lower resolution, and the structure in question is already very faint.

Also, there are many other satellite mapping services out there that South Koreans have access to. I don't see how this would work.

 

[Z O N E]

While it wouldn't surprise me guven South Korean culture, the second images are of a lower resolution, and the structure in question is already very faint.

Also, there are many other satellite mapping services out there that South Koreans have access to. I don't see how this would work.

I thought that too, but if you look, it's only the airport and runways that have degraded in quality. The surrounding areas remain the same.

Google Maps shows a VERY old versions of that airport and Kakao Map seems to censor all the airports, which I'm guessing is for security reason. I would probably be saying the same thing as you, but why after this incident did it change?

 

[Trilobit]

So I previously wrote that I always book my seats at the back of the plane and that the ones surviving this were in the back of the plane, but today I saw this picture of exactly who survived and it was most likely the flight attendants in the back.



Top comment:

Those seats in the rear where the crew was seated are jump seats. They are uncomfortable seats that fold down during use. The main reason why they had a better chance of survival was that they were wearing a 4 point harness, facing backwards, behind the lavatory and received the least amount of impact force.

So in this case all passengers were doomed. It's very bleak to look at each red square and realize that each represents a whole life and someone's child/spouse/parent/sibling/friend.

 

[Hookshot]

Wonder how the people who should have been in those 11 empty seats are feeling.

 

[newtypepilot]

 

[Pagusas]

Wonder how the people who should have been in those 11 empty seats are feeling.

Survivors guilt is a very very real thing

I wonder how those 2 flight attendance are feeling right now, any word on their condition?

 

[Hookshot]

Survivors guilt is a very very real thing

I wonder how those 2 flight attendance are feeling right now, any word on their condition?

Last I heard one was real bad, potentially paralyzed and they weren't telling them what happened. the other one wasn't as bad, but neither could recollect what happened.

 

[Pagusas]

Last I heard one was real bad, potentially paralyzed and they weren't telling them what happened. the other one wasn't as bad, but neither could recollect what happened.

frankly if I went through something like that, I think I'd prefer to have no recollection of what happened.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

The final moments before the Jeju Air crash in South Korea

Maps and diagrams break down the final minutes of Jeju Air flight 2216 that ended in the deadliest air crash in South Korea.

www.reuters.com

Great summary of the tragedy. I hope that we get clear answers about what caused it and that it never happens again.

 

[newtypepilot]

 

[EverydayBeast]

Can you prevent birds from flying into plane motors? And I don't know why there's a wall on a plane runway.

 

[Avid Reading Horse]

Data recorders went out as the same time as the satellite tracking as apparently the plane was old enough to not require a battery backup for them.

My best guess as a casual watcher of YouTube air disaster videos is they shut down the wrong engine or maybe they were going full Sully with a dual engine failure. But surely if both went out in the bird strike they'd just land as configured. Unless the go-around was to avoid the birds and they hit after that decision I suppose.

 

[newtypepilot]

 

[kruis]

South Korea's Jeju Air plane crash probe finds duck DNA in both engines of jet that burst into flames in Seoul

Investigators found bird blood and feathers in both engines of the Jeju Air Boeing 737 that crashed in Seoul, killing 179 people.

www.cbsnews.com

South Korea's Jeju Air plane crash probe finds duck DNA in both engines of jet that burst into flames in Seoul

January 27, 2025 / 10:27 AM EST / AP

U.S. experts join South Korea plane crash probe

Seoul, South Korea — The first report on last month's Jeju Air crash in South Korea confirmed traces of bird strikes in the plane's engines, though officials haven't determined the cause of the accident that killed all but two of the 181 people on board. The preliminary accident report released by South Korea's Aviation and Railway Accident Investigation Board on Monday said that feathers and bird blood stains were found in both engines.

"The samples were sent to specialized organizations for DNA analysis, and a domestic organization identified them as belonging to Baikal teals," the report said, referring to a migratory duck.

The report also said the plane's two black boxes — the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder — stopped recording about four minutes before the crash. This could complicate efforts to find the cause of the crash.

The Boeing 737-800 skidded off the runaway at Muan International Airport on Dec. 29 after its landing gear failed to deploy, slamming into a concrete structure and bursting into flames. The flight was returning from Bangkok and all the victims were South Koreans except for two Thai nationals.

Many analysts said the concrete structure, which housed a set of antennas called a localizer that guides aircraft during landings, should have been built with lighter materials that could break more easily upon impact. South Korea's Transport Ministry announced last week that it will remove the concrete structure at the airport.

Investigators earlier said that air traffic controllers warned the pilots about possible bird strikes two minutes before the aircraft issued a distress signal confirming that a bird strike had occurred, after which the pilots attempted an emergency landing.

The preliminary report said the pilots also noticed a group of birds while approaching the runway at the Muan airport and that a security camera filmed the plane coming close to birds during an aborted landing as well.

The report said authorities will disassemble the engines, examine their components in depth, analyze the black box and air traffic control data, and investigate the embankment, localizer and bird strike evidence.

"These all-out investigation activities aim to accurately determine the cause of the accident," the report said.

The Transport Ministry said the preliminary report has been sent to the International Civil Aviation Organization, Thailand, the United States and France. It said the plane was built in the U.S. and its engines in France.

It said the Muan airport will remain closed until April 18.