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League of Legends |OT7| She Ezreal To Me, Dammit!

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Newt

Member
The 500 range nerf just makes sense. Sivir has a lot in her kit to compensate for having 500 range and so does Lucian. 550 isn't right for him.
 
P

PhillipCostigan

Member
Newt said:
The 500 range nerf just makes sense. Sivir has a lot in her kit to compensate for having 500 range and so does Lucian. 550 isn't right for him.
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Lucian is not in the same League as Sivir in terms of ultity and reasons for 500 range.

Lucian will be a worse version Graves now.
 
T

TomShoe

Banned
pigeon said:
I really don't know who the main "basically okay at everything" ADC will be when Lucian is gone. Jinx and MF don't have dashes. Graves?
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Hasn't Caitlyn been a safe pick since forever? Her range is completely easy mode.

Is Twitch still viable? Even with the damage and Q nerfs, I'm still able to get a 60% win rate with him.
 
N

Newt

Member
PhillipCostigan said:
Lucian is not in the same League as Sivir in terms of ultity and reasons for 500 range.

Lucian will be a worse version Graves now.
Click to expand...
Sure Lucian doesn't have the utility of Sivir, but he has enough to compensate for 500 range. You know Lucian's abilites, there's nothing else I can tell you other than you're wrong.
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
CRS said:
The BT/4.10 changes don't help the Lucian nerfs at all. They almost magnify the issues.
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Lucian was unnaffected by the BT changes because he was already starting to be used as a BOTRK carry and Ghostblade amplified that.

Let's not pretend Lucian still isn't the best ADC in the game.
 
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brian!

Member
his kit is about getting in range to hit a double shot u fukkin tool
he never started botrk when bt give 100 ad u morans, he built it after lw because it gave 90% lifesteal and an active that draws out the soul of his enemies
 
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PhillipCostigan

Member
Newt said:
Sure Lucian doesn't have the utility of Sivir, but he has enough to compensate for 500 range. You know Lucian's abilites, there's nothing else I can tell you other than you're wrong.
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What? No he doesn't. lol.

Sivir has enough to compensate for 500 range because she operates at a long range with her kit. She has reach in her W bounces, incredible damage from a very long range that hits twice with her boomerang blade, and a team wide movement speed boost. Those are real tools to operate from long range.

Lucian has none of those. His Q requires him to be within 500 range of something to use. A lot of his power is contained in his passive which HE HAS TO BE AT 500 RANGE TO USE.

He does not have the tools to get around being 500 range. He HAS to be in that range to operate, aside from the Culling. You could not be more wide of the mark.
 
D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
brian! said:
his kit is about getting in range to hit a double shot u fukkin tool
he never started botrk when bt give 100 ad u morans, he built it after lw because it gave 90% lifesteal and an active that draws out the soul of his enemies
Click to expand...
Take it easy, he just wants to find his wife's soul.
 
B

brian!

Member
TFkBiNO.png
 
N

Newt

Member
PhillipCostigan said:
What? No he doesn't. lol.

Sivir has enough to compensate for 500 range because she operates at a long range with her kit. She has reach in her W bounces, incredible damage from a very long range that hits twice with her boomerang blade, and a team wide movement speed boost. Those are real tools to operate from long range.

Lucian has none of those. His Q requires him to be within 500 range of something to use. A lot of his power is contained in his passive which HE HAS TO BE AT 500 RANGE TO USE.

He does not have the tools to get around being 500 range. He HAS to be in that range to operate, aside from the Culling. You could not be more wide of the mark.
Click to expand...
Sivir does not operate from a long range, lol. She's an AA heavy champion, unless you're referring to laning phase. Speaking of laning, Lucian has to take no risks in laning in his current state since he can harass with his Q from a safe distance and just AA you with his passive so he can win every trade. I'm actually really confused where you get the idea that Sivir operates from a long range.
 
S

scy

Member
Sr Kitsune said:
Wasn't Lucian "meh" when he was released? What did Riot change to make him so strong?
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People stopped being playing him improperly and some QoL tweaks to mana costs/regen and the Q tracking.

More the former than the latter, really.

Newt said:
I'm actually really confused where you get the idea that Sivir operates from a long range.
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Realistically, the better wording is "longer" range. It's that Sivir is about starting at a further distance (Q harass) and getting into range via ult / spellshield safety with an AA reset to minimize the time needed in the range to push her damage. More of Sivir's kit can appropriately be used at a greater-than-AA range to do things compared to Lucian who needs to get in before he can operate.
 
S

Stone Ocean

Member
PhillipCostigan said:
What? No he doesn't. lol.

Sivir has enough to compensate for 500 range because she operates at a long range with her kit. She has reach in her W bounces, incredible damage from a very long range that hits twice with her boomerang blade, and a team wide movement speed boost. Those are real tools to operate from long range.

Lucian has none of those. His Q requires him to be within 500 range of something to use. A lot of his power is contained in his passive which HE HAS TO BE AT 500 RANGE TO USE.

He does not have the tools to get around being 500 range. He HAS to be in that range to operate, aside from the Culling. You could not be more wide of the mark.
Click to expand...
His Q needs something within 500 range to use but hits farther than that - you know, like Ricochet. A lot of power is in his passive that he needs to be in 500 range to use... Except he has a free dash. And if all else fails there's his ult which also extends how far he can damage people.

Saying "he doesn't have the tools to get around being 500 range" when he has a fucking super Phage on his W and pretty much the best mobility ability for ADCs in the game makes me think you don't actually play as or against Lucian, either that or you have no idea how to actually play him. By your logic Lucian should have trouble against someone like Cait but guess what, he doesn't because on top of his base range he has mobility and effective range out of his whazoo
 
G

Ghost is Bad

Banned
Stone Ocean said:
His Q needs something within 500 range to use but hits farther than that - you know, like Ricochet. A lot of power is in his passive that he needs to be in 500 range to use... Except he has a free dash. And if all else fails there's his ult which also extends how far he can damage people.

Saying "he doesn't have the tools to get around being 500 range" when he has a fucking super Phage on his W and pretty much the best mobility ability for ADCs in the game makes me think you don't actually play as or against Lucian, either that or you have no idea how to actually play him. By your logic Lucian should have trouble against someone like Cait but guess what, he doesn't because on top of his base range he has mobility and effective range out of his whazoo
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whats the point of being mobile if ur literally a riven e away from death every time u auto someone.
 
L

Leezard

Member
pigeon said:
I think the Lucian changes are interesting in the sense that I think it's a cool design space for a champion to be in. He'll keep his 1000 range poke, but his effective kill range is going to be much tighter -- so you can't hover in the mid range, you have to commit one way or the other. It feels appropriate to his flavor concept and at least hypothetically offers an interesting choice and counterplay.

That said, it might be an unpopular niche that means Lucian doesn't see any play (right now; someday they'll release a dumb item that cares about ADCs being in melee or something and he'll be meta again), and he may be totally poorly tuned so that they don't make him super OP again in a different way. So it sucks pretty bad if you liked Lucian as a champion, because he's probably going to be basically bad at the thing he used to be pretty good at.

I really don't know who the main "basically okay at everything" ADC will be when Lucian is gone. Jinx and MF don't have dashes. Graves?
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Tristana. Graves is way too weak in the current meta. Tristana does not have as hard lane bullying though. Caitlyn is safe as always.

Personally I think the Lucian changes are... interesting. It's possible it is too harsh, but at the same time he will become insanely mobile. E-auto-Q-auto-E-auto will allow him to dash so much. I won't completely condemn the changes before I have seen it properly in game.
 
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brian!

Member
ACTUALLY tristana early prtty hot
she has trouble in the midwest tho?

check out the icons for explosive shot and buster shot
Explosive_Shot.jpg

Buster_Shot.jpg

cloth armor doesnt block magic damage fool
 
L

Leezard

Member
brian! said:
ACTUALLY tristana early prtty hot
she has trouble in the midwest tho?
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Well yes, her early is good, but she can't really harass as well as Lucian can. She wants to just E - auto back off unless she can go in for the kill, while Lucian/Cait will deal more damage than that. She has a good early, but not as good as Lucian. Her midgame is definitely her lowest point, though.
 
S

scy

Member
Leezard said:
Personally I think the Lucian changes are... interesting. It's possible it is too harsh, but at the same time he will become insanely mobile. E-auto-Q-auto-E-auto will allow him to dash so much. I won't completely condemn the changes before I have seen it properly in game.
Click to expand...

It's one of those "in theory" sort of things. Granted, maybe "in practice" will match it but it's hard to imagine the best case scenario (E-AA-Q-AA-E) cycles to be the norm. Functionally adding an extra auto-attack cycle to his dead zone vs some ADCs is a fairly big thing even before factoring in supports.

Really, just the whole proposition of "engage with your escape" lends itself to really bad worst case situations.
 
B

brian!

Member
scy said:
It's one of those "in theory" sort of things. Granted, maybe "in practice" will match it but it's hard to imagine the best case scenario (E-AA-Q-AA-E) cycles to be the norm. Functionally adding an extra auto-attack cycle to his dead zone vs some ADCs is a fairly big thing even before factoring in supports.

Really, just the whole proposition of "engage with your escape" lends itself to really bad worst case situations.
Click to expand...

here's the icon for rocket jump
Rocket_Jump.jpg


some ppl in na lcs have been playing stay the fuk away from me static shiv tristana
 
L

Leezard

Member
scy said:
It's one of those "in theory" sort of things. Granted, maybe "in practice" will match it but it's hard to imagine the best case scenario (E-AA-Q-AA-E) cycles to be the norm. Functionally adding an extra auto-attack cycle to his dead zone vs some ADCs is a fairly big thing even before factoring in supports.

Really, just the whole proposition of "engage with your escape" lends itself to really bad worst case situations.
Click to expand...

It will require good positioning to pull off properly. I mean, I haven't tried the changes so Lucy might be terrible after the changes for all I know, but I imagine that his skill cap is raised quite a bit now. It is definitely a nerf and one might not want to pick Lucy into all bot lane matchups, but only that is fine I think.
 
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